It would lack...well....a certain something.....
Now donch'all go rushing to read it all at once, but do review it before posting on this thread, its continuation.
tomb
hellhost
Louise
T
P
quote:
Originally posted by tomb:
I will kill myself first, thanks all the same.
T
Oh,don't do that Tomb....Hell couldn't possibly manage without you.....
It would lack...well....a certain something.....
quote:
Originally posted by Stephen:
Oh,don't do that Tomb....Hell couldn't possibly manage without you.....
It would lack...well....a certain something.....
besides which, then wood would think he'd won (we all know he wouldn't have - buthe'd think it)...
and how would 'frin police hell without you?
don't do tomb, i beg of you
viki
quote:
Originally posted by sarkycow:
besides which, then wood would think he'd won (we all know he wouldn't have - buthe'd think it)...and how would 'frin police hell without you?
don't do tomb, i beg of you
What do you mean, would think?
Anyway. Apart from Sarkysteak's misunderestimation (thanks, Dubya) of me, I agree. Don't kill yourself, Tomb.
I'd have no one to make me look good.
But if you do, could you tell us who will get your organ?
tomb modestly digs a razor-clawed toe into the carpet and scratches at the patch of dry scales on his spine. He's touched that so many people care so very deeply and quickly wipes away a tear before it drops onto his desk and eats a hole the French polish.
But back to Crappy Choruses and Horrible Hymns.
tomb had the misfortune of attending a funeral of a woman who was his contemporary this weekend.
It was at a charismatic/non-denominational cum evangelical church up in the mountains.
The husband of the deceased had requested "worship music." So the congregation was led through spirited renditions of "Shout to the North," "Days of Elijah," "We will dance (on the streets that are golden)," and several other similar pieces.
Now, don't get tomb wrong. He has actually been known to program every one of the songs he sang. Just not at a friggin' funeral.
It reinforced tomb's intention to be buried out of the American 1928 Prayer Book, the burial office of which never mentions the name of the deceased and which programs a stupefying number of obscure Psalms.
tomb hastens to add, however, that he is not a hidebound traditionalist. Although he does not Believe in cremation, he has told his wife that he wants to be pickled and has given special instructions about the designs on the exterior of his canopic jar.
But back to the rant. tomb disapproves of funerals that masquerade as wakes. Five minutes into the service (after the first spasm of Worship was over), the husband of the deceased got up to speak (10 minutes worth). tomb muttered to hisself that he needed a drink. At a wake, this wouldn't be an issue; at a funeral, it was a Big Problem.
After two hours of reminiscences, when the service was less than half over and the Liturgical Dancers were preparing to Flit About to yet another Praise Chorus, tomb and his wife had to leave, having a previous engagement.
As they drove away, they could see the shadows of the dancers in the lighted sanctuary and could vaguely hear the {boom} {boom} of the bass guitar through the walls.
tomb found occasion to give infinite thanks to Almighty God that he is too busy to last through a funeral. It got him out of a horrible situation.
He grieved for his friend while driving down the freeway toward town. It was the first holy moment he had experienced.
quote:
I have moved Alaric the Goth's magnum opus to the archive--all thirteen pages of it.
Gothic warrior groweth angry!
You might have let the thread get to a SIGNIFICANT NO. of replies, like it was up to 636 and you might have waited for another 30, say!
I want to be a tree that's bearing fruit,
that God has pruned and caused to shoot,
oh, up in the sky so very, very high
I want to be, I want to be a blooming tree.
Chorus:
God has promised his Holy Spirit will water our roots and help
us grow;
listen and obey, and before you know it, your fruit will start to grow,
grow, grow, grow, grow!
You'll be at tree that's bearing fruit,
with a very, very, very strong root;
bright colours like daisies, more fruit than Sainsbury's*
you'll be a blooming tree.
Someone told me about this at CU, and I thought they were joking. Sadly, they informed me that it was real. I nwas VERY impressed that my GLE CU didn't take it on as a theme song, and in fact hated it with a passion.
Can you do worse than this?
Rachel.
PS... I found the full words on the web. Thankfully they ahve not yet implanted into my brain. Take care not to look at them for too long, however....
* Sainsbury's is a supermarket chain, in case any non-English shipmates were wondering!
R.
quote:
Originally posted by rachel_o:
I am booting this up, just in case nobody has read my very nauseating lyrics, which I was hoping would incite some response!
R.
I'm speechless.
Moo
I'm afraid that the fivefold repetition of "grow" is now permanently implanted in my brain.
Obviously these lyrics are the work of the devil!
Saint Joseph stood beside the cradle
and embraced the Holy Child,
Then he knelt upon the sod..........
The words all seemed to be on the theme of having the Virgin Mary intercede for poor sinners when they die. There was one, "Mother ,At Your Feet is Kneeling," for which I don't remember all of the lyrics, but I clearly recall "Mother, when my Jesus calls me, from this world so dark and drear..." Though not as popular at weddings, there was another with words about "Mother of Christ, star of the sea, pray for the sinner, pray for me."
Of course, my worst fit of giggling came when a couple I knew who did like classical music (but understood no Italian, and did not bother to ask for a translation of the words) used the Italian art song (actually not at all liturgical) "Virgin, tutto amor." It's a wonderful piece of music, though very dramatic, but the words speak of the sad lament of the sinner asking for God's mercy.
It seems that JFK and Jackie had it at their wedding, and it was also sung at JFK's funeral.
It was one of only a handful of "standards" of the pre-Vatican II age.
quote:
Originally posted by Amos:
I hereby offer up "All Things Bright And Beautiful" as my least favorite funereal ditty.
Monty Python's All Things Dull and Ugly
quote:
Originally posted by Amos:
.... Good ministerial practice requires me to say very little about the things I've heard at the Crem, but, since this thread has been provided by the Providence of Hell, I hereby offer up "All Things Bright And Beautiful" as my least favorite funereal ditty....
It is, perhaps, my disordered imagination, Amos, but I assume the song is sung as the coffin is sliding into the fire? Bright, perhaps, but certainly not beautiful, I daresay.
Have to share this gem in the 'do we really think childen are that stupid' category:
Jump, jump, jump, jump,
Jumpity jump, jump, jump,
jump, jump, jump, jump,
Jumpity jump for Jeeeesus
Hop, hop, hop...you get the idea. It went on for four verses, with actions 
And I thought I'd managed to kill this miserable thread.
When Jesus heard that his very best friend
Called Lazarus had died,
He went to the grave and he cried REAL TEARS
And he told him to come alive.
It was a miracle, It was a miracle,
It was a miracle, and it's true-oo-oo
It was a miracle, it was a miracle,
cos that's what Jesus did do.
There's another verse I don't remember, and the piano does this odd 'dum de dum' thing after 'died'...
Since you have no choice when you are christened and half the choice when you are married why shouldnt you have all the choice when you die. For me I think happy stuff, seeing as we dont have wakes usually over here in the uk.
quote:
Originally posted by simon 2:
Since you have no choice when you are christened and half the choice when you are married why shouldnt you have all the choice when you die.
It is, after all, your last chance to really wind the organist up and s/he can't answer back!
It's actually not too bad, and the verse fits the propers quite nicely.
Still, I am incapable of thinking of it as anything other than "Bondage for Jesus."
tomb
quote:
Bind us together, Lord/Bind us together/with chords that cannot be broken.../bind us together in Love.
But chords can be broken (arpeggios) and aren't very helpful for tying things with either! Cords however are a different matter.
As to the hymn I liked it when I was about 10 but have gone off it over time.
Carys
Back in the old, old days of the Ship I started a thread called 'musical irreverence' where someone posted "bind us together with cords and black leather and tie my legs to the bedpost"...
Lazarus - I'm afraid the second verse is imprinted on my memory:
So they took the bandages off him
And he stood up strong and straight
And the people around all ooh'd and aah'd
As he sat right down and ate
Even worse, however, was one with the refrain:
Come down, Zacchaeus, come down from the tree
Come down, Zacchaeus, give the Lord his tea
I`mmmmmmmmmmm Not such an ugly duckling
No feathers all stubby and brown
And the other birds in so many words say
*mch* The best in town
*mch* The best
*mch-mch* The best
*mch-mch* The best in town
I suppose there is a bit of a similarity, now you come to mention it. Myself, I really like that song, except for the "you`re the best" bit, which really spoils it.
quote:
Originally posted by Weslian:
Does anyone else find it impossible to sing the otherwise reasonable song: 'All I once held dear', without thinking of Danny Kaye's 'Ugly Duckling' when singing 'you're my all, you're the best, you're my joy, my righteousness.'??
lol
So I'm not the only one. Gets me every time!
And what about "I'm Special" - which to me has the same pathetic...empathetic....(emetic) feel to it as that sweet little ditty by Keith Harris and Orville. You know - all together now:
I wish I could fly
Right up to the sky but I..... (nearest thing to a vomiting smiley)
Scratch another head
Scratch a head next to you
Scratch another head and sing along....
I'm not going to torture you further with the rest
Madkaren
Allalalala-lalalalaleluia
Allalalalalale, Allalalalalale,
Allalalala-lalalalaleluia
Allalalalalale, Alleluia
Hold another hand, hold the hand next to ya..
(the couple in front of me at that point obeyed gladly)
Hug another friend, hug the friend next to ya..
Kiss another friend..
(the couple in front of me started off on a marathon snogging session that lasted the rest of the event)
I think it stopped there (at any rate, I`m pretty sure there wasn`t a "shag another friend" verse..)
). Tahnks to this thread I was reduced to helpless laughter as I imagined the Ugly Duckling lyrics instead. This caused *bad looks* from the holier-than-thou couple who sit across the aisle from me I hope you all burn in Hell for this
Viki
Robin is seriously thinking of complaining that we were made to sing something so trite and annoying. But that`s the sort of thing that happens when the warden (a man with taste) is away.
As a matter of fact, the verses are rather worse than the chorus. The chorus is merely twee. But "Born with the right to be clean" is bad theology. (We don`t have rights, we don`t *deserve* to be made clean, we are made clean only because God loves us.) And who is the third verse addressed to? Some lines seem to imply it`s us, others that it`s Jesus. There`s an alternative set of verses at the back of Mission Praise that are better in their theology (though they don`t scan any better).
Ultimately, it`s a totally unsuitable song for singing in church (especially as an introit hymn, which is how we had it, played on the organ). It`s for strumming on the guitar round a campfire or in a sitting-room, or singing unaccompanied when there are only a few of you. And it`s still not very good then.
quote:
Fit for the Glory of God
......
born with the right to be free
......
Which seem just as bad.
Or just as bad; Shine Jesus Shine to the tune of Grease. Both possible, and both hideously performed at St Mary Bredin, Canterbury.
Oddly enough, I cannot remember specific instances in great detail (though I vaguely recall, when I spoke at a retreat for young adults during the 1970s, that they sang something about "I'm looking for space, and to find out who I am")... perhaps a lapsed memory is merciful on some conditions. However, enjoying this thread as I am, I ask others with similar memories to fill in the blanks.
'Why don't you put your trust in Jesus,
and ask him to come in,
He saw or need from up in heaven
and died to save our sin;
Why don't you take him as your captain,
and crown him as your king,
For he'll love and help and guide you
he will never ever fail.
Clap-Clap-Clap- Jesus!'
I am not sure who wrote it though!
It was the way the write had tried *so* hard to keep closely to the original lyrics, but make them to God instead. And he *almost* got it rhyming!
Viki
quote:
Originally posted by Oriel:
Ha! *We* had "Bind us together", and I couldn`t help but think of the bondage version.. and ended up trying to finish it! ("Strip me and tether me
Naked, and leather me
Bind us together in lust")
Hmmm. Well done, and it scans better than the original, which isn't, I suppose, saying much.
I wonder if we couldn't expand the scope of this thread by listing *actual* songs that would be suitable for people with various emotional, physical, and personality disorders.
"Pass it on" immediately comes to mind for people afflicted with communicable diseases. I suppose it would also work for anybody afflicted with pyromania: "It only takes a spark to get a fire going/" etc.
"Shout to the North" would be an excellent theme song for a television weather reader--particularly one burnt out by reporting winter storms. I'm assuming, you'll note, that being a meteorologist is a personality disorder. Certainly the way they behave on television leads to that conclusion.
And how about "Whispering Hope" for the schizophrenics?
And having thoroughly explored "Bind us together" for bondage enthusiasts, how about expanding the repertoire with "Draw us with the Spirit's tether"?
Others?
tomb
[fixed my own stinkin' UBB code]
[ 30 January 2002: Message edited by: tomb ]
Viki
It was all pretty dire, but one line gave me a particularly loud, prolongued and embarrassing laughing fit. It was an earnest prayer that:
"Our sheep may bring forth thousands
And ten thousands in the streets."
It brought to mind such a vivid picture that even when the main laughter had subsided (thanks to angry glances from a more senior member of my choir), I was unable to prevent myself from emitting the odd giggle throughout the rest of the service.
Make our world a better place
Help us save the human race
Give us food to feed our faces
As we’re put through our paces
Keep us safe from evil’s harm
Be our safe-ty alarm
You’re in charge
Oh you’re so cool
Cos’ you ain’t
No man’s fool
Yuck yuck yuck yuck yuck I was subjected to this recently, and it has a tune as dire as the words! It's a kind of rap (i.e. it tries to be a rap, but fails miserably due to lack of scansion )
Can you spot what this is a modernisation of?
Answers on a postcard to the usual address
Viki
I had been resisting joining this thread because this is a subject I happen to feel very strongly about.
But a recent experience has changed all that. I just need to check the furious face is working : 
yes? Right. Here goes.
This week I went off to cell group, leaving husband (who'd had a foul day and didn't want to talk to anyone) at home.
When I arrived I had two new songs inflicted upon me. One was entitled Adjust to the Dove, and the second, The Waters are Breaking.
I don't really think I need go on, but I will. I can't actually recall many of the words to either, but the chorus of the first went:
Come Holy Spirit
Come Holy Spirit
To rise above the Mountains
We must adjust to the Dove.
The second included a line beginning 'I feel like pushing' but strangely didn't have anything along the lines of 'it's been 36 hours and I've had enough, give me more pain relief' or 'this is all your fault, I'm never letting you anywhere near me again'.
When I got back husband and I had a good laugh, but now I'm just
Who in their right mindcan possiblythink that any such DRIVEL can be appropriate to worship God?
I've got myself all cross now, I'm going to have to go.
I would have taken the sheet of words to 'share' with others, but I was scared it might be interpreted as a positive response.
None of the people who write and propagate such "hymns" are by any means in their right minds!I'm glad to see the resurection of this thread - it's my favourite. Someone I know was telling me of a hymn called "The Angel Gabriel," which she was taught by nuns at school. I'd never heard of it - perhaps one of the nuns was the composer - and it loses much when one cannot hear the bizarre tune, but these are the words as I recall:
Verse:
The Angel Gabriel declared to Mary,
That she would be God's mother you see.
And on the Cross, Jesus our brother,
Said behold thy mother.
Chorus:
Hail, Mary, mother of God,
Lady in blue, I love you,
Hail Mary, mother of God,
Mary is my mother too.
Anything for a rhyme.
More info please on the 'dove' and 'breaking waters' songs. I've just got to see those words for myself!
I've heard rumours of a 'prayer of Jabez' chorus asking God to 'enlarge my borders'. As a dedicated Weight Watcher, there's no way I'm asking God to enlarge my anything!
Could be a useful song for managers of large American bookstores though.
I lead worship on a Sunday morning occasionally and I can't help be scared that asking for more details of these songs will mean people then expect to hear them.... I have already decided what I will say if I'm ever singing as back-up and someone schedules these songs, as I can't, in all conscience, sing them!
I can't shake off the image I have of God, in heaven, listening to us, and saying 'eh?'
I'll be back when I've found them!
Birdie
quote:
Birdie wrote:
When I arrived I had two new songs inflicted upon me. One was entitled Adjust to the Dove....
It is perhaps my profoundly unregulated imagination, but this immediately made me think of Leda and the Swan.
tomb
[ 04 March 2002: Message edited by: tomb ]
For a song to be become the new 'shine Jesus shine' It has to be sung in places like here where 'shine Jesus shine' is really modern and He has to appear on songs of Praise.
"Oh I feel like dancing
It's foolishness I know,
But when the world has seen the light,
they will dance with joy like we're dancing now."
I always want to scream,
"I don't feel like dancing,
it's not just foolishness, it's bullsh!t,
the world has seen the light, and they crucified it,
AND NOBODY IS DANCING NOW!
Furthermore you're all sitting on your under-excersized McDonald's fed arses with nothing moving at all but your bloody hands waving in the air!"
Which is why I skip the music part of the service and time my arrival for the sermon and communion, what ever happened to "What a friend we have in Jesus" and "Amazing Grace" There's a song you can sing. My favorite is the Doxology. "...praise Father Son and Holy Ghooooooost. Aaaaaamen." in pleasant harmony can make my spine tingle.
Some pop/rap type song of the day, had the refrain "No money man can win my love, it's sweetness that I'm thinking of" ... and we were inflicted to, of course, "it's JESUS That I'm thinking of" sung (badly) over an even worse kareoke backing track by two rather daringly clad young women.
And I've never been able to get it out of my head since. I think they did one or two others, but those, along with the verses to said song, are obliviated in the mists of time and my ageing brain.
One of the favourite songs at the Catholic Community here in Nottingham seems to be a little ditty called "Zion".
The refrain of which is:
"Zion, holy mountain, holy city
Lead me on to the Father
Sacred road
I set my face like flint for you Jerusalem
My greatest joy."
Is it just me, or can /anyone/ make any sense out of this? "I set my face like flint?" *boggles quietly*.
Unfortunately we're doing it this Sunday. I'm sorely tempted to go to the 11am Latin Mass at the Cathedral instead...
There`s another song which uses that line. I can`t remember much of it, but it does go
Setting our faces like flint
We`ll walk into the light
with such a cheery bouncy tune that it makes a mockery of the whole idea that we`re meant to be setting our faces like flint to the prospect of *suffering*!
quote:
Originally posted by Oriel:There`s another song which uses that line. I can`t remember much of it, but it does go
Setting our faces like flint
We`ll walk into the lightwith such a cheery bouncy tune that it makes a mockery of the whole idea that we`re meant to be setting our faces like flint to the prospect of *suffering*!
It was called 'We shall stand', and was a favourite in the early 90's. It went something like:
We shall stand
With our feet on the rock
Whatever men may say
We'll lift your name up hi-igh
We shall waaaaalk
Through the darkest night
Setting our faces like flint
We'll walk into the liiight
Hopefully that's now all stuck in your heads
(PS I did quite like it at the time 
)
quote:
Originally posted by Birdie:
Adjust to the Dove[/i]
I would have thought that you, of all people would have appreciated this one. Now, can someone find me a song including a line about cephalopods?
quote:
Little Miss Chatterbox reminded us all:
It was called 'We shall stand', and was a favourite in the early 90's. <snip>
Hopefully that's now all stuck in your heads
Ach. So it is. And the "Zion" one has a similarly bouncy feel to it. All most un-flint-like.
quote:
I set my face like flint for you Jerusalem My greatest joy."
setting your face like flint comes from Isaiah 50 vs 7 'Because the Sovereign Lord helps me, I will not be disgraced.
Therefore have I set my face like flint,
and I know I will not be put to shame'
Basically to be determined to reach Jerusalem in the context of your song. Now does that mean heaven 
Bitterness is poisonous to my soul
Un-forgiveness makes the heart grow cold...
O to forgive and be forgiven
Release and be release.
We were created to be free.
To rise above the mountains
We must adjust to the dove....
Holy Spirit come
Holy Spirit come
To rise above the mountains...
We must adjust to the dove...
Quarelling is damaging this I know
With forgiveness the anointing flows...
O to show mercy and to know mercy
Grace and know grace
Filling our lives with peace again
To rise above the mountains
We must adjust to the dove
It's not actually as bad as I remember it.
I can only bring myself to give you the fisr verse of the other one:
The waters have broken
All across this land
Birthing a new dawn
I don't fully understand
But hwew I am
Watching, Watching
The Earth is groaning
There's pain within this land
I feel like pushing
I don't fully understand
But here I am
Praying, shaking
Anticipating... something...
Better than before, it's got to be
And expecting... something...
Greater than we've ever known
A new thing...
From the ancient spring.
I bet you all though I'd made it all up. I have to confess that I quite like the line about the ancient spring, but I think that's a reaction against churches who tend to behave as though Jesus was born in 1962. If you know what I mean.
In some ways I feel quite bad about posting this...after all some people obviously love them and I know God can use anything to speak to people. But I can't forget the horror when I was handed the sheet of words....
sigh. 
Cheers
Birdie
There was the time when one bright spark decided we should sing:
"Jesus take me as I am
I can come no other way..."
Needless to say, the inmates (with lots of tittering) saw meanings to the word that the songwriter had not even imagined!
Next was another stinker whose only line I can remember is
"Judgment is good.Mercy is Best"
Stood there halfway between laughing and just going What? One day we may do a good new song at church.Huh.Fat chance.
quote:
Originally posted by da_musicman:
"Two sins have we commited".Yeah and the rest.
"Judgment is good.Mercy is Best"
Musicman, you're a genius. You just formed a rhyming couplet which scans perfectly (or as well as many others). Keep working on it and you'll have a complete chorus to teach your church by Sunday.
Cuttle.
I love it!
quote:
Originally posted by Cuttlefish:
Musicman, you're a genius.
.
At last my gift is recognised by the rest of the world.Watch Out Kendrick here I come.
quote:
Originally posted by da_musicman:
Next was another stinker whose only line I can remember is"Judgment is good.Mercy is Best"
I think the song is Greater grace
and i like the words...sorry
null
quote:
Originally posted by Atticus:
I hate that song that has a middle part about dancing:
I Could Sing of Your Love Forever(which the song attempts to mimick by indeed, repeating itself, you guessed it, forever)"
When this forst came out our worship leader had scrawled on the bottome of his music copy
"repeat 29 times to fade"
I think he was joking
"Make me like a David Stone
Six foot two and finely combed"
Of course, this was also the group which turned "Ascribe greatness to our God the Rock" into the following:
Ascribe lateness to our faulty clock
It's works are dirty and both its hands are bust (repeat)
A clock of latefulness and completely rusty
Good and uptight are we... (repeat)
Not to mention the new modern re-working of Jesus wants me for a sunbeam: "I wanna be an LED for Je-e-e-esus"
I may never
March in the infantry
Ride with the calvary
Shoot the artillary
I may never
Fly o'er the enemy
But I'm in the Lord's Army!
I'm in the Lord's Army!
I'm in the Lord's Army!
(Start over, with actions. Once sung for over half an hour in the van as we left Camp Lutherhaven.)
I just mentally ran through it three times to figure out how to transition back to the "verse" and that was horrible enough.
Were there adults on this bus? Did the church pay for their psychiatric care?
quote:
You give the baren woman healing
She'll dance for joylikethe mother of children.
I actually paused during that.
I am, well let me share. Remember that all this is accompanied by actions.
"I leap up high and I touch the ground
I touch my knees and I turn around
I've got to (Woo-hoo)praise the Lord"
The next stanza includes the line
"I might look silly, but that's all right, I've got to (woo-hoo) praise the Lord".
Just so everyone knows that the truly pious person will be jumping around like a loon and not standing at the back trying to work out how the same God who inspired Bach was also responsible for this drivel.
Thank you for letting me get that particularly traumatic experience off my chest.
look on the bright side...it could be
Oh jesus thou hast promised to the cheesyest tune possible.....i was cringing in the pew....
(scared for life by st georges parade..we had no matter what played on the organ once......aaaagggggghhhhh)
quote:
Originally posted by Yaffle:
[QB]Am I the only one who has had to endure the musical atrocity known only as "I leap up high".QB]
aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaagh!!!!
No, Yaffle, you're not.
quote:
Originally posted by sophs:
look on the bright side...it could be
Oh jesus thou hast promised to the cheesyest tune possible.....i was cringing in the pew....
That`s not the one that goes
OJesusI have prom ised (pom pom pom)
Toservetheeto the end (pom pom pom pom)
Bethouforev er near me (pom pom pom)
Mymasterand my friend
I-shall-not fear the battle (da-da-da)
If-thou-art by my side
No-or WANder from the pa-athway
If thou wilt be my guide (pom, pom, PA-da and into next verse)
is it?
quote:
Originally posted by sophs:
I think the song is Greater grace
and i like the words...sorry
null
Okay eating my hat slightly here.The song aint that awful(we sung it again yesterday) but that last verse/Chorus/Bridge(You know that bit which is to an entirely differnt tune and tempt to to the rest of the song) is dreadful.
Picture this. A church of 253 adults after the children have left to go to their groups. (I'm stood in the balconey, counting heads ) The adults are ALL singing:
I will dance, I will sing
To be mad for my king
Nothing Lord is hindering (nice rhyme there)
The passion in my soul!
And I'll become (bom-bom)
Even more undignified than this
etc. etc. etc.
Pan over the entire congregation. All.Stood.Still.
Rigid even. Which, lets face it, if I had to be in the body of the church for this song, I too would be stood stock still. Either that, or I would have gone out 'to the loos' before the song started. But I wouldn't have sung it. And they ALL are!!
And when I discretely asked several of them afterwards, if they could see any problems with singing this, and standing still, NONE of them got it!!
Anglicans. Tchuh.
Viki
Too, too faboo. It has been sent to assorted Friends of Real Music/Enemies of Tripe. Thank you!
We owe God our best, and it is my considered opinion that NONE of the lyrics offered thus far for our consideration in this discussion remotely qualify. (And I'm sure the same is true of the tunes.)
Someone else, Lord
Please not me, Lord
I am hiding underneath my bed
I won't go, Lord
I'm too scared, Lord
Won't you please send someone else instead?
quote:
Originally posted by Oriel:
That`s not the one that goesOJesusI have prom ised (pom pom pom)
Toservetheeto the end (pom pom pom pom)
Bethouforev er near me (pom pom pom)
Mymasterand my friend
I-shall-not fear the battle (da-da-da)
If-thou-art by my side
No-or WANder from the pa-athway
If thou wilt be my guide (pom, pom, PA-da and into next verse)is it?
That'll be the one......
quote:
Originally posted by Oriel:
That`s not the one that goesOJesusI have prom ised (pom pom pom)
Toservetheeto the end (pom pom pom pom)
Bethouforev er near me (pom pom pom)
Mymasterand my friend
I-shall-not fear the battle (da-da-da)
If-thou-art by my side
No-or WANder from the pa-athway
If thou wilt be my guide (pom, pom, PA-da and into next verse)is it?
What a fabulous rendition! I couldn't for the life of me remember the tune, but suddenly - thanks to your effortless use of punctuation - it all came flooding back, and now it won't leave. At all. Even whistling the Great Escape isn't working.
I'm not a happy ginger.
Since posting yesterday seem to have got that 'I Jump up high' song on the brain!! Can't stop whistling it!
Wondered why there was a gust of laughter from Mr M and daughter last night as I wandered into TV room mid-rendition. Turns out Ricky Gervaise was just sounding forth about people who whistle.
I have been sent to Room 101!
quote:
Originally posted by Oriel
That`s not the one that goesOJesusI have prom ised (pom pom pom)
Toservetheeto the end (pom pom pom pom)
Bethouforev er near me (pom pom pom)
Mymasterand my friend
I-shall-not fear the battle (da-da-da)
If-thou-art by my side
No-or WANder from the pa-athway
If thou wilt be my guide (pom, pom, PA-da and into next verse)is it?
*Irony* Thank you so much - you've now removed my current crap chorus from my brain almost totally. I'm not sure if this is a good thing or not...
Anyhow, anyone else get really bugged by " I want to walk with Jesus Christ"? It's not the words, so much as the tune, which sounds as though it should be performed by a German Ooom-pah band!! I'm almost completely incapable of singing this, as I end up convulsed with laughter!
quote:
Originally posted by Gill H:
Honest version of 'here I am Lord':Someone else, Lord
Please not me, Lord
I am hiding underneath my bed
I won't go, Lord
I'm too scared, Lord
Won't you please send someone else instead?
Exactly what i'm thinking ATM...Thanks GillH!!
quote:
We did a couple of new songs on Sunday and once again Christian Music is leading the way. First up was A delightful ditty which started off with the line "Two sins have we commited".Yeah and the rest.
If you are talking about the song that goes:
"two sins have we committed,
Two sins are plain before our eyes
We have turned from you,
the fount of living water
and have tried to drink from cisterns cracked and dry"
Then you are talking about a song written by a guy called Sam Chaplin who is a mate of mine and a thoroughly fantastic bloke and
It's also a cool song. and YES I believe he's right about the two sins. That essentially is what all our sin revolves around...rejecting God and embracing idols..including idolising ourselves.
As a general point, is taking the piss out of people's musical efforts really neccesssary?
If you don't like them. Don't sing them. But as a song writer myself, I HATE placing new songs before churches. It takes a lot of guts for people to stand up in front of a church with a new song.
The Bible calls us to "sing a new song to the lord" and ok, so you might not like it, but you could at least applaud people for having a go.
Our offerings to God are like a child's painting. When your 3 year old kid tells you you they've painted a picture of you, you don't comment on their water colour technique. You love it for the offering and the gift of love it represents.
Stop dissing your brothers an sisters and start encouraging them instead.
Ok....getting all het up now. This is hell after all
quote:
Originally posted by Matt the Mad Medic:
Then you are talking about a song written by a guy called Sam Chaplin who is a mate of mine and a thoroughly fantastic bloke
I have no doubts that he is but sorry I just don't like that song. Personally If I make something which people don't like I'd like to know as you've let me know with your reply.
The song: O let all who are thirsty. It`s a lovely slow piece, which I sang solo in church yesterday. But the arrangement! It needs a moving bassline, for sure, but does that justify the dee-daw siren effect that goes right the way through it? This was in the most recent edition of Hymns Old and New. In an older edition there`s a different arrangement; not that good either, but a lot better. So why did they feel the need to change it?
And the lyric? The third line of the last verse. "Bring the children without might". What on earth is that about?
My heart shall sing
Of the day you bring
Let the fires of your justice burn
Wipe away all tears
For my dawn draws near
And the world is about to turn
They invariably accompanied it with a flute and a fiddle and played gaily-tripping-along at breakneck speed. This caused my friend Bob and me to dub it "The Pirate Ditty." Whenever the choir launched into it we'd catch each other's eye across the nave and mouth the words, "Arr Matey!" while gleefully hoisting imaginary flagons of ale.
My personal favourite bad hymn is "There is a fountain filled with blood" -- I once worked in a Christian community where the naughty students would repeatedly request this, and it was then sung very earnestly by half the community while the other half bit the insides of their cheeks hard to keep from screaming. Seriously though, I direct a kids' choir at our church and it's awfully tough to find songs for the un-tutored young singer that don't make me barf. Any suggestions?
John Holding
My current unfavourite is nothing to do with the (rather pleasant) tune but the utterly un-Christian theology.
"Dear Lord and Father of Mankind"
I now find strength not to sing it. Maybe when I'm a bit bolder I'll find the strength not to stand up when everyine else is.
It should appear in no Christian hymnbook. Vile.
quote:
Oriel -- don`t know Hymns Old And new, but what you sang looks a lot to me like a song from the 70s by the St. Louis Jesuits (Foley, SChutte are the key names). In which case, the mysterious line is "Bring the children, without price" -- for rationale, look at the passage from Isaiah (I think) from which this is drawn.
Given that the next line is "Easy the load and light", I reckon somebody at some point decided that rhyme was more important than sense. Of course, good writers can do both at once.. Here are the full words, including "Without might".
quote:
I have heard people object to the first line of "Dear Lord and Father of Mankind", on the basis that God is not the Father of everyone, but only of those who have been saved. Personally I disagree with that view (if I was going to be picky I'd object to exclusive language, but I don't believe in rewriting hymns), but I've never heard anyone condemn the whole hymn. What's the problem with the rest of it?
It is perfectly Biblical to say that God is the father of us all! Trust me, I'm, a Calvinist.
The problem is first that the rest of the hymn, as a hymn, though perhaps theistic, is not Christian. I can cope with that - obviously much of the praise we use is Jewish and not Christian, and I have no problem with those beautiful Muslim prayer-poems the exordium to the Koran and the call to prayer...
But DLAFOM is specifically anti-Christian at points, anti-incarnational, gnostic, anti-materialist.
Oh nuts, I think we need to start a new thread because this wanders off-topic.
I'm going to try to set one up in Purgatory because it merits Serious Theological Discussion rhater than name-calling. If it works it will be my first thread!
![[Devil]](graemlins/devil.gif)
while at the "ancient" end, a few lines in "Come thou holy Paraclete" (nothing like accessible terms for the Holy Spirit!) always make me start sniggering:
quote:Presumably these virgins would be frigid?
Originally posted by adso:
Oh, and there's an obscure verse in "For the beauty of the earth" that contains the line:
"For thy virgins robed in snow"
![[Snigger]](graemlins/snigger.gif)
![[Waterworks]](graemlins/bawling.gif)
or ![[Projectile]](graemlins/puke2.gif)
quote:My most detested, music-and-words-wildly-mismatched hymn is "Love Lifted Me".
Originally posted by mysticlisa:
Not the song's fault... just twisted students at Calvary Bible College singing in loud, happy voices:
Years I spent in vanity and pride
Caring not my Lord was crucified
Knowing not it was for me He died...
While At Calvary!
And finally... is there anything worse than contemporary Christian wedding music??? I probably hate this 1) because it only talks about a woman's submission and nothing about a man's role... and 2) I'm divorced and am probably still bitter and angry and.... No!!! This song is crap! And I had to sing it at my college roommate's wedding:
(picture sweet fluttery music)
A gen-tle, qui-et spi-rit
An in-ner pee-eace of mind
A gen-tle qui-et spi-rit
Such hap-pi-ne-e-ess I find
Through yield-ing i-in sub-mis-sion
This is the Fa-a-ther's plan
A gen-tle, qui-et spi-rit
Show-ing sweet love for my man.
Not sure if I want to
![[Flaming]](graemlins/angryfire.gif)
![[Help]](graemlins/help.gif)
quote:Much better.
Originally posted by Gill H:
How about this for a wedding song?
Three part harmony
Not too treacly, and no mention of submission.
quote:I live to serve.
Originally posted by Beethoven:
our vicar currently seems to have adopted 'Bind us together'. Thanks CM - this will never be the same again
quote:Erm...doesn't that make two seals?
Originally posted by Inanna:
Come set me like a seal upon your arm
A seal protecting your heart
![[Paranoid]](graemlins/paranoid.gif)
If this is derived from the Song Of Solomon, I hate to think what they might be up to.
quote:Allow me to drive you all insane...
Originally posted by Snow White:
Does anyone else know this one? I can't remember all of the words but I know it starts like this...
"Mister Cow, how do you
Say to God "I love yoooo"?
AHHHHHH!
quote:I have a sneaking fondness for that one, but only becuase the frst time I heard it, it was on a tape that our sunday school co-ordinator had got from somewhere and was maing us listen to because it was funny. Especially that when it gets to Mr Sheep, when he replies he has a very definite Welsh accent. (Well I sit arrrrround..). No stereotyping here!
Originally posted by sarkycow:
quote:Allow me to drive you all insane...
Originally posted by Snow White:
[qb]Does anyone else know this one? I can't remember all of the words but I know it starts like this...
"Mister Cow, how do you
Say to God "I love yoooo"?
AHHHHHH!
Mi-ster Cow, how do you
Say to the Lo-ord I lo-ove you?
Mi-ster Cow, how do you
Say to the Lo-ord I love you?
Well I stand around in a field all day
Which gives me plen-ty of time to say:
Mooooo, moooooo
I love you.
[QB]
quote:Not... saying... a word!
Originally posted by Inanna:
wanting to make barking noises and start clapping flippers together...
Shame really, coz my partner would rather like it for our committment ceremony...
quote:
Main Entry: 1cow
Pronunciation: 'kau
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English cou, from Old English cu; akin to Old High German kuo cow, Latin bos head of cattle, Greek bous, Sanskrit go
Date: before 12th century
1 a : the mature female of cattle (genus Bos) b : the mature female of various usually large animals (as an elephant, whale, or moose)
quote:Nice try. Too bad others have access to dictionaries too, isn't it?
2 : a domestic bovine animal regardless of sex or age
quote:Obviously, arguing about whether Christmas in July is hellish.
Originally posted by tomb:
What could be more hellish than Christmas in July?
quote:I suspect your organist plays it in a very slow, dragging manner. Some people think that all plainsongs should sound like dirges.
I don't know if this has been addressed before, but I would forego Advent and even happily skip Christmas not to have to sing "Oh come, Oh come, Eee-MAAAAAAAHHHnnnnYOOOOOOelllll".
But most of the time the end result is a smooth piece of music with no gasping inhales audible in it.
![[Ultra confused]](graemlins/confused2.gif)
quote:Come on and celebrate,
Originally posted by Mousethief:
Bongo: what song is the "cellotape" thing meant to be a spoof of?
Reader Alexis
quote:I wanna be a flea for the Lord
Originally posted by Bongo:
Not sure if I've posted this somewhere back in the mists of time, but...anyway.
Anyone else recall this cringeworthy 'action song' (I can only remember the chorus)?:
I'm not a grasshopper, I'm a giant for the Lord (repeat 3 times)
When you get to the chorus, you're supposed to hurl your arms straight down in front of you (like line judges do when a ball is in at Wimbledon) and jump up and down maniacally. Good clean fun. NOT!
Failing that, a cow? quote:Hey, maybe we've all got it wrong? Jesus wasn't a man. He wasn't even human. He was a flower, in fact, a rose.
Originally posted by Mousethief:
The one I really hated, which is not a worship song per se but I have heard it done as "special music," is
Love Crucified a Rose.
I always wondered: what in the heck would Love do that for?
Reader ALexis
quote:Somebody was trying to be literary. All that rose imagery in medieval and early renaissance European poetry. If you're a disciple of D.F. Robertson (or you happen to be D.F. Robertson) you figure the Rose is Christ. If you're anybody else, you just assume it's a vagina.
Originally posted by Mousethief:
The one I really hated, which is not a worship song per se but I have heard it done as "special music," is
Love Crucified a Rose.
I always wondered: what in the heck would Love do that for?
Reader ALexis
quote:Mockery? For someone brave enough and selfless enough to perform the deed you just have? Never.
Originally posted by Scot:
Hmmm, either I'm going to be helpful OR I'm going to prove that I'm the only one too slow to pick up on the joke. However, just to show that I am selfless to a fault and exist only to help others...
I think you'll find that it is 'Love Crucified Arose' as in 'Love embodied in Christ, was Crucified and then Arose from the dead'
Okay, let the mockery begin.
quote:Somehow I have managed not to have heard that song. I gather I am blessed beyond all measure.
Originally posted by Amos:
I logged on this morning, Lord, because I just wanna lift up to you my brother Tomb who yesterday put the tune of "Shine Jesus Shine" into my head for the whole of the day.
quote:No, thanks. My day is fine just the way it is.
Originally posted by Ann:
Moo, just to make your day.
quote:is potentially a really good song but spoile by the horrible scansion in the second verse. An extra 5 minutes effort would have improved it no end.
The Lord's loving kindnesses
indeed will never cease
And his compassions
they will never fade away
They are new every morning
They are new every day
Great is thy faithfulness
The Lord's amazing grace
abounds to us every day
And his great mercies
they will never fade
quote:I have fond memories of that particular song from my house church days. According to the acetate we used the next line went:
The biggest grammatical irritation in modern crap choruses is that one that goes 'It was for freedom/That Christ has set us free.' Get yer tenses right, O shiny-gnashered ones.
![[Disappointed]](graemlins/disappointed.gif)
, but then again compared to what it could be... But in its context it is a little too silly to be singable.quote:That song was on my list of All-time Most Hated, for that line. It got redeemed, when I put it up on the original Crappy Chorus thread, and someone came back and told me what the the lyrics could be translated as (they're from Songs of Solomon)
Originally posted by Lux Mundi:
Sorry if this one has already been done, but I, and my friends at University used to balk at:
'...You do all things well;
Just look at our lives.'
from 'His Banner over me is Love.
I don't quite class my life as being that good
Lux
![[Sunny]](graemlins/flowerface.gif)
![[Puke]](graemlins/puke.gif)
quote:Want some salt to go with it?
Originally posted by Nightlamp:
How big is your chip Fr G?
quote:Fr G is Orthodox.
Originally posted by Nightlamp:
How big is your chip Fr G?
quote:OK Theology-lite churches
Originally posted by Fr. Gregory:
Dear Robert
What do you mean, "we"?
I haven't laughed so much for ages! Thanks everyone. But sometimes it isn't the hymn or song itself which is bad, but the context. For example, "Lord dismiss us with thy blessing" as the first hymn, or "The day thou gavest Lord is ended" at 10 AM. I can no longer sing "Take my life and let it be..." with a straight face since one of my choristers dubbed it "The Suicide Song" (and suggested that it should be used for organ transplant occasions).
- sorry, ranted too much
quote:Erm, can we just clarify exactly who amongst your friends at uni balked at that particular song? I always loved it. Maybe I was just too easily pleased.
Originally posted by Lux Mundi:
Sorry if this one has already been done, but I, and my friends at University used to balk at:
'...You do all things well;
Just look at our lives.'
from 'His Banner over me is Love.
) ) quote:Your wish is my command, Gill H
Originally posted by Gill H:
I've heard rumours of a 'prayer of Jabez' chorus asking God to 'enlarge my borders'. As a dedicated Weight Watcher, there's no way I'm asking God to enlarge my anything!
Could be a useful song for managers of large American bookstores though.
![[brick wall]](graemlins/brick_wall.gif)
quote:Don't worry, Elisabeth. It happened to me as well.
Originally posted by Elizabeth Still Believes:
And Elizabeth slowly becomes unglued as the long-repressed memories of Sunday school come flooding back....
One consisted of the line "God became a baby boy", repeated over and over and over and over again, and nothing else.
And then there was "Jesus was a child like me/ He would fall and scrape his knee/ His mom would soothe his hurt/ And clean up all the dirt/ Jesus was a child like me"
quote:How strange. Nor can I now. It definitely worked when I posted it...
Originally posted by Gill H:
Thanks Birdie, but I couldn't get in without a password.
quote:
Originally posted by jlg:
Funeral hymns. hmmm. One of the standards in the local RC churches here (where I cantor at funerals) is "How Great Thou Art". I've never figured out quite how it fits a funeral, especially with the typical American RCs who never sing all the verses of a hymn. So you end up singing two verses about mountain grandeur, twittering birds, and silvery moons and then abruptly ending. Drives me nuts!
quote:Not the most beautiful of poetry, but it is better than many. But there was something familiar about the tune...
Give thanks, with a grateful heart
Give thanks, to the Holy One
Give thanks, because He's given
Jesus Christ, His Son
And now, let the weak say "I am strong"
let the poor say "I am rich"
because of what the Lord has done for me
quote:
Give thanks, with a grateful heart
Give thanks, to the Holy One
Give thanks, because He's given
Jesus Christ, His Son......
And they played The Village People's other song, the one that isn't about the YMCA: Go West!.
![[Killing me]](graemlins/killingme.gif)
)
quote:
Originally posted by ChrisT:
Last year we did a modified version of 'Venus' where the title was changed to 'Jesus'.
I kid you not.
How would that work?! I could be mistaken, but didn't the words go something like: for the last hour. Brings back fond memories..quote:after a lapse of about thirty years, somehow my mind became filled with memories of a dreadful song about
![[Not worthy!]](graemlins/notworthy.gif)
![[Embarrassed]](icon_redface.gif){kind=icon}
Sorry.
quote:While working overseas and looking for a church, after four weeks at one I thought it was it: great people, good sermons and services, great hymns, nice pipe organ.
Originally posted by Sauerkraut:
I most sincerely appologise if "Shine, Jesus, Shine" has been addressed already. If it has, it probably hasn't been addressed in this way: have you ever heard "Shine, Jesus, Shine" on a pipe organ? If you haven't, save yourself the trouble. I've been through it, and I would rather have my head slammed into a brick wall than hear that attrocious combination again. That song was last played over a year ago. I told the pastors I would leave if that song was ever played again. Fortunately, my threat carries some weight since I am the bell choir director.
quote:This reminded me of the time my Dad walked out of an Easter service when I was a teenager (some 25 years ago). The vicar had chosen a hymn which was sung to the tune of the Drunken Sailor. The chorus went thusly
Originally posted by little Miss Sparkle:
How would that work?! I could be mistaken, but didn't the words go something like:
I'm your Venus, I'm your fire, Your desire ..
Is it just me or would that wound rather odd if you put 'Jesus' in instead of Venus?
quote:And, on the topic of inappropriate wedding hymns I have two favourites, I'm dreaming of a white Christmas and Balfour Gardiner's wonderful but puzzling as a choice for a wedding Evening hymn with its second verse about defending us from all nightly fears and fantasies.
Way-oh and up he rises
Way-oh and up he rises
Way-oh and up he rises
Early in the morning.
quote:I am sorry you had to go through that. Really, I wouldn't want even my worst enemy to have to go through that torture. It is so bad with me that I cannot listen to any version of that song anymore without hearing the organ moaning like a dying whale in my head. It is making the hair on the back of my neck stand up just thinking about it.
Originally posted by Admiral Holder:
While working overseas and looking for a church, after four weeks at one I thought it was it: great people, good sermons and services, great hymns, nice pipe organ.
And guess what was played on the fifth week? On the pipe organ?
And guess who never went back?
Sauerkraut, you are right. It was the most horrific experience one can imagine.
Admiral.
quote:My dad used to sing, out loud and in church, "They'll know we are Christians by our bumper stickers".
Originally posted by Newman's Own:
Then again, that was probably a cut above "They'll Know we are Christians by Our Love," which assumed that we had already arrived.
quote:Indeed: and our leaders' talents extended to:
Originally posted by Jengie:
Anyone remember the Sunday School collection hymn
Dropping, dropping dropping
Hear the pennies fall
Every one for Jesus.
He shall have them all.
quote:Argh! I had forgotten this one!
Originally posted by Newman's Own:
Then again, that was probably a cut above "They'll Know we are Christians by Our Love," which assumed that we had already arrived.
quote:Mine was even more horrible than yours.
Originally posted by Anselmina:
A verse for 'Jesus loves me, this I know, for the Bible tells me so' that I can't find in my hymn-book, but that we sung at our Sunday School run by some independent evangelical folk went like this.
'Jesus loves the Indian boy
bow and arrow for his toy;
And he loves the cowboy, too
with his horse and big lassoo
Yes, Jesus loves me, Yes, Jesus loves me etc'
Were we the only ones to sing this er... rather unusual version?
quote:Goodness, isn't that against the RC rules or such? Or is omission not the same as openly saying different things?
Originally posted by Newman's Own:
In one RC parish of which I knew (and, of course, never attended), the head of the religious education programme was constantly re-writing hymns - not only to make sure God was never referred to as He, but to eliminate all mention of sin, forgiveness, or anything else that would potentially wound the self esteem of the godly children.
quote:
Rock my soul in the bosom of Abraham
Rock my soul in the bosom of Abraham
Rock my soul in the bosom of Abraham
Oh, rock my soul
So high (reach up you hip-young youth!) I can't get over it
So low (reach down LOW!) I can't get under it
So wide (spread out your hands) I can't get round it
Oh, rock my soul
Rock my soul
Rock my soul
Rock my soul
Oh, rock my soul
quote:Dare I confess ignorance and ask for a quick explanation - or link - to nihil obstat and imprimatur?
Originally posted by ChastMastr:
Wow! I figured the whole nihil obstat and imprimatur business would be absolute necessities for hymns as well...
quote:How anyone can sing the final line without a trace of "huh?" or "WTF?!" is beyond me. Whilst being the gungho happy clappy I am I appreciate the sentiment, I mean, could it be phrased any more sexually? Almost as bad as
My Jesus, my lifeline
I need you more than I've ever known
There's no-one quite like you
I'm crying out for your loving
quote:Wake up people.
Take me just the way I am
quote:To be fair, I think it was intended more as a personal song used in performance by the writer. A sort of apology for having inglicted so many glib choruses on the church
Originally posted by Sheriff Pony:
I think it's called "The Heart of Worship," . . . I think. Frankly, I shield my eyes when it comes up on the OHP, so I'm not sure.
quote:I know this one as "I Could Sing of Your Love Forever," and it tends to go on . . . forever. ("This is the song that never ends / It goes on and on my friends") And if it must be sung at all, the bridge portion that you quote above should be left out. In my staid, conservative Lutheran church such a sight would be . . . inconceivable!
Originally posted by Jack the Lass:
The one that gets me every time, from "Over the Mountains and the Sea":
Oh I feel like dancing
It's foolishness I know
For when the world has seen the light
They will dance with joy like we're dancing no-o-ow...
Where I go this song is usually sung as a slow-ish worshipful thing rather than boppy and dancey, so whenever that bit gets sung I always have to do a double take - I *don't* feel like dancing (never do), and *nobody* is dancing now. Although whenever that last line is sung there's usually someone who'll start shuffling guiltily.
quote:I quite agree with all your comments, Sheriff Pony. My added gripe is that the writer keeps saying that worship is all about God, and then starting talking about himself again. Now, I don't mind songs of the "This is where I'm at" variety, as long as they're not overused. However, saying that you've sinned by making worship all about yourself, while singing a song which is essentially all about yourself, is a bit much!
Originally posted by Sheriff Pony:
I think it's called "The Heart of Worship," . . . I think. Frankly, I shield my eyes when it comes up on the OHP, so I'm not sure......
-----------
When the music fades
and all is stripped away
and I simply come,
longing just to bring
something that's of worth
that will bless Your heart.[1]
I'll bring You more than a song
for a song in itself
is not what You have required.[2]
You search much deeper within
through the way things appear[3]
You're looking into my heart.
I'm coming back to the heart of worship
And it's all about You.
It's all about You, Jesus.
I'm sorry Lord for the thing I've made it,[4]
when it's all about You,
it's all about You, Jesus.
---------.
quote:Amen! Amen! I rarely get up and leave a service, but it's either that or risk apoplexy when this ditty is sung. And for some insane reason, our choir seem to LIKE it.
Originally posted by Sheriff Pony:
I'm not even going to check to see if this one has been mentioned, but every time this one shows up on Sunday morning, my worship time is RUINED! RUINED, I tell ya!
I think it's called "The Heart of Worship," . . . I think. Frankly, I shield my eyes when it comes up on the OHP, so I'm not sure.
As with most crappy choruses, it's not just the words, the tune, or the way certain lines are emphasized. It's the way they all combine.
quote:Aye, and for sure if you'd been a Roman, you'd have known the glorious hymn, "Oh, Mary, Queen of Blooming May." (Mercifully, I remember only that first phrase.) Selah.
Originally posted by simon 2:
In reference to the tree song, I read it as 'then I'll be a bloomin tree'. Bloomin as in 'aye that were a bloomin fine pint'.
quote:What actually makes it strangest is that the song is quite lively until you get to the bit about dancing, at which point dancing is just impossible!
Originally posted by Jack the Lass:
The one that gets me every time, from "Over the Mountains and the Sea":
<snip>
Where I go this song is usually sung as a slow-ish worshipful thing rather than boppy and dancey, so whenever that bit gets sung I always have to do a double take - I *don't* feel like dancing (never do), and *nobody* is dancing now. Although whenever that last line is sung there's usually someone who'll start shuffling guiltily.
quote:That's the Bible! It's from Isaiah 52!
Originally posted by nicolemrw:
lovely appear
over the mountains
the feet of those that preach
and bring good news
quote:Burn it.
Originally posted by ken:
...You'll be telling me I have to hand in my videotape of Sleepless in Seattle next.
...
quote:When we first sang this when I was quite young I thought the words were "rocker my soul in the bosom on Adrian" which was confusing as who was Adrian and why did he have bosoms?? people dont realise how much they can confuse kids...
Rock my soul in the bosom of Abraham
Rock my soul in the bosom of Abraham
Rock my soul in the bosom of Abraham
Oh, rock my soul
So high (reach up you hip-young youth!) I can't get over it
So low (reach down LOW!) I can't get under it
So wide (spread out your hands) I can't get round it
Oh, rock my soul
Rock my soul
Rock my soul
Rock my soul
Oh, rock my soul
quote:Ya know, I agree that this song is naff and gooey, but it makes me cry. If I read the words or hear others sing it, I find it completely gag worthy. But as soon as I join in the singing, I get a huge gut punch from the Holy Spirit. Go figger.
Originally posted by oswald:
I beg your pardon, that should have read:
For I will raise him up
For I will raise him up etc
It was Our Lord speaking, I forgot; the effect is the same though.
quote:One acquaintance of mine had told me that, when he was young, he'd heard "All Hail the Power of Jesus' name, let angels prostrate fall," and thought that a fallen prostate was an unfortunate condition which one would think a horrid thing to wish on an angel.
Originally posted by Hope Seeker:
What she heard: "And we entirely desire thy chocolately goodness"
![[Angel]](graemlins/angel.gif)
quote:I think I mentioned this before, but my dad liked to loudly sing "They'll know we are Christians by our bumperstickers". Mom wanted to crawl away.
Originally posted by Newman's Own:
Refrain:
And they'll know we are Christians by our love, by our love,
Yes, they'll know we are Christians by our love.
quote:Ebenezer means "stone of help", at least that's what it means in 1Sam 7:12.
Come thou fount of every blessing here, though I haven't heard of an Ebenezer being used as a swear word or obscene term before, Amos.
In fact, I don't understand what the line in the hymn is supposed to mean.
) quote:I have fond memories of it from the 1970s, but I don't think I've heard it sung for 20 years.
Originally posted by Newman's Own:
All right, old timers, who remembers this 60s gem (for which the melody reminded me of some sort of old film about American Indians.)
We are one in the Spirit,
We are one in the Lord,
We are one in the Spirit,
quote:I quite like it too.
Originally posted by Sine Nomine:
He stands up and nervously clears his throat...
Hello, my name is Sine N., and...and...I LIKE "I am the bread of life"
He bursts into tears and runs from the room.
quote:Actually, you can sing "Amazing Grace" to a large number of 1960s sitcom theme songs. Try out "The Brady Bunch" or "My Three Sons" or "The Andy Griffith Show."
Originally posted by Cassandra W:
Oh, and am I the only one who has ever sung the hymn "Amazing Grace" to the tune of the Gilligan's Island theme?
quote:[aside]My brother was at a youth conference and won a free t-shirt for doing that very thing on stage in front of everybody![/end of aside]
Originally posted by Cassandra W:
<snip>OK, feel better for saying that. Oh, and am I the only one who has ever sung the hymn "Amazing Grace" to the tune of the Gilligan's Island theme?
quote:I was talking about the third and 4th lines of this one , Newman's own, which I think are concerned with the idea of redemption...
Originally posted by Newman's Own:
This one must be so bad that the lyrics escape me, but does anyone remember a dreadful song called "Let Us Come to the Water"? All I can remember is something about "and let all who have nothing, let them come to the Lord."
quote:They published them in a book called "Youth Praise". We used to use it in the 1970s, when it was already getting dog-eared and superannuated.
Originally posted by Newman's Own:
I believe that there must have been a weekend, c. 1965, when those who knew how to play exactly four guitar chords, and had never composed anything previously, got together and wrote about 100 pieces.
quote:
Originally posted by Gill H:
Joyeux, try singing it as 'Give thanks with a grapefruit tart', or just think of it as the Village People/Pet Shop Boys song 'Go West' - it's exactly the same tune, just a better dance routine.
I'll have to remember that the next time my church has a special service of Thanksgiving... the choir member/congregation member who can't sing and is turning purple will be me suffering from unexpressed laughter!
quote:My offspring used to embarrass me by singing the football version: Allez, a les Strasbourgeois!
Originally posted by Joyeux:
quote:
Originally posted by Gill H:
Joyeux, try singing it as 'Give thanks with a grapefruit tart', or just think of it as the Village People/Pet Shop Boys song 'Go West' - it's exactly the same tune, just a better dance routine.
quote:Which is frighteningly close to what all we boys hoped would happen on those co-ed youth group trips.
It only takes a spark
To get a fire goin'
And soon all those about
Can warm up to its glowin'
quote:It is very late now, and time for a brief prayer before I finally go to sleep. I shall include one of thanksgiving that I am acquainted neither with such a book nor with the climate in which it would grow... (Incidentally, I only heard the "Fountain" song once in my life. A young man I knew, who was a minister of one of the Reformed churches, told me of his organist introducing it - bleaaah!)
Originally posted by tomb:
Which reminds me: surely you have encountered Virginia Carey Hudson's Oh ye jigs and juleps, a delightful little book about growing up Episcopalian in the south.
quote:And this, which none of us worked out how to pronounce anyway:
Jehovah Jirah, my provider
His grace is sufficient for me, for ME! FOR MEEEEEEEE!!!
Jehovah Jirah, my provider
His grace is sufficient for me.
My God shall supply all my needs
According to his riches in glory.
He shall give his angels charge over me
Jehovah Jireh cares for me, for ME! FOR MEEEEEEEE!!!
Jehovah Jireh cares for me!
quote:Admiral.
El Shaddai, El Shaddai,
El Elyonna Adonai,
age to age you're still the same,
by the power of the name.
El Shaddai, El Shaddai,
erkamkana Adonai,
we will praise and lift you high,
El Shaddai.
quote:
Originally posted by ken:
Though that wasn't ever quite as naff as the excruciating "100 Hymns for Today" which was a mixture of Peter-Paul-and-Mary style "protest songs" mixed with some sub-Vaughan Williams Anglo-Catholic polite disbelief.
quote:You clearly haven't seen Gather Australia
I didn't think Romans could ever come up with something so naff!
quote:They don't write 'em like that any more
Man of Sorrows! what a name
For the Son of God, Who came
Ruined sinners to reclaim.
Hallelujah! What a Savior!
Bearing shame and scoffing rude,
In my place condemned He stood;
Sealed my pardon with His blood.
Hallelujah! What a Savior!
Guilty, vile, and helpless we;
Spotless Lamb of God was He;
?Full atonement!? can it be?
Hallelujah! What a Savior!
Lifted up was He to die;
?It is finished!? was His cry;
Now in heav?n exalted high.
Hallelujah! What a Savior!
When He comes, our glorious King,
All His ransomed home to bring,
Then anew His song we?ll sing:
Hallelujah! What a Savior!
quote:And, since "Weird Al" Yankovic did the "Brady Bunch" theme to the tune of the 1980s pop song "The Safety Dance" (by Men Without Hats), ergo...
Originally posted by Sheriff Pony:
quote:Actually, you can sing "Amazing Grace" to a large number of 1960s sitcom theme songs. Try out "The Brady Bunch" or "My Three Sons" or "The Andy Griffith Show."
Originally posted by Cassandra W:
Oh, and am I the only one who has ever sung the hymn "Amazing Grace" to the tune of the Gilligan's Island theme?
quote:I remember the first time I heard this song. It was at a play called "Tony 'N' Tina's Wedding," which is about the Italian wedding from hell. Anyway, the groom's sister (a nun, of course), came out front with a guitar and had everyone in the church sing this song. My cousin happened to be in the play and he sent his boss ion the play to come harass me during this song. Needless to say, "eat his booty" now goes through my head whenever I hear this song. Considering how bad the song is, it is probably an improvement.
Originally posted by Newman's Own:
Refrain:
Sons of God, here his holy word,
Gather round the table of the Lord.
Eat his Body, drink His Blood.
And we'll sing a song of love,
Allelu, allelu, allelu, alleluia.
Verses (not necessarily in order - and I know there were others):
Brothers, sisters, we are one.
And our lives have just begun.
In the Spirit, we are young.
We can live forever.
Shout together to the Lord,
Who has promised our reward,
Happiness a hundredfold,
And we'll live forever.
If we want to live with him,
We must also die to him,
Die to selfishness and sin,
And we'll rise forever.
With the church we celebrate,
Jesus' coming we await,
So we make a holiday,
So we'll live forever.
quote:That is like me with "God rest you merry Gentlemen":
Originally posted by Amelie:
I like the song 'Man of Sorrows' very much, but I always want to sing 'stood' and 'blood' as if they rhyme with rude in the second verse which always distracts me.
- and forgets to rhyme 'wind' with 'mind'. quote:Yes, I dangle off people's necks! PEDANT!
Originally posted by me:
I am a pendant, aren't I???
Admiral.
quote:Yes.
Out of curiousity, did "mind" and "wind" once rhyme? I assume so, given the song.
quote:When I lived in Atlanta, I heard a local band do Amazing Grace to the tune of "Purple Haze". That was cool! And the guitarist got so into the solo, that he would broke every guitar string but one.
Originally posted by Cassandra W:
OK, feel better for saying that. Oh, and am I the only one who has ever sung the hymn "Amazing Grace" to the tune of the Gilligan's Island theme?
Cassandra
quote:Nice one, Insomniac! Haven't heard it, but it reminds me of a song by Sweet in the late 70's....
More than oxygen I need your love/more than the life-giving food the hungry dream of
quote:What did you restain yourself with, Bob, and could you get the stain out afterwards? And what about the cremation when the chosen hymn for the contained the line "So light up the fires and let the flames burn"?!
Had to restain myself from laughing at the irony of the words at a wedding
quote:I hadn't - I used google and it came up with a letters page from the Catholic Weekly: "Is Gather Australia un-Catholic"!!! Sounds interesting.
Originally posted by Cusanus:
quote:You clearly haven't seen Gather Australia
I didn't think Romans could ever come up with something so naff!
quote:Of course, it's obligatory to repeat 10,000 times and get faster and faster as you do...
King of Kings and Lord of Lords, Glory Hallelujah!
King of Kings and Lord of Lords, Glory Hallelujah!
Jesus Prince of Peace, Glory Hallelujah!
Jesus Prince of Peace, Glory Hallelujah!
quote:
If God can love turkeys,
God can love you.
For you are a turkey,
but I am one too.
So when you're lonely, wa-ooo
Remember the truth.
If God can love turkeys,
God can love you.
quote:Is lovely hymn. Specially the bit about dropping thy still dews of quietness & etc.
Originally posted by bobthemagicviking:
Was at a wedding last summer where Dear Lord and Father of mankind was sung. Had to restain myself from laughing at the irony of the words at a wedding
quote:- a bit too close a comment on the behaviour of the bridegroom (to whom I had taken something of a disliking by this stage...)
Dear Lord and Father of Mankind
Forgive our foolish ways...
![[Two face]](graemlins/scot_twoface.gif)
) that it's impossible to get into as an average punter... Ignoring the triteness of the words..
quote:multipara and I recently sang at the Jubilee Mass for six Sisters of Mercy, under the resolute direction of Madame la Directrice.
Originally posted by multipara:
Ken, that sounds VERY Catholic (note upper-case) to me !!
quote:Not exactly in the tone of this thread, but I agree with KLS. I have terrible trouble getting my wife to sing, because she is convinced that she can't.
Originally posted by Karl - Liberal Backslider:
Bet he could. Very few people can't sing in tune. It's about motivation, and the fact that anyone who isn't of recording quality tends to get told they "can't sing" in our society. So they don't.
)
quote:At least you have a worship band.
Originally posted by busyknitter:
There really is nothing worse than the local parish church worship team (2 guitars and an electronic keyboard, no bass, no drums and no-one under 40), trying to reproduce the effect of a stadium number from New Wine, Greenbelt or wherever.
As far as the men are concerned I'm almost the least bad singer
quote:Oh my, that's bad
Originally posted by Ken
As far as I can tell I think I'm probably the most musically able member of our congregation - and I'm not joking As far as the men are concerned I'm almost the least bad singer
quote:The Cliff connection aside, what's so awful about the song? You can't fault the lyrics. And I've seen you belting out Auld Lang Syne at enough New Year parties to know that the tune doesn't repel you. I think it's anti-Cliff snobbery. When I was 12 it was compulsory to hold a similar attitude towards anything by Abba. When I was 16 you had to hate Chic. You're just trying to make me bow to peer pressure.
The less said about the Cliff matter the better. Some things are too horrid to contemplate. If you persist in liking the song I'll have to come over and sing at you
quote:When I was at a church which sung this regularly, I always imagine a divine response along the following lines:
Originally posted by Sauerkraut:
...
Open our eyes Lord
We want to see Jesus
To reach out and touch him
And say that we love him
Open our ears Lord
Help us to listen
Open our eyes Lord
We want to see Jesus
...
) is:
will never write another song like this again!!!
quote:I shall stop here due to copyright laws. There are two things wrong with this hymn. First, someone got the bright idea that this should be our hymn of praise. I have no problem with replacing the hymn of praise (our ruberics allow for such), but it better be as good theologically and musically as the Gloria. There are very good hymns within our hymnal as replacements. But no, we had to get untrinitarian garbage from the Baptists (it could be the Pentecostals or non-denominationalists for all I care, a good Lutheran will still blame it on the Baptists), or, more specifically, the Gaithers. Yuck. Secondly, this stufff sounds like it comes out of a Baptist hymnal. Lutheran hymnody sounds like traditional Catholic hymnody. This song sounds like the organ needs to be played with vibratto galore. This is American spiritual; stuff that is just outside our tradition that, when brought in, sound weird and is distracting to everyone. We all look at each other and ask what the heck our pastors were thinking.
God sent his Son, they call Him Jesus
He came to love, heal and forgive
He lived and died to buy my pardon;
An empty grave is there to prove my Saviour lives
Because He lives I can face tomorow
Because He lives all fear is gone
Because I know He hold the future
And life is worth the living just because He lives
quote:The meter is 3/4. It is being played on an organ. Um bah bah! Um bah bah! You could have played the Sonata Da Circo (Circus Sonata) by PDQ Bach and I wouldn't have known the difference. This is very distracting while trying to take communion. Add to it the wonderous songs "God is so Good" and "Alleluia", two more songs that try hard to say nothing, and you liturgy has sunk to a new low. Handel's "Halleluia Chorus" could not recessitate this musical-liturgical nightmare of an Easter service. I tried. I direct that handbell chior and, knowing my church's tendencies toward crappy music and cut up liturgy, I desperately fought the tide by choosing music that is within the bounds of Lutheran Hymnody. I have failed. I will make one last gasp with Beethoven's Ode to Joy (Joyful, Joyful We Adore Thee). I am fighting a loosing cause.
To God be the glory
Great things He hath done,
So loved He the world
That he gave us his Son.
Who yielded His life
An attonement for sin
And opened the lifegate
That all may go in.
Praise the Lord, praise the Lord
Let the earth hear His voice!
Praise the Lord, Praise the Lord,
Let the people rejoice!
O come to the father
through Jesus the Son
And give Him the glory
Great things He hath done.
. The only officers here are the hosts, the administrators, and, of course, our glorious Captain, Simon Jenkins!) )
quote:I am most familiar with this being sung at funerals (the whole song not just this bit), and have always found it just a bit bizzare!
Because He lives I can face tomorow
Because He lives all fear is gone
Because I know He hold the future
And life is worth the living just because He lives
quote:Glad to hear it, Alliebellie....
Originally posted by Alliebellie:
(btw... yep, TonyK, I've read all the guff!!!)
quote:ever since my friend leaned over one time we were in the middle of this verse and whispered "we call this the cyclist's lament"
"....I woke, the dungeion flamed with light; My chains fell off, my heart was free;.....
quote:Thanks a bunch, Alliebellie - it'll never be the same for me either!
Originally posted by Alliebellie:
Yes, I know it's not a naff hymn (at least I don't think so, but feel free to put me straight!), but I have never again been able to sing the hymn "And can it be" (Charles Wesley)with a straight face in the verse that goesquote:ever since my friend leaned over one time we were in the middle of this verse and whispered "we call this the cyclist's lament"
"....I woke, the dungeion flamed with light; My chains fell off, my heart was free;.....
quote:The 60's? I didn't encounter that until the late 80's!
Originally posted by Newman's Own:
All right, old timers, who remembers this 60s gem (for which the melody reminded me of some sort of old film about American Indians.)
We are one in the Spirit,
We are one in the Lord,
We are one in the Spirit,
We are one in the Lord,
And we pray that all unity shall one day be restored.
Refrain:
And they'll know we are Christians by our love, by our love,
Yes, they'll know we are Christians by our love.
quote:In that case, welcome to SOF, although I'm afraid you are not likely to be noticed down here in Dead Horses.
Originally posted by CrossedTheTiber:
I'm new and I know this thread is old, but I kept reading all of your posts and laughing my head off. I remember a "delightful" song from childhood that went...
"I've got the joy, joy, joy, joy down in my heart." (I thought of the post about the five "grows".)
.quote:For all your virtual sipping, check out the Gin thread in MW
Originally posted by TonyK:
...promotion to Sipmate follows...
)
quote:Oh, I forgot to add. It has actions too. I'm sure you can guess, but when you are sat behind a group of older ladies who feel that they have to join in for their grandchildren and look as if they are in a mosh pit ...
Originally posted by Caver:
It is a childrens song about waking up in the morning and being so excited to go to school that (in the chorus) they go 'boing, boing, boing, boing, boing, boing' ... etc.
quote:Interesting. At first I thought it was Gordon Light (et al - Common Cup Company) "She flies on", under a different title. But it's definitely not.
Originally posted by Newman's Own:
Here is a gem which I heard the first time on Pentecost - and sincerely hope to never hear again. It's title was "Enemy of Apathy," and it took me a moment to realise it dealt with the Holy Spirit.
She sits like a bird, ...
quote:It is almost certainly a reference to Jeremiah 2:13 "for my people have committed two evils: they have forsaken me, the fountain of living waters, and hewed out cisterns for themselves, broken cisterns that can hold no water." These would be cisterns hewn from rock to hold water for drinking rather than toliet cisterns. So instead of a fountain of living water they would rather have still stagnant water in a cistern that rturns out to be broken anyway.
Originally posted by Punkijellybean:
Anyone know what the line "I tried the broken cisterns, Lord, but oh, the waters failed", is about? I kid you not. The hymn starts "O Christ in thee my soul have found....the peace, the joy", etc, etc. A good start, but downhill thereon after.
Seems like we now have cyclist hymns, and plumbers'anthems. Any other vocational specials??
quote:I heard it at Saint Alban's, Margravine Road, Fulham (West London.)
Originally posted by dorothea:
Elizabeth...that's a cracker...what sort of congregation would sing a hymn/song like that???
quote:Thank you so much!
Originally posted by Maestro:
A seasonal one from the English Hymnal, not crappy - just hilarious.
Saint Joseph stood beside the cradle
and embraced the Holy Child,
Then he knelt upon the sod..........
quote:This a Matt Redman song.
I lift you high
and bow down low
How high can You be?
How low can I go?
quote:Horrid piece of drivel! No, sadly, the use of it hasn't gone out, at least not on the Western side of the pond. Very common among RCs here. Thank God all my friends are already married
Originally posted by Newman's Own:
Though it is not a religious song per se, the quasi-religious elements (and misuse of the scripture quotations) in Paul Stookey's "Wedding Song" qualify it for inclusion here. It was not until this week, when a musician friend told me of requests for its use at weddings (I had hoped that long died out!), that I remembered the ghastly text.
As just one example: "The union of your spirit here has caused him to remain, for whenever two or more of you are gathered in his name, there is love..." We therefore have a bizarre picture of a God who has no existence of his own, but can be conjured - I suppose God can materialise, rather like a genie when one rubs the lamp, by people having sex.
quote:No, but did it have a good tune? I could imagine that with a stonking gospel tune this might pass muster.
Who remembers this one?
"Alleluia, I want to sing all about it,
Alleluia, I want to shout all about it,
Alleluia, I can't live without it, praise God,
Praise Go-o-o-o-D!
Now we're living in a new creation,
Now we're drinking at the well of salvation,
Now there is no condemnation,
Praise God, praise God, praise God."
I personally believe that, when the charismatic movement in mainline churches was popular (1970s), someone or other (with minimal musical gifts) was told to produce a hymnal full of original songs over the course of perhaps 2 days.
quote:I remember that! Not sure where from, School I guess.
Originally posted by Boopy:
'I sing a song of the saints of God' is as you might expect about saints and trying to live up to them as good examples etc. but has as part of its second verse,
"and one was a soldier and one was a priest
and one was slain by a fierce wild beast
and there's not any reason, no not the least
why I shouldn't be one too".
quote:If my memory serves me, 'Go West' was orginally recorded by The Village People in the 80's and revamped by the Pet Shop Boys in the 90's. Don't know anything about the origins of the tune but am tickled pink to think someone used it for a hymn.
The tune is that pop song "Go West" - Erasure or one of that crowd I seem to recall.
quote:Not in SLW. I've only seen it in "Songs of Fellowship".
Originally posted by Boopy:
Pierce my ear, O Lord
[...]
Could these be from Sounds of Living Waters?
quote:Welcome, Boopy! That song's in a Baptist hymnal? I'm amazed! It seems so... Anglican -- I guess that's my bias because the lyrics are British-English not US-English (e.g., "I mean to be one too"). I'm a cradle Episcopalian who grew up with this hymn and yes, the "fierce wild beast" line did make an impression on me as a child; I'm not aware of any other children's hymn that introduces the fact of martyrdom, however briefly. But -- the biggest impression the hymn had on me, and has to this day, is the final line: "But the saints of God are just folk like me, and I mean to be one too." As a little kid, saints can seem too distant, plastic, and perfect. This hymn stressed their humanity; and when, as an adult, I grew to understand the "communion of saints," this song's simple theology provided the foundation.
Originally posted by Boopy:
I am new here but would love to share with you this treat from the old Baptist Hymn Book, as a warning against separating the subject by too many lines. 'I sing a song of the saints of God' is as you might expect about saints and trying to live up to them as good examples etc. but has as part of its second verse,
"and one was a soldier and one was a priest
and one was slain by a fierce wild beast
and there's not any reason, no not the least
why I shouldn't be one too".
Feel free to picture children in congregation deciding they'd rather not be fierce wild beasts, thanks very much.
quote:Don't forget that we do have Baptists in England too!! Its not just the Anglican church over here.
Welcome, Boopy! That song's in a Baptist hymnal? I'm amazed! It seems so... Anglican -- I guess that's my bias because the lyrics are British-English not US-English (e.g., "I mean to be one too").
quote:I've just found it in my "Baptist Praise and Worship" (first published 1991).
Originally posted by Boopy:
Mmm....this one's definitely English Baptist which is a very different tradition from American Baptist.
I Sing a Song of the Saints of God is no 259 in the old Baptist Hymn Book (1962) - there's a more recent hymnal called Baptist Praise and Worship. It's early 20th Century and was written believe it or not by Lesbia Scott.
quote:A quick trip to MW should show plenty in category 2, I think.
And one was a doctor and one was a queen
and one was a shepherdess on the green:
they were all of them saints; and I mean
God helping, to be one too.
quote:I'm glad I'm not the only one who cringes at this one - although personally I find the fact that I am the one deciding Jesus' status a bit difficult (If I lift you high...it will ultimately make little difference to the fact that you are God Almighty the Creator of all things and I couldn't 'lift' you a fraction of a millimetre even if I wanted to)
Originally posted by welsh dragon:
quote:This a Matt Redman song.
I lift you high
and bow down low
How high can You be?
How low can I go?
I don't have a problem with the sentiments, is just the words are really trite. It's the "low/go" rhyme that's just too simple and obvious. And the effect is made worse with multiple repetitions...which you get if you use this as a chorus...
quote:There is a hymn I have sung a couple of times to the tune of "Ode To Joy". The words go something like "Praise the Lord for times and seasons, cloud and sunshine, sun and rain" and continue on in a similarly banal way for four verses. Moreover, in each verse the first two lines are repeated as the last two lines. What, did you run out of ideas for things to praise God for? Or were you just really determined to use Ode to Joy?
Originally posted by Sauerkraut:
I will make one last gasp with Beethoven's Ode to Joy (Joyful, Joyful We Adore Thee). I am fighting a loosing cause.
Oh, oh, now I can't the darn tune out of my head!
quote:I've sung 'What a friend we have in Jesus' to the tune of 'Now the Carnival in over' before.
Originally posted by Boopy:
If you think singing along to Ode to Joy is bad (and I agree, because it's also the tune for Take Me to the Emerald City, from The Wizard of Oz, so I can never sing a hymn to that tune with a straight face!), try singing a hymn to the tune of The Carnival is Over. Can't track it down just yet but I promise you that there's one to this tune in Baptist Praise and Worship. Uuurrgh.
Boopy
quote:I mean I know it's for kids...but...actually this makes 'The Lord Jesus after eating with his friends@ (see Newan's Own contribution above) seem like a masterwork!
I am the apple of God's eye,
His banana over me is love.
He oranges his angels to protect me,
as his blessings plum-met from above.
quote:That was my own comment. They did supply the fruit lyric that inspired this characteristic burst of petty mindedness from me though.
I wonder if God ever regrets bestowing some modern day Christian lyric writers with a free will?
)
quote:Ouch. I don't have to go back 30 years to remember this; we used it at our Sunday evening "Folk Mass", which only gave up the ghost two or three years ago (ostensibly because no one could be found to provide musical accompaniment).
Originally posted by Newman's Own:
May I cast a vote here for the bizarre, quasi folk renditions of the Lord's Prayer which appeared through the years?
The full dreadfulness of this one would not be possible to comprehend without hearing the horrid melody, but this was definitely a 'sway, look happy, clap' version I recall from 30 years ago.
Our Father, who art in heaven,
Hallowed be thy name.
Thy kingdom come, thy will be done,
Hallowed be thy name.
quote:Is this,
Originally posted by dorothea:
That sing-along version of the Lord's prayer reminds me of a poem I used to like at primary School. The poem ended.
"Amen, amen, amen, amen.
Timothy Winters, Lord. Amen!"
And for that reason I rather enjoy it.
quote:Not so bad really, though if I were given the ability to look beyond the veil, I would rather see God than the saints. But what really bugs me is the tune. Bullock had a couple of good ideas, and couldn't be bothered to find a way of making a transistion between them, so he stuck them next to each other -- resulting in practically unsingable, and frankly rather ugly, changes of key. In addition, the vocal harmonies appear to consist mainly of parallel fifths and octaves, as if he couldn't be bothered working out four separate parts. What isn't parallel is horribly dissonant -- especially on "with one united breath", which I would have thought would be the last place you'd want a dissonance.
Give us the wings of faith to rise
Within the veil, and see
The saints above, how great their joys,
How bright their glories be.
We ask them whence their victory came,
They, with one united breath,
Ascribe the conquest to the Lamb,
Their triumph to his death.
They marked the footsteps that he trod,
His zeal inspired their breast,
And, following their incarnate God,
They reached their promised rest.
quote:It's by Charles Causley, and first appeared in a collection called Union Street in 1957. Here's the correct first verse (what a wonder is Google!)
Originally posted by dorothea:
Booby,
yes it is the same poem. It began something like this:
'Timothy Winters go to school
(with?) eyes as wide as the football pools
with teeth like bombs and hair like splinters;
a blitz of a boy is Timothy Winters.'
I can't recall the writer's name....if it's not too much of a tangent, does anyone know the name of the poet?
quote:I suspect that this song was chosen by one of the other sisters who was celebrating her Jubilee at the Mass, since anyone who has really worked for justice would find this PC gobbledygook risible.
Those without status, those who are nothing,
you have made royal, gifted with rights,
chosen as partners, midwives of justice,
birthing new systems, lighting new lights.
quote:It's a poem, not a song, and a tangent really; only in this thread at all because it ends with 'Amen Amen'and another poster was reminded of it via a similarity with a chorus mentioned further up the thread, and wanted to trace it.
Originally posted by Zeke:
Is the song about Timothy Winters a religious song? I'm confused.
quote:What do you think it did to my Sunday morning?
Originally posted by ce:
You've quite ruined my Sunday afternoon.
quote:No, it was the whole jolly lot of us
Originally posted by ce:
Did you stray into sunday school by mistake (it would still be unforgivable but vaguely understandable) or was this farrago actually perpetrated on a congregation?
quote:My thoughts exactly. At the end of every line I wanted to shout "No, no, no!" but then I realised that was the wrong song
Originally posted by ce:
Pedant mode on
But prayer can’t be “like a telephone” – if it was, God and Jesus wouldn’t hear you if you “use no words at all” – you’d need to say something like “Prayer is a bit like a telephone” and “unlike a real telephone we can………”. It couldn’t possibly make it any worse
Pedant mode off
I'll now be singing it all evening
quote:Very funny story. BTW, the Titans are playing tonight, so there's still life in Tennessee.
Originally posted by Hinematov:
There's one in our fellowship songbook that I suppose is OK, except that it's to the tune of O Sole Mio.
quote:That thought inspired me as a child to these words:
Originally posted by Fr. Gregory:
I don't know if it's been quoted yet ... but what about a classic from Yusuf Islam?
"Morning has broken ..."
.... well bloody fix it then!
quote:Now that I would like to hear
Speaking of 'Give me oil in my lamp', has anyone else heard the version that the Byrds did? Very good. I like to sing that one instead of the traditional one...
quote:You know, my old Methodist YA Fellowship did just that- taking movingly phrased but boringly set lyrics and creating new melodies for them, on a guitar trio. Better then any praise songs in existence.
Originally posted by Joyeux:
What gets me is that quite a few of the older hymns have great biblical lyrics that explore the implications of living a Christian life, and the character of God, etc., etc, but the melodies are soooo bad (read: non-existant) that they aren't done any more. I'm all for people with musical ability in composition taking those lyrics and resetting them. Nothing comes to mind right now, but I know that I've sung my share of them!
quote:Actually, I think "Victorian" is a more suitable adjective than "American." That age produced a tidal wave of sentimental bilge on both sides of the Atlantic.
You know, as bad as some of the modern stuff is, it all has its roots it American sentimentality and the nauseating hymns that came with it.
quote:I'm going to have to try and make a defence of this one, as I am quite fond of it. Here goes:
Originally posted by Newman's Own:
As for terrible theology, I can recall when, in some circles (religious communities liked this one for the offertory at Mass on profession day!), the 'gem,' "All that I Am" was popular.
All that I am,
All that I do,
All that I'll ever have
I offer now to you.
All that I dream,
All that I pray,
All that I'll ever make
I give to you today.
So far, that does not sound too bad, but note the following!:
Take and sanctify these gifts
For your honour, Lord,
Knowing that I love and serve you
Is enough reward.
We therefore are left with a very strange picture of an offertory that is of one's own dreams and prayers, and reassurance to God that he does not need to pay the fees for our contributing how marvellous we are. (Didn't the gifts come from Him in the first place?
)
quote:You're right of course. Apologies for my very sloppy writing style - never been one for precise definitions of words
Originally posted by multipara:
The "lay " observer???!!!!
Don't you mean the "non-Catholic" observer?
I've heard of the priesthood of believers, but this is ridiculous!
m (always a Roman but never a Mariolatrist)
.
quote:First, my condolances for being confirmed in the quagmire that is now known as the ELCA. Thankfully, the little green book in our pews does say Hymnal Supplement '98. I have seen the horor that is With One Voice A.K.A. With No Voice and I do feel for you. My own churches chior has sung a song out of that pitiful excuse for a hymnal supplement and it was painful. I moved to this church to get away from crap like that. Thankfully, rather than having half the "hymns" be "Blessed Assurance lite," I only have to deal with the chior anthem. Why a LCMS church has copies of With No Voice hanging around is beyond me. Unfortunately, my own synod does not need a book like With No Voice to fall completely into sentimental B.S. You do realize we thought nothing could get worse than the Green and Blue hymnals, respectively? It did. God save us from ourselves and give us back TLH.
Originally posted by Egeria:
Actually, I think "Victorian" is a more suitable adjective than "American." That age produced a tidal wave of sentimental bilge on both sides of the Atlantic.
Last weekend I visited the church where I was confirmed. The program included "Blessed Assurance," not in the Lutheran Book of Worship but in the dreck-heavy With One Voice (which was supposed to be a supplement, I think, but which some churches apparently regard as a replacement).
There we have it--a "spiritual" ancestor of unsingable twentieth-century hymns ("Be Not Afraid" comes to mind). Sentimental, straining for those high notes like a third-rate folk-singer, and worst of all, capable of inserting a mindworm that plays ceaselessly all the next day.
quote:Please tell me that this revolting, tasteless text is a spoof! I have heard many a horrid hymn in my day, but this is the only one I recall which nearly made me vomit.
Originally posted by Huntress:
Verse 1:
Jesus said to his disciples
Wash those weary toes!
Do it in a cheerful fashion,
never hold your nose!'
Chorus:
The world is full of smelly feet
Weary from the dusty street
The world is full of smelly feet
We'll was them for each other.
A gem from Michael Forster, printed in 'The Catholic Supplement to "Hymns, Songs and Chants"'.
quote:Whilst this is correct, I still find nothing wrong with the words of the hymn itself. Though singing it during the offertory as we did this weekend does add to the general confusion of that time, as technically bringing big plates of money up to the alter has nothing to do with the preparation for Holy Communion either. If you're in with the "seeing as we're offering up our cash, we might as well offer up our personal gifts" camp then it's fine.
Originally posted by Newman's Own:
Incidentally - my comments on 'All that I Am' hold. The offertory at Holy Communion has nothing to do with our thanking God for our personal gifts.
quote:It does appear to be a bona fide hymn, or at least several editors believe so. According to Hymn Quest (TM) it appears in three published collections, including the Complete Anglican Hymns Old and New (but not the Catholic HO&N, oddly enough).
Originally posted by Newman's Own:
quote:Please tell me that this revolting, tasteless text is a spoof!
Originally posted by Huntress:
Verse 1:
Jesus said to his disciples
Wash those weary toes!
Do it in a cheerful fashion,
never hold your nose!
...'
quote:One interpetation of The Song of Songs which used to be common was that Christ was the Bridegroom and the believer (of either sex) was the Bride - and we all know what brides and bridegrooms do, don't we?
Originally posted by Sarkycow:
Plenty of people, including me, have said this before, and it will get said again and again and again.
But it happened in church yesterday, so I'm flagging it up right now.
Just wtf is it with songs that basically say: "I want to have sex with Jesus"?
shudder
quote:I assure you it is no spoof
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by Huntress:
Verse 1:
Jesus said to his disciples
Wash those weary toes!
Do it in a cheerful fashion,
never hold your nose!'
Chorus:
The world is full of smelly feet
Weary from the dusty street
The world is full of smelly feet
We'll was them for each other.
A gem from Michael Forster, printed in 'The Catholic Supplement to "Hymns, Songs and Chants"'.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Please tell me that this revolting, tasteless text is a spoof! I have heard many a horrid hymn in my day, but this is the only one I recall which nearly made me vomit.
but it is in the children's section of the hymnal, not that that's an excuse. The final verse is devoted to Jesus himself and ends with the exhortation 'Smart or scruffy, we'll still love him / wash his smelly feet!' Having just read Huntress's post... quote:
Originally posted by Newman's Own:
If this is what liturgical music has come to (and I thought the 60s were bad..), I am very glad that I have access to churches that did not go with such trends... otherwise, I'd be a Buddhist by now...
Incidentally (and this is not a new hymn - I cannot remember where I heard it once), I remember shuddering at "There is a Fountain filled with Blood."
quote:We were then asked to close our eyes and "really just imagine this: lying with Jesus, lying in his arms"
By your side, I would lay
In your arms, I would lay
Jesus lover of my soul
Nothing from you I withold.
quote:so it isn't only modern songs that that can raise sniggers.
thy couch was the sod
quote:Totally hillarious!! It's as if these people both writers and those who promote this type of stuff have undergone an irony bypass. Quite a number of times, I've accidently turned up at 'praise' service - to find myself grinning my head off in the songs, not because I am enraputured but because I'm ******* my sides.
I'm very familiar with many mystic writings (and naturally the scriptures) which use erotic imagery, but what I find so hilarious about the "I want to have sex with Jesus" imagery today is that those using it in their compositions seem not to see the erotic implications at all.
quote:Bible translators too. From the NIV -
Originally posted by dorothea:
Totally hillarious!! It's as if these people both writers and those who promote this type of stuff have undergone an irony bypass. Quite a number of times, I've accidently turned up at 'praise' service - to find myself grinning my head off in the songs, not because I am enraputured but because I'm ******* my sides.
J
quote:Of such things do defence lawyers make fortunes in our wiser and sadder days...
Originally posted by Newman's Own:
One of the friars taught the little ones (3-4 years old) to sing "I am my beloved's and he is mine..." song, complete with gestures (totally innocent, of course.)
quote:It's certainly not these days!
Originally posted by Anna B:
I never could abide
It's ME, it's ME, it's ME, oh Lord,
Standing in the need of prayer,
It's ME, it's ME, it's ME, oh Lord,
Standing in the need of prayer.
<snip>
This is what passes for intercessions these days??
quote:I take it you're not singing it to the EH tune Benson (so so la do1.do1 te:-.la so etc)? If you are, I can see there might be a problem. I agree it doesn't make much sense to sing anything with a reasonably complex and non-repetitive text as a round. However, I confess to having a soft spot for Seek ye first, at least in certain moods. (If you don't know it, it's a two-part round where each part spends half its time singing Alleluia).
Originally posted by Anna B:
...
God is working His purpose out .
The words aren't so bad, but the tune is a real mess, and no one, but NO one, can sing it correctly as a round:
quote:I've seen it done a few times. It only made me feel cross when the song was rubbish!
Originally posted by Anna B:
I apologize for double-posting. Has anyone else had to sit through the questionable practice of rehearsing liturgical music with the congregation right before the service?
quote:Hi, could anyone possibly locate a source for this hymn or Pm me with it?
Originally posted by Punkijellybean:
Anyone know what the line "I tried the broken cisterns, Lord, but oh, the waters failed", is about? I kid you not. The hymn starts "O Christ in thee my soul have found....the peace, the joy", etc, etc. A good start, but downhill thereon after.
Seems like we now have cyclist hymns, and plumbers'anthems. Any other vocational specials??
quote:Have PM'ed the complete hymn, from Sacred Songs and Solos, as requested. The verse with the cisterns goes
Originally posted by welsh dragon:
quote:Hi, could anyone possibly locate a source for this hymn or Pm me with it?
Originally posted by Punkijellybean:
Anyone know what the line "I tried the broken cisterns, Lord, but oh, the waters failed", is about?
quote:Sudden memories of childhood Sunday school....
Originally posted by welsh dragon:
thank you sweetie and congratulations!
Anyone with any other ideas for hymns suitable for blessing toilets, feel free...
quote:A pleasure.
Originally posted by welsh dragon:
thank you sweetie and congratulations!
Anyone with any other ideas for hymns suitable for blessing toilets, feel free...
quote:J
God is working His purpose out as year succeeds to year,
God is working his purpose out, and the time is drawing near;
Nearer and nearer draws the time, the time that shall surely be,
When the earth shall be filled with the glory of God as the waters cover the sea.
quote:I bought the complete works of Christina Rossetti last weekend.
Originally posted by The Great God Dyfrig:
Is this from the Christina "Snow was falling, snow on snow / snow snow snow snow snow" Rosetti school of padding out a verse?
quote:now that is a crappy chorus! Maybe I could compose chud all day and give up the day job?
Simon was a rebel
Jesus loved him still
and replaced his dagger
with a daffodil
quote:They'll never replace vocal canons
Originally babbled by Anna B:
Don't get me started on rounds sung in church...
quote:One bed. Three bodies. Menage a trois.
Originally posted by tomb:
This Sunday during Communion, we will be singing a little ditty with a refrain that runs: Bind us together, Lord/Bind us together/with chords that cannot be broken.../bind us together in Love.
It's actually not too bad, and the verse fits the propers quite nicely.
Still, I am incapable of thinking of it as anything other than "Bondage for Jesus."
tomb
quote:You must have the same book as us judging by the typo.
Originally posted by tomb:
This Sunday during Communion, we will be singing a little ditty with a refrain that runs: Bind us together, Lord/Bind us together/with chords that cannot be broken.../bind us together in Love.
quote:Several of Rosetti's poems were addressed to a female love interest, though it's entirely possible that she was using a male voice. Her major work, Goblin Market, includes two sisters who express their love for each other in a physical/sexual sort of way. General opinion seems to be that Rosetti's sexuality was just very repressed (but I'm taking that mainly from Germaine Greer, and I'm sure most people appear repressed to her!)
I'm told by my literary correspondence that Rosetti wrote a poem about lesbianism. Is this true?
quote:Ahem! I was BORN in that grim town, and my father worked on said railways.
Goulburn ( a grim boarding school in a grimmer New South Wales railway town)
quote:LOL, very inappropriate! But on the sort of cold Christmas Eve night, when we celebrate Holy Communion in our local church at the foot of the Pennines, ya' can't beat it. Guess, geography and climate wasn't Christina's strong point.
Bloody Christina and her "snow on snow"...
Ever tried singint that at 35 degrees C during an Antipodean Midnight Mass?
J
quote:ISTR that it was written as a commission for an American Magazine (Scribners?).
Originally posted by dorothea:
Multipara wrote:
quote:LOL, very inappropriate! But on the sort of cold Christmas Eve night, when we celebrate Holy Communion in our local church at the foot of the Pennines, ya' can't beat it. Guess, geography and climate wasn't Christina's strong point.
Bloody Christina and her "snow on snow"...
Ever tried singint that at 35 degrees C during an Antipodean Midnight Mass?
quote:It's a metaphor, dearest.
Originally posted by multipara:
Bloody Christina and her "snow on snow"...
Ever tried singint that at 35 degrees C
quote:Yep, metaphor, dunno why I said allegory - probably thinking of "Goblin Market" - although Rossetti tried to deny that that was allegorical....
Originally posted by ken:
quote:It's a metaphor, dearest.
Originally posted by multipara:
Bloody Christina and her "snow on snow"...
Ever tried singint that at 35 degrees C
quote:That's not Christina! That is Wesley.
Originally posted by Newman's Own:
there is dreadful theology (ironically the sort of point condemned centuries ago, as denying Jesus' humanity) in "Veiled in flesh, the Godhead see!"
quote:
Enough for Him, Whom cherubim, worship night and day,
Breastful of milk, and a mangerful of hay;
Enough for Him, Whom angels fall before,
The ox and ass and camel which adore.
Angels and archangels may have gathered there,
Cherubim and seraphim thronged the air;
But His mother only, in her maiden bliss,
Worshipped the beloved with a kiss.
I was only making a general comment.quote:It's one of the abiding dreadful memories of a post-Christian friend of mine - only she thinks of it as the drunken Jesus song...
I now think of it as the drunken donkey song.
quote:
Originally posted by multipara:
I bet she knew about as much about the Bethlehem snow situation as she did about where babies came from (what with being a delicately brought-up English gel of the time).
)quote:For what?!?!
Originally posted by ken:
It's a metaphor, dearest.
That's a rather bizarre reading - she's told us already that it was in the bleak midwinter, so presumably the presence of snow is to press home the fact that this was, indeed the case. It's not metaphor - it's description. It might scrape in as pathetic fallacy, but there is no metaphorical reading possible, here. What is a lot of heavy snowfall meant to be a metaphor for, pray?
quote:Things were already pretty horrible and they were getting steadily worse?
Originally posted by dyfrig:
quote:For what?!?!
Originally posted by ken:
It's a metaphor, dearest.
quote:Well, midwinter is like a dark and cold time, and like a soul, or a world, mired and trapped in sin and shame and spiritual dullness.
Originally posted by dyfrig:
What is a lot of heavy snowfall meant to be a metaphor for, pray?
quote:I always thought the plumber's anthem was:
Originally posted by Punkijellybean:
Anyone know what the line "I tried the broken cisterns, Lord, but oh, the waters failed", is about? I kid you not. The hymn starts "O Christ in thee my soul have found....the peace, the joy", etc, etc. A good start, but downhill thereon after.
Seems like we now have cyclist hymns, and plumbers'anthems. Any other vocational specials??
quote:Sung to a skiffle tune?
Telephone to glory, oh what joy divine!
You can feel the current coming down the line!
Made by God the Father for his loved and own
You can talk to Jesus on His Royal Telephone...
quote:It's theologically nonsense as well. God is person-shaped, not hole-shaped.
Originally posted by flev:
And another superb song to patronise the kids with...
Life without Jesus is like a doughnut,
Is like a doughnut, is like a doughnut,
Life without Jesus is like a doughnut,
'cos there's a hole in the middle of your soul
Repeat ad infinitum using ideas from the kids for other things with holes in the middle (eg hula hoop, party ring biscuit...) The ultimate so far has to be "a fried egg with the yolk taken out".
It's sung to a super-perky tune, with a chorus about letting Jesus in to fill the hole in your life. And once the kids start suggesting alternative verses, there's no chance of scanning properly!
quote:and for some reason that really cracked me up. Do they have jam or vanilla custard in them?
But you can get doughnuts without holes - I've seen them in Morrisons.
quote:They did it again!
Originally posted by Miffy:
Our local radio played 'Love Divine, all loves excelling' this morning set to the melody of Mozart's 'Ave Verum.'
aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!
quote:I dunno. I rather think "Away in a manger" is rather spoilt by only ever being lisped by four-year-olds. Sung well, it's a lovely tune, but people get put off it because they never do hear it sung well, because it is deemed to be a children's song and therefore only very small children get to sing it.
Originally posted by Albatross:
Another one that I personally think is strictly for the younger members is "Away in a Manger" - by this point the sugar overdose raches epic proportions, and the atmosphere is so full of it it might as well be candy floss.
quote:True. Maddy Prior did a very nice version of it in the "Carols and Capers" CD
Originally posted by Oriel:
quote:I dunno. I rather think "Away in a manger" is rather spoilt by only ever being lisped by four-year-olds. Sung well, it's a lovely tune, but people get put off it because they never do hear it sung well, because it is deemed to be a children's song and therefore only very small children get to sing it.
Originally posted by Albatross:
Another one that I personally think is strictly for the younger members is "Away in a Manger" - by this point the sugar overdose raches epic proportions, and the atmosphere is so full of it it might as well be candy floss.
Rhiannon
quote:Ouch, that makes me wince. Reduces one of our biggest sexual health problems to a Kit-Kat advert. Beggars belief.
And one of the all-time worst songs ever written, which I am thankful I've never actually been forced to sing, but which I happened to see printed in a book of songs that were trying to be up-to-date and relevant to real issues in the real world, etc, consists solely of the repeated lyric "AIDS, AIDS, give us a break."
I kid you not. Can someone explain to me how that constitutes a worship song?
quote:I agree.
Originally posted by Sarkycow:
Plenty of people, including me, have said this before, and it will get said again and again and again.
But it happened in church yesterday, so I'm flagging it up right now.
Just wtf is it with songs that basically say: "I want to have sex with Jesus"?
shudder
quote:(blush)
When the music fades
All is stripped away
And I simply come
Longing just to bring
Something that's of worth
That will bless your heart
quote:Though it doesn't scan very well - you have to sing 'sodawithoutthebubbles'.
Life without Jesus is like soda without the bubbles,
Soda without the bubbles, Soda without the bubbles
Life without Jesus is like soda without the bubbles
Life tastes flat and full of troubles
quote:
"When a woman comes on stage, you know it's going to be a good night"
quote:Because Tim & Pete "Easy Chords" Hughes are right behind him...
Originally posted by dyfrig:
Strange, isn't it? We demand life imprisonment for murderers; we ponder about the death penalty for Saddam; yet, curiously, Matt Redman is allowed to walk free. Why is this?
quote:
Originally posted by Sir George Grey:
Matt Redman ... seemed exciting and new.. a
quote:You've hit on something very important here - that contemporary congregations are somehow too stupid or unsophisticated to sing anything more complex than a Graham Kendrick song.
because Matt Redman's songs are relatively unsophisticated it was easy to transplant them from Soul Survivor to the local congregation.
quote:Ah - I'm afraid this one does have a double meaning, for me anyway. The children's writer Antonia Forest has a character in one of her books say that lines 3 and 4 of this verse always remind her of school dinners. And having once read that, I'm now unable to see this verse without that mental image!
Originally posted by Newman's Own:
I love this thread, and I'm laughing aloud about the double entendre, so I hope no one will mind my posting two examples of 'old but bad' Christmas hymns that have no double meaning...........
See amidst the winter's snow,
Born to us on earth below,
See the tender lamb appears
Promised from eternal years.
quote:Now I feel free to admit that my horribly dirty mind will not allow me to sing the hymn "Just As I Am."
Originally posted by Cartwheel:
Can I submit the following as the most embarrassing double entendre EVER in a worship song. As far as I remember, it goes
"Before the world began
You were on his mind
And everything you've done
Is precious in His eyes
Because of his great love
He sent his only Son:
Everything was done so you would come."
and so on for another 2 verses, all with the same last line.
If I ever get married, I want that song at my wedding!
quote:You're obviously a decent singer. Many Graham Kendrick songs are actually quite hard for lots of not-very-good singers to sing. Not only do they sometimes have more range than most of us plebs can manage, but he has an irritating habit of ending with really odd cadences that give most of us no idea what note we should be singing even if we could hit it.
Originally posted by dyfrig:
You've hit on something very important here - that contemporary congregations are somehow too stupid or unsophisticated to sing anything more complex than a Graham Kendrick song.
quote:You're better than 95% of our congregation then!
Originally posted by dyfrig:
No, ken, I'm not a decent singer at all- but with a little help I found myself capable of participating in simple but affective four part harmonies.
quote:To be fair, I'm not sure they are expecting that at all, though I suppose they don't mind the royalties. Kendrick can and does write singable things (except for those bloody awful harmonies on the final bar, whiuch he seems addicted to).
The problem with the Kendricks and the Redmans of this world is (apart from the sheer banality of most of their words) that they are expecting congregations to participate in singing songs that are written in a style and idiom suited to individual performance,
quote:Yes. It's called a concert.
Originally posted by Chorister:
There is a time to occasionally sit back and listen, whatever your preferred worship style.
quote:Ken, I said 'occasionally' - if I went to a concert that only had 1 item I'd want my money back!
Originally posted by ken:
quote:Yes. It's called a concert.
Originally posted by Chorister:
There is a time to occasionally sit back and listen, whatever your preferred worship style.
quote:One of our worship teams recently decided to introduce "Word of God, Speak" into our Sunday Morning repertoire. Um, yeah it's a current pop hit by an extremely popular band, but it is not the sort of thing congregations should attempt to sing in unison. I am pleased to report that it was terribly awkward, and it may be awhile before it's attempted again--if ever.
Originally posted by ken:
But they also write other sorts of songs that aren't intended to be congregational hymns at all. Perhaps the real culprits are the people who choose inappropriate songs for churches, not those who write them.
quote:Have you ever hear that song played on an organ? I have and it is an experience I regret having and, at the time, would have rather listened to a poorly-tuned symphony than the joke comming out of the pipes of the organ.
Originally posted by Chorister:
(However the popularity of 'Shine Jesus Shine' is that it is more in hymn format and possible to sing as a congregation.)
quote:Needless to say, I didn't select it, but went for a hymn I knew that was similar to the Psalm for the Day. I did, of course, show it to my priest the day before and said this was what I wanted as it truly got to the heart of the story.
There once was a man as mean as could be;
if he could take two then he'd try to take three.
Then one day he took Jesus for tea:
and Jesus helped him to change.
Well, Jesus helps meanies and goodies and baddies,
Jesus helps lazies and happies and saddies,
Jesus helps lonelies and mums, kids and daddies,
and Jesus wants us to help too.
Blind Bartimaeus, as all will agree,
was wise to keep shouting as loud as could be,
"O please, son of David, have mercy on me!"
Jesus opened his eyes.
(remainder removed ... see below)
Words and Music © Digby Hannah (1949-)
He was not amused.
moments on this thread, I am glad I could give one back!quote:Pendatic point: Tim Hughes, not Pete Hughes. Pete is his preacher brother.
Originally posted by ken:
<snip>
Not sure about Redman, but his apparent successor (Redman is already dated for the teenage worship-song-fans, there is a lot of fashion in this) Pete Hughes writes singably, as does (when he wants to) Stuart Townend.
I would go so far as to say that Kendrick and Townend sometimes even write hymns. One or two of which will survive.
But they also write other sorts of songs that aren't intended to be congregational hymns at all. Perhaps the real culprits are the people who choose inappropriate songs for churches, not those who write them.
quote:Bit of a tangent, but is Pete younger?
Originally posted by GeordieDownSouth:
Pendatic point: Tim Hughes, not Pete Hughes. Pete is his preacher brother.
quote:Often. Often. Often.
Originally posted by Sauerkraut:
quote:Have you ever hear that song played on an organ?
Originally posted by Chorister:
(However the popularity of 'Shine Jesus Shine' is that it is more in hymn format and possible to sing as a congregation.)
quote:You poor soul.
Originally posted by ken:
quote:Often. Often. Often.
Originally posted by Sauerkraut:
quote:Have you ever hear that song played on an organ?
Originally posted by Chorister:
(However the popularity of 'Shine Jesus Shine' is that it is more in hymn format and possible to sing as a congregation.)
As there is a move foot to use Songs of Fellowship as our church hymnbook, this sort of thing seems likely to get more common.
quote:As a good Vicar's Daughter™ I used to be called on to play the tunes on our piano for non-churchy wedding couples. By careful process of elimination, the top hymns that most couples knew at least five of were
Originally posted by Chorister:
Scarily, though, all the crappy choruses and horrible hymns of the 60s and 70s are what people are requesting us to sing at their weddings now, because the couple remember them from their school and sunday-school days and get all nostalgic. I suspect in many cases they are the only Christian songs and hymns they know, as well. Maybe church choirmasters and organists ought to attend these bridal fayres and play a selection of alternatives to show them what other music is available!
quote:If its the complete songs of fellowship (there's now a 3rd volume out which I haven't got yet) it could be a lot worse. But then it will always come down to who picks the songs.
Originally posted by Sauerkraut:
quote:You poor soul.
Originally posted by ken:
quote:Often. Often. Often.
Originally posted by Sauerkraut:
quote:Have you ever hear that song played on an organ?
Originally posted by Chorister:
(However the popularity of 'Shine Jesus Shine' is that it is more in hymn format and possible to sing as a congregation.)
As there is a move foot to use Songs of Fellowship as our church hymnbook, this sort of thing seems likely to get more common.
quote:The trouble is that, unlike Mission Praise which we already use, Songs of Fellowship has a very poor selection of the 18th & 19th century hymns. Which we like singing at our church. (Though I sometimes wonder if our new vicar does)
Originally posted by GeordieDownSouth:
If its the complete songs of fellowship (there's now a 3rd volume out which I haven't got yet) it could be a lot worse. But then it will always come down to who picks the songs.
quote:I actually quite like "Shine Jesus Shine". Sorry. Though the implied 1980s-style restorationism gets irritating.
My home church had Songs of Fellowship 1 & 2 (and an OHP for extras). Unfortunately we were one of only about two churches in the circuit who had this and a band, so all the local preachers took the opportunity to pick their favourite songs. Which usually meant "Come on and Celebrate", "Shine Jesus Shine" and "I am a new Creation."
quote:And then it continued:
O come let us adore him,
O come let us adore him,
O come let us adore him,
Chri-ist the Lord.
quote:There may have been a couple more choruses of New Words, too. But was there any compelling reason to leave out all the verses of a marvelous old hymn and turn it into Yet Another Repetative Praise Chorus? I suppose the argument is that the repetition and simple language allow us to enter in to worship better. Lame. I don't want my classics frelled with.
For he alone is worthy,
For he alone is worthy,
For he alone is worthy,
Chri-ist the Lord.
We'll give him all the glory,
We'll give him all the glory,
We'll give him all the glory,
Chri-ist the Lord.
quote:Well, in the grand scheme of things, that's last week!
Originally posted by Gracious rebel:
Those words are not 'new' Sherrif Pony - I recall singing that version in a church about 20 years ago.
quote:I think I'm with Ken on this one although I agree that if you are able to get in appropriately trained people as you describe congregations can sing much better than many might suppose.
Originally posted by dyfrig:
Any congregation is capable of singing four part harmonies (just get the Wild Goose people in for a Big Sing and you'll see what I mean). We deserve better than anodyne, poppy crap which appeals only to the banal sensibilities of middle aged clergy who think they can fill pews by forcing people to sing second-rate imitations of tenth rate genres. We are meant to worshipping Almighty God, not drowning in drivel. [/QB]
quote:Someone who was being baptized at the same service as me chose this hymn. I hadn't heard it before and thought it was jolly marvellous - though I haven't heard it sung in church since, either!
Originally posted by ken:
"I am a new Creation" is sort of jolly and perhaps suitable for occasinal use.
quote:Me neither, Sheriff Pony. I was at a service the other week when the organist launched into "Onward Christian Soldiers." Half the congregation started singing the words they knew, and the other half started singing the words as printed in the service sheet. And it sounded very peculiar, as hymns are wont to do when half the congregation are belting out "Onward Christian Soldiers, marching as to war," and the other half are limping through "Onward Christian Pilgrims, Christ will be our light; see, the heav'nly vision breaks upon our sight!" and other variations on a deeply feeble theme.
Originally posted by Sheriff Pony:
Lame. I don't want my classics frelled with.
quote:"Onward..." is out of copyright, and the publishers commissioned entirely new words to the same tune, which, I suppose, they are perfectly entitled to do. And, it being their hymnbook, Kevin Mayhew Ltd are entitled to put whatever they please in it. But if the words of such classics as "Stand Up, Stand Up For Jesus" and "God is Our Strength From Days of Old" offend their delicate sensibilities, why not just leave them out?
Originally posted by Newman's Own:
Apart from it must verge on sacrilege to tamper with such a classic as Adeste Fideles, I have a strong sense that writing new words to hymns is highly illegal (at least, if they are under copyright.) Somehow, even though I loathe hymns that are on 'war' and 'soldier' themes, I think it is odd to tamper with those that are well-known.
quote:I've heard this also. In my opinion the reason why that sort of stuff gets said in such churches is precisely because of the attempt to eeeeemotionalise the worship.. it's an attempt at counterbalance.
Originally posted by dyfrig:
Eeeemotin, eh? Well, what puzzles me most is that the places that use choruses often preach stuff like, "There were three cats walking along a wall: the one at the front was called Facts, the one in the middle was called Faith, and the one at the back was called Feelings. So long as Faith kept looking at Facts* he was safe, but as soon as he turned around and looked at Feelings, he fell off the wall."
* or, presumably, Facts's arse.
And no, I'm not making that one up.
quote:Indeed there is for those of us who have been fortunate enough to get a lot of singing practise in. For others, just trying to sing the bloomin' harmony is a pain in the arse and a distraction from their 'spiritual time' or whatever such a thing is called this month.
There's plenty of spine tingling emotion about when you're listening to a Welsh chapel singing its heart out in four part harmonies, or when you hear the descant in the final verse of "O Come All Ye Faithful".
quote:IANAL, and IANA copyright L in particular. But I do hang out with people who're up on intellectual property issues.
Originally posted by Newman's Own:
...I have a strong sense that writing new words to hymns is highly illegal (at least, if they are under copyright.) ...
quote:With the help of a ministering angel and a course of anitobiotics?
"Master, grant your servant
His discharge in peace"
quote:As is Graham Kendrick's (I think) 'Jesus Stand Among Us'
Originally posted by Miffy:
... and as for 'Bind Us Together,' some might consider it to be an entirely appropriate choice for a wedding.
quote:Oh dear I like that one (Jesus stand among us) so what have I missed? - why is it so awful and in particular unsuitable for a wedding?
Originally posted by Henry Troup:
quote:As is Graham Kendrick's (I think) 'Jesus Stand Among Us'
Originally posted by Miffy:
... and as for 'Bind Us Together,' some might consider it to be an entirely appropriate choice for a wedding.
quote:I am a new creation
Originally posted by GeordieDownSouth:
However, "I am a new creation"???
quote:Simple enough. It's awful because of the very high
Originally posted by Gracious rebel:
quote:Oh dear I like that one (Jesus stand among us) so what have I missed? - why is it so awful and in particular unsuitable for a wedding?
Originally posted by Henry Troup:
quote:As is Graham Kendrick's (I think) 'Jesus Stand Among Us'
Originally posted by Miffy:
... and as for 'Bind Us Together,' some might consider it to be an entirely appropriate choice for a wedding.
Jesus stand among us
at the meeting of our lives
be the sweet agreement
at the meeting of our eyes
Oh Jesus we love you
and so we gather here
Join our hearts in unity
and take away our fear
(I won't quote verse 2 in case I get accused of copyright infringement)
factor.
quote:Hooray, another reason to persuade our minister not to use it
Originally posted by Divine Outlaw-Dwarf:
[QB] I am a new creation
No more in condemnation.
Make a little birdhouse in your soul.
quote:That's what I thought.
Originally posted by Gill H:
That sounds very like a playground song I vaguely remember 'Poor Jenny is a-weeping'. One of those 'join hands and walk round' type songs. I suspect someone just Christianised the words.
quote:Well, I've never heard that song, but if those are the first two lines, it sounds suspiciously like a slightly messed-up version of Psalm 48, verse 1:
Originally posted by Padingtun Bear:
Can anyone explain:
Great is the Lord and most worthy of praise.
The city of our God, the holy place...
Any connection at all?
quote:Ken it seems you are right from this link (mind you, like you I would find the references more authentic if they were from Iona and Peter Opie!)
Originally posted by ken:
quote:That's what I thought.
Originally posted by Gill H:
That sounds very like a playground song I vaguely remember 'Poor Jenny is a-weeping'. One of those 'join hands and walk round' type songs. I suspect someone just Christianised the words.
In fact I might even remember it sung with "Mary" in it.
For all I know it might be the last gasp of some piece of mediaeval mummery. Where are Iona and Peter Opie when you need them?
quote:We always sang "In the City....etc" I didn't know that the "In" wasn't there until I looked it up in my CCAHHR songbook. It is, I believe, as Erina suggested, a paraphrase of Psalm 48.
Can anyone explain:
Great is the Lord and most worthy of praise.
The city of our God, the holy place...
Any connection at all?
quote:This got me so hot under the collar when I read it that thought I should address the points raised.
When the music fades
and all is stripped away
and I simply come,
longing just to bring
something that's of worth
that will bless Your heart.[1]
I'll bring You more than a song
for a song in itself
is not what You have required.[2]
You search much deeper within
through the way things appear[3]
You're looking into my heart.
I'm coming back to the heart of worship
And it's all about You.
It's all about You, Jesus.
I'm sorry Lord for the thing I've made it,[4]
when it's all about You,
it's all about You, Jesus.
---------
[1] First thing that gets me is the idea that I'm going to "bless Jesus' heart." It's theologically questionable, and it's overly precious. So I'm already cringing from the start.
[2] "For a song in itself is not what you have required"? Huh? The phrasing is awkward enough, but the song is already running in circles at this point. (Which, now that I think about it, may be fitting for some forms of worship.)
[3] I'm chewing aluminum foil when we hit "You search much deeper within through the way things appear." At this point I find myself thinking "What am I singing about anyway? 'Things'?" Some precise writing please!
[4] And then we hit "the thing I've made it." Once again, we're singing about a "thing" followed by the pronoun "it," which always has me searching for an antecedent. I'm lost and confused by this point, having no idea what the subject matter of this song is.
The song seems to be a worship song about singing worship songs, with Jesus as a passive receiver of "blessing." So, in a sense, it's not so much about praise to our God than it is about navel-gazing on the part of the singer. While I would agree that self-reflection is a necessary part of coming before God, in this case it doesn't quite work for me.
quote:It's from a psalm (can't remember which number). Opening verse says that God is great. Next verses says that Jerusalem is a strong and holy city, the joy of the whole earth. Said chorus doesn't quite capture the point of the psalm, which is to laud Jerusalem as the place where God lives. Chorus then veers away into some non-psalmic stuff that reminds God that we want to worship him and thank him. Which is nice.
Originally posted by Jolly Jape:
Paddington :
quote:We always sang "In the City....etc" I didn't know that the "In" wasn't there until I looked it up in my CCAHHR songbook. It is, I believe, as Erina suggested, a paraphrase of Psalm 48.
Can anyone explain:
Great is the Lord and most worthy of praise.
The city of our God, the holy place...
Any connection at all?
quote:I don't know about a hundred years, but people of my generation - I'm in my 40s - are much more likely to be able to play an instrument or read music than people of my parent's generation. Rock and roll changed a lot! (As did folk, and punk, and the Atari computer, and cheap sampling & mixing software)
Originally posted by Sir George Grey:
Another thought is that our society is a good deal less musical than it was one hundred years ago
quote:People in general don't sing well, but I doubt if they ever have. That's not what congregational singing is about.
- people in general don't sing - which makes me wonder if congregational singing should be a part of a church service at all now).
quote:And lo, here are the Opies, or at least their views:
Originally posted by Gracious rebel:
For all I know it might be the last gasp of some piece of mediaeval mummery. Where are Iona and Peter Opie when you need them?
Ken it seems you are right from this link (mind you, like you I would find the references more authentic if they were from Iona and Peter Opie!)
quote:One man's trash . . .
Originally posted by phudfan:
This got me so hot under the collar . . .
quote:Yeah - art 'in' worship would have been better. I was careless in my use of words. Apologies!
Originally posted by phudfan:
I agree with you Sir George when you say that the average Hymn is probably a better work of art than the average chorus, but I think the view that it is also a better form of worship is a bit more subjective (I hope I'm not misinterprteing you here).
quote:Apart from church, what other non-work pursuits involving singing have gone out of fashion?
Originally posted by Sir George Grey:
Compare non-work pursuits (including church) and consider how many of those pursuits involve singing, and how many people are involved in those pursuits compared with forty years ago. What conclusion would you draw?
quote:To say there were more "good singers" somewhere back in history is quite opinionated. The technique most modern professional singers use is very different to their counterparts a century ago because of the amplification available today. If everyone was taught to sing "properly" by fully using their diaphragm we wouldn't have the vast variety of singers we have today. What is probably most difficult for those singing some of the more traditional pieces is that a more advanced breathing technique is required than that of most modern popular music. Similarly, though, those who are accustomed to singing with the diaphragm all of the time find it difficult to sing with the more gentle style.
Originally posted by Sir George Grey:
I suspect they were written in a time when really good singers were easier to come by.
quote:And, indeed:
Originally posted by Divine Outlaw-Dwarf:
quote:I am a new creation
Originally posted by GeordieDownSouth:
However, "I am a new creation"???
No more in condemnation.
Make a little birdhouse in your soul.
In a similar vein to:
Give thanks with a greatful heart.
Go West, life is peaceful there.
quote:Hooray, hooray, it's not just me!
Originally posted by testbear:
indeed:
"Open the eyes of my heart Lord, open the eyes of my heart,
I want to see you, I want to see you..."
At which point I have to bite my hands not to sing:
"But I stiiiiil haven't fouuuuuund what I'm looking for!!"
![[Yipee]](graemlins/spin.gif)
I get so laughed at at music group practice for that one. Have been tempted to sing the original in an alt. service, though. J
quote:But is an improvment, IMO, on Cecil Frances Alexander.
Originally posted by Sir George Grey:
Redman is no substitute for Wesley.
quote:I love those too. Although he does have a tendency to try and fit the whole of salvation history into one song, so you can't sing more than one of them in a service.
Originally posted by ken:
I, er, sorry Karl, um, er, I really quite like some of Stuart Townend's songs. And he's pretty "sound". I like the hymnlike ones more than the man-with-a-guitar-like ones.
quote:I didn't say they were all like that. Not that I'm into Stuart Townend either.
Originally posted by ken:
I, er, sorry Karl, um, er, I really quite like some of Stuart Townend's songs. And he's pretty "sound". I like the hymnlike ones more than the man-with-a-guitar-like ones.
quote:
Originally posted by ken:
I, er, sorry Karl, um, er, I really quite like some of Stuart Townend's songs. And he's pretty "sound". I like the hymnlike ones more than the man-with-a-guitar-like ones.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I love those too. Although he does have a tendency to try and fit the whole of salvation history into one song, so you can't sing more than one of them in a service.
Spot-on Lep!
quote:Except it isn't in a hymn book, it is in Come and Praise which is designed to be a wishy-washy collection of generic 'worship' music (definitely not hymns), including a number of songs suitable for multi-cultural schools (ie with no references to Jesus, just to a generic 'God' or 'Lord'). It doesn't stop it being crap, it just explains the reasoning behind it.
Originally posted by GeordieDownSouth:
Purple Sparkler
I believe military jets meet in the air to be refuelled, but what on earth its doing in a hymn book I've no idea.
quote:I have to admit, i have never heard these guys. I guess I just reckon that has the devil appears to have all the best modern tunes, I stick with the tried and tested in hymns and get my 'modernity kicks' from secular sources. Maybe I don't get out enough.
Apart from feeling everyone's often a bit hard on the modern writers, comparing a Soul Survivor/Vineyard song to a wesley hymn doesn't seem like comparing like to like, there's something else that often seems to be forgotten.
A lot of these song writers are really young still. I think Redman may have hit his thirties now, but Tim Hughes, Martin Layzell are all in their mid twenties. They're still marturing as song writers. Also, the whole movement in britain is still a young-ish movement
quote:Well, why not wait until they produce some good "mature" stuff and use that? There's plenty to use in the meantime without using sub-standard "young" stuff, if that's the problem. It's hardly an excuse, anyway - Mozart was dead before he was 40.
Originally posted by GeordieDownSouth:
Apart from feeling everyone's often a bit hard on the modern writers, comparing a Soul Survivor/Vineyard song to a wesley hymn doesn't seem like comparing like to like, there's something else that often seems to be forgotten.
A lot of these song writers are really young still. I think Redman may have hit his thirties now, but Tim Hughes, Martin Layzell are all in their mid twenties. They're still marturing as song writers. Also, the whole movement in britain is still a young-ish movement.
quote:Hope springs eternal. It didn't happen with Graham Kendrick...
Personally I like a lot of what's around at the moment, but I also expect that what will come next will be even better.
quote:Bollocks. I know plenty of people who love action songs, and plenty of them are adults. If you think they're for kids, fine, but they're not JUST for kids, unless of course your above that sort of thing. I mean they're so demeaning aren't they - its like washing smelly feet.
Dorothea said:
Phudd: action songs...for kids.
quote:Yup. In order to make a point. Its about humility in worship. We may not 'like' all the aspects of the corporate worship that we find in our churches, but, IMO, we should have the humility to be a part of it. In order to take part in the singing of a song that you consider to be for the people other than yourself, you need to humble yourself, and 'wash their feet'. If you think an action song is for kids and so not for you, IMO, you should humble yourself and wash their feet by taking part.
Did you really just compare doing an action song to Jesus washing the disciples' feet.......?
quote:And don't you dare judge me when you know very little about how I worship. I wasn't lecturing - I was answering the question which you asked me.
Dyfrig said:
phudfan, from what I gather you go to a church that has abandoned most of the traditional ways of worshipping God - don't you dare lecture anyone on humble submission to forms of worship we don't like.
quote:I think that's fair enough. I don't think anybody should be forced or co-erced into something that makes them feel uncomfortable. When I say take part, I simply mean join in and sing as best you can. The actions are an option. My original objection was to the statement that 'Action songs are for kids'. Ok, I'll accept, in the most part, the actions are there primarily for the kids, and most adults don't really want to do them. (Although some do) This doesn't stop the words holding meaning, however simplistic the words may be.
KLB said:
You make a good point, but, and it's a big but, I differentiate between acts of worship that are not to my taste, and being asked to do something that makes me feel not humbled, but a complete twerp.
quote:That's ok. I'll sing a spontaneous song of release and healing over you. Possibly in tongues.
Originally posted by dyfrig:
I feel the Spirit is leading me to kill you.
In Christian love, of course.
quote:As long as I'm not doing some actions at the time!
I'm sure Phudfan will assist in catching you as you fall to the floor
quote:Naw, not above it; I used to be a playleader so I know a lot of action songs. I could sing the the 'trees of the fields' with 3-9 year olds in Suday school or in a 'special family service' but don't want to sing it for myself when I go to communion, cos a load of 'aesthically challenged' folk up the front think it's liberating to do so. It makes me feel physically ill.
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dorothea said:
Phudd: action songs...for kids.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Bollocks. I know plenty of people who love action songs, and plenty of them are adults. If you think they're for kids, fine, but they're not JUST for kids, unless of course your above that sort of thing.
quote:Esther went to Moab?
Originally posted by busyknitter:
One horrific experience that I had a few weeks ago was a themed family service, where the congregation sung the entire book of Ruth, written in doggerel and set to the tune of "One Man went to Mow". It started "
-Esther went to Moab,
-Went to Moab in a famine
quote:oops, told you I was traumatised. And no it doesn't scan, that was half the trouble.
Esther went to Moab?
I hope it was Naomi
quote:I've written a new verse which could possibly be used at the convention of Christian Pharmacists if such a thing existed!
Originally posted by Erina:
Speaking of trauma, I was recently talking to one of my friends in a Christian highschool. Apparently, ever since they got a new headmaster, they have been singing in chapel a hymn entitled "God of Concrete, God of Steel". At first, I didn't believe that could actually be a real hymn, but a little googling found it for me. From the 1971 Hymn Book of the Anglican Church of Canada and the United Church of Canada, comes this marvelous tune:
God of concrete, God of steel,
God of piston and of wheel,
God of pylon, God of steam,
God of girder and of beam,
God of atom, God of mine:
all the world of power is thine.
There are three more verses in the same vein, which can be found here, if you're curious. I can understand maybe singing this once, just once, but I have it on good authority that my friends suffered through this in every bi-weekly chapel for two months.
quote:
Originally posted by ACOL-ite:
My God is a Great Big God
quote:Oh yeah? If that's so, how come it happens at our church so frequently?
what's going on in a main Sunday service and what's going on at Holiday Club (even if it's the worshippy bit at the end) are IMO very different things and so inserting something from one into the other rarely works.
quote:I am reminded of the school prayer from Monty Python's 'Meaning of Life' - "O God you are so huge, and we're all mightily impressed down here I can tell you."
Originally posted by busyknitter:
-Oi, oi, we're gonna praise the Lord
-Oi, oi, we're gonna praise the Lord
He's an exciting, powerising, c-collosal, humungous- mungus God!
BK
quote:Go, Jane!
There was a lot of singing, too. The congregation was supposed to join in, but it didn't, leaving the vocal exertions up to the choir. Gregor didn't blame them. The music was frequently insipid and sometimes just plain awful, the kind of thing the Carpenters might have written on a bad day.
quote:The worry about that, is it sounds so very familiar!
Quote from Jane Haddam's mystery Precious Blood (Bantam, 1991)
'There was a lot of singing, too. The congregation was supposed to join in, but it didn't, leaving the vocal exertions up to the choir. Gregor didn't blame them. The music was frequently insipid and sometimes just plain awful, the kind of thing the Carpenters might have written on a bad day.'
Go, Jane!
quote:Now, how well can you sing "Ghost" and "Pentecost" so that they rhyme? Without laughing?
Yes, and Christ ascended, too,
to prepare a place for you;
so, we give him special praise,
after those great Forty Days.
Then, he sent the Holy Ghost,
on the Day of Pentecost,
with us ever to abide;
well may we keep Whitsuntide!
quote:Oh, I don't know, that sounds like it might be their fate in Purgatory or something -- sort of like the stuff Adrian Plass talks about in his Bouncy Castle book.
Originally posted by Janine:
You haven't lived until you've seen staid matrons and dignified elders and deacons writhing around imitating dancing hippos, all in the name of the Lord.
quote:I've heard quite a few like that; strangely they all have similar "tunes". Not identical, just similar. Is someone reinventing plainsong? Only without the craft and skill.
Originally posted by Papio*:
I don't know if anybody else has encountered this hymn:
Love is his word, love is his way
feasting with all, fasting alone
living and dying, rising again
love, only love is his way
and so on and so forth with only minor variations.
In any case, I thought it was very, very soppy.
quote:I thought we were the only ones to be subjected to this! Do you get the squeaky voices too?
Originally posted by Janine:
I'm visualizing the wriggling, as if using a hula-hoop, when my church sings the Hippo Song "Hip-Hip-Hippopotamus, Hip-Hip-Hooray God Made All of Us..." Yes, the adults do it with the kids, at the kids' events.
You haven't lived until you've seen staid matrons and dignified elders and deacons writhing around imitating dancing hippos, all in the name of the Lord.
quote:I was happier then when I hadn't lived. It's this regression to childhood that these wretched things cause in otherwise intelligent adults that really bugs me.
Originally posted by Janine:
You haven't lived until you've seen staid matrons and dignified elders and deacons writhing around imitating dancing hippos, all in the name of the Lord.
quote:KLB, If people are worried about what others will think of them, they probably won't want to be associated with any Christians. Christians do have this knack of making other Christian's toes curl.
Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
Doesn't explain the damned things being used when there are no kids around.
I worry more about the impact they might have on any normal person who wanders in off the street. "You mean Christianity is about looking a tit doing 'one potato, two potato' actions to 'I will build my church'? No thanks, I think I'll try the Buddhists"
quote:KLB,
Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
Need to explain further, now I think I've understood for myself what the problem is.
It's niceness.
Not holiness, not goodness. But niceness.
The action songs smack of a Christianity that's all flower shows and square dancing. Coffee Mornings and beetle drives. Cleaning the silver and stacking up the chairs after the Ladies' Prettiest Tea Cosy competition. It's completely alien to most people I know, who go down the pub, watch the telly, swear and make rude jokes about willies. I'm in the latter group and find the whole church culture as alien and as uninviting as a suggestion to a hippopotamus to join the Royal Ballet. Fortunately, I was appealed by the theology, not the culture. If I'd grown up in the church I'd probably not be a Christian now.
And action songs epitomise the horrible, "nice", girly worst of it. Go on - go round your office and ask your workmates how many of them want to sing action songs in public. They'll look at you like you've just said something weird about Hyracotheria.
Or, to put it the way Vyvyan did in the Young Ones - "It's so sodding NICE AND IT MAKES ME SICK!"
quote:There was an ecumenical service in our town square with all this (why is it that ecumenical services are always taken over by the loony brigade?)
Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
I worry more about the impact they might have on any normal person who wanders in off the street. "You mean Christianity is about looking a tit doing 'one potato, two potato' actions to 'I will build my church'? No thanks, I think I'll try the Buddhists"
quote:Oh.my.goodness. I can't believe there are still churches that sing this song. Much as I love 80's culture, there are certian aspects of it that need to be left there. Like this song.
Originally posted by cygnus:
A while back I was at a service with my teenage daughter, and during the dreadful "Isn't He?" ie
Isn't he beautiful? (beautiful?), \Isn't he wonderful? (wonderful?).... Wonderful (isn't he?) etc. ad nauseam
she turned to me and whispered "That's exactly how we talk to the dog!"
quote:We Want to See Jesus Lifted High. I sometimes dream I'm in a church service where they started to sing this and never ever found the way to end it, so we end up singing it for all eternity.
Originally posted by English Johnny:
My pet peeves:
The song without end. This is usually some Christian rock number that ought to fade out*, but few if any churches can fade such music out. What is worse, even when there are musicians around that can knock up an ending in seconds, they don't bother. If music can start it can d....d well end too.
quote:My experience is slightly different.
Originally posted by Wood:
quote:We Want to See Jesus Lifted High. I sometimes dream I'm in a church service where they started to sing this and never ever found the way to end it, so we end up singing it for all eternity.
Originally posted by English Johnny:
My pet peeves:
The song without end. This is usually some Christian rock number that ought to fade out*, but few if any churches can fade such music out. What is worse, even when there are musicians around that can knock up an ending in seconds, they don't bother. If music can start it can d....d well end too.
A foreshadowing of damnation, perhaps.
quote:That song "Here I am to worship" (which I think is a nice song, don't get me wrong) actually has no cadence written in it to end. Someone told me once about being at a meeting where they were singing this and they just kept on and on, and the band stopped but everyone kept singing, so the band had to start again. How it ever ended I have no idea.
Originally posted by English Johnny:
Originally posted by English Johnny:
My pet peeves:
The song without end. This is usually some Christian rock number that ought to fade out*, but few if any churches can fade such music out. What is worse, even when there are musicians around that can knock up an ending in seconds, they don't bother. If music can start it can d....d well end too.
, fizzle, splutter
quote:My own personal view on this is that its because worship isn't really something you do in church anyway. But that's probably a discussion for somewhere else...
Originally posted by English Johnny:
Oh and another thing.
Why, instead of saying what we are going to do don't we get on and do it instead? Don't the writers know how to worship (or praise) beyond instructing people to do so?
quote:I do believe, that in times of warfare and shoddy hymns/songs that that is really called collaboration and so should never be talked of again
My evasive action trumps them all - I'm playing the piano.
quote:You should try finding (it might be difficult) either Hot Air for Jesus or Char by Marc Catley. He has written great new lyrics that just might bring this song back to common usage in the church.
Originally posted by cygnus:
A while back I was at a service with my teenage daughter, and during the dreadful "Isn't He?" ie
Isn't he beautiful? (beautiful?), \Isn't he wonderful? (wonderful?).... Wonderful (isn't he?) etc. ad nauseam
she turned to me and whispered "That's exactly how we talk to the dog!"
quote:We sing that too.
Originally posted by Janine:
We've got a "Higher Higher", don't know if it's the one mentioned above. Hear it as "Hiyah", as if some New Jersey guy with a broken nose and a gun in a hidden holster was singing it:
(verse one)
Higher higher,
Hiiiiigher higher higher higher higher
Higher higher --
Lift Jesus higher!
Then the chorus:
Cast your burdens (clap clap clap)
Onto Jesus (clap clap clap)
For He caaaaaares for you (clap clap clap)
(repeat)
Then, "Lower lower, push Satan lower"
"Deeper deeper, dig your faith deeper"
"Wider wider, spread the Gospel wider"
quote:Yes, i can imagine. Unfortunately, in the latter situation, it just looks like the only high person is the vicar, for choosing it in the first place.
Originally posted by Gill H:
I learned 'Higher, higher' at Kensington Temple. It works a lot better when about 400 Afro-Caribbean pentecostals are singing it with vigour than when performed by a piano and 30 nervous Anglicans.
quote:The "Spaghetti Western" flavor has led us to now call it "The Theme from Fist Full of Angels".
Resucito! Resicito! Resucito! Aleluya! (strum strum) (strum strum)
Aleluya! Aleluya! Aleluya! Resucito! (bwaawaa bwaawaa) (bwaawaa bwaawaa)
Dea-eth!
Where is dea-eth?
Where is dea-eth?
Where is it's sti-ing?
quote:Me too. Brilliant, isn't it?!
Originally posted by Gill H:
I've got a great Wellspring recording of that song. Full paso doble guitars and trumpets, the whole bit. Love it, but I'd never try to sing it in my church!
quote:ROFLMAO at this one. Thank goodness no-one's tried to make a worship chorus out of the way *I* talk to the dog.
Originally posted by cygnus:
A while back I was at a service with my teenage daughter, and during the dreadful "Isn't He?" ie
Isn't he beautiful? (beautiful?), \Isn't he wonderful? (wonderful?).... Wonderful (isn't he?) etc. ad nauseam
she turned to me and whispered "That's exactly how we talk to the dog!"
quote:This sounds like a potential source of contamination - especially if the person in question did not take the necessary precautions before opening the 'Songs of Fluffiness' book - ie: protective clothing and an iodine tablet.
Maybe the hymn-choosing-person was looking through the book to see what was there and was reminded of all the GK songs she used to sing back in the days when MP was new.
quote:That's because they aren't up to playing it.
Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
Organists, as usually talented and sensitive musicians, generally hate GK.
quote:Has anyone noticed that much of the sheet music published today seems to be created as a staight print from a MIDI system? So every tiny difference in what's really a repeat gets notated with dotted eighth notes and the like. It's tedious when what's really a verse and chorus structure is eight or ten pages of notation, exercising obscure note length variants everywhere.
Originally posted by David:
That's because they aren't up to playing it.
quote:I like GK! I think the key to incorporating modern material is to a)find the right moment in the service, some make useful 'gathering songs' some of the quieter, more reflective choruses work well during communion and b) Re-harmonisation of some of the simpler material can help, sometimes I arrange them into SATB or barbershop type.
Organists, as usually talented and sensitive musicians, generally hate GK
quote:So far so good...
As the deer panteth for the water
So my soul longeth after Thee
quote:Note the switch to You in the 3rd line, and in the 4th line, BAM! back to "Thee"
You alone are my heart's desire
And I long to worship Thee
quote:From Thee to You and back to Thee again. My head is spinning just trying to think about it, and no doubt King David is rotating in his grave at high speed.
You alone are my strength, my shield
To You alone may my spirit yield
You alone are my heart's desire
And I long to worship Thee
quote:We use the grammatically coherent version. My wife, who's the contemporary worship leader, is also a technical writer with a Classics background - she couldn't stand that mishmash, either.
Originally posted by Joykins:
I have found online a grammatically coherent version of this song, but I've NEVER HEARD IT SUNG with grammatically coherent lyrics!
quote:are in general, quite crap?
And the trees of the field shall clap their hands, and the tree's of the field shall clap their hands and the tree's of the of the fields shall clap thier hands and we'll go out with joy And the trees of the field shall clap their hands, and the tree's of the field shall clap their hands and the tree's of the of the fields shall clap thier hands and we'll go out with joy And the trees of the field shall clap their hands, and the tree's of the field shall clap their hands and the tree's of the of the fields shall clap thier hands and we'll go out with joy And the trees of the field shall clap their hands, and the tree's of the field shall clap their hands and the tree's of the of the fields shall clap thier hands and we'll go out with joy
quote:And ok, we haven't sung the last if these yet, but the dreadful memories of it from my eva days haunt me still..................
We'll just stand there with our hands to the sky and when the world wonder's why, we'll just tell them we're praising the king. Ye-ee-es, we'll just tell them we're praising the king. O-oo-o, we'll just tell them we're praising the king
quote:Interestingly, the only version of this hymn I have ever sung goes "Hast thou not seen, how thy desires ere have been..." which thematically seems to be closer to "all thy heart's wishes" than the original version you posted. I, too, would rather think God is only going to grant what's needful and not everything I want (how appalling that would be), but the psalm does say "delight yourself in the Lord and He will give you the desires of your heart." How is one meant to read that?
Originally posted by Talitha:
The second involved the excellent "Praise to the Lord, the Almighty, the King of Creation." There is a verse which goes
Hast thou not seen
All that is needful hath been
Granted by what he ordaineth?
The penultimate line was replaced with some bastardisation along the lines of "All thy heart's wishes have been..."
This from a really very mainstream worship book.
What kind of outrageous false vending-machine prosperity theology spawned that?! No, I most emphatically have not seen all my heart's wishes blah blah etc, and no Christianity worthy of the name would claim that I ought to have done.
People are going to sing that line and think "Nope ... I guess the whole thing must be a fairy story then."
quote:In Praise! - you really don't want to know this, but I'll tell you anyway:
Thine be the glory, risen conquering Son
quote:Words are fine in themselves, but it doesn't sound as if its the same hymn. And that really annoys me
Glory to Jesus! Risen conquering Son
quote:Although your memory is not quite 100%, you are not hallucinating:
Originally posted by Oriel:
Please tell me I'm not hallucinating!
quote:
Praise to the Lord, who, when darkness of sin is abounding,
who, when the godless do triumph, all virtue confounding,
sheddeth his light,
chaseth the horrors of night,
saints with his mercy surrounding
" anyway here is the song that we always sang as the offering was taken up. quote:Yes, I like those verses as well - though I can never sing them with a straight face now, since the person next to me turned and whispered "but my mother doesn't do speed..."
Originally posted by Oriel:
"Then to thy need
He like a mother doth speed
Spreading the wings of grace o'er thee"
quote:are in general, quite crap?
Originally posted by Papio.:
[QB] Can I take this opportunity to remind the clergy/"worship leader's" that "hymns" which go:
[QUOTE] And the trees of the field shall clap their hands, ...
quote:Well at our church we had someone complain to the minister about that song until he told whoever it was that it came from Isiah, at which point it became a favourite of theirs!!!
Originally posted by Henry Troup:
quote:are in general, quite crap?
Originally posted by Papio.:
[QB] Can I take this opportunity to remind the clergy/"worship leader's" that "hymns" which go:
[QUOTE] And the trees of the field shall clap their hands, ...
Isaiah 55:12
You will go out in joy and be led forth in peace; the mountains and hills will burst into song before you, and all the trees of the field will clap their hands.
(NIV, courtesy BibleGateway.com)
quote:became:
Tell out my soul, the greatness of the Lord
quote:Her aims were thoroughly laudable, but she was no poet to say the least.
Tell out my soul the greatness that I've heard.
quote:
This is just another Graham Kendrick song
This is just another Graham Kendrick song
We sing the first line twice and then we sing it again
This is just another Graham Kendrick song
quote:is any more "crammed in" than, say,
Mary and Joseph in stable bare
quote:from the other version.
heaven'ly hosts sing alleluia
quote:Pretty sure of that, aren't they? And my husbands former church sang this song *every week* as the church leadership slipped further and further into various weirdnesses.
There's a sweet sweet spirit in this place
And I know that it's the spirit of the Lord
quote:Frankly, it sounds like everyone is stoned. Maybe it's just pot smoke?
There are sweet expressions on each face
And I know that it's the presence of the Lord
quote:This last bit wouldn't be so bad, except for all that sweetness. As the song ends, teeth decay and diabetics are frantically shooting up insulin as everyone walks around smiley and dazed...
Sweet Holy Spirit
Sweet heavenly dove
Stay right here with us
Filling us with your love
And for these blessings
We lift our hearts in praise (hearts in praise)
Without a doubt we'll know that we have been revived
When we shall leave this place
quote:It is also in the old Baptist Hymn Book (1962 version). Not new at all!
Originally posted by Robin:
That version of Silent Night is not particularly new; it appears in the Revised Church Hymnary and even the Public School Hymn Book (among others).
Robin
quote:has become
Then sings my soul, My Saviour God, to Thee,
How great Thou art, How great Thou art.
Then sings my soul, My Saviour God, to Thee,
How great Thou art, How great Thou art!
quote:So far, not so bad. But then we get this gem at the end, just to prove that choruses aren't the only domain of 'God is my Boyfriend' songs, although perhaps as this is a hymn 'I had an Affair with God during my Mid-Life Crisis' might be a better way of putting it:
Then my heart leapes, my spirit bursts in praise;
Creator God, how great you are.
Then my heart leaps, my spirit bursts in praise;
Creator God, how great you are.
quote:This following a reference to 'Revealing God' makes for a very odd overall effect.
Then my heart leaps, my spirit bursts in thanks;
My lover God, how true you are
(x2)
quote:Even that is really, really naff. If they had to rewrite it (and I dispute that) what's wrong with a minimal change of lyrics, like "Then my soul sings, my Saviour God, to you; how great you are, how great you are"?
Originally posted by Sir George Grey.:
I have another example of a rewritten hymn from the aformentioned church. I'm not quite sure why they did a hatchet job on this one; as it wasn't all that 'gender-biased' in the first place. But anyway.
quote:has become
Then sings my soul, My Saviour God, to Thee,
How great Thou art, How great Thou art.
Then sings my soul, My Saviour God, to Thee,
How great Thou art, How great Thou art!
quote:So far, not so bad.
Then my heart leapes, my spirit bursts in praise;
Creator God, how great you are.
Then my heart leaps, my spirit bursts in praise;
Creator God, how great you are.
quote:Absolutely.
Does anyone think that rewriting hymns in this way is a form of plagiarism?
quote:This looks more like a theological hatchet-job to me. Substituting "Creator" for "Saviour" is a little pointed, isn't it? Deism? Personal theology or official theology?
Originally posted by Sir George Grey.:
... I'm not quite sure why they did a hatchet job on this one; as it wasn't all that 'gender-biased' in the first place. But anyway.
quote:has become
Then sings my soul, My Saviour God, to Thee,
How great Thou art, How great Thou art...
quote:...
Then my heart leapes, my spirit bursts in praise;
Creator God, how great you are....
Does anyone think that rewriting hymns in this way is a form of plagiarism?
quote:Oooh! I volunteer for that duty! Actually, I was at a parish that absolutely refused to sing that song. Not because of the kings, because it mentioned 'Orient', which we all know is so totally un-PC since you're supposed to call it 'Asia' now.
Originally posted by Ravenloft:
There've been many comments about re-writing, sanitising, "modernising" the words of various hymns, but I suppose the worst ones are the Christmas Carols - whoever reworked "We three kings" ala Mission Praise should be taken outside and shown the error of their ways with a bit of 2" by 4".....
quote:Never come across this one - [MarvinTheParanoidAndroid]sounds dreadful[/Marvin]
Originally posted by Ferinjen:
1. Wind, Wind, Blow Away (or something equally banal and with unfortunate references for us with thinking minds!)
quote:Which version? Both are as cheerful as a funeral, though.
2. Spirit of the Living God
quote:Not such a bad song, but whoever even thought it should be even considered for accompaniment on an organ should be dragged out into the streets and shot.
3. The Spirit Lives to set us free/Walk, Walk in the light
quote:
4. Be Still for the Presence of the Lord
quote:I don't mind losing the plainchant - it's brilliant when the congregation can actually do it but just sad when they can't - like with Psalm chants.
5. Come, Holy Ghost our souls inspire (which MP has masterfully taken from plainchant into 3/4)
quote:'Nuff said. Perhaps it's Graham Kendrick who should be dragged out into the streets and shot? Can Matt Redman stand behind so we don't have to waste two bullets?
6. Shine Jesus Shine.
quote:No, it was definitely 'Wind, wind...' (its the blow away bit I can't remember). Somewhere in Mission Praise should you look it up. A very dull tune, with a range limited to about six semitones.
Originally posted by GeordieDownSouth:
Was it "There's a Wind a-blowing"?
Not a great song, but fun to play with Drop-D tuning on Guitar.
quote:How about:
But I still don't have an eloquent reason ('its Graham Kendrick' doesn't suffice!) why I should refuse to have anything to do with it.
quote:Is that one really any worse than (I'm sure it's been mentioned several pages back!)
Originally posted by Lillian:
[
Second, the worst of the "sex with Jesus" hymns, "Come Ye Sinners Poor and Needy":
I will arise, I will go to Jesus
He will take me in his arms
In the arms of my dear savior
O there are ten thousand charms
At least in the US I don't think it's ever really sung anymore except in the backwoodsy parts of the south and Appalachia. The melody's quite spare and beautiful, which is a shame, because ewwww.
Oh, I feel so much better now.
quote:I think it's
Originally posted by GeordieDownSouth:
Was it "There's a Wind a-blowing"?
Not a great song, but fun to play with Drop-D tuning on Guitar.
quote:?
Jesu, lover of my soul
let me to thy bosom fly
quote:A friend of mine abominates the sub-genre as "My Jesus, My Boyfriend", and includes Charles Wesley in her disapproval.
Originally posted by ken:
And in what way is that worse than:
quote:
Jesu, lover of my soul...
quote:That would be considered a heresy in the Methodist Church. Wesley wrote (on the whole) briliant hymns.
Originally posted by Henry Troup:
quote:A friend of mine abominates the sub-genre as "My Jesus, My Boyfriend", and includes Charles Wesley in her disapproval.
Originally posted by ken:
And in what way is that worse than:
quote:
Jesu, lover of my soul...
quote:That's the one. The tune for the chorus is exactly the same as the tune for the verse.
Originally posted by cygnus:
quote:I think it's
Originally posted by GeordieDownSouth:
Was it "There's a Wind a-blowing"?
Not a great song, but fun to play with Drop-D tuning on Guitar.
Wind wind blow on me
wind wind set me free
Wind wind my father sent
The blessed Holy Spirit.
Etc.
NOt the worst hymn around, but definitely closer to "horrible" than otherwise.
quote:Doesn't mean everyone has to like all of them. The Anglican Church of Canada hymnbooks have a fair bit of Wesley. And Isacc Watts, whose father did jail time for not being an Anglican.
Originally posted by thomasm:
That would be considered a heresy in the Methodist Church. Wesley wrote (on the whole) briliant hymns.
Tom
quote:Author and publisher, and copyright date? Such an item should be well-documented, if only as a horrible example.
Originally posted by Norman the Organ:
...I found, quite by accident, a copy of Mary, blessed teenage mother. ...
quote:Can't remember offhand, someone else will know I'm sure - but it can be found in The Complete Anglican Hymns Old And New - along with a lot of other claptrap, and some decent hymns with their harmonies tampered with.
Originally posted by Henry Troup:
quote:Author and publisher, and copyright date? Such an item should be well-documented, if only as a horrible example.
Originally posted by Norman the Organ:
...I found, quite by accident, a copy of Mary, blessed teenage mother. ...
) quote:This caused no end of hilarity at our Worship Group practices, but, sadly, we bottled out of ever actually playing it in a congregational setting. Shame, really, as it's a pretty good tune.
I am looking for, I am longing for the place
Where I can lay my head upon your breast.
I am looking for, This place where you will pour,
Your oil over me, all over me.
quote:Sounds like the Psalms to me ... which are full of imagery that doesn't work for 20+th century people, like Psalm 133:1-2
Originally posted by Jolly Jape:
I am looking for, I am longing for the place
Where I can lay my head upon your breast.
I am looking for, This place where you will pour,
Your oil over me, all over me.
quote:Just doesn't match my notion of pleasant.
1 How good and pleasant it is
when brothers live together in unity!
2 It is like precious oil poured on the head,
running down on the beard,
running down on Aaron's beard,
down upon the collar of his robes.
quote:Ah, but the other two verses are MUCH worse than that!
Originally posted by Wesley J:
If anyone's interested, some lines from "Mary-the-unmentionable-hymn" are here.
Funny (?) enough, the writer is full of praise. But, please, just look at the text... Aargh!!!
Blessings
quote:Happy clappy? Be Still seems to me about as far from happy clappy as you can possibly get! I'd put it in a similar genre to Guide Me, Oh Thou Great Redeemer, or possibly For All The Saints.
Originally posted by Ferinjen:
4. Be Still for the Presence of the Lord
4) has long rivalled SJS as the not-quite-as-happy-clappy alternative when an Anglican church wants a token 'modern hymn'
quote:Whilst I agree that happy-clappy is possibly overstating its modernity, it surely can't be in the same category as Guide me, Oh thou great redeemer?
Originally posted by Amorya:
quote:Happy clappy? Be Still seems to me about as far from happy clappy as you can possibly get! I'd put it in a similar genre to Guide Me, Oh Thou Great Redeemer, or possibly For All The Saints.
Originally posted by Ferinjen:
4. Be Still for the Presence of the Lord
4) has long rivalled SJS as the not-quite-as-happy-clappy alternative when an Anglican church wants a token 'modern hymn'
quote:
What I really hate about this one is the theological background from which it comes.
He comes to cleanse and heal, to minister his grace;
No work too hard for him, in faith receive from him
Innocuous enough, EXCEPT that you know, and I know, and even the church cat knows, that this is actually code for "Now we're going to have a long and emotionally charged ministry time in which the suggestible will have various words from the Lord, other people will suddenly remember a trauma from 1965, and if you're not completely delivered from it you didn't have enough faith or God doesn't like you very much" - or am I just bitter and twisted?
Of course, used as a communion hymn, it can just refer to the Presence of Christ in the sacrament, but we all know that's not how it was written, and, well, for me - too much baggage. 'Nuff said.
quote:I suspect that your "familiar dirges" often are the "popular tunes of the day".
Originally posted by GeordieDownSouth:
I've heard that too, and that the familiar dirges were added later. No one's ever provided evidence to back it up.
quote:I was, of course, talking musical style. Perhaps we sing it very differently to you...
Originally posted by Ferijen:
quote:Whilst I agree that happy-clappy is possibly overstating its modernity, it surely can't be in the same category as Guide me, Oh thou great redeemer?
Originally posted by Amorya:
quote:Happy clappy? Be Still seems to me about as far from happy clappy as you can possibly get! I'd put it in a similar genre to Guide Me, Oh Thou Great Redeemer, or possibly For All The Saints.
Originally posted by Ferinjen:
4. Be Still for the Presence of the Lord
4) has long rivalled SJS as the not-quite-as-happy-clappy alternative when an Anglican church wants a token 'modern hymn'
Judgement call, anyone?
quote:I agree.
That aside, it's quite a good song, and not at all fluffy-bunny. Even if it is sung to a barely disguised ripped-off Dylan tune.
quote:Indeed. My brain on first encountering this (at CU) went 'what? an egg or the table?' and proceeded to sing 'lie'. It might not rhyme but it is at least English.
Originally posted by cygnus:
By your side I would stay
In your arms I would lay*
Jesus lover of my soul
Nothing from you I withhold.
etc. etc.
* shouldn't it be "lie"? That has always bothered me.
quote:Heresy.
Hymns & Psalms, one of the worst adverst for traditional Hymns ever.
quote:Don't you mean "Hymns Ancient and More Ancient"?
Originally posted by Ferijen:
'little red books' - sound suspiciously like Hymns Ancient and Modern
quote:That sounds possibly like the ?Methodist Hymnal. We have my great-grandmother's copy somewhere, and I'm pretty sure it is little and red and has many hymns. It also, IIRC, was great at having the music for hymns where AMR (or A&MA!) suggested something utterly unsingable and/or unknown.
Originally posted by GeordieDownSouth:
Nope, these were specifically Methodist books. With tiny print. And over a thousand hymns in them.
quote:Not that ancient. Does A&M still include the truly risible " God of concrete, God of steel"?
Originally posted by Custard123:
quote:Don't you mean "Hymns Ancient and More Ancient"?
Originally posted by Ferijen:
'little red books' - sound suspiciously like Hymns Ancient and Modern
quote:I can't remember much of Ancient & Mouldy, but I don't think HO&N is all that great. Our organist sometimes complains about the dreadful harmonies to be found therein.
Originally posted by Ferijen:
And I like them. Not as good as Hymns Old and New (Liturgical Version) or even the NEH at what they do, but a hell of a lot better than Mission Praise.
)
quote:Don't think it ever did - it was in '100 hymns for today' (or the day before yesterday).
Originally posted by corpusdelicti:
Does A&M still include the truly risible " God of concrete, God of steel"?
quote:Oh yes indeed. They seem to think that the harmonies of hymn tunes are of no importance. Unbelievable.
Originally posted by Wandering Crucifer:
...I don't think HO&N is all that great. Our organist sometimes complains about the dreadful harmonies to be found therein.
quote:Mission Praise carol sheets, anyone?!
I find anything where the words have been altered annoying
Someone was on something when they put those together.
quote:I believe they were called "Christmas Praise" and i think the Christian bookshop I work in sells them! (still)
Originally posted by Norman the Organ:
I think they're Mission Praise ones, though I might be wrong - anyone else come across them? They are especially noticeable by the fact that in O Little Town of Bethlehem some loony has seen fit to take one of the verses, cut it in half and put the two halves back together the other way round - so you sing the second half of the verse first
quote:It might not just be down to Mission Praise, as horrible as I find that book. I've seen many carol sheets mix up the "O morning stars together" verse so that it starts "For Christ was born of Mary", despite the fact that it clearly doesn't scan.
Originally posted by Norman the Organ:
I think they're Mission Praise ones, though I might be wrong - anyone else come across them? They are especially noticeable by the fact that in O Little Town of Bethlehem some loony has seen fit to take one of the verses, cut it in half and put the two halves back together the other way round - so you sing the second half of the verse first
quote:Not unusual, Norman, I am sorry to say. I presume you mean the O morning Stars/For Christ is born of Mary thing. I tried looking on the internet for an explanation of this, but didn't get far. I did, however, find this little snippet. A bit off-topic I suppose, but I wanted to share it.
Originally posted by Norman the Organ:
I think they're Mission Praise ones, though I might be wrong - anyone else come across them? They are especially noticeable by the fact that in O Little Town of Bethlehem some loony has seen fit to take one of the verses, cut it in half and put the two halves back together the other way round - so you sing the second half of the verse first
quote:Indeed. That verse seems to exist in both orders. We had to be careful because the 'St Nicholas Carolbook' (a thin volume not quite A4 in size which I've never seen anywhere else) had it one way round whilst Carols for Choir and AMNS (which the congregation were using) had it the other way round. I think the St Nicholas Carolbook must have contained the descant as I can't think why else we'd have been using it over the other two.
Originally posted by Ferijen:
quote:Not unusual, Norman, I am sorry to say. I presume you mean the O morning Stars/For Christ is born of Mary thing.
Originally posted by Norman the Organ:
I think they're Mission Praise ones, though I might be wrong - anyone else come across them? They are especially noticeable by the fact that in O Little Town of Bethlehem some loony has seen fit to take one of the verses, cut it in half and put the two halves back together the other way round - so you sing the second half of the verse first
quote:That's wonderful, Ferijen.
I tried looking on the internet for an explanation of this, but didn't get far. I did, however, find this little snippet. A bit off-topic I suppose, but I wanted to share it.
quote:and on The First Noel
Reflects social gospel.
quote:Ooh, dangerous. The social gospel and a possible implication of universal salvation. Can't find either of those in scripture!
Verse 6 -- Expression "with His blood mankind hath bought" could be misconstrued to imply universal salvation.
quote:Not knowing this hymn at all, I looked it up in Mission Praise which gives verse 4 as
#122 -- WHO IS HE IN YONDER STALL?
Text & Tune: Benjamin R. Hanby, 1866
Verses 4 and 5 questionable.
quote:Seems Biblical to me! I assume that the version in the Living Hymns hymnal has more verses!
Who is He, that stands and weeps
at the gave where Lazarus sleeps
quote:Aah. I've been exploring the rest of that site and have found a longer version of the condemnation of Christmas carols which makes it clear what has happened. Who is he has fewer verses in their version. Their complaint is
Originally posted by Carys:
This one confused me.
quote:Not knowing this hymn at all, I looked it up in Mission Praise which gives verse 4 as
#122 -- WHO IS HE IN YONDER STALL?
Text & Tune: Benjamin R. Hanby, 1866
Verses 4 and 5 questionable.
quote:Seems Biblical to me! I assume that the version in the Living Hymns hymnal has more verses!
Who is He, that stands and weeps
at the gave where Lazarus sleeps
quote:So forgiveness isn't a blessing? and Christ doesn't heal?????
Note verse 4--Strictly speaking, Christ on the cross asked the Father to forgive them, He did not pronounce blessings. Verse 5 suggests an improper emphasis on healing.
quote:I also like the way they comment on the authors (note the "s around Father):
"born this happy morning" (v. 3) ... Jesus was...most likely was born in the evening
quote:
Text: "Father" Joseph Mohr, 1818 (Roman Catholic priest);
Tune: Franz Grüber, 1818 (Roman Catholic)
...
Text: Nahum Tate, 1700 (died a drunk, 1715)
quote:According to that site then yes! They agree with the Puritans (and give many reasons for it)
Originally posted by welsh dragon:
Does that mean we ought to cancel Christmas?
(oh hang on...the Puritans already did that...)
![[Tear]](graemlins/tear.gif)
Vox sub mare
quote:I put it into our services about once every 6 months as a sort of penance. It's only slightly better than being stung by wasps.
Originally posted by seasick:
I had to play 'Shine, Jesus, Shine' on Sunday.
I thought (perhaps overly optimistically) that no-one sang that anymore.
quote:One of our choir members (there are only four to six) is named Joy, and the same odd thoughts do tend to come around.
Originally posted by cgp:
... And my mother's name is Joy - which led to some interesting mental images!! As did "The trees of the field" which starts "you shall go out with Joy......"
quote:Or you could attend a workshop on worship-song-writing by the Rev. Gerald Ambulance. I really feel that his hour-long workshop at Greenbelt on Monday night really just inspired us all to go away and write some wonderful songs.
Originally posted by ICCM - SouthEast:
...snip...
quote:MP does have one redeeming feature (which I discovered on Sunday night), it sets Breathe on me, Breath of God to Trentham and Take my life to Nottingham which are my preferred tunes to those hymns. It even manages not to have mangled the words to those hymns. Oh and it doesn't omit the promise to follow julie from O Jesus I have promised (unlike Hymns and Psalms which doesn't have that verse).
Originally posted by Vox Angelica:
I discovered yesterday that it's perfect for propping open the lid of the church piano
Sorry Norman, but the only use for Mission Praise is to help your local authority maintain its re-cycling quota. In order to make maximum use of MP, you should send a bulk delivery to your nearest rubbish re-cycling dump. Retaining a copy in your church, even in a menial capacity, "could seriously damage your [musical] health".
Vox
to merge into the Lieder genre, such as quote:One of our choristers, yet another Joy, used to throw things when we sung that in church! Mission Praise at 20 paces...NOT GOOD! Then her mother became our deaconess, so the song was banned forevermore!
Originally posted by Henry Troup:
quote:One of our choir members (there are only four to six) is named Joy, and the same odd thoughts do tend to come around.
Originally posted by cgp:
... And my mother's name is Joy - which led to some interesting mental images!! As did "The trees of the field" which starts "you shall go out with Joy......"
This one has been worrying away at me for months. Have any of you noticed the simiarity between Rebecca St Jame's 'This is the air I breathe,' and Whitney Houston's 'I will always love youuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu!?'
quote:You misjudge the number of old codgers here on the Ship, Leetle Masha.
Originally posted by Leetle Masha:
Metrical psalms are horrid poetry, but some of the tunes are very stirring if played properly. I used to have a problem with hymns that seemed
"I come to the garden alone, while the dew is still on the roses...."
Guess I'm so old, and most of =you= are so young, that you'll never have heard that one....
So good to know there are fellow codgers around! If one has problems with "In the Garden", they can always try my method of imagining I was St. Thérèse of Lisieux and I was meditating on the Mystical Marriage.
quote:Sounds fun, please can I have a copy?
Originally posted by Leetle Masha:
"I come to the garden alone, while the dew is still on the roses...."
quote:see (and hear!) here
Originally posted by The Venomous Bede:
quote:Sounds fun, please can I have a copy?
Originally posted by Leetle Masha:
"I come to the garden alone, while the dew is still on the roses...."
Andy and I tend to think it's a bit on the fluffy-bunny side, but maybe we're not understanding it properly.
quote:I looked the hymn up in AMNS (because I could remember the number (aaargh)) and couldn't see the problem, but then I noticed the telling asterix which means that it has been altered, comparing it with NEH the alteration is quite extensive.
Originally posted by Henry Troup:
Last weekend we had harvest festival, and of course sang Come, ye Thankful People, Come. I decided that the theology of the third and fourth verses was pretty noxious in that:
quote:I don't read the bit about the tares (which is in AMNS) like that necessarily. If one takes it that we are all a mixture of wheat and tares and that the bad stuff in us goes (rather than some people being the tares and others the wheat). Maybe this is just me being strange though.
The third verse seems to glory in the thought that some people will go to Hell come Judgement.
quote:Note the subjunctive in the third line:
The fourth, depending on how you read it, suggests that the church is free from sin and sorrow.
Besides, isn't calcling for Judgement "right now" a sin?
quote:Flashbacks! Flashbacks!
Originally posted by Newman's Own+:
I cannot recall the entire verse, but it began with:
Here comes Jesus.
See him walking on the water.
He lifts me up, and he helps me to stand.
quote:The verse seems to imply that it it "offences" rather than "offenders" that will be taken to Hell. Not brilliant theology, I suppose.
Originally posted by Henry Troup:
Last weekend we had harvest festival, and of course sang Come, ye Thankful People, Come. I decided that the theology of the third and fourth verses was pretty noxious in that:
The third verse seems to glory in the thought that some people will go to Hell come Judgement.
...
Besides, isn't calling for Judgement "right now" a sin?
quote:That's not how you sing it! It goes:
Originally posted by Laura:
Oh Lord. If I hear "The Shepherd's Pipe Carol" ONE MORE TIME I will not be responsible for my actions.
...on the road to BETH-le-hem.
quote:Psalm 118 has a similar structure:
Originally posted by Whiteadder:
...
(Man, statistically that's exactly 50% of the whole chorus occupied by the same word.)...
Okay, that's my rant, feel free to shoot me down!
quote:But there is such a thing as too much too much too much repetition.
1 Give thanks to the LORD , for he is good;
his love endures forever.
2 Let Israel say:
"His love endures forever."
3 Let the house of Aaron say:
"His love endures forever."
4 Let those who fear the LORD say:
"His love endures forever."
to all cheesy Christian music!quote:Undignified, Matt Redman.
Originally posted by Freelance Monotheist:
There's one song I could never stand by Delirious (or someone like that, modern anyway) who have a line that goes 'Nah nah nah hah Hey/Yeah!' which doesn't even mean anything!!!
quote:and
And David danced before the LORD with all his might; and David was girded with a linen ephod.
So David and all the house of Israel brought up the ark of the LORD with shouting, and with the sound of the trumpet.
And as the ark of the LORD came into the city of David, Michal Saul's daughter looked through a window, and saw king David leaping and dancing before the LORD; and she despised him in her heart.
quote:I used to have "And I'll become even more undignified than this." as my signature.
When David returned home to bless his household, Michal daughter of Saul came out to meet him and said, "How the king of Israel has distinguished himself today, disrobing in the sight of the slave girls of his servants as any vulgar fellow would!"
David said to Michal, "It was before the LORD , who chose me rather than your father or anyone from his house when he appointed me ruler over the LORD's people Israel-I will celebrate before the LORD . I will become even more undignified than this, and I will be humiliated in my own eyes. But by these slave girls you spoke of, I will be held in honor."
quote:Sorry to butt in so late on a post, but I couldn't let this one go! This is by no means the worst bit of this song, as any fule kno.
Originally posted by Whiteadder:
For example the, otherwise fine, worship song "Light of the World" that repeats the word altogether three times in the chorus...
"You're altogether lovely,
Altogether worthy,
Altogether wonderful to me."
(Man, statistically that's exactly 50% of the whole chorus occupied by the same word.)
as one word 'Hereayyam'. Which I really dislike, or,quote:I've no problem with the song as a song (though I don't like it much). Matt Redman is quite free to sing it on stage or record it on his CDs to make a point.
Originally posted by Padingtun Bear.:
But I've no problem with Undignified ! Some things you just have to forgive...
quote:The churches where I've heard it sung are charismatic, and since we're vertical at the time and mostly wind up on the carpet afterwards, it's accurate. Playing Head in the bucket at TACF with Melinda Fish was undignifed, amusing, and spiritually rewarding.
Originally posted by ken:
But I do have a problem with singing it as a worship song in a normal church service. Because its not true. We don't intend to become significantly more undignified than that, not at any church I've been to anyway. We're lying when we sing it.
I do remember that it was Kendrick, as I noticed that there were two of his.
quote:This song shall forever live in my memory as a symbol of my protest against clapping. The worship leader strode down the aisle encouraging all to clap. She reached me. My hands remained clenched behind my back. She motioned to me to join in, and clapped in my face. I gave her a look that said, "I'll kill you first." She moved on.
Originally posted by ken:
728 Give me oil in my lamp keep me burning
quote:I really don't want to go into all this again because it must be boring by now. There was a whole thread about it not long ago. Probably around somewhere.
Originally posted by The Wanderer:
There is nothing wrong with DLAFOM.
quote:Someone else just started a thread about DLAFOM so I put some of my reasons there.
Originally posted by ken:
There was a whole thread about it not long ago. Probably around somewhere.
quote:ken, the fact that you have to explain your views about DLAFOM so often shows that there is nothing clear or obvious about them. I happen not to believe that it is heretical, anti-christian or gnostic, but I can see that you have made out a case. However it is not a "clear and obvious" one.
But it is clearly and obviously not just heretical but anti-Christian.
quote:Monty Morris' ska version of that song is terrific, though. A beautifully simple horn solo kicks in half way through, blows a fanfare and gasps through a clownish glissando before resurrecting into a descant that has grace shot through it. Just the bare minimum of ornament, a scale and a one note gallop: perfect in every way. Then Toots Hibbert gives it some gospel that'd convert a sand lizard.
Originally posted by Ian Climacus:
quote:This song shall forever live in my memory as a symbol of my protest against clapping. The worship leader strode down the aisle encouraging all to clap. She reached me. My hands remained clenched behind my back. She motioned to me to join in, and clapped in my face. I gave her a look that said, "I'll kill you first." She moved on.
Originally posted by ken:
728 Give me oil in my lamp keep me burning
quote:Fair enough, perhaps 'colonialist' was the wrong choice of word on my part. But lines like
Originally posted by ken:
What's colonialist about that?
Unless you think that Christianity itself is colonialist and should never be communicated to people who already have their own religion.
quote:seriously slander many faiths whose purpose is not to worship a wooden idol and so, imho, have no place in a modern church where if we're not preaching active conversion of people of other faiths (and whether we should do that is another discussion) we should at least promote tolerance and understanding.
In vain with lavish kindness the gifts of God are strown;
the heathen in his blindness bows down to wood and stone!
quote:hasn't yet arrived, and I'm not singing as though it is.
soul [is] lighted with wisdom from on high,
quote:A direct quote from Kipling (or vice versa) The 'Eathen
Originally posted by ferijen:
...quote:
...
the heathen in his blindness bows down to wood and stone!
quote:Recent threads have suggested that there are more women attending church than men. Maybe we don't need to tell the women to do it.
Originally posted by Moth:
I'm thinking of locking someone up after being subjected to Men of Faith Rise Up and Sing
quote:Why the sudden shift from "his" to "you" between lines 2 and 3? Is it just me that finds that jarring?
We've been through fire we've been
through rain
We've been refined by the power of his name
We've fallen deeper in love with you
You've burned the truth on our lips
quote:This reminds me of one of Andrew Rumsey's 'Strange Warmings' columns - 'Mighty Rivers of Praise.' You'll find it in the magazine.
Originally posted by shareman:
From Greenland's Icy Mountains. Ah, childhood. It is, of course, the marching song of 19th century Imperialism. Not that I was a child in Victorian England or anything.....
We whose hearts are lighted with wisdom from on high (good Victorian Christians that we are, most advanced and all)Can we to men benighted, the lamp of life deny? No, we must shoulder the White Man's Burden, now mustn't we? Thing is, I find the words funny, rather than offensive. I get images of earnest Victorian churchgoers singing it all sincere and everything, meaning every word. Now it's a lovely rousing tune, I still love singing it, but usually only when I'm a little tipsy and in the mood to cause derisive chuckles at other than my voice.
quote:"The heathen in his blindness bows down to wood and stone." OK OK I can see the spiritual meaning of it, but it's still good for a chuckle. I nod my head about how it's spiritual darkness that needs dispelling by the Light of Christ that we have been most fortunate to have received. That, having been so fortunate to have received the wonderful Light of God, we have a responsibility to spread that Light to all. And that man alone is vile because man alone is vile and fallen everywhere, that's what it is to be human. I'll acknowledge why it's vain that God sowed His gifts in lavish kindness to those whose spiritual darkness and enslavement to the powers of evil prevent them from acknowledging the grace of the Giver of every blessing. In a way, I believe all of it actually, all sarcasm aside. But I'll still have a good laugh at the Imperialism of it all. Great fun really. And it sounds really good belted out of several people after three or four pints at the local!
Originally posted by ken:
Shareman, that's an eisegesis, not an exegesis.
It doesn't say that, even if that's what many of the singers would have thought when they sang it.
quote:Why????? Drink from it I could have understood.
Dip your heart in the stream
quote:The recessional was 'Walk with me, oh my Lord'. This did at least acknowledge that the Christian journey is not always easy but:
As I kneel before you,
and I see your smiling face,
ev'ry thought, ev'ry word
is lost in your embrace
quote:is just bad poetry. Some of the verses had rhymes between the second and fourth lines (as above) but I'm not convinced spent and strength do, nor mind and side and I'm sure blind and high don't.
Stones often bar my path
and there are times I fall,
but you are always there
to help me when I call
quote:I too am not much of a fan but i was at a church the other week that did it to the tune of House of the Rising Sun. It was actually really good (though I doubt you'd like it as it had guitars and drums accompanying
Originally posted by Carys:
*I'm afraid I'm not a fan, mainly I think because of overuse and a dislike of the tune.
)
quote:Ask the "yoof" what they want. Are they fighting for MP? Proponents of mor modern worship usually use "relevance to the yoof" as a pretext for ditching existing hymnals and liturgy. It might be interesting to find out if the younger element actually want MP or whether it is the Christian Blairites (modernisers) that do so.
Originally posted by The Venomous Bede:
Help! I have plenty of reasons for hating Mission Praise. Various members of our Vestry wish to buy copies and introduce it as the main hymnal (they currently borrow copies from the Presbyterians for their once a month navel gazing "Prayer and praise" service). We currently use A&M new standard. 90% of our congregation is over 50. We only have 4 teenagers at our main Eucharist on Sundays. Please can I have as many reasoned arguments as posssible to fight them off? The Hymnal I would love to use is NEH. My trouble is, I guess, that I find MP so ghastly I cease to be logical about it and lose my rag. Your suggestions please, or else they will lose me as choir leader and I will have to commute to St Mary's in Edinburgh on Sundays!
quote:So... it basically has a groovy tune
Originally posted by mr_ricarno:
I'd always liked 'my glorious', though I agree it's pretty crappy lyrically!
Delirious started out so well, but something changed early on and they've been crap ever since...
. quote:in context - Trading My Sorrows
And we say yes Lord yes Lord yes yes Lord
Yes Lord yes Lord yes yes Lord
Yes Lord yes Lord yes yes Lord Amen
quote:I think that the Jesus Army lyrics that you just mentioned are profound in there simplicity and strong in their meaning
Originally posted by Calindreams:
Another Jesus Army one:-
Universe universe
We feel your living soul.
Universe universe
Throbbing through the whole.
quote:The Universe has a soul? The Universe throbs? Have I missed something.
Originally posted by riverfalls:
quote:I think that the Jesus Army lyrics that you just mentioned are profound in there simplicity and strong in their meaning
Originally posted by Calindreams:
Another Jesus Army one:-
Universe universe
We feel your living soul.
Universe universe
Throbbing through the whole.
quote:It certainly throbs.
Originally posted by Sioni Sais:
The Universe has a soul? The Universe throbs? Have I missed something?
quote:isotropic means having uniform properties in all directions independent of the direction.
Originally posted by Sioni Sais:
If ken could come back and explain anisotropic I'd be grateful.
quote:A red cross on a blue 'ink-marbled' background? Oh, the memory of it.
Originally posted by ken:
Wasn't that in 100 Hymns for Today?
I can feel my flesh creeping already.
quote:Google points me to
Originally posted by The Lady of the Lake:
Can anybody tell me which is the song that has 'we are a vapour' as its second line.
quote:I found "My faith. it is an oaken staff", number 148 in the Boys Brigade hymnal. Cyberhymnal has that here credited to Thomas T. Lynch (1818-1817) and thereby Public Domain.
Originally posted by Barnabas62:
...recalled finding a hymn with the title "My heart it is an oaken staff" - and said it was truly horrible. ...
quote:I've never aspired to be "staid" myself.
My faith, it is an oaken staff,
The traveler’s well loved aid;
My faith, it is a weapon stout,
The soldier’s trusty blade,
I’ll travel on, and still be stirred,
By silent thought or social word;
By all my perils undeterred,
A soldier pilgrim staid.
quote:Yes. Exactly. I hope it is possible for Kevin to be re-habbed (if he hasn't been already). I reckon a lot of other people might as well. New thread?
Originally posted by Calindreams:
I was gutted when Kevin Prosch's albums were taken off the shelves when he was caught up in some controversy in the Vineyard church. During my own struggles with my own faith his words always spoke powerfully, probably because his lyrics reflected a similar struggle.
quote:I'm pretty sure this song was discussed, mocked and even parodied farther back on this thread. I have never heard it sung but it is responsible for me cracking up audibly during a three-hour Good Friday service one time, as I was flipping idly through (unfamiliar to non-Anglican me) hymnal.
Originally posted by Henry Troup:
Ken's use of "anisotropic" reminds me obliquely of the whole genre of 1960/1970 "relevant" hymns such as God of Concrete, God of Steel. Anyone ever actually heard this sung? I never have.
Frederick R.C. Clarke and Richard Granville Jones in The Hymn Book of the Anglican Church of Canada and the United Church of Canada (1971 edition)
quote:Speaking of Wesley, aren't some of the words of "Christ the Lord is risen today" quite odd.
Originally posted by Sioni Sais:
That's another "Directive " hymn or song. I detest all of them of any era, even if Charles Wesley wrote it.
quote:I think it was some chap called Dave who made them popular. Jewish guy...
Originally posted by Sioni Sais:
That's another "Directive " hymn or song. I detest all of them of any era, even if Charles Wesley wrote it.
quote:Which bits? Just checked out the words at cyber hymnal and the only bits I could find that are maybe a little odd are:
Originally posted by Leprechaun:
Speaking of Wesley, aren't some of the words of "Christ the Lord is risen today" quite odd.
We had some international students at church today who had not a clue of what was going on - and I could see where their confusion stemmed from.
quote:Ah yes, the monstrosity my father has always called "The Red Oven Door". I take it you didn't get to the one that thanked God for "this sacrament of sex that recreates our kind".
Originally posted by TrudyTrudy (I say unto you):
quote:I'm pretty sure this song was discussed, mocked and even parodied farther back on this thread. I have never heard it sung but it is responsible for me cracking up audibly during a three-hour Good Friday service one time, as I was flipping idly through (unfamiliar to non-Anglican me) hymnal.
Originally posted by Henry Troup:
Frederick R.C. Clarke and Richard Granville Jones in The Hymn Book of the Anglican Church of Canada and the United Church of Canada (1971 edition)
Between unsingable arrangements, rewordings that seem to be only for the sake of change, and hymns no-one would want to sing anyway, that book has to be the absolute worst thing ever foisted on unsuspecting Christians. Most places went back to the old Book of Common Praise a few years after the red thing came out. I don't know of any Anglican parish on the island that uses it, the church in my hometown having given up it's occasional use of it for the new green book. The latter is an improvement, but I suspect it is best received in those parishes that have used nothing else than the aforementioned piece of crap for the past thirty or so years and have thus forgotten what a good hymn is supposed to be anyway. What odds about blessing gay unions, we should have been drummed out of the Communion for allowing that thing in the door, IMNSHO!
quote:The red union hymnal gets a fair amount of use in the Anglican Diocese of Ottawa. Some parishes have taken up the new Anglican book, which I think is also titled Comon Praise. The new United Voices United has its moments ... good and bad. I was at one Anglican parish in Toronto that was seriously discussing adopting Voices United.
Originally posted by shareman:
...Most places went back to the old Book of Common Praise a few years after the red thing came out. I don't know of any Anglican parish on the island that uses it...
quote:1. Not so's you'd notice.
Originally posted by John Holding:
Shareman -
The Red Book was almost universal in Western Canada and Ontario. Interseting to hear what your father thought about it; do you have an opinion of your own?
And the new book is blue, not green.
John
quote:Possibly it's to do with the (perceived or actual) shortened attention span of modern youngsters/non-regular churchgoers/people in general. Or to do with the fact that non-regular churchgoers really aren't used to corporate singing. Therefore, the thought goes, we shouldn't stress the poor things too much by inflicting too many verses on them. Even if you disrupt the entire narrative structure by doing so . (Think of the consequences of missing out certain verses of "At the name of Jesus"...)
Originally posted by shareman:
I mean leaving out verses, for instance. Sorry, I don't own a copy, and thus can't give examples. I remember that the "new book" is not as bad for that sort of thing as the Red one was. We used it at home last Christmas Eve. One of the carols we sang was shortened in this fashion, can't remember which one at present, but it seemed needless to me. Sorry not to have specific references, but I'll see if I can find a copy over the next couple of days and be more specific.
quote:Hymns whose primary subject matter is something other than God are always a source of some discomfort to me. "Lord Thy Word abideth" is another of these, as the words make clear that what is being referred to is Scripture, not Christ.
Originally posted by Henry Troup:
quote:
My faith, it is an oaken staff,
The traveler’s well loved aid;
My faith, it is a weapon stout,
The soldier’s trusty blade,
quote:Nope -- I'm just a user. Commons WOrship would have been rather different if I'd been there. And, though I'm nearing 60, I's have to be closer to 80 to have been involved with the Red Book.
Originally posted by shareman:
I suspect from your tone you had some input into the compilation of one or both books.
...
A case in point is Jesus Loves Me, every kid's favourite hymn when I was growing up in the 60s and 70s. If the kids for whom it was meant had no trouble understanding it, why was it necessary to change it to "... and the Bible tells me so. Little ones to Him belong, in His love we shall be strong "? I do think changes like that need justification if only to avoid the accusation of pettiness.
quote:Guitar straps at a Evo' worship event?
Originally posted by Sinisterial:
Can anyone explain what is behind
God's promises are like rainbows in the dark?
quote:As interpreted by MY pastor, not YOURS.
Originally posted by Custard.:
Oh, and as for "Jesus loves me, this I know, for the Bible tells me so."
It's not that it's discounting other ways of knowing about God, simply working from the realisation that other ways are not as reliable and authoritative as the Bible.
quote:The second verse is particularly appropriate as a processional,
Originally posted by Jante:
How many remeber/know -
Hold the Fort for I am coming!!
Jante
quote:
See the mighty host advancing,
Satan leading on
quote:Karl Barth, who led the counter-attack against the feeble minds and shonky theology of the Bultmanniacs, was asked if he could sum up his theology in a single sentence. He thought for a while, and responded, "Jesus loves me, this I know, for the Bible tells me so".
Originally posted by Custard.:
Oh, and as for "Jesus loves me, this I know, for the Bible tells me so."
It's not that it's discounting other ways of knowing about God, simply working from the realisation that other ways are not as reliable and authoritative as the Bible.
quote:Welcome aboard! Looks like you'll fit right in!
Originally posted by Auntie Doris:
Having only recently boarded The Ship (and subsequently spending most of yesterday reading this thread) I would like to add my own contribution.
...oops did I say that? Internal monologue taking over again!!)
Auntie Doris x
quote:Sounds Like Zebedee to me
Hey ho!
It's time to go
boing boing boing boing boing boing boing boing boing boing boing boing boooooooooooooooooooooing
boing boing boing boing boing boing boing boing boing boing boing boing boooooooooooooooooooooing
quote:We use annually at our church - for kids holiday clubs.
Originally posted by mr_ricarno:
Has anyone heard a really stupid children's 'praise' song whose chorus goes
Hey ho!
It's time to go
boing boing boing boing boing boing boing boing boing boing boing boing boooooooooooooooooooooing
boing boing boing boing boing boing boing boing boing boing boing boing boooooooooooooooooooooing
or similar. It was used at a family service at my home church, and I found its almost total lack of reference to God, Jesus or Christianity rather amusing.
quote:I stand corrected.
Originally posted by thomasm:
Oh and also its "come on" rather "hey ho" i think.
Tom
quote:Funny that, cos over here that was probably one of the most sung songs (in evangelical circles) about 5 years ago. It is also one of Matt Redman's songs that is most suitable for congregational singing (some would take that as an indication of what the rest of them are like!) I've sung it many times in many different groups and settings and most of the time it's been fine. I think one of the problems with music is that people don't accept that the first time you do something it's probably going to be a bit pants. It does sound like the band didn't know what they were doing though.
Originally posted by Henry Troup:
I got exposed to an example of a worship song that just didn't work for congregational singing this week. At a Cursillo ultreya, we sang (in the middle of a bunch of other stuff) Once Again by Matt Redman. Unfortunately:It, to be charitable, limped. By contrast, more familiar stuff had excellent volumen from band and congregation.
- The acoustics were poor
- Most of the congregation didn't seem to know it
- The praise band was a little uncertain on it
- There was no strong lead singer with enough volume
- The phrasing of the song is irregular
quote:I presume you mean Stuart Townend who has indeed written quite a few hymn-like songs in the past few years. I'm a bit confused though; Blessed Be Your Name is a Matt Redman one and couldn't really be described as a 'proper hymn'. Townend's most well known song is In Christ Alone - you might be thinking of something like that.
Originally posted by A. Smith:
My least favourite Matt Redman song is the "dirge" Worthy.
The verses are bearable but the chorus
"Worthy X lots
Much more worthy than i know!
Cant stand repetetive choruses. It sounds like a droning chorus!
Like Mr Townsend (sp?) stuff, especially the Blessed be your name - sounds like a "proper hymn"
quote:What exactly does this mean?
God's promises are rainbows in the dark
quote:??? Heaven lost something when Christ died? - an empty status maybe but that is all!
...our gain was heavens loss..
quote:would be far better if the "I" and the "You" were swapped around (which we do in my ch__ch)
..though my world will fall I'll never let you go..
quote:Sorry it was a Matt Redman song, it is unfortunately the closest thing we get to a hymn in my church. (Doh!)
Originally posted by quantpole:
quote:I presume you mean Stuart Townend who has indeed written quite a few hymn-like songs in the past few years. I'm a bit confused though; Blessed Be Your Name is a Matt Redman one and couldn't really be described as a 'proper hymn'. Townend's most well known song is In Christ Alone - you might be thinking of something like that.
Originally posted by A. Smith:
My least favourite Matt Redman song is the "dirge" Worthy.
The verses are bearable but the chorus
"Worthy X lots
Much more worthy than i know!
Cant stand repetetive choruses. It sounds like a droning chorus!
Like Mr Townsend (sp?) stuff, especially the Blessed be your name - sounds like a "proper hymn"
quote:You have my deepest sympathy.
Sorry it was a Matt Redman song, it is unfortunately the closest thing we get to a hymn in my church. (Doh!)
quote:Dunno, but maybe its all explained here:
Originally posted by Sinisterial:
what is it with the words in some hyongs?
quote:Yes!
Originally posted by Pânts:
Should I be concerned that the only songs I know all the words to, and so consequently keep singing to Alien are crappy choruses?!?!
quote:The tune makes my ears hurt.
Originally posted by ken:
What's wrong with Morning is Broken?
Its quite good, I thought. Not exactly an exposition of the entire Gospel in one song, but then what is?
quote:"Morning is broken
Originally posted by Papio.:
quote:The tune makes my ears hurt.
Originally posted by ken:
What's wrong with Morning is Broken?
Its quite good, I thought. Not exactly an exposition of the entire Gospel in one song, but then what is?
And lyrically, I always thought it was rather twee and santimonous.
quote:"Timothy Winters" by Charles Causley...my favourite poem
Originally posted by dorothea:
sing-along version of the Lord's prayer reminds me of a poem I used to like at primary School. The poem ended.
"Amen, amen, amen, amen.
Timothy Winters, Lord. Amen!"
quote:..."that decision often lies with the reader."....Which, of course, also applies to the singer/listener when deriding the crappy choruse and hideous hymns.
Originally posted by Boopy:
many not ostensibly religious poems may be so if you choose to read them that way; that decision often lies with the reader. Boopy;)
quote:There's something risible about innocence?... See my previous post about the contribution of the singer/listener.
Originally posted by dorothea:
Newman's Own wrote:
quote:Totally hillarious!! It's as if these people both writers and those who promote this type of stuff have undergone an irony bypass. Quite a number of times, I've accidently turned up at 'praise' service - to find myself grinning my head off in the songs, not because I am enraputured but because I'm ******* my sides.
I'm very familiar with many mystic writings (and naturally the scriptures) which use erotic imagery, but what I find so hilarious about the "I want to have sex with Jesus" imagery today is that those using it in their compositions seem not to see the erotic implications at all.
quote:I confess to providing my own inappropriate mental image when I read this.
Originally posted by Robin:
Simon was a rebel
Jesus loved him still
and replaced his dagger
with a daffodil
quote:Noooo! I've only just made it here.
Originally posted by Ann:
If you want to waste more time ...
![[Snore]](graemlins/snore.gif)
quote:It makes better sense if you put the words in the right order:-
Originally posted by M.:
..... It contains the priceless line,
'With God things just don't happen'....
quote:Yes, I assumed that that is what is meant; although it's inelegant, it does make more sense.
It makes better sense if you put the words in the right order:-
With God things don't just happen
Or to emphasise the point. use quotation marks:
With God things don't "just happen"
quote:Yes, sung to the tune Finlandia. They had this at the church I work for this morning, along with a rewritten version of "America" and some other terribly PC thing. Gag.
Originally posted by GloriaGloriaGloria:
From today's slightly early July 4th service, I think it's called 'This is my Song':
My country's skies are bluer than the ocean
And sunlight beams on cloverleaf and pine;
But other lands have sunlight too, and clover,
And skies are everywhere as blue as mine.
quote:On Sunday, we were introduced to a new 'chorus' which included the line "I've seen the latest fashions" and goes on to say how much better our Lord, King and Creator of the Universe is, than the latest shoes. Talk about damning with faint praise!
Originally posted by AngelicR:
Lovely thread, has made me chuckle out loud!
I myself fell victim recently, during a rendition of 'It's all out you' (not an all time favourite...) I caught myself singing a slightly alternative chorus of "It's all about shoes, Jeee-sus".
Whoopsie!
quote:Better that than the friend of mine who would get the whole emphasis of the song everso slightly wrong - "It's all about meeee...Jeee-sus"
Originally posted by AngelicR:
Lovely thread, has made me chuckle out loud!
I myself fell victim recently, during a rendition of 'It's all about you' (not an all time favourite...) I caught myself singing a slightly alternative chorus of "It's all about shoes, Jeee-sus".
Whoopsie!
quote:or
Hail, our Sovereign Elizabeth, by God's grace Queen of Great Britain and Northern Ireland, Duke of Lancaster, defender of the faith, paragon of the charms and virtues and glorious even beyond the Barbie dolls!
quote:
My darling, shall I compare you to a summer's day? You are more lovely and more temperate; more beautiful even than Barbie, for only your breast implants are made of plastic.
quote:The very same. I find it too distracting, and not matter how hard I concentrate always end up lapsing into shoe worship... maybe an important lesson in discipline in worship!?
Is the "it's all about you Jesus" one Heart of Worship? Because that has to be the single most unsingable song ever
quote:Otherwise, the women would be teaching the men, and that would be Bad™.
Songs of Praise said:
Has anyone yet mentioned those horrid 'question and answer' evangelical choruses, where the men <snip> provide the answers to the women's questions.
Such as Lift up your heads, O ye gates (the king of glory shall come in), thus:
Women: Who is the king of glory? What is his name? (i.e. Oh no, we've forgotten already, our heads are so full of kittens and knitting)
Men: We are the men and we know all the answers in this case!
Or something like that.
quote:Oddly enough, in Teacher Skool, they tell us that asking the questions is the teaching part.
Originally posted by seasick:
quote:Otherwise, the women would be teaching the men, and that would be Bad™.
Songs of Praise said:
Has anyone yet mentioned those horrid 'question and answer' evangelical choruses, where the men <snip> provide the answers to the women's questions.
Such as Lift up your heads, O ye gates (the king of glory shall come in), thus:
Women: Who is the king of glory? What is his name? (i.e. Oh no, we've forgotten already, our heads are so full of kittens and knitting)
Men: We are the men and we know all the answers in this case!
Or something like that.
quote:That is because you are not singing the sensible Mr. Handel version, where the questions and answers alternate between the upper and lower parts. Unlike 'Good King Wenceslas' where all the women have to sing the weakening Page's part - walking about in the snow in their high heels again, no doubt.
Songs of Praise said:
Has anyone yet mentioned those horrid 'question and answer' evangelical choruses, where the men <snip> provide the answers to the women's questions.
Such as Lift up your heads, O ye gates (the king of glory shall come in), thus:
Women: Who is the king of glory? What is his name? (i.e. Oh no, we've forgotten already, our heads are so full of kittens and knitting)
Men: We are the men and we know all the answers in this case!
Or something like that.
quote:Answer is Richard Bewes, formerly of All Soles Langham Place London W1.
which moron put the words of "God is our strength and refuge" to the Dambusters theme? Can't sign it now without thinking of black and white films and/or that Carling Black Label advert
quote:I think it was written with choirs of boys and men in mind, so the boys would sing the page's part, on account of the page being a boy.
Originally posted by Chorister:
quote:That is because you are not singing the sensible Mr. Handel version, where the questions and answers alternate between the upper and lower parts. Unlike 'Good King Wenceslas' where all the women have to sing the weakening Page's part - walking about in the snow in their high heels again, no doubt.
Songs of Praise said:
Has anyone yet mentioned those horrid 'question and answer' evangelical choruses, where the men <snip> provide the answers to the women's questions.
Such as Lift up your heads, O ye gates (the king of glory shall come in), thus:
Women: Who is the king of glory? What is his name? (i.e. Oh no, we've forgotten already, our heads are so full of kittens and knitting)
Men: We are the men and we know all the answers in this case!
Or something like that.
quote:I don't think this hymn deserves to be on this thread at all. It's a fine metrical version of Psalm 46, set to an equally fine piece of music, The Dambusters' March.
Originally posted by Dubitante:
Ages ago, on 15 July 2005 Tubbster wrote:
quote:Answer is Richard Bewes, formerly of All Soles Langham Place London W1.
which moron put the words of "God is our strength and refuge" to the Dambusters theme? Can't sign it now without thinking of black and white films and/or that Carling Black Label advert
quote:I like it, too. It's certainly one of the bits of Mission Praise I won't be consigning to the burning circular out-tray come the revolution.
Originally posted by Faithful Sheepdog:
quote:I don't think this hymn deserves to be on this thread at all. It's a fine metrical version of Psalm 46, set to an equally fine piece of music, The Dambusters' March.
Originally posted by Dubitante:
Ages ago, on 15 July 2005 Tubbster wrote:
quote:Answer is Richard Bewes, formerly of All Soles Langham Place London W1.
which moron put the words of "God is our strength and refuge" to the Dambusters theme? Can't sign it now without thinking of black and white films and/or that Carling Black Label advert
quote:I know the origins of this song. Its meant to be a "dirge", a lament, a repent. A sort of Psalm 51 (acknowledgement of faults) for those who idolise musical worship, those who "worship worship" rather than worship God. It was written by Matt Redman in the context of a period of repentance for that fault at the Soul Survivor church in Watford UK. (The church leader had, temporarily, banned the band). The song was a recognition by him of a personal failing, by that community of a corporate failing. It caught on in the UK - and has been sung a lot over here - because it says something important about the dangers of that sort of overemphasis on sung worship, particularly amongst young Christians.
Originally posted by TrudyTrudy (I say unto you):
"Heart of Worship" is just dirgelike and the lyrics are annoying. [/QB]
quote:I remember discussing the feasability of this, but now can't remember whether or not it happened - it was back in 1999. Maybe we just said the psalm (cowards!)
Originally posted by Callan:
So, own up, which church has sung it on Remembrance Sunday?
quote:Yeah unfortunatly it has joined the category of things it was written as an apology for!!!
Originally posted by Barnabas62:
quote:I know the origins of this song. Its meant to be a "dirge", a lament, a repent. A sort of Psalm 51 (acknowledgement of faults) for those who idolise musical worship, those who "worship worship" rather than worship God. It was written by Matt Redman in the context of a period of repentance for that fault at the Soul Survivor church in Watford UK. (The church leader had, temporarily, banned the band). The song was a recognition by him of a personal failing, by that community of a corporate failing. It caught on in the UK - and has been sung a lot over here - because it says something important about the dangers of that sort of overemphasis on sung worship, particularly amongst young Christians.
Originally posted by TrudyTrudy (I say unto you):
"Heart of Worship" is just dirgelike and the lyrics are annoying.
Because I know the story and the people, I find the song very moving. I think it is a very helpful reminder in context, but its use as a quiet worship song, unexplained and out of context, can be pretty inappropriate. A weed is a flower growing in the wrong place.
quote:Well, this is based on a psalm, and meant to be sung by two groups, the one answering the other, because that's the way the psalm is written too. But who says the men have to do all the answering bits?
Originally posted by Spiffy da Wonder Sheep:
quote:Oddly enough, in Teacher Skool, they tell us that asking the questions is the teaching part.
Originally posted by seasick:
quote:Otherwise, the women would be teaching the men, and that would be Bad™.
Songs of Praise said:
Has anyone yet mentioned those horrid 'question and answer' evangelical choruses, where the men <snip> provide the answers to the women's questions.
Such as Lift up your heads, O ye gates (the king of glory shall come in), thus:
Women: Who is the king of glory? What is his name? (i.e. Oh no, we've forgotten already, our heads are so full of kittens and knitting)
Men: We are the men and we know all the answers in this case!
Or something like that.
Bwahahah. [/evillaughofgenderdisparity]
quote:
Originally posted by quantpole:
I'm sure it must have been linked to before, but was that a variation on Anyone can write a Graham Kendrick song?
loved it. Am now working on an analogous version for Martin Smith. Rough starting point. quote:I'd have thought one of the most obvious would be I Could Sing of Your Love Forever simply because it changes so well to I Could Sing this Song Forever
Am now working on an analogous version for Martin Smith.
quote:Might be OK. It looks a bit like the veiled and unveiled passage at the end of 2 Cor 3. "Beholding his glory, we are being changed into his likeness from one degree of glory to another. Comes from God who is the Spirit," says Paul.
Originally posted by Gill H:
Back to horrible songs - I saw a song title recently, 'You are my glory'. Please tell me this isn't as heretical as it sounds!
quote:I definitely remember singing both this and "Glorious things of Thee are Spoken" (to Austria) in a service shortly after England beat Germany at football...
Originally posted by Callan:
Fine if you are on the terraces for England vs Germany.
So, own up, which church has sung it on Remembrance Sunday?
quote:But what can we sing, from the lexicon of horrible hymns and crappy choruses, when, for example, England are losing at soccer to Northern Ireland? We need a lament! "To Calvary, Lord, in Spirit now"? "By the Rivers of Babylon"? Any ideas?
Originally posted by Custard.:
I definitely remember singing ..."Glorious things of Thee are Spoken" (to Austria) in a service shortly after England beat Germany at football...
quote:There are dozens of songs that can be sung to the tune of The Star of the County Down
Originally posted by Barnabas62:
]But what can we sing, from the lexicon of horrible hymns and crappy choruses, when, for example, England are losing at soccer to Northern Ireland? We need a lament!
quote:I'd forgotten I ever knew that chorus until I sow it printed here. I only remeber the chorus part not the verse and haven't sung it ofr at least 25 years!!!!
Originally posted by Jaeger:
Anyone heard this one? I call it Prayer of the Flat-Chested Woman
Like the woman at the well I was thirsting
For things that could not satisfy
And then I heard my Saviour saying
Draw from my well that never can run dry
Fill my cup Lord, I lift it up Lord
Come and quench the thirsting of my soul
Bread of Heaven feed me till I want no more
Fill my cup, fill it up and make me whole!
Our youth mission team secretly sings it as "Fill my cups Lord...Breasts of Heaven fill me till I want no more"
quote:Perhaps slightly off point here, but during the NI match against Azerbjan there was a religious chant that went thus....
Originally posted by Barnabas62:
But what can we sing, from the lexicon of horrible hymns and crappy choruses, when, for example, England are losing at soccer to Northern Ireland? We need a lament! "To Calvary, Lord, in Spirit now"? "By the Rivers of Babylon"? Any ideas?
quote:What about the Book with the Sven Seals?
Originally posted by Barnabas62:
Its a pity Sven does not appear to be a biblical word ....
quote:Cyberhymnal page -- if it's heretical, it's pretty subtle.
Originally posted by The Venomous Bede:
OK - so our new Rector wants "O Valiant Hearts" on Remembrance Sunday. I think it is heretical. My mother told me she used to sing it on Empire Day in New Zealand. I would rather be locked in a room (for a very short time) with Kendrick. any input?
quote:That's funny. I used to sing 'Give Thanks' in church as a little 6-year-old kid. When, at 13, I heard the Pet Shop Boys song (I was very behind in my pop-music knowledge at that time) I thought they'd copied the worship song! And I thought it was really cool that they obviously knew Christian worship songs so well, so they were obviously Christians and were going to start a revival...
Originally posted by Matt Black:
I haven't read through all the pages here so forgive me if I repeat something someone else has alread posted, but on the first page or two there was talk of choruses which start with or incorporate melodies of pop songs. This reminded me of the opening lines of "Give thanks with a grateful heart" (well, how else does one give thanks?), which is suspiciously reminiscent of the opening lines of "Go West" by the Pet Shop Boys...
quote:I don't know about trolls, but To be a pilgrim has hobgoblins and foul fiends in it. Bunyan predates Tolkien by a few centuries though.
Originally posted by blackaxe:
Then a few years ago at a Presbyterian church service, we sang a hymn that had a particularly Tolkien inspired verse with mentions of hobgoblins and trolls - I kid you not!
quote:Thanks. That's the one.
Originally posted by Ann:
Not as much memory as searching the OHP files I organise:
What can I say but ‘I love You’?
What can I say but ‘I praise You’?
(As it is short, I'll leave it as that; if you have Songs of Fluffiness book 3 (the new book 3 - the first 3 or 4 short books got combined many years ago and have since been added to) it's number 1594.)
quote:Funny, that. We sang that version of TbaP at St Ed's a couple of weeks ago, and I didn't recognise those lyrics. The version we sang at school (it was their anthem) was far less weird. And, in my humble opinion, better than the hobgoblin version.
Originally posted by Carys:
I don't know about trolls, but To be a pilgrim has hobgoblins and foul fiends in it. Bunyan predates Tolkien by a few centuries though.
quote:Bunyan's original version is packed with gobliny goodness. The later (early-C20th?) version seems pale and anemic by comparison, but manages to leave in the giants, so it's not a fully-exorcised Jack-Chick-compliant version either.
Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
There do seem to be two versions going around. Does it start "He who would valiant be" or "He who would true valour see"?
I think the hymn loses a certain je ne sais quoi without the hobgoblins.
quote:It could also be the song
Originally posted by AngelicR:
quote:The very same. I find it too distracting, and not matter how hard I concentrate always end up lapsing into shoe worship... maybe an important lesson in discipline in worship!?
Is the "it's all about you Jesus" one Heart of Worship? Because that has to be the single most unsingable song ever
quote:Oh yes. Especially as Temple Meads is on God's Wonderful Railway. A (late
Originally posted by Gracious rebel:
Someone made a reference to that verse from Isaiah (and it appears in several musical settings) where 'his train fills the temple'
Can I just add an aside - that when travelling to Bristol by train, this always springs to mind as the station is called 'Temple Meads'. Anyone else make this connection or is it the weird way my brain works?
![[Votive]](graemlins/votive.gif)
) friend at church and I couldn't be looking anywhere near each other when such a song was being sung.
quote:I usually pass on this one, because I'm thinking, "Hey if we really saw the Lord like Isaiah did, we wouldn't be twittering about it. We'd be face down on the floor."
I see the Lord! (I see Jesus!) 2x
He is high and lifted up and his train fill the temple. 2x
The angels cry glory 3x
To the Lord!
quote:Ah, for the good of my health I long since gave up attending churces where anyone spontaneously sung anything, unless you count the hymns being on the board and not announced.
Originally posted by Hinematov:
Great idea, but as a Quaker I get few such opportunities.
quote:Do you have a particular reason to have your sanity unpreserved at this time, or is it just a general longing for madness?
Originally posted by Jonathan the Free:
Can anyone remember how it starts please because I think the first verse is irritating in some way that has been removed from my brain to preserve my sanity?
.quote:Some who feared daylight? Holy Dracula, pray for us sinners.
Babes at the knee, a taxman in a tree
Women by men molested
Some who were bright and some who feared daylight
And many the privileged few detested
quote:[grins] Presumably they were thinking of Nicodemus?
Originally posted by Callan:
quote:Some who feared daylight? Holy Dracula, pray for us sinners.
Babes at the knee, a taxman in a tree
Women by men molested
Some who were bright and some who feared daylight
And many the privileged few detested
quote:Zacchaeus does appear in this version, but in an earlier verse:
Babes at the knee, a cripple all could see
quote:Personally, I prefer the taxman in a tree.
Martha who fussed, Zacchaeus the unjust
quote:Cardiphonia is the name of their album. The band's called onehundredhours and they're actually pretty good. One of the few 'worship bands' whom I would happily use in my personal devotion (such as it is). But I agree that 'Foot of the Cross' is a hackneyed tune...
Originally posted by Padingtun Bear.:
I believe it's these guys:
Cardiphonia
You can catch a few notes of it at the end of their sampler.
quote:I had not noticed the similarity between At the Foot of the Cross and Father And Son before. Now I will never be able to sing it again with a straight face. Thanks a pantload.
The offending object is called 'At the foot of the Cross'. For those of you who know it's in Songs of Fellowship book 3, and it bears a uncanny resemblance to a certain track by a well know (if now ex-) boy band. Boyzone - Father and Son
)...
quote:wow, I'd never noticed that one before! I just followed your link to the words of Sing we the King and found myself totally unable to remember the tune of fthe first line (I could hum all the rest quite happily) as all that came to mind was the Chigley tune - and I think I'm right in saying that they are not identical just similar?
Originally posted by Kitten:
I cannot hear 'Sing We the King' from Mission praise without thinking of the dance that followed the six o'clock whistle at the biscuit factory in 'Chigley'
quote:
Originally posted by Gracious rebel:
Oh yes it does!
Remember the bit in the middle that goes:
'You're my all, you're the best, you're my joy, my righteousness'...
well its exactly the same tune as:
'And he went with a quack, and a waddle and a quack'.
Once you know this, you will never again be able to sing this without thinking of the Ugly Duckling. You have been warned!
quote:I have always thought that it sounded like The Ugly Duckling... and I have never been able to sing it without giggling!!
Originally posted by Barnabas62:
My wife agrees with you about the song and says she will now not be able to sing "Knowing You Jesus" without an image of a duckling floating into her mind! I'm praying for her ...
quote:Assuming you are talking about the full-diminished chord, the 9th scale degree would already be present.
Originally posted by ken:
...ending on a major 9th diminished chord....
quote:I really have no idea what Fred Kaan was thinking of when he wrote that, but clearly whatever it was was completely distracting him from writing decent hymnody.
Originally posted by Sinisterial:
Yesterday we sang Let us talents and tongues employ
Apart from some really, really, dodgy rhyming in the verses, everytime I sing this song I get this mental picture of bread rolls boucing around the church.
Boing, boing, boing.
(URL disconnected-by-disjoining because this is a family friendly thread) quote:in Buenos Aires (see www.comeasyou are.com/masturbate/)
a co-operatively owned sex toy, book and video store.
.quote:Point out that it is copyright protected, your licence doesn't cover it (or like material) so they will have to arrange licensing. If they ask you to say it will cost mayvbe £100.
Originally posted by Zappa:
I don't normally flog dead horses, but I'm preparing for a funeral and ...
... the family want that (ghastly) Deidre Brown song "Come as You are".
In a moment of naive-absent-minded too-lazy-to-type-it-ness I decided to google the title. D'uh.
Hmmmm. Could have been an interesting funeral. The first results werequote:in Buenos Aires (see www.comeasyou are.com/masturbate/)
a co-operatively owned sex toy, book and video store.
The next links were the Nirvana-related websites.
Kurt Cobain might have appreciated the humour.
quote:Re Quantpole's comments - when were the lyrics to <i>Glorious things of thee are spoken</i> written? As it would be interesting to know whether the composer had re-appropriated "Austria" from Hitler?
Originally posted by Barnabas62:
quote:But what can we sing, from the lexicon of horrible hymns and crappy choruses, when, for example, England are losing at soccer to Northern Ireland? We need a lament! "To Calvary, Lord, in Spirit now"? "By the Rivers of Babylon"? Any ideas?
Originally posted by Custard.:
I definitely remember singing ..."Glorious things of Thee are Spoken" (to Austria) in a service shortly after England beat Germany at football...
Its a pity Sven does not appear to be a biblical word ....
quote:Haydn is a long time before Hitler! Though I'm not sure if he wrote the tune or just arranged it for the Emperor - it does sound awfully like one of those old Lutheran chorales. Not that the likes of the Most Catholic Emperor woudl be dabbling in such things.
Originally posted by Alex Cockell:
Re Quantpole's comments - when were the lyrics to <i>Glorious things of thee are spoken</i> written? As it would be interesting to know whether the composer had re-appropriated "Austria" from Hitler?
quote:Ah yes, lie to the bereaved because you want to impose your ideas on them. Great idea.
Originally posted by Sioni Sais:
Point out that it is copyright protected, your licence doesn't cover it (or like material) so they will have to arrange licensing. If they ask you to say it will cost mayvbe £100.
That should scare tem off.
quote:The Deutschlandlied was being sung to 'Austria' long before there was a Nazi party. According to one hymnal I've seen, Haydn took the tune of the 'Emperor' quartet from a Croatia folk tune. And 'Most Catholic' was the title of the King of Spain - Francis was Holy Roman Emperor and Apostolic King of Hungary...
Originally posted by ken:
quote:Haydn is a long time before Hitler! Though I'm not sure if he wrote the tune or just arranged it for the Emperor - it does sound awfully like one of those old Lutheran chorales. Not that the likes of the Most Catholic Emperor woudl be dabbling in such things.
Originally posted by Alex Cockell:
Re Quantpole's comments - when were the lyrics to <i>Glorious things of thee are spoken</i> written? As it would be interesting to know whether the composer had re-appropriated "Austria" from Hitler?
quote:I agree with you. (Would not normally post just to say that, but wanted to record that rare event.)
Originally posted by sharkshooter:
Ah yes, lie to the bereaved because you want to impose your ideas on them. Great idea.
Hint: Whoever a funeral is about, it is not about you.
quote:Almost everyone agrees with me at least once. You are just the latest victim.
Originally posted by Doublethink:
...I agree with you. (Would not normally post just to say that, but wanted to record that rare event.)
quote:Or behind the faders/cameras in my case...
Originally posted by Gill H:
I'm female and a worship leader (and yes, there are plenty of them - just look at any recent Spring Harvest album). If I do 'call and response' songs, I'm doing the 'call' bit. So usually the women end up singing those lines, and the men do the other lines.
The other singers on stage are mostly female too (the men like to hide behind instruments - chicken!).
quote:Does it have 5 legs? Can we call them T, U, L, I and P?
Originally posted by testbear:
Ooh, can we fill in the rest?
Did it go:
The Church is like a table
A table that is round
...It stands on solid legs
That reach down to the ground
These are the solid legs of faith
That keeps it off the floor
To let the table worship
for ev-er more
...?
Try it yourself!
quote:Me too- especially as we have just introduced the toddlers at my church to
I'm singing that to 'Puff the Magic Dragon'...
quote:Kendrick is much better quoted than sung, in my humble opinion. And - occasionally - his work does age significantly better than most of the rest of what was written at the time.
Originally posted by leo:
That said, I heard a sermon at a famous local anglo-catholic church where Kendrick was quoted and the words were really good (from Meekness and Majesty) about the theology of the ascension.
quote:Morning has broken - pick up the pieces
Originally posted by Alex Cockell:
Morning has broken....
Alex
quote:AAAGGGGGHHHHH!!!!!!
Originally posted by Spiffy da WonderSheep:
Musical ensemble consisted of a guitar, an accordian, bongo drums (played by Other!Parish's priest, our deacon wound up leading most of the service, he couldn't pull himself from behind them long enough to give the Absolution) and bagpipes.
Let's review the song sheet, shall we?
Introit: Morning Has Broken (bagpipe solo)
First Hymn: Some hymn I had never heard before, all about thanking God for random things, including our parents who teach us daily. And the average age of attendees was hovering around 65.
Gospel Processional: Thy Word is a Lamp Unto My Feet
Preperation Hymn: Here I am, Lord
Postcommunion Hymn: Give Thanks
Closing Hymn: Shine, Jesus, Shine
quote:No, seriously? People begin their married life together through chirping about 'the wrath of God being satisfied'? Lovely.
Originally posted by Alex Cockell:
At some other weddings, we joked about In Christ Alone becoming the SJS of 2003
quote:I think it very much depends on whether you can stomach `the wrath of God was satisfied'. Other than that one line, I think it is a good hymn and I'm particularly impressed by the fact that it has a verse on the Resurrection, but I have major theological problems with that one line. If you're ok with PSA you're probably ok with it, but if not ... .
Originally posted by Jante:
And I am having it at my wedding next month- it has special significance to me, and am happy to declare " Here in the love of Christ I stand" and "Here in the power of Christ I stand" as I start my married life.
quote:I loved that song when I was at primary school! Another favourite sung with great enthusiasm was
Originally posted by Ena:
At my school a special favourite is 'Be Bold' ... as in
Be bold
Be strong
for the LORD your GOD is with you.
Be bold
Be strong
for the LORD your GOD is with you.
I am not afraid (NO NO NO!)
I am not dismayed (NOT ME!)
for I'm walking in faith and victory
come on and walk in faith and victory
for the LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOORD
your GOOOOOOD
is WIIIIIIIIII IIIIIIIIII IIIIIIIIITH YOU!
with shouting and enthusiasm. Which I'm not used to seeing in assembly.
quote:Some of us think that the wrath of God being satisfied is a good thing worth remembering on your wedding day. It's a wedding favourite of the last couple of years IME.
Originally posted by Divine Outlaw Dwarf:
quote:No, seriously? People begin their married life together through chirping about 'the wrath of God being satisfied'? Lovely.
Originally posted by Alex Cockell:
At some other weddings, we joked about In Christ Alone becoming the SJS of 2003
quote:You're not the only one who has had such urges. At my church the DVDs have some appeal, namely that the tempo is steady and the music is sung on key, so dispite the temptation I usually don't mess with them.
Originally posted by Gay Organ Grinder:
I was working the power point and sound desk and was tempted to hijack the DVD but thought better of it.
quote:We'll occasionally use a DVD thing (are you using those horrible iWorship ones?) but mute the sound and have the band play it to the same tempo. But we are also a large church blessed with a large number of very talented musicians, and I recognise it's probably harder for most churches.
Originally posted by Kepler's Puppet:
quote:You're not the only one who has had such urges. At my church the DVDs have some appeal, namely that the tempo is steady and the music is sung on key, so dispite the temptation I usually don't mess with them.
Originally posted by Gay Organ Grinder:
I was working the power point and sound desk and was tempted to hijack the DVD but thought better of it.
quote:Time to "misplace" the DVD? Or have it suffer a regrettable scratch in the innermost ring?
Originally posted by Gay Organ Grinder:
...the powers that be insist on having these horrid DVD's. ...
quote:The ones we use are instead of us real live musos and are shown on the over head screen with the congregation TRYING to join in!!!
Originally posted by Amethyst:
I have never come across DVDs like this and find the idea strange. Are they shown on a large overhead screen so that the congregation can join in, or are they for the benefit of the band? If just for the band, is this why you can mute the sound and play along with what’s on the screen?
quote:Actualy, it's pretty good atonement theology.
Originally posted by leo:
...'The wrath of God was on him laid' - appalling atonement theology.
quote:Pretty darn essential atonement theology. Very useful for anyone who's ever sinned.
Originally posted by sharkshooter:
quote:Actualy, it's pretty good atonement theology.
Originally posted by leo:
...'The wrath of God was on him laid' - appalling atonement theology.
quote:I'm definitely not OK with PSA, but I'll happily sing the song. Like a lot of hymns, I may not agree 100% with 100% of the words, but overall it's good and I suspect it will prove to "have legs" (more so than SJS - does ANYONE sing it these days except as an act of postmodern irony?)
Originally posted by Carys:
quote:I think it very much depends on whether you can stomach `the wrath of God was satisfied'. Other than that one line, I think it is a good hymn and I'm particularly impressed by the fact that it has a verse on the Resurrection, but I have major theological problems with that one line. If you're ok with PSA you're probably ok with it, but if not ... .
Originally posted by Jante:
And I am having it at my wedding next month- it has special significance to me, and am happy to declare " Here in the love of Christ I stand" and "Here in the power of Christ I stand" as I start my married life.
Carys
quote:Only if you believe God is some sort of child abuser (to paraphrase Steve Chalke).
Originally posted by sharkshooter:
quote:Actualy, it's pretty good atonement theology.
Originally posted by leo:
...'The wrath of God was on him laid' - appalling atonement theology.
quote:Incredible then, that so many Christians throughout the centuries have believed no such thing whilst claiming to believe in atonement.
Originally posted by the giant cheeseburger:
quote:Pretty darn essential atonement theology.
Originally posted by sharkshooter:
quote:Actualy, it's pretty good atonement theology.
Originally posted by leo:
...'The wrath of God was on him laid' - appalling atonement theology.
quote:Never.
Originally posted by leo:
.Better - the wrath of man was on him laid
quote:It's the only one that makes sense. Unless somehow you can go to heaven without anything getting rid of all the sin that keeps you out of heaven.
Originally posted by Emma.:
Ive really had this clarified when I heard James Alison speak - he was fantastic.
Am I right in thinking hed go along with wrath of man?
I think Sharkshooter, that although your view is shared by a lot of cons evos, its not at all universally accepted!!!
quote:I know that. But since I believe it, I can't help sometimes professing it - even on the Ship!
Originally posted by Emma.:
I think Sharkshooter, that although your view is shared by a lot of cons evos, its not at all universally accepted!!!
quote:Ah. I'm looking to the mercy and love of God to do that.
Originally posted by the giant cheeseburger:
quote:It's the only one that makes sense. Unless somehow you can go to heaven without anything getting rid of all the sin that keeps you out of heaven.
Originally posted by Emma.:
Ive really had this clarified when I heard James Alison speak - he was fantastic.
Am I right in thinking hed go along with wrath of man?
I think Sharkshooter, that although your view is shared by a lot of cons evos, its not at all universally accepted!!!
quote:Same here. I rely on God expressing his mercy and love through sending Jesus to be the ultimate sacrifice of atonement.
Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
quote:Ah. I'm looking to the mercy and love of God to do that.
Originally posted by the giant cheeseburger:
quote:It's the only one that makes sense. Unless somehow you can go to heaven without anything getting rid of all the sin that keeps you out of heaven.
Originally posted by Emma.:
Ive really had this clarified when I heard James Alison speak - he was fantastic.
Am I right in thinking hed go along with wrath of man?
I think Sharkshooter, that although your view is shared by a lot of cons evos, its not at all universally accepted!!!
quote:Is there some checklist they give new composers lately?
Originally posted by Gill H:
Our church is currently singing a new song that goes "Strength will rise as we wait upon the Lord". I trust that this will prove true in the case of asthmatics like myself, because there is absolutely nowhere to breathe in the first half of this song!
quote:Yes - I got the idea from James
Originally posted by Emma.:
Ive really had this clarified when I heard James Alison speak - he was fantastic.
Am I right in thinking hed go along with wrath of man?
I think Sharkshooter, that although your view is shared by a lot of cons evos, its not at all universally accepted!!!
quote:So God puniishes people for what others have done. When I was a teacher, if I had a detention for a whole class if the culprit would not own up, I would have been unprofessional. If, when they had caning, I caned the wrong child, I would be unproffessional and immoral. Is God immoral?
Originally posted by sharkshooter:
quote:Never.
Originally posted by leo:
.Better - the wrath of man was on him laid
The SIN of man, and the WRATH of God. So that, being cleansed of our SIN, the WRATH of God is no longer on us. This is what atonement is all about.
[Dear, oh Dear. I am becoming centurion]
quote:Where did you get that from my post?
Originally posted by leo:
...So God puniishes people for what others have done.
quote:This is part of the problem with modern society - the lack of responsibility to the group. We are our brothers' keepers, what we do affects them. Dealing with the above situation by punishing the whole class would have taught that principle, but you missed the opportunity.
Originally posted by leo:
When I was a teacher, if I had a detention for a whole class if the culprit would not own up, I would have been unprofessional. ...
quote:To clarify - God punished Jesus for what you/I did.
Originally posted by sharkshooter:
quote:Where did you get that from my post?
Originally posted by leo:
...So God puniishes people for what others have done.
He took my sin from me. I didn't say He took your sin from me.quote:This is part of the problem with modern society - the lack of responsibility to the group. We are our brothers' keepers, what we do affects them. Dealing with the above situation by punishing the whole class would have taught that principle, but you missed the opportunity.
Originally posted by leo:
When I was a teacher, if I had a detention for a whole class if the culprit would not own up, I would have been unprofessional. ...
quote:Earth and All Stars!
Classrooms and labs!
Loud boiling test tubes!
Sing to the Lord a new song!
Athlete and band!
Loud cheering people!
Sing to the Lord a new song!
quote:
Originally posted by Henry Troup:
I went a-Google for that, and found:
quote:Earth and All Stars!
Classrooms and labs!
Loud boiling test tubes!
Sing to the Lord a new song!
Athlete and band!
Loud cheering people!
Sing to the Lord a new song!
(Hymn Number 558 in the Lutheran Book of Worship)
...
So, it gets around, that's three major hymnbooks it's in. Someone likes it.
I thought Bunyan's line about hobgoblins and foul fiends was as bad as it could get! After seeing that boiling test tube hymn, I think I might just go and jump around in the house of God. Hey! Hey! Jump around!
)
quote:Yes, if you are into old hymns and everything it is fine. However, I would frown upon any line that has vocalists laughing out loud during a rehearsal and then still giggling a bit during the service. It is asking for trouble, as is using that hymn at a school!
Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
Bunyan's hobgoblins and foul fiends are one of the finest lines in English hymnody, IMNOAHO.
quote:You need to consider I'm only 22! My parents were still at school when Vatican 2 rocked the RCC.
Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
I don't recall anyone laughing at it when we had it at school, although that was in Bedford where John Bunyan is generally considered to be the forgotten fourth person of the Trinity.
It's just such a good line. As for being into "old hymns", the church has been around for 2000 years, in our fast moving culture we consider anything more than 10 years old to be "old", so simple maths tells me that some 99.5% of our hymnody is "old", so the options really are (a) Being "into" old hymns, or (b) cutting oneself off from 1990 years of Christian lyrical expression. Indeed, at only, what, 350 years old or so, Bunyan's lines are positively modern
quote:Thanks for that TGC! On my way to get it now. (Knew it was late September, but had the 28th in my mind!)
...Chris Tomlin album released today...
quote:This alwasy puts me in mind of Victorian and pre-Victorian notions of sleep as a kind of death, which distracts me from the perfectly good sentiments of the hymn. (Note that the linked version is longer than the one in the Canadian Anglicna Hymnal.)
Restored to life and power and thought.
quote:Hope you're enjoying it! It's not on the shelves anywhere here in Adelaide yet. I have a pre-order for when it is released, which will probably be tomorrow (it's currently 10:40pm Tuesday) for everything must be released in the USA first despite them being behind the rest of the world.
Originally posted by Jolly Jape:
quote:Thanks for that TGC! On my way to get it now. (Knew it was late September, but had the 28th in my mind!)
...Chris Tomlin album released today...
quote:Yeah I do love it - in the way I love Shakespearian insults I guess. My favourite line theologically is
Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
Bunyan's hobgoblins and foul fiends are one of the finest lines in English hymnody, IMNOAHO.
quote:closely followed by the metaphorical wizardry of
consubstatial, co-eternal, while unending ages run
quote:The number one worst, surely, is
'tis only the splendour of light hideth thee
quote:followed by the whole of "Jesus take me as I am" with all its utterly delightful but sadly I fear unintended sexual undertones.
Lord, you put a tongue into my mouth
quote:To quote St. Paul "my spirit prays, but my mind is unfruitful."
4. Sinners, whose love can ne'er forget
the wormwood and the gall.
Go, spread your trophies at His feet
and crown Him Lord of all!
quote:Anyone noticed that the slide guitar break (Bryn Haworth?) on Gerry Rafferty's "Don't give up on me" is lifted straight from the intro of "Hosanna"? (Or was it the other way round?)
In our home group last night I learned an alternative version of 'Hosanna' which I couldn't wait to share with you all:
Lasagne, lasagne
Lasagne's in the oven (x)
Lord we lift up our plates
'Cause we just cannot wait ...
(sadly the rest of the song was obscured by laughter!)
quote:The title of this twee piece of musical crap is "The Spirit Song".
Originally posted by The Thirteenth Duke:
Have we sunk to the depths of beastility yet?
I utterly despise the twee chorus "Let the Son of God enfold you...
Chorus
"Jesus, Jesus, Come and fill your lambs"
quote:Maybe you should read Isaiah 53
Originally posted by leo:
quote:So God puniishes people for what others have done. When I was a teacher, if I had a detention for a whole class if the culprit would not own up, I would have been unprofessional. If, when they had caning, I caned the wrong child, I would be unproffessional and immoral. Is God immoral?
Originally posted by sharkshooter:
quote:Never.
Originally posted by leo:
.Better - the wrath of man was on him laid
The SIN of man, and the WRATH of God. So that, being cleansed of our SIN, the WRATH of God is no longer on us. This is what atonement is all about.
[Dear, oh Dear. I am becoming centurion]
The point about the 'wrath of man' is thathumans took out all their anger on to Jesus because they could not bear the implications of his truth for their lives.
The theory that he paid for our sins by taking away God's wrath on us is a very modern one - it gained popularity in the USA revivals of the late 18th and early 19th Centuries (it is possible to read Calvin to say something similar, also Anselm - but only by reading the idea back into their work).
So penal substitution is not a mainstread Christian idea - neither throughout the current church geographically, not the church historically.
quote:I expect Leo, like me, has read Isaiah 53, and, like me, is unconvinced that it can be said to be the base text for PSA. Though I agree that there is a debate to be had, this is probably not the place to have it. I actually owe m.t-tomb and Barnabas a thread examining the biblical basis (or, as I believe, non-basis) for PSA, so, since I'm on leave next week, I may get the opportunity to start it.
originally posted by Mudfrog:
Maybe you should read Isaiah 53
quote:Isa 53's servant refers to the nation of Israel and is not a prophecy about Jesus - I can PM a study guide of it to you if you want.
Originally posted by Mudfrog:
quote:Maybe you should read Isaiah 53
Originally posted by leo:
quote:So God puniishes people for what others have done. When I was a teacher, if I had a detention for a whole class if the culprit would not own up, I would have been unprofessional. If, when they had caning, I caned the wrong child, I would be unproffessional and immoral. Is God immoral?
Originally posted by sharkshooter:
quote:Never.
Originally posted by leo:
.Better - the wrath of man was on him laid
The SIN of man, and the WRATH of God. So that, being cleansed of our SIN, the WRATH of God is no longer on us. This is what atonement is all about.
[Dear, oh Dear. I am becoming centurion]
The point about the 'wrath of man' is thathumans took out all their anger on to Jesus because they could not bear the implications of his truth for their lives.
The theory that he paid for our sins by taking away God's wrath on us is a very modern one - it gained popularity in the USA revivals of the late 18th and early 19th Centuries (it is possible to read Calvin to say something similar, also Anselm - but only by reading the idea back into their work).
So penal substitution is not a mainstread Christian idea - neither throughout the current church geographically, not the church historically.
quote:Isaiah 53 is a prophecy - you cannot talk in absolutes about what it does/doesn't say. Why not posst a link to your study guide for us all to judge it by.
Originally posted by leo:
quote:Isa 53's servant refers to the nation of Israel and is not a prophecy about Jesus - I can PM a study guide of it to you if you want.
Originally posted by Mudfrog:
......
Maybe you should read Isaiah 53
quote:Not mutually exclusive.
Originally posted by leo:
Isa 53's servant refers to the nation of Israel and is not a prophecy about Jesus
quote:Because it isn't on line and it isn't finished yet.
Originally posted by the giant cheeseburger:
quote:Isaiah 53 is a prophecy - you cannot talk in absolutes about what it does/doesn't say. Why not posst a link to your study guide for us all to judge it by.
Originally posted by leo:
quote:Isa 53's servant refers to the nation of Israel and is not a prophecy about Jesus - I can PM a study guide of it to you if you want.
Originally posted by Mudfrog:
......
Maybe you should read Isaiah 53
The most compelling argument is that Jesus did actually die a criminal's death. Given God is in nature infinitely glorious, there would have to be a pretty darn good reason for Jesus to have been completely humiliated in that manner.
I reckon that paying the price for humanity's sins in the cause of reconciliation with God is a pretty high possibility given the strong biblical support for the idea.
quote:Actually, I rather like the song. It's unsingable in the key it's written in, though! Taking it down a tone helps, but I wouldn't play it at the end of a set!
Last Sunday we had a new song "Beautiful One":
...No eye has seen, no ear has heard, no heart can fully know
How glorious, how beautiful you are
Chorus:
Beautiful one I love
Beautiful one I adore
Beautiful one my soul must sing
Powerful so powerful your glory fills the skies
Your mighty works displayed for all to see
The beauty of your majesty awakes my heart to sing...
Which sounds as naff as it reads. And, as I pointed out to the person next to me, contradicts.
He had no beauty or majesty to attract us to him,
nothing in his appearance that we should desire him.
Isaiah 53:2
quote:Which - when you stop to consider the depths already plumbed by charismatic hymnody - is quite a remarkable achievement.
Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
Truly, charismatic hymnody has plumbed new depths.
quote:There used to be one:
Originally posted by Dogs Dinner:
Has anybody seen the lyrics to a chorus, I think from the redemption hymnal that went something like this
I'm on the pil
I'm on the pil
I'm on the pilgrims way
I have a man
I have a man
I have a mansion in the sky
He's gona come
He's gona come
He's gona come into my heart
I think there are one or two more verses
Please add as you see fit
quote:Sinners, who constantly remember that Jesus died for you.
Originally posted by Henry Troup:
Does anyone understand this verse of All Hail the Power of Jesus' Name ?
quote:To quote St. Paul "my spirit prays, but my mind is unfruitful."
4. Sinners, whose love can ne'er forget
the wormwood and the gall.
Go, spread your trophies at His feet
and crown Him Lord of all!
quote:I seem to remember that Dorothy L Sayers puts this joke into the mouth of one of her characters in Murder Must Advertise - there it's 'O take a pil/grim home' and 'O for a man/sion of the skies'.
Originally posted by Dogs Dinner:
Has anybody seen the lyrics to a chorus, I think from the redemption hymnal that went something like this
I'm on the pil
I'm on the pil
I'm on the pilgrims way
quote:lyrics here (scroll down) - thanks for reminding me!
Originally posted by Teufelchen:
There's also the Two Ronnies' English Folk Song and Dance sketch, which uses a similar gag.
quote:The poster there hasn't such a good memory. This page has a better recollection of the first two verses. I recall the last two as:
Originally posted by sanityman:
quote:lyrics here (scroll down) - thanks for reminding me!
Originally posted by Teufelchen:
There's also the Two Ronnies' English Folk Song and Dance sketch, which uses a similar gag.
quote:There's a whole pile of hymns, songs, and psalms that describe actions; usually we're not doing them. "Let the lifting up of my hands be as the evening sacrifice" - but Anglicans who use psalms rarely, if ever, lift their hands. Similarly, there are hymns that describe standing - we use them as communion hymns and sing them kneeling. And the odd hymn that describes kneeling can wind up as the processional.
Originally posted by grushi:
Also, "they will dance with joy like we're dancing now". What, awkwardly?
quote:If only it were always so. With this one the worship leaders usually seemed to feel they hadn't done their job until they'd roused everyone into an uncomfortable wiggle.
Originally posted by Henry Troupe:
There's a whole pile of hymns, songs, and psalms that describe actions; usually we're not doing them.
quote:I play in the music group, but I’m not the leader. Last time the top job came up, I considered it, mainly as a way of preventing drivel worship from being sung. Then I realised this was going to leave so little material left to sing, that long gaps would appear in the service, which would be filled with extra preaching.
Originally posted by Jolly Jape:
Nice segue, though, Sarah. You're not a worship leader, are you?
quote:Oh, but it went even deeper today.
Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
Truly, charismatic hymnody has plumbed new depths.
quote:It would, I think, work in Latin. In English, it's terminally confusing.
Originally posted by Sarah G:
Thank You Jesus, thank You Lord,
For loving us so much.
You know you don't deserve anything.
(Although come to think of it ... )quote:Knew I should have added the quotation marks. Otherwise the typed words don't convey the sense of overwhelming sarcasm intended. Then again, could anyone mistake "I'm special" for a classic?
Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
That's a classic? I know GK has more poetry in his soul than that.
Even without the pronoun confusion.
quote:Can I take it there were no children in the service at the time? That seesm to be the most appropriate number for that song.
Originally posted by Sarah G:
Many of us are familiar with the GK classic “I’m special”. Given the number of children that were in the service at the time it was sung, it was reasonable enough to sing it.
quote:Mee-ow!
Originally posted by ken:
Can I take it there were no children in the service at the time? That seesm to be the most appropriate number for that song.
quote:
I play in the music group, but I’m not the leader. Last time the top job came up, I considered it, mainly as a way of preventing drivel worship from being sung. Then I realised this was going to leave so little material left to sing, that long gaps would appear in the service, which would be filled with extra preaching.
quote:Calling the Mother of Jesus "higher than the Cherubim" contradicts Psalm 8.6, "You have made [mankind] but little lower than the angels", unless it can be argued on the basis of such passages as 1 Cor. 6.5 and 1 Cor. 15.49 that all the baptised will become "higher than the cherubim". But I don't think this is what the author meant.
O higher than the Cherubim
more glorious than the Seraphim
Lead their praises, alleluia.
Thou bearer of the eternal Word,
most gracious, magnify the Lord
I hope you'll all forgive me for not reading it all from end to end!
quote:Would that be this one?
Originally posted by Keren-Happuch:
Someone was playing a CD yesterday evening with Matt Redman singing a song which included the word "antheming"
quote:
...Sweet birds antheming the morn
And, in the same moment, hark!
'Tis the early April lark...
quote:Sure am. I survived the singing of this recently in my church (by the church school
Originally posted by Sarah G:
Many of us are familiar with the GK classic “I’m special”.
) by quietly humming the Orville song to myself. Not that they're alike or anything.....
quote:It's credited "from the Latin 7th century, tr. John Mason Neale and the compilers". Those last three words usually strike terror into my heart, as it means that the hymn book committee messed with it. The book in question is the 1971 Hymn Book of the Anglican Church of Canada and the United Church of Canada.
So we, when this new day is gone
and night in turn is drawing on,
with conscience by the hours unstained,
shall praise thy name for victory gained.
quote:The version at Oremus seems much better:
Originally posted by Henry Troup:
quote:
So we, when this new day is gone
and night in turn is drawing on,
with conscience by the hours unstained,
shall praise thy name for victory gained.
quote:I guess I like my Victorian hymns unreconstructed?
So we, when this day's work is o'er,
and shades of night return once more,
our path of trial safely trod,
shall give the glory to our God.
quote:Seems like they've also mis-attributed the translation.
Originally posted by Choirboy:
...translated by Charles Winfred Douglas, first printed 1932, ... Thus the translation perhaps predates the compilers of the hymnal from '71. Just so that blame is directed in the right direction.
quote:When I sung that carol as a child (and why does everyone make *children* sing it and never let the grown-ups at it? Sung nicely, it's beautiful) I never thought that it meant that Jesus never cried. I assumed it meant that Jesus happened not to cry when he woke on that particular occasion. (The cattle aren't always lowing, either, after all.) It's an image; an icon in words. I was quite surprised to find that most people seemed to think it meant that he never cried at all. Maybe I was just too sensible a five-year-old.
Originally posted by Balaam:
But little Lord Jesus no crying he makes Yeah, sure. And the bit about him being fully human?
quote:I wonder about this sometimes myself, especially when the idiots who took out the sexist language[1] in our hymn book get it wrong again and ascribe properties to God that were written as man's and vice versa (thus we have God's toil availing naught or humans exalted). I generally take the view that I should sing what's written, in a gesture of assent to community worship with the rest of the congregation (unless it's an obvious typo that the rest of the congregation won't be singing anyway, like the time in For All The Saints when the countless host were supposed to stream 'through gates of pear').
Originally posted by Balaam:
The problem with having these songs chosen for worship is what do you do? If I sing them I feel a hypocrite for singing something I don't believe, and if I refuse to sing them I feel a hypocrite for not joining in with the rest of the congregation.
quote:The "bleak midwinter" has little to do with meteorology.
Originally posted by Balaam:
Strangely I quite like songs such as See amid the winter's snow, and In the bleak mid-winter.
Although I know the weather was unlikely to have been like that, I like the idea of making the incarnation real to people in other chimates. The theology expressed in these songs seems OK to my mind too. But when sound theology is replaced by Victorian sentimentality.
The problem with having these songs chosen for worship is what do you do? If I sing them I feel a hypocrite for singing something I don't believe, and if I refuse to sing them I feel a hypocrite for not joining in with the rest of the congregation.
quote:I suspect your music group is larger than ours, because from time to time we have the opposite problem, that the night’s service leader has a “theme to this evening’s service”, and insists on sticking to his songs regardless of that evening’s musical line-up.
Originally posted by Puter-Guy:
2nd biggest (after singing songs people obviously don't mean, and man is it a close 2nd) pet peeve: singing haphazardly organized songs (As if selected by randomly flipping open the song book, 6 songs that have nothing in common, conceptually or musically, save that we sing them in the same building.)
quote:Totally agree - me and my girlfriend exchange glances whenever this is sung - usually at the type of place where they do sing this chorus forever. I hate the "hey look - we're getting so spiritual by singing the same chorus again, again and again" attitude. What I think is really happening is people are becoming mildly hypotised by the repetition.
Originally posted by Puter-Guy:
I had remarked to my wife a few days ago that it really grates on me when "I could sing of your looove for-e-ver" sounds like they should be singing "I can't wait til this sooong is-o-ver"...
quote:This is wonderful - can you give us the second half please?
Originally posted by Cottontail:
here's the first half of my favourite children's hymn found in The Scottish Hymnal from 1890 (so copyright no problem??)
quote:I've encountered that one ... cna't find it online.
Originally posted by The Crab:
...
Over the sea there are little brown children;
Fathers, and mothers and babies dear.
They have not heard of the dear Lord in Heaven;
They do not know that God is near.
...
quote:
Originally posted by The Crab:
Over the sea there are little brown children;
Fathers, and mothers and babies dear.
They have not heard of the dear Lord in Heaven;
They do not know that God is near.
quote:Is there any wonder some of us, while missing some things in the Hymnal 1940, were happy to get the Hymnal 1982.
Where children wade through rice fields
And watch the camel trains.
—from "Remember all the people" Hymnal 1940, #262 (See complete words to hymn.)
quote:
The past is a foreign country - they do things differently there.
quote:(repeat getting faster and faster each time until no one can sing fast enough....)
I am a C
I am a C-H
I am a C-H-R-I-S-T-I-A-N
And I have C-H-R-I-S-T in my H-E-A-R-T and I will L-I-V-E E-T-E-R-N-A-L-L-Y.
quote:My mother recalled singing that one as a girl at school in, er, Tottenham. Even then, there were significant numbers of (observant Christian) non-white immigrants in the area.
Originally posted by The Crab:
Over the sea there are little brown children;
Fathers, and mothers and babies dear.
They have not heard of the dear Lord in Heaven;
They do not know that God is near.
quote:Afric?
From Greenland’s icy mountains, from India’s coral strand;
Where Afric’s sunny fountains roll down their golden sand:
From many an ancient river, from many a palmy plain,
They call us to deliver their land from error’s chain.
quote:Who as they weren't overseas and were Christians obviously aren't the people the song was about. The burden of it being that those dear children who are overseas need Jesus just as much as anyone else. Thats a really crap and patronising song but it isn't racist! The racist thing to do, in the context of the times, would have been to leave them in their ignorance. NB the British government (and before them the East India Company) was in general opposed to missionary activity in most of the Empire. As, of course, were lots of slave-traders and slave-keepers. Taking Christianity to people was a way of treating them as equal, as people like yourself. And not infrequently a way of liberateing them, both economically and metaphorically. The opposite of racism.
Originally posted by Teufelchen:
My mother recalled singing that one as a girl at school in, er, Tottenham. Even then, there were significant numbers of (observant Christian) non-white immigrants in the area.
quote:I have sung it. Its actually rather good in some ways.
One which I don't think I've ever sung, but which combines racism, imperialism, and some damn funny imagery, in From Greenland's Icy Mountains,
quote:"Afric" is a bit of really naff 19th-century pseudo-archaic Latinised English. Its supposed to be Poetic. Itys terrible English. But its not racist. If it was would Marcus Garvey have used it?
Afric?
Sunny fountains of sand?
Yer what?
quote:And they aren't "sunny fountains of sand". They are "sunny fountains", i.e. springs or streams of fresh water with the sun shining on them as they pass over sandy beaches into the sea. Not just Poetic but arguablypoetry.
Afric's Love
1. When Afric's sun was setting fast
The Prophets told the tale,
But Psalmists said she'd win at last
And pass beyond the vale.
Chorus:
Come sing the song of Afric's love
The love of God so dear,
The Father great in realms above,
The greatest when so near.
2. The day has come for us to see
The glory of our name,
The hour of our jubilee
Will crown our greatest fame.
3. The hand of God is showing how
Our princes shall arrive;
Old Egypt's land is throbbing now
With souls that are alive.
4. For ages past our sons were slain
On altars far and near,
But all was destined, purging pain
To point the way so fair.
5. As Israel's people suffered long,
So Afric's host must do,
But ours shall be the joyous song
By hearts most firm and true.
6. When tides of ocean cease to be,
Our joys will be immense,
For that will be our jubilee
Our faith this day commence.
quote:OK, that is somewhat unfortunate phraseology...
It goes on to talk about Ceylon, 'where every prospect pleases, and only man is vile'
quote:I be that's one that proponents of the virus of political correctness won't be rushing to make geneder inclusive!
Originally posted by ken:
quote:OK, that is somewhat unfortunate phraseology...
Originally posted by Teufelchen:
[QUOTE][qb]
It goes on to talk about Ceylon, 'where every prospect pleases, and only man is vile'
quote:And if you're a teenager (or have the mind of one) it takes those 'Jesus Is My Boyfriend' songs to a whole other level!
Originally posted by Love the You you hide:
Apologies if this song has been mentioned before, but I was looking at music CDs with the Vicar, and we came across this one "Lord you put a tongue in my mouth".
Well, we played it and it was TRULY awful!
quote:Is that why they hate us so much, and call us meddling kids, and cut our allowance and make us come home by 11 on weekends?
Originally posted by ken:
Inside every grumpy old fart there is a teenager trying to get out.
quote:Is that because it's 100% Biblical or because it's funny?
Originally posted by mmmerangue:
And i would say the song in cheeseburgers signature "the geneology of jesus" is the best hymn ever ^_^ lol!
the week after he'd been to see 'Mamma Mia'.
quote:...Martin Smith. Easily confused, I know: one is a talented yet mild-mannered frontman specialising in mediocre mid-tempo epic sweeping indie-rock designed to appeal to as many people with no real musical taste, and the other is [insert your own punchline].
Originally posted by Alex Cockell:
...Chris Martin
quote:Um, are you sure you linked to the right page? I can't imagine "Will your anchor hold?" as a hymn at a wedding. Almost seems as if you are posting on April 1st. Although, around this neck of the woods, you wouldn't have to print the words as most everyone would know it by heart. It is a much beloved hymn and one guaranteed to be sung with lots of energy. Our verses are little bit different than the ones you have posted.
Originally posted by Oriel:
My (secular) choir has been booked to sing at a wedding this weekend. One of the hymns we are to sing I had never heard before, though the rest of the choir knew it. Here are the words and tune.
Eww.
quote:I'm not even in my 50s, yet. I kind of miss some of those favorites from my youth.
Originally posted by ken:
... I'd expect that most evangelicals over he age of about 60 would know it!
...
I rather like it
)
quote:When I was a humble (yeah right
Originally posted by Teufelchen:
<snip>
One which I don't think I've ever sung, but which combines racism, imperialism, and some damn funny imagery, in From Greenland's Icy Mountains, which should be sung at dirge-like speed to Aurelia for full effect:
quote:Afric?
From Greenland’s icy mountains, from India’s coral strand;
Where Afric’s sunny fountains roll down their golden sand:
From many an ancient river, from many a palmy plain,
They call us to deliver their land from error’s chain.
Sunny fountains of sand?
Yer what?
It goes on to talk about Ceylon, 'where every prospect pleases, and only man is vile' - this was amended to Java, rather than Ceylon, in later versions - which at least fits the tune better.
T.
) curate in the late '80s a glorious eccentric "spinster" lady in our faith community shuufled off this mortal blah blah blah. In her will she stipulated this should be sung at her funeral. It was - with gusto - and with suppressed guffaws. The past indeed was a different country
quote:Do you never watch Snogs of Praise? 'Will Your Anchor Hold?' is a staple of theirs. And to be honest, I have more doubts about the nautical soundness than the theological soundness of its lyrics. It's good enough, though, and I like the tune.
Originally posted by Oriel:
My (secular) choir has been booked to sing at a wedding this weekend. One of the hymns we are to sing I had never heard before, though the rest of the choir knew it. Here are the words and tune.
quote:Or is related to someone who was (and at a church which had BB parade services). I'm not sure I've ever come across it outside a BB context.
Originally posted by ken:
And anyone who had ever been in the Boy's Brigade.
quote:Just curiously, if you're just the organist, why does your list of un-favourites matter for their wedding? Shouldn't you just play the damn hymn/s instead of pushing them around with your personal preferences?
Originally posted by Alan Mathew:
...
I had to very quickly quash any suggestions for Bind us together and One more step!!!!! Both firm un-favourites of mine! Anyone else feel the same or have any similar funny stories?
quote:This hymn was also sung at Diana's funeral too. I played the tune yesterday as a prelude to our service. A couple of the old dears made some nice comments about the tune but not the words!!!
Originally posted by The Revd H P Stinker Pinker:
The website also informs us that it was sung at Princess Diana's wedding - that explains something perhaps. I wonder who's choice that was?!
Can anyone justify singing this in church, ever?
It's a pity because the tune is nice.
Stinker
quote:Its just a spelling difference. Whats the problem with that?
Originally posted by Henry Troup:
A slightly generalized rant/query: Why do some hymns say "Sion" and others "Zion"?
quote:Yes there is, its been used in English for at least 700 years. How long does it take to invent a word?
While I'm on that topic, what about "Jehovah"? There is no such word;
quote:Well, yes, except that that isn't the tetragramaton its another invented word based on different (and perhaps more realistic) assumptions about the original vowels. And even if we did know the original pronounciation, it is a word that no-one has used liturgically for at least the last 2500 years.
it's the result of reading the tetragramaton (Yahweh) with the vowel pointing for Adonai.
quote:And why not? What's the problem>
Yet this keeps being used in hymns.
quote:I direct you to ken's excellent post directly above yours.
Originally posted by Mudfrog:
I get annoyed at 'alleluia' when the word is 'hallelujah'.
quote:Sorry, specifically, it is still being used in new hymns and songs, where it comes across (to me) as bad style.
Originally posted by ken:
...quote:And why not? What's the problem?
..."Jehovah"? ...
Yet this keeps being used in hymns.
quote:Especially when the rest of the hymn is not in greek.
Originally posted by Mudfrog:
I get annoyed at 'alleluia' when the word is 'hallelujah'.
quote:My word what quiet lives you must lead to get worked up about the spelling of alleluia/hallelujah in hymns.
Originally posted by the giant cheeseburger:
quote:Especially when the rest of the hymn is not in greek.
Originally posted by Mudfrog:
I get annoyed at 'alleluia' when the word is 'hallelujah'.
quote:... and I say 'let's call the whole thing off!'
Originally posted by multipara:
You say tomayto when I say tomahto....
quote:But the Hebrew word is hallel
Originally posted by J Whitgift:
quote:My word what quiet lives you must lead to get worked up about the spelling of alleluia/hallelujah in hymns.
Originally posted by the giant cheeseburger:
quote:Especially when the rest of the hymn is not in greek.
Originally posted by Mudfrog:
I get annoyed at 'alleluia' when the word is 'hallelujah'.
For the record, I prefer, alleluia, it looks more elegant - sans the H's!
quote:... and I say 'let's call the whole thing off!'
Originally posted by multipara:
You say tomayto when I say tomahto....
quote:Well, the first four words at least seem appropriate to the occasion. In a similar vein it once occured to me that perhaps the best wedding hymn would be O Valiant Hearts, given what the couple had in store for them. I can't imagine any bride wanting it at her wedding though. Actually this occured to me while the bride was walking down the isle at one wedding, and it was all I could do not to burst out laughing, which I gather would have been something of a faux pas.
Originally posted by The Revd H P Stinker Pinker:
I suspect this hymn has been vilified before on these pages but...
I've always had a problem with I vow to thee my country and in all honesty cannot sing the first verse - I am unable to give my country "a love that asks no questions" - surely that leads to a very dangerous place.
But it seems bizarre that anyone could have it at a wedding - something I have experienced over the years.
etc) but my particular hate is the fact that the verses are sung from God's perspective, and the chorus from "our" perspective. What is going on there? I just can't get on with singing as if I'm God. Too weird.
) we sang yesterday (a lot ) is not one of them. Only a taste of its dreadfulness can be provided under international Human Rights legislation(!):
quote:Don't several classic hymns do that too, though?
Originally posted by sparklylady:
...I just can't get on with singing as if I'm God.
quote:I like it, especially the Vandals version (ignore the strange animation).
Originally posted by sparklylady:
Don't know if someone has already mentioned this song, but my pet hate at the moment is " I the Lord of Sea and Sky "
Lots to hate about this one (twee, sentimental,
quote:I did in fact play this for a wedding a few weeks back. The bride was a Naval person. the congregation (mostly military by the look of the dress whites and swords etc) sang it with gusto.
Originally posted by Teufelchen:
quote:Do you never watch Snogs of Praise? 'Will Your Anchor Hold?' is a staple of theirs. And to be honest, I have more doubts about the nautical soundness than the theological soundness of its lyrics. It's good enough, though, and I like the tune.
Originally posted by Oriel:
My (secular) choir has been booked to sing at a wedding this weekend. One of the hymns we are to sing I had never heard before, though the rest of the choir knew it. Here are the words and tune.
T.
quote:Were you celebrating Harvest Festival in July?
Originally posted by Henry Troup:
We had Come Ye Thankful People today, and as usual I reacted to a couple of points:
quote:It tends to show up about the beginning of actual harvesting - hay and maize (corn). I didn't choose it, though.
Originally posted by Cantiones Sacrae:
Were you celebrating Harvest Festival in July?
quote:And the interesting thing is that so far as I can see, the hymn is not about harvest thanksgiving at all. Look at the words (especially some of those Henry has highlighted). It's appropriate for the day the parable of the wheat and the tares is read -- that after all is the story behind the hymn. And for one of those days in/before ADvent when the Last Judgement is the theme.
Originally posted by Henry Troup:
quote:It tends to show up about the beginning of actual harvesting - hay and maize (corn). I didn't choose it, though.
Originally posted by Cantiones Sacrae:
Were you celebrating Harvest Festival in July?
I'm deeply sorry. Not only do we have Elizabeth J. Smith, but now this!
quote:Chorister, this sounds the sort of thing that Greenbelt might be into.
Originally posted by Chorister:
A compilation based on this thread would make rather a good hymnbook. Then we could all gather round the church piano for a nostalgic 'Crappy Choruses and Horrible Hymns' evening (a la Moody and Sankey) every now and again.
Perhaps the Diocese of Wenchoster would be interested in hosting such an event?
Not that I've ever been, you understand. What with all the Shippie regulars there, the potential for sales is tremendous. A few sneaky bribes of Green and Blacks, a free portaloo or three, world domination could be ours! It might even qualify as a Fresh Expression!
quote:No, seriously? People can't actually stand up in church and sing that sewage is washed downriver, can they?
"Sewage is washed down-river while lonely orphans cry"
quote:Or like a sort of heavenly emetic?
Originally posted by leo:
Not a crappy chorus as such but...for tiday's gradual hymn we sang an oldie which included the line 'when he had purged our stains'.*
There was a young couple there who have never been to church before - I wonder what they made of it. Something about Jesus being washing powder?
quote:Perhaps unfortunatly that image is Biblical.
Originally posted by leo:
I wonder what they made of it. Something about Jesus being washing powder?
quote:"fullers' soap" being the Daz of the day.
But who can endure the day of his coming? And who can stand when he appears? For he is like a refiner's fire and like fullers' soap.
quote:
Six days later, Jesus took with him Peter and James and John, and brought them up on a high mountain by themselves. And he was transfigured before them and his garments became radiant and exceedingly white, as no launderer on earth can whiten them.
quote:It's a much better hymn when it's sung to "The Lincolnshire Poacher."
Originally posted by ken:
O God, that Great Tsunami
Some people ought to have their poetic licences revoked. Others hsoudlnever have been issued with them.
Being pedantic for a moment, is the meaning of the first verse of this song be sensitive to the difference between those often-confused words "O" and "Oh"?
quote:
Originally posted by Carys:
We can't their bodies find just isn't English. I think it is that you can't put the object between the auxiliary and main verb. So it would have to be We their bodies can't find but even that is strained, probably because of the contraction can't. The original reads as we know that poetry sometimes inverts word order but we don't understand the rules so we'll just put it in any order.
Carys
We can't their bodies find sounds fine (in poetry) to me, while we their bodies can't find sounds terrible.quote:I just e-mailed the worship team leader and another singer in our worship band, pretending I wanted us to do this one...
Originally posted by bib:
I took a copy of the tsunami hymn to church today and terrified my choir into thinking we were singing it! I'll have to do penance for weeks. The author of this ghastly hymn will be punished in the afterlife. I'm so embarrassed to be an Australian.
quote:We did the "what a load of rubbish" song at easter holiday club and I thought very similarly to you....
Originally posted by Jenn R:
Today we had our bible club service. So we sang 3 action songs and "all things bright and beautiful".
We even sang the club theme song 3 times. 3. And it began "what a load of rubbish". And that just about summed it up. And the worst thing - this is thhe only church service today. At least when we normally have "all age worship" (all age!! Yeah right!! some 5-7 year olds more like) there is communion in the evening, so I can recover.
quote:That Persil moment.
Originally posted by ken:
And Jesus obviously does his own washing.
Mark 9:
quote:
[snip] And he was transfigured before them and his garments became radiant and exceedingly white, as no launderer on earth can whiten them.
quote:There's another You Tube one with the original singer and the most
Originally posted by Moth:
Can I just relieve my feelings by saying here just how much I hate Matt Redman's "Oh no, you never let go"? The uninitiated can hear a version similar to how it sounds in my church by clicking on You Tube .
For all I know, it sounds Ok when the culprit ... I mean songwriter ... performs it, but in my church it sounds like a wailing cat with a very annoying chorus.
If I meet Matt Redman in heaven, I'm going to kick him in the balls.
quote:Ahhh, a person after my good lady's heart, I see. I actually think the song is rather fine: the bit about the heart holding on would be a pretty good one, were it not for the overtones of Kate Twinset standing at the bow of Titanic, hair blowing in the draught of an industrial strength wind machine.
Originally posted by Moth:
Can I just relieve my feelings by saying here just how much I hate Matt Redman's "Oh no, you never let go"? The uninitiated can hear a version similar to how it sounds in my church by clicking on You Tube .
For all I know, it sounds Ok when the culprit ... I mean songwriter ... performs it, but in my church it sounds like a wailing cat with a very annoying chorus.
If I meet Matt Redman in heaven, I'm going to kick him in the balls.
quote:We had "Shine" yesterday too and something rather strange happened say the least as I found myself "enjoying" singing this dreadful hymn. Oh dear.
Originally posted by MirrorMouse:
People at my church never clap normally. Then suddenly, to magnify the challenge of singing Shine Jesus Shine (which isn't my favourite hymn, shall we say), the *minister* started clapping. Between the verse and chorus of SJS - 2 bars of clapping of a jaunty rhythm. And then the congregation joined in - they were clearly familiar with this practice! Shine Jesus Shine I can just about cope with. Clapping I can just about tolerate. But a special marriage of the two?!!
when at my local St Andrews branch.. a 3-CD set entiitled "The Worship Library". Billed as containing "less-well-known" worship songs, it conatined some of Matt Redman's, Tim Hughes's etc early stuff.quote:I don't like it much but I thought it was more about the Transfguration than the Epiphany.
Originally posted by Gay Organ Grinder:
quote:We had "Shine" yesterday too and something rather strange happened say the least as I found myself "enjoying" singing this dreadful hymn. Oh dear.
Originally posted by MirrorMouse:
People at my church never clap normally. Then suddenly, to magnify the challenge of singing Shine Jesus Shine (which isn't my favourite hymn, shall we say), the *minister* started clapping. Between the verse and chorus of SJS - 2 bars of clapping of a jaunty rhythm. And then the congregation joined in - they were clearly familiar with this practice! Shine Jesus Shine I can just about cope with. Clapping I can just about tolerate. But a special marriage of the two?!!
quote:It was chosen by the praise leafer for the day whom I would doubt would know what Epiphany is about. Bless her as she is such an angel!!
Originally posted by leo:
quote:I don't like it much but I thought it was more about the Transfguration than the Epiphany.
Originally posted by Gay Organ Grinder:
quote:We had "Shine" yesterday too and something rather strange happened say the least as I found myself "enjoying" singing this dreadful hymn. Oh dear.
Originally posted by MirrorMouse:
People at my church never clap normally. Then suddenly, to magnify the challenge of singing Shine Jesus Shine (which isn't my favourite hymn, shall we say), the *minister* started clapping. Between the verse and chorus of SJS - 2 bars of clapping of a jaunty rhythm. And then the congregation joined in - they were clearly familiar with this practice! Shine Jesus Shine I can just about cope with. Clapping I can just about tolerate. But a special marriage of the two?!!
quote:Forgive me, but I can't help thinking that knowing "what <insert festival or season here> is about" was a bit of a fundamental qualification for a worship leader.
Originally posted by Gay Organ Grinder:
It was chosen by the praise leafer for the day whom I would doubt would know what Epiphany is about. Bless her as she is such an angel!!
quote:Sorry i should have qualified my statement by saying: the said praise leader came from another religion where the church calendar was not followed unlike our church.
Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
quote:Forgive me, but I can't help thinking that knowing "what <insert festival or season here> is about" was a bit of a fundamental qualification for a worship leader.
Originally posted by Gay Organ Grinder:
It was chosen by the praise leafer for the day whom I would doubt would know what Epiphany is about. Bless her as she is such an angel!!
quote:There are no words. How awful! Clapping by the minister and that, that...song. Mercy...<shudder>
Originally posted by MirrorMouse:
People at my church never clap normally. Then suddenly, to magnify the challenge of singing Shine Jesus Shine (which isn't my favourite hymn, shall we say), the *minister* started clapping. Between the verse and chorus of SJS - 2 bars of clapping of a jaunty rhythm. And then the congregation joined in - they were clearly familiar with this practice! Shine Jesus Shine I can just about cope with. Clapping I can just about tolerate. But a special marriage of the two?!!
quote:Oh, I wouldn't call the non-Calendar followers a different religion.
Originally posted by Gay Organ Grinder:
quote:Sorry i should have qualified my statement by saying: the said praise leader came from another religion where the church calendar was not followed unlike our church.
Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
quote:Forgive me, but I can't help thinking that knowing "what <insert festival or season here> is about" was a bit of a fundamental qualification for a worship leader.
Originally posted by Gay Organ Grinder:
It was chosen by the praise leafer for the day whom I would doubt would know what Epiphany is about. Bless her as she is such an angel!!
quote:Oh duchess I'm so glad you are able to feel my pain through my post and sympathise! I am still traumatised even five days later, so I need all the sympathy I can get!
Originally posted by duchess:
quote:There are no words. How awful! Clapping by the minister and that, that...song. Mercy...<shudder>
Originally posted by MirrorMouse:
People at my church never clap normally. Then suddenly, to magnify the challenge of singing Shine Jesus Shine (which isn't my favourite hymn, shall we say), the *minister* started clapping. Between the verse and chorus of SJS - 2 bars of clapping of a jaunty rhythm. And then the congregation joined in - they were clearly familiar with this practice! Shine Jesus Shine I can just about cope with. Clapping I can just about tolerate. But a special marriage of the two?!!
quote:Shout to the LORD sends me over the edge. I have to walk out of any church (if I am able). I have banned that song in my church and Shine-blah blah. I am only a singer in the Worship Band but I have my limits and I DO speak up. I am fortunate the praise songs my worship leaders enjoy having us sing are usually by people like Sovereign Grace, Chris Tomlin, Fernando Ortega etc...
Originally posted by MirrorMouse:
quote:Oh duchess I'm so glad you are able to feel my pain through my post and sympathise! I am still traumatised even five days later, so I need all the sympathy I can get!
Originally posted by duchess:
quote:There are no words. How awful! Clapping by the minister and that, that...song. Mercy...<shudder>
Originally posted by MirrorMouse:
People at my church never clap normally. Then suddenly, to magnify the challenge of singing Shine Jesus Shine (which isn't my favourite hymn, shall we say), the *minister* started clapping. Between the verse and chorus of SJS - 2 bars of clapping of a jaunty rhythm. And then the congregation joined in - they were clearly familiar with this practice! Shine Jesus Shine I can just about cope with. Clapping I can just about tolerate. But a special marriage of the two?!!
quote:Eeek! I remember singing that at a GFS Rally in the 70s. Only we changed it to 'Family of God'. The mention of the cringeworthy 'coolie in Peking' makes me think of the Two Fat Ladies: "It's a raspberry sauce, please do not call it a coulis. A coolie is a Chinese gentleman in a triangular straw hat. And jolly good chaps they are too!"
Originally posted by Chorister:
The Tsunami and Honduras hymns remind me of most of the Youth Praise selection from the 1960s/70s. Even if people like them at the time, they date so easily. (How many miners are there in the Rhondda these days, I wonder? They're all tourist guides for the Big Pit theme park, I guess.)
Ohhhhhh, the miner in the Rhondda, the coolie in Peking......
the family of man (boom, boom) keeps growing,
the family of man (boom, boom) keeps sowing
the seeds of a new life ev'ry day.
quote:I have a few recordings of it done in a Congregational environment with Life Teen (Matt Maher leading)
Originally posted by Hart:
I actually have a recording of Matt Redman performing this and it's pretty good. I was wondering what it would sound like if sung as a congregational piece. Now I know why I'd never found out.
quote:Well, J Whitgift, you're clearly not coming to the right church. Not many miles away from you we sang 'Now the green blade riseth' as the Gradual on both Easter Day and 2nd Sunday of Easter.
Originally posted by J Whitgift:
Unfortunately, there's been no sighting (or singing) of 'Now the green blade riseth' at Church this Eastertide. This (and singing 'O Jesus I have promised' on Sunday evening) prompted me to realise that 'Now the green blade riseth' can be sung to the tune of 'O Jesus I have promised'. This in turn means that 'Now the green blade' can be sung to the following tunes:
- The Muppets theme music, and
- Match of the Day.
quote:Jesus may be better than Barbie, but does he have as many cool accessories and outfits?
previous page post by North East Quine a song "Jesus, You're my Superhero" which includes the line "Jesus! Better than Barbie!"
quote:Of course.
Originally posted by beachpsalms:
quote:Jesus may be better than Barbie, but does he have as many cool accessories and outfits?
previous page post by North East Quine a song "Jesus, You're my Superhero" which includes the line "Jesus! Better than Barbie!"
quote:And does he have a boyfriend called Ken?
Originally posted by beachpsalms:
quote:Jesus may be better than Barbie, but does he have as many cool accessories and outfits?
previous page post by North East Quine a song "Jesus, You're my Superhero" which includes the line "Jesus! Better than Barbie!"
quote:No, but he may have had one called John.
Originally posted by Auntie Doris:
And does he have a boyfriend called Ken?
quote:We have parody lyrics for that one that go something like
Originally posted by Boopy:
I am new here but would love to share with you this treat from the old Baptist Hymn Book, as a warning against separating the subject by too many lines. 'I sing a song of the saints of God' is as you might expect about saints and trying to live up to them as good examples etc. but has as part of its second verse,
"and one was a soldier and one was a priest
and one was slain by a fierce wild beast
and there's not any reason, no not the least
why I shouldn't be one too".
Feel free to picture children in congregation deciding they'd rather not be fierce wild beasts, thanks very much.
quote:I've sung several RC settings of the Gloria in excelsis which include such a refrain (usually the opening "Glory to God in the highest, and peace to his people on earth"). I don't get why it needs that, either, but apparently the composers of RC church music don't feel their congregations are capable of learning the whole text.
Originally posted by Laudate Dominum:
We’ve sung a Gloria in my parish for two or three years now which is perfectly dreadful. The chorus words, “Gloria, Gloria in excelsis Deo” are not too terrible, but the verses have mangled the official translation of this prayer. Incidentally, the Gloria was originally a chant hymn, which by definition does not have a verse-refrain structure. Just one verse after another. So, it shouldn’t have a refrain at all.
Also, the melody is horrible and rock-influenced. In fact, when it is played fast enough, it actually tempts some of the more simpleminded in the congregation to start clapping. As in, somewhat in time to the music. This is a Roman Catholic church! We don’t do that! What happened to dignity? Ok, I should stop now…
quote:Is one of those the one I'm thinking of -- in "limping" 3/4 time that reminds me of Peter Schickele's comment re P.D.Q. Bach: "Most of P.D.Q. Bach's dance music seems to suggest that one of his legs was shorter than the other."
Originally posted by Fr Weber:
I've sung several RC settings of the Gloria in excelsis which include such a refrain (usually the opening "Glory to God in the highest, and peace to his people on earth").
quote:Wrong DH thread, sir.
Originally posted by Amanda B. Reckondwythe:
quote:No, but he may have had one called John.
Originally posted by Auntie Doris:
And does he have a boyfriend called Ken?
quote:I think SJS in a cathedral for Songs of Praise accompanied by organ sounds worse. Looks bad too, all those middle aged women wearing silly hats mumbling into the songsheets. At least SJS in the Stock-Aitken-Waterman style is 20th century mediocrity throughout.
Originally posted by Alex Cockell:
Just heard one of the worst travesties in cheesy worship songs...
SJS in a Stock-Aitken-Waterman style. Had their trademark fast 16ths-on-hihat all over it... it just sounded scarily awful... especially when you wake up to it.
quote:Oh my goodness... "I believe in World War 3"? "Sin is like my stinky sox"? "Jesus died on a wooden cross/ Jesus died to save the lost/ He died for the lambs and the little fleas/ God loves me/" Are these genuine?
Originally posted by Mama Thomas:
In a thread 32 pages long and growing, I'll bet this collection has probably been linked several times. This has to be done on purpose--a collection of the worst and crappiest of choruses and most horrible of hymns--bar none.
Trust me, if you haven't seen, you won't get very far before deciding you've had enough.
quote:
You are worthy at all times to be praised by happy voices
quote:Other translations of the hymn use "pious voices", or "voices of praise", or "voices lifted in fitting melody". Whenever we've used the Phos hilaron, we've substituted "pious" for "happy"--it's not great, but it is an improvement.
Originally posted by Hilda of Whitby:
I don't know if this is the appropriate thread ... but there is a line in 'Phos hilaron' in the evening prayer service in the 1979 BCP that just makes me go 'huh?':
quote:
You are worthy at all times to be praised by happy voices
This line sounds like something one would sing in vacation Bible school or something. It scans badly and really wrecks it for me.
It is especially tin-eared because the words in the rest of the hymn are truly beautiful.
WTF??
quote:'Altogether lovely' sounds quite a normal expression to me, out of context of church - though perhaps a bit poetic and old-fashioned. But in the song, it always makes me thinnk of Terry Pratchett's multiple-personality character Altogether Andrews ...
Originally posted by matthew_dixon:
Okay - has anyone mentioned "Here I Am To Worship" yet? That's my personal pet hate at present.
The start of the chorus...
Here I am to worship
Here I am to bow down
Here I am to say that you're my God
is okay... but when it goes on...
You're altogether lovely
Altogether worthy
Altogether wonderful to me
Why "altogether" everything? Doesn't make sense. How can someone be "altogether wonderful"? "Altogether worthy"? What of?!? As for "You're altogether lovely" - a friend of mine and fellow shipmate referred to this line once as "something I'd say to my boyfriend and not to my saviour"
"I'll neve know how much it costs to see my sin upon that cross" is similarly dreadful lyrics!
)
quote:It's even in Rite I!: "Thou art worthy at all times to be praised by happy voices." What were they thinking? I think someone must have had a little seizure or something at that point.
Originally posted by Hilda of Whitby:
I don't know if this is the appropriate thread ... but there is a line in 'Phos hilaron' in the evening prayer service in the 1979 BCP that just makes me go 'huh?':
quote:
You are worthy at all times to be praised by happy voices
quote:No, no!! That is an old Sunday-school favourite which goes:
Originally posted by Freddy R:
How about this one, sung to the tune of "There's a Tavern in the Town":
Jesus loves me, this I know
This I know
'Cause the Bible tells me so,
Tells me so -o- -o- -o-.
He's my saviour,
I -I- am his lamb.
Yes, by Jesus Christ, I am!
Sung at fraternity parties.
quote:I somehow suspect that even the Blessed Matt of Watford is a bit embarassed about having written it! Ah, the exuberance of youth!
Originally posted by briony:
I discovered this site a couple of years ago and drop in occasionally. However, a song we sang in church last Sunday has prompted me to register and share it all with you. It has plumbed new depths of Christian songwriting and I can't see that it's ever been mentioned on here. Having noticed in someone's earlier message that I can't post all the lyrics, here is a taster:
I will dance
I will sing
To be mad
For my King
Chorus:
And I'll become
Even more undignified than this
Some may say
It's foolishness
But I'll become
Even more undignified than this
Leave my pride
By my side
La, la, la, la, la, HEY!
La, la, la, la, la
La, la, la, la, la, HEY!
La, la, la, la, la
I'm sure you can imagine the "actions" and "dancing" that accompanied this. And we had a lot of parents from the guides, cubs etc who aren't usually in the church. Believe me, they won't be coming back after that & I'm not sure I will either. Never been so embarassed...
quote:I think it's usually attributed to Matt Redman, though Dave Crowder and a load of other "Lead worshippers" (thanks, Barnabas) have covered it.
Originally posted by briony:
It seems to have been written by someone called David Crowder.
quote:Just click the little one with the " ".
Originally posted by briony:
Aha, I do apologise. I've now found it attributed to Matt Redman, though the website I found last night definitely said "lyrics by David Crowder". Wrong! As you've probably realised I haven't yet worked out how to use the "quote" function on here! On other message boards there's normally a reply button on each message but I can't see how to do it here.
quote:And yet I still haven't quite got it! Maybe this one will be right!
Originally posted by briony:
Looks so obvious once you've had it pointed out to you! [/QB]
quote:Maybe some of the song writers we are criticising know a little more Scripture than some of us here.
Originally posted by matthew_dixon:
Okay - has anyone mentioned "Here I Am To Worship" yet? That's my personal pet hate at present.
The start of the chorus...
Here I am to worship
Here I am to bow down
Here I am to say that you're my God
is okay... but when it goes on...
You're altogether lovely
Altogether worthy
Altogether wonderful to me
Why "altogether" everything? Doesn't make sense. How can someone be "altogether wonderful"? "Altogether worthy"? What of?!? As for "You're altogether lovely" - a friend of mine and fellow shipmate referred to this line once as "something I'd say to my boyfriend and not to my saviour"
quote:But isn't that the point?
Originally posted by Mudfrog:
The phrase 'altogether lovely is part of the description of the Lover in the Song of Songs, which of course, is a source of a number of phrases that describe Christ and the Church.
quote:He's the Fairest of Ten Thousand
Originally posted by Johnny S:
quote:But isn't that the point?
Originally posted by Mudfrog:
The phrase 'altogether lovely is part of the description of the Lover in the Song of Songs, which of course, is a source of a number of phrases that describe Christ and the Church.
There are some big assumptions in the song writing, namely:
1. The use of Elizabethan language is appropriate for contemporary songs.
2. That S of S is an allegory of Christ and the Church.
My guess is that both of those assumptions are up for debate.
quote:Though "altogether" in the sense that it is used in "Here I am to worship" has never seemed to me to be anachronistic. To say that something is "altogether a good thing" would feel quite natural to me.
Originally posted by Johnny S:
quote:But isn't that the point?
Originally posted by Mudfrog:
The phrase 'altogether lovely is part of the description of the Lover in the Song of Songs, which of course, is a source of a number of phrases that describe Christ and the Church.
There are some big assumptions in the song writing, namely:
1. The use of Elizabethan language is appropriate for contemporary songs.
2. That S of S is an allegory of Christ and the Church.
My guess is that both of those assumptions are up for debate.
quote:True - it was more the other examples cited by Mudfrog I had in mind.
Originally posted by Jolly Jape:
Though "altogether" in the sense that it is used in "Here I am to worship" has never seemed to me to be anachronistic. To say that something is "altogether a good thing" would feel quite natural to me.
)
quote:That makes more sense - but it clearly shows that it wasn't meant for congregational singing on a fine morning in June.
Originally posted by Gill H:
I understand 'This is the air I breathe' was written out of someone's personal trauma (loss of a child, I think?) and as such, could be very moving. But for me, most Sundays, I can't really sing 'I'm desperate for You' with any honesty. (Not that I've sung it for years now - I hoped it had gone away!)
quote:There is only one in that top 25 that I don't recognise as in common use in our place.
Originally posted by Sioni Sais:
There aren't many surprises. Or maybe there are.
quote:Slight tangent here. Our 19 year old son remarked the other day that he still remembers the songs he had to sing at our local C of E Junior School. Apparently they come into their own at the end of a long hard drinking session, when he says you can always tell who's been to a church school; they always seek each other out for a sing-song. I can just picture 'When a Knight Won His Spurs,' and 'Give Me Oil in My Lamp,' being roared out, karaoke-style in Varsity.
Originally posted by mrs whibley:
The major surprise to me is that so many of the songs in the 'schools' section are those I sang at school.
Actually, I have been thinking of them as typical 1970s songs for about 30 years, when I should have viewed them as typical school songs!
Maybe Beer n' Hymns is on to a good thing.
quote:Oh. Dear. God. (reading through them)
Originally posted by Mama Thomas:
In a thread 32 pages long and growing, I'll bet this collection has probably been linked several times. This has to be done on purpose--a collection of the worst and crappiest of choruses and most horrible of hymns--bar none.
Trust me, if you haven't seen, you won't get very far before deciding you've had enough.
quote:I prescribe a dose of Death Metal, pick your own track
Originally posted by Margaret:
I was one of those lucky people who'd never heard of "Mr Cow" until I came across it on this thread. I thought I'd amuse a friend who works in a milk testing lab by sending her a page which advertises the CD, and I made the mistake of clicking the link which gives you the first thirty seconds of it...
Oh Lord, I wish I hadn't. Where's the brain bleach?
quote:I hope she got the message.
Originally posted by LutheranChik:
It was one of those "Dear Lord, please make it stop now" moments.
quote:And this love song is apparently:
I've got a love song in my heart. It's for you Lord!!
quote:And as for 1059:
La la la la la la la la
La la la la la la la la
La la la la la la la la
La la la la la la la la
(repeat)
quote:Or 756:
This is my pilgrimage
to climb into You
[...]
I'm so restless, hear my words O God.
quote:
He made the earth
He made the sky
He made the sun and the moon and the stars
Jupiter and Mars
He made the sun for everyone
[...]
He made the boys
He made the girls
He made our Mums and Dads
[...]
Our God is beautiful
Our God is great
quote:Yes, because watching in-flight refuelling is something most people have experienced and have fond memories of.
Originally posted by Baptist Trainfan:
Autumn days when the grass is jewelled
And the silk inside a chestnut shell
Jet planes meeting in the air to be refuelled
All these things I love so well
quote:SOF came out about 1986 I'd guess, from the fact I bought SOF1 before I went to University ie before 1984.
Originally posted by ken:
It is SOF TWO that is basically the out-takes from the CCK Sunday School circa 1997 as influenced by the Jesus is my Boyfriend Movement
quote:I used to love that one when we sung it in school.
Originally posted by jlg:
quote:Yes, because watching in-flight refuelling is something most people have experienced and have fond memories of.
Originally posted by Baptist Trainfan:
Autumn days when the grass is jewelled
And the silk inside a chestnut shell
Jet planes meeting in the air to be refuelled
All these things I love so well
That and Cauliflowers Fluffy.
quote:
Originally posted by Jengie Jon:
Here is something to entertain people. I thought this might require its own thread but think is well within the theme here.
I discovered the website of Hymnal Net today.
If anything its midi are easier to listen to than those of cyberhymnal but why I have started this thread is in searching for something else I came across O praise the Lord, God had a plan.
Jengie
quote:Hmmmmmmm
Originally posted by Jengie Jon:
Here is something to entertain people. I thought this might require its own thread but think is well within the theme here.
I discovered the website of Hymnal Net today.
If anything its midi are easier to listen to than those of cyberhymnal but why I have started this thread is in searching for something else I came across O praise the Lord, God had a plan.
Jengie
quote:A friend in a pub tells me that is exactly what has happened. There is a computer program that notates scores on the basis of recordings. It is widely used. Apparently the default setting is extremely sensitive. Even on more sensible settings it is apparently not very competent.
Originally posted by Doc Tor:
I imagine that John's probably right about the genesis of these tab lines. Like I said, some of the chords are so fantastically obscure that I have to assume it's some vast, cold machine deciding on the basis of the recording that that's what was played.
Scary and snigger-worthy on so many levels. quote:AAAAAGGGGGHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Originally posted by Alex Cockell:
Premier Radio are doing another radiothon - and they offered as a "reward" for gathering enough donations in an hour (900 quid) - to play Julia Plaut's "Mr Cow".
Someone has to die.
quote:That one came up this morning. Thank goodness I just had to project the lyrics, but couldn't resist a smirk at the memory of your CCHH post...
Originally posted by mrs whibley:
I apologise if this has had a mention before. We sang a song last Sunday (in the children's slot, thankfully) which contained the couplet:
God's love is big, God's love is great;
God's love is fab and he's my mate.
While I had no problem with the rest of the song, that 'mate' thing kept my inner theologian occupied for the rest of the service.
quote:
Originally posted by Squirrel: I see that there is another thread on "Kum By Yah." That got me thinking- what was the absolute WORST hymn ever sung during the Folk Mass craze of the Sixties and early Seventies? My nomination:
Sons of God
Hear His holy word
Gather 'round
the table of the Lord
Eat His Body
Drink His blood
And we'll sing a song of love
Allelu, Allelu
Alleluia
quote:Oh my goodness, I had completely forgotten that one. Please don't let it be an earworm!!!
Sons of God
Hear His holy word
Gather 'round
the table of the Lord
Eat His Body
Drink His blood
And we'll sing a song of love
Allelu, Allelu
Alleluia
quote:Somebody please tell me this song is a joke? Please please?
in searching for something else I came across O praise the Lord, God had a plan.
Jengie
quote:As far as I know it is genuine.
Originally posted by Belle Ringer:
quote:Somebody please tell me this song is a joke? Please please?
in searching for something else I came across O praise the Lord, God had a plan.
Jengie
quote:Sadly no joke. But it can be countered with Mannish Boy...
Originally posted by Belle Ringer:
quote:Somebody please tell me this song is a joke? Please please?
in searching for something else I came across O praise the Lord, God had a plan.
Jengie
quote:Jengie
Lost in a shuffle
I was lost as a goose
The devil had a rope out
and it looked like a noose
but just before I went off at that deep end
My father through me out a line
forgave me for my sin
Paddyquote:Or, HE does! I sent these atrocious lyrics to all my Gay male pals so they could get a good laugh from some of those lines... "fill me to the brim..."
Originally posted by Boogie:
The writer of this just needs to get herself a nice fella and a room.
quote:Oh man, that's one of my pet hates. Mainly because it seems that Brian Doerksen wrote a perfectly adequate first verse, then seemed to think 'but one verse cannot possibly be enough', and came up with.... that.
Originally posted by Gill H:
Eek! Makes "Your love is surprising, I can feel it rising" seem pretty tame by comparison.
<== Smug Smiley.
quote:Ah, Lord of the Dance is beautiful! Not that I had any understanding of what it was all about when I sang it at school...
Originally posted by Emma Louise:
My school loved it too! It was one of my favourites along with "dance then wherever you may be..."
quote:Indeed - I refuse to have it sung in my church.
Originally posted by FooloftheShip:
I know we've done PSA to the point of collective madness, but I still think "There is a green hill" belongs in here.
quote:I love it! And I'm very much looking forward to singing it on Friday.
Originally posted by leo:
quote:Indeed - I refuse to have it sung in my church.
Originally posted by FooloftheShip:
I know we've done PSA to the point of collective madness, but I still think "There is a green hill" belongs in here.
quote:Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa! I have some alternate lyrics. "Jesus taught me to sing like a robot. Jesus taught me it's okay to throw up!" Oh, man, that is really... something... not something good, but something...
Originally posted by Darkwing:
One time in College Chapel, the speaker said, "You know, chapel could be a lot worse" and proceeded to show us this.
I apologize in advance.
quote:You've got to be kidding me!
Originally posted by Joshua Bell:
Revelation, Revelation,
Twenty-one eight, twenty one eight,
Liars go to Hell, liars go to Hell,
Burn burn burn, burn burn burn.
quote:Well, then, with that sort of humor, you might prefer this version better!
Sonseed has inspired me to write my own little ditty to Jesus. Here's a little sample:
(snip)
quote:
He loves me when I'm right, he loves me when I'm wrong.
He loves me when I'm wasting time by writing silly songs
quote:I wish I were. But no, someone had it taught to them in Sunday School - about 20 years ago.
Originally posted by Darkwing:
You've got to be kidding me!
quote:That'll be Michael W Smith's
Originally posted by ianjmatt:
I don't know if this has been mentioned, but someone sang this as a solo during a service this weekend:
Crucified
Laid behind a stone
You lived to die
Rejected and alone
Like a rose
Trampled on the ground
You took the fall
And thought of me
Above all
The verses are kind of meh but this chorus (accompanied by what sounded like a gear crunching modulation) just had me in stitches. It isn't just the crappy purple-ness of 'Like a Rose/Trampled on the ground" it is the vomit-inducing lovey-doveyness of the last three lines.
quote:
Originally posted by Alex Cockell:
quote:That'll be Michael W Smith's
Originally posted by ianjmatt:
I don't know if this has been mentioned, but someone sang this as a solo during a service this weekend:
Crucified
Laid behind a stone
You lived to die
Rejected and alone
Like a rose
Trampled on the ground
You took the fall
And thought of me
Above all
The verses are kind of meh but this chorus (accompanied by what sounded like a gear crunching modulation) just had me in stitches. It isn't just the crappy purple-ness of 'Like a Rose/Trampled on the ground" it is the vomit-inducing lovey-doveyness of the last three lines.
Above All.
quote:It doesn't really stand up to Victimae Paschali Laudes, does it?
Originally posted by ianjmatt:
I don't know if this has been mentioned, but someone sang this as a solo during a service this weekend:
Crucified
Laid behind a stone
You lived to die
Rejected and alone
Like a rose
Trampled on the ground
You took the fall
And thought of me
Above all
The verses are kind of meh but this chorus (accompanied by what sounded like a gear crunching modulation) just had me in stitches. It isn't just the crappy purple-ness of 'Like a Rose/Trampled on the ground" it is the vomit-inducing lovey-doveyness of the last three lines.
quote:Actually Paul Baloche, I think. And I, too, think it's awful, though I've a lot of time for some of the rest of Baloche's compostions.
Originally posted by Spike:
quote:
Originally posted by Alex Cockell:
quote:That'll be Michael W Smith's
Originally posted by ianjmatt:
I don't know if this has been mentioned, but someone sang this as a solo during a service this weekend:
Crucified
Laid behind a stone
You lived to die
Rejected and alone
Like a rose
Trampled on the ground
You took the fall
And thought of me
Above all
The verses are kind of meh but this chorus (accompanied by what sounded like a gear crunching modulation) just had me in stitches. It isn't just the crappy purple-ness of 'Like a Rose/Trampled on the ground" it is the vomit-inducing lovey-doveyness of the last three lines.
Above All.
quote:Yeah. It gets stuck in your brain for days on end. Until you. want. to. jump. out. a. window.
Originally posted by tomsk:
Thanks for that link Alex. The Jesus is a friend of mine video was quite a piece of archaeology, what with the matching outfits. Did sub-70's ska revival worship music catch on? In spite of the cringeworthy words it is annoyingly catchy.
quote:Thank God it was Catholic and not evangelical !
Originally posted by Paddy O'Furniture:
quote:Yeah. It gets stuck in your brain for days on end. Until you. want. to. jump. out. a. window.
Originally posted by tomsk:
Thanks for that link Alex. The Jesus is a friend of mine video was quite a piece of archaeology, what with the matching outfits. Did sub-70's ska revival worship music catch on? In spite of the cringeworthy words it is annoyingly catchy.
quote:This is worthy of a mention in here, if it hasn't been already. I'm a bad person, but I can't help associating "I'm special" with something a lot less PC.
quote by churchgeek:
quote:Oh dear God, if anything ever deserved the
Originally posted by Boogie:
He has them singing such songs as I'm special
And it's poorly written, too.
quote:My church choir had to record "I'm special" for someone who wanted to teach it to young teenagers at school - probably wasn't a good idea but he's still alive, so they must have been pretty tolerant teenagers. We (the choir) laughed ourselves silly.
Originally posted by OhSimone:
This is worthy of a mention in here, if it hasn't been already. I'm a bad person, but I can't help associating "I'm special" with something a lot less PC.
quote:Delusion is a terrible thing. Doesn't mean it can't be commented on.
Originally posted by Penny S:
It occurs to me that the authors of these pieces believe that they are doing something beautiful for God.
quote:I would be singing the last part of this song with a lot of gusto! Would I be allowed to make gestures to accompany the song?
Joshua Bell: One I heard recently (not used any more, thankfully):
Revelation, Revelation,
Twenty-one eight, twenty one eight,
Liars go to Hell, liars go to Hell,
Burn burn burn, burn burn burn.
(To the tune of Frere Jacques et al.)
quote:I'd like to think there's at least one that's not a cloying 1930s English Sunday School sing-along.
Originally posted by Baptist Trainfan:
Except for one thing: it rightly shows "saints" as ordinary Christians doing ordinary things. And there are very few other hymns that do that.
quote:If I had any song-writing skills I would. I'm sure that Lesbia Scott meant well, and it's a fine song for five-year-old children to sing (they are probably its originally intended audience). But much like "Jesus Loves Me This I know" or "Jesus Loves the Little Children," it holds little appeal to me as an adult.
Originally posted by Albertus:
You could try writing one, or adapting Ms Scott's.
quote:I'm fond of the newish hymn from the A & M stable:
Originally posted by Mockingale:
quote:I'd like to think there's at least one that's not a cloying 1930s English Sunday School sing-along.
Originally posted by Baptist Trainfan:
Except for one thing: it rightly shows "saints" as ordinary Christians doing ordinary things. And there are very few other hymns that do that.
quote:If it's all the same to you, I think I'd rather eat bees.
Originally posted by Chorister:
Once a year, on Education Sunday, all the choirs from the local schools get invited to church and sing all these songs in one go. You are all invited (next service this Sunday, 9.45am) to come along and sing your little hearts out. You know all the words now, they're all on this thread if you need reminding. A whole hour of CC&HH fun!
And boy, will you need the coffee afterwards. With an extra shot of morphine, no doubt (BYO).
quote:Oh of course there is. There's some piece of doggerel about one of the Welsh saints that includes something about "ffurfafen Eglwys Gymru" — the Church of Wales' firmament — I mean, renaming the Church is fine, as it's what it gets called half the time anyway, but I was not aware that amongst its glories was its own sky.
Originally posted by Theophania:
Is there nothing terrible written in Welsh?
quote:Definitely. The "holy Church as his creation and her teaching as his own" bit of "Firmly I believe and truly" (which I suspect I am far from alone in feeling more than a little bit uncomfortable about!) becomes "geiriau ei hathrawiaeth iachus ddwg im genadwri'r nef" — the words of her wholesome teaching will bring me to the mission of heaven.
Originally posted by Baptist Trainfan:
Perhaps some of the songs have been improved in the translation?
quote:Translating the whole thing into Welsh is not strictly necessary at that point; my own solution is simply to change the gender of the last pronoun, which neatly expresses my own position on the point, namely that, quite a lot of the time, the church makes it up as it/she goes along.
Originally posted by pererin:
The "holy Church as his creation and her teaching as his own" bit of "Firmly I believe and truly" (which I suspect I am far from alone in feeling more than a little bit uncomfortable about!)
quote:Yes, see here. Seasick made a hostly request for the tangent to come onto this thread.
Originally posted by Snags:
Am I going blind, or has the Gamaliel/Greatest Day thing come in from somewhere else?
quote:Reminds me of John Betjeman's An Eighteenth Century Calvinistic Hymn - which was at least meant as a parody!
Originally posted by Edith:
The one I remember as being the very worst seems to have been slightly modified in recent years. It's called:
Oh come and mourn with me awhile
It has a terrible verse about sitting under the cross while
'The blood falls gently on me
Drop by drop'
quote:Jesus take me as I am
Originally posted by Edith:
I've never heard of that one. Amazing. Please type out the chorus, it must rival the 'all the world is gay' one I mentioned above.
quote:Can you provide a link? I'd hate to miss out on something so dreadful.
Originally posted by Edith:
We had another of Fr Faber's best last Sunday
Oh purest of creatures...
V 5 is really dreadful.
What made him so obsessed
quote:It is here
Originally posted by Pigwidgeon:
quote:Can you provide a link? I'd hate to miss out on something so dreadful.
Originally posted by Edith:
We had another of Fr Faber's best last Sunday
Oh purest of creatures...
V 5 is really dreadful.
What made him so obsessed
quote:Just reading those words brings to mind guitars and jumpers and Scouse or Mancunian accents and the Mass setting they seem to use at my brother's (RC) parish church which I always think of as 'The Spinners in C'.
Originally posted by Oferyas:
I really don't think this is the worst Marian hymn I've seen, sorry!
The worst I've ever sung is thankfully nowhere on the web as far as I can tell. The first verse if I recall begins Mother Eve was walking in the garden, so they say, and the unforgettable chorus (I only heard it once when I was 17, and it has haunted me ever since) begins
You are my Star, my Star of the Sea,
over the ocean beckon to me.....
If I ever find a copy I'll post it, promise. Then I'll burn it. Even if it isn't mine....
quote:To me that hymn will always be "There's a Wideness in God's Trousers". Probably just me.
Originally posted by Albertus:
Indeed, tho' to be fair, and to his great credit, he did also write There's a Wideness in God's Mercy
quote:Lo, the Lord shall come in triumph and glory upon the earth. And He shall stand before all peoples of the earth and shall say:
Originally posted by Aravis:
I've just discovered the joys of the "in Memoriam" column in the local paper. Maybe some of the "poems" it contains should be set to music??
My favourite lines last week were from a memorial poem for the person's deceased mother's birthday:
"Look out for Jesus,
He's coming soon,
With all our best wishes
And a big bunch of balloons"
quote:I really love that song! Except for the sickening last line:
Originally posted by Helen-Eva:
quote:To me that hymn will always be "There's a Wideness in God's Trousers". Probably just me.
Originally posted by Albertus:
Indeed, tho' to be fair, and to his great credit, he did also write There's a Wideness in God's Mercy
