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Source: (consider it)
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Thread: Protestant at a Catholic school?
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St Deird
Shipmate
# 7631
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Posted
I'm currently researching primary schools for my son, and am very interested in the local Catholic school. It, however, is not as interested in ME: its website assumes that all students would be Catholics (fairly reasonably).
So, two questions:
1) Protestants - would you have any concerns about sending your child to a Catholic school?
2) Catholics - would you consider it reasonable for a non- Catholic student to attend a Catholic school?
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They're not hobbies; they're a robust post-apocalyptic skill-set.
Posts: 319 | From: the other side of nowhere | Registered: Jun 2004
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Amanda B. Reckondwythe
Dressed for Church
# 5521
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Posted
I taught for two years at a Catholic high school and had a Quaker boy in class. His father believed he'd get a better education there than in the public school. He used to love to argue theology with me and was actually a delight to have in class.
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"I take prayer too seriously to use it as an excuse for avoiding work and responsibility." -- The Revd Martin Luther King Jr.
Posts: 10542 | From: The Great Southwest | Registered: Feb 2004
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Zacchaeus
Shipmate
# 14454
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Posted
In my experience it depends on the individual school.When we were looking at schools for my childrne the local RC school didn't taken non RC children
you may be best going to see and talking to the school.
Posts: 1905 | From: the back of beyond | Registered: Jan 2009
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jacobsen
seeker
# 14998
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Posted
The private nun-run RC prep school I attended did accept non-catholics (as they were then called.) There seemed to be some idea that they might be converted, but I suspect that the fees had more to do with it.
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But God, holding a candle, looks for all who wander, all who search. - Shifra Alon
Beauty fades, dumb is forever-Judge Judy
The man who made time, made plenty.
Posts: 8040 | From: Æbleskiver country | Registered: Aug 2009
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LeRoc
Famous Dutch pirate
# 3216
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Posted
Hmm, if we start by getting 500 children in Catholic schools, and each of them manages to revert 5 Catholics from their papist ways ...
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I know why God made the rhinoceros, it's because He couldn't see the rhinoceros, so He made the rhinoceros to be able to see it. (Clarice Lispector)
Posts: 9474 | From: Brazil / Africa | Registered: Aug 2002
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Curiosity killed ...
Ship's Mug
# 11770
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Posted
The joint Catholic primary school where I did part of my teaching practice put all the RC children through their first communion preparation and service and had weekly assemblies led by a priest with communion catholic style - standing with tongue stuck out.
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Mugs - Keep the Ship afloat
Posts: 13794 | From: outiside the outer ring road | Registered: Aug 2006
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venbede
Shipmate
# 16669
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Posted
My sister went to a Convent School fifty years ago. It was common in England for middle class parents who didn't want to send their daughters to a state school.
The nuns were educational Robin Hoods who took the fees from middle class protestants to give a free catholic education to poorer catholic girls.
I don't think the same applied to boys schools.
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Man was made for joy and woe;
And when this we rightly know,
Thro' the world we safely go.
Posts: 3201 | From: An historic market town nestling in the folds of Surrey's rolling North Downs, | Registered: Sep 2011
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la vie en rouge
Parisienne
# 10688
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Posted
Possibly a slightly different set-up, but a very high percentage of private schools in France are Catholic. Many, if not most of the families who send their children there are not Catholic, but choose these schools because they think their children are going to get a better education in a nicer environment.
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Rent my holiday home in the South of France
Posts: 3696 | Registered: Nov 2005
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Offeiriad
Ship's Arboriculturalist
# 14031
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Posted
Our son went to an RC primary for some years. They involved him as fully as they could, even letting him serve at Mass.
Some of the older nuns were slightly nonplussed when they asked the children what their fathers did for a living, and he announced that his father was a priest! ![[Eek!]](eek.gif)
Posts: 1426 | From: La France profonde | Registered: Aug 2008
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Albertus
Shipmate
# 13356
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Posted
'Well, dear, I'm sure you're not the only one, but most of them think it's not something to advertise...' ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
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My beard is a testament to my masculinity and virility, and demonstrates that I am a real man. Trouble is, bits of quiche sometimes get caught in it.
Posts: 6498 | From: Y Sowth | Registered: Jan 2008
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Kitten
Shipmate
# 1179
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Posted
My eldest Grandson is from a protestant family and started his education at a RC primary school, they accepted him upon receipt of a letter from our minister that he attended Church regularly (Methodist) and proof of baptism. The school seemed the best fit for him amongst the schools in the catchment area, the other being a school that had a rough reputation.
They have now moved to a different area and he attends a non faith primary as does his little brother. Although there is a faith school in their current catchment area (Anglican), study of the prospectuses seemed to show this school would be a better fit for them, and it has prooved so, it is an excellent school and both are doing well.
He seems to be getting a better grounding in Christianity at the non faith school than he did at the RC one, as well as learing about other faiths and traditions.
Although the RC school did teach him, at age 4, the correct way to address a bishop when one enters the room.
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Maius intra qua extra
Never accept a ride from a stranger, unless they are in a big blue box
Posts: 2330 | From: Carmarthenshire | Registered: Aug 2001
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Baptist Trainfan
Shipmate
# 15128
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Posted
In our town there are several CofE primary schools, but the only Church-run secondary is Catholic. Lots of Christians from across the denominations send their children there.
It's not so much the Evangelical ones who have trouble with the school but the more Liberal Christians as the school is pretty traditionalist in its moral teachings.
Posts: 9750 | From: The other side of the Severn | Registered: Sep 2009
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mark_in_manchester
not waving, but...
# 15978
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Posted
Our kids are at an RC primary, which is attached to what I suppose is a slightly charismatic inner city RC church. A lot of the staff are Christians, kids come home singing 'I am a C' etc, kids instituted grace in our family at mealtimes, they learn a lot of bible stories in class...it's been really good. We go to a small Methodist church which is ageing and where we're in a very small cultural minority, and the school, RC church youth club etc have really made Christianity 'normal' for our kids in a way which might not have been possible otherwise.
Those teachers who are more into Our Lady of this and that happen to be very welcoming, and keen to explain stuff in ways which might make sense to a Prod ('...so she points to Jesus...'etc). I support things at the RC church too - it seems right given their welcome of us - and there I have encountered the odd burst of not-very-thinking-denominational-bias (as well as some very thoughtful and fruitful sharing at other times) which one might expect the other way around for an RC in an evangelical setting. But never at the school; ISTM that the staff are pleased to be teaching kids who are part of a family of active Christians, wherever they come from.
I'd certainly go and talk to the head of your school - the rules say the head at least must be a practising Catholic, and they'll be able to talk to you sensibly about this stuff.
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"We are punished by our sins, not for them" - Elbert Hubbard
(so good, I wanted to see it after my posts and not only after those of shipmate JBohn from whom I stole it)
Posts: 1596 | Registered: Oct 2010
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mark_in_manchester
not waving, but...
# 15978
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Posted
Oh - to just add - my kids go to a lot of school masses, but just go forward for a blessing. About 1/3 to 1/2 of the class are probably in this category.
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"We are punished by our sins, not for them" - Elbert Hubbard
(so good, I wanted to see it after my posts and not only after those of shipmate JBohn from whom I stole it)
Posts: 1596 | Registered: Oct 2010
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L'organist
Shipmate
# 17338
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Posted
It all depends on the school: where I live there are plenty of RC primaries, nearly all of which are Voluntary Aided so the staff are all RC and there is a lot of religious (mainly RC) input; by contrast, most of the primaries that are badged CofE are Voluntary Controlled, which means the LEA appoints teachers and the children don't necessarily get much, if any, Christian input. A number of CofE parents therefore choose an RC school over the CofE one because they find there is a more obvious Christian ethos in a VA school.
At secondary level this changes because the RC comprehensive is VC and the CofE is VA.
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Rara temporum felicitate ubi sentire quae velis et quae sentias dicere licet
Posts: 4950 | From: somewhere in England... | Registered: Sep 2012
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Baptist Trainfan
Shipmate
# 15128
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Posted
This discussion must be totally incomprehensible to non-Brits!
Posts: 9750 | From: The other side of the Severn | Registered: Sep 2009
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cliffdweller
Shipmate
# 13338
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Baptist Trainfan:
This discussion must be totally incomprehensible to non-Brits!
How so? Lots of conversations on the Ship have certainly eluded this non-CofE, non-Brit, but this isn't one of them. The OP is very much a dilemma faced by many American parents as well for the exact same reasons as have been discussed here. It's particularly the case in inner-city neighborhoods with crappy state schools, often in those cases the RC schools are the only affordable alternative.
[ 04. November 2015, 13:06: Message edited by: cliffdweller ]
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"Here is the world. Beautiful and terrible things will happen. Don't be afraid." -Frederick Buechner
Posts: 11242 | From: a small canyon overlooking the city | Registered: Jan 2008
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Baptist Trainfan
Shipmate
# 15128
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Posted
No, that's not what I was meaning. My point was the difference between "Voluntary Aided" and "Voluntary Controlled" church schools, neither of which I think correspond in any way to the American model of "Christian schools".
By the way the distinction is not understood by lots of Brits, too!
Posts: 9750 | From: The other side of the Severn | Registered: Sep 2009
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Gramps49
Shipmate
# 16378
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Posted
The fact is most Roman Catholic schools have Protestant teachers now. About the only difference one will find is when it comes to Religious classes. Now I know that the American system and the English system differs here. The Religion classes will generally be taught by a nun or a priest and the students will be getting Roman Catholic teachings. About the only difference a parent will note, though, is when they talk about the Real Presence in the Mass and maybe when it comes to church hierarchy.
Non Roman Catholics will have to pay a higher tuition--at least in the American system.
I guess I would ask about student discipline--what their approach would be. Thankfully, most schools have more enlightened about this, but there are still different approaches to student discipline. I would want one that is more in line with my own parenting philosophy. That way there would be more consistency for the student. If both parent and school are on the same page when it comes to discipline the results are much better.
Another concern is science. Do they have the facilities to present science in an engaging way? Often times private schools do not have the financial wherewithal to have the best equipment for the student. Of all the private school systems out there I think Roman Catholic schools will present science in a positive way as opposed to "evangelical" schools which lean more to creationism.
In short, I would have no problem sending my children to Roman Catholic schools if they can meet the educational standards of the public schools (they generally exceed them). I believe the students will get proper discipline that will encourage continued, life long learning.
Posts: 2193 | From: Pullman WA | Registered: Apr 2011
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Baptist Trainfan
Shipmate
# 15128
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Gramps49:
The fact is most Roman Catholic schools have Protestant teachers now.
Indeed. The wife of one of our local Vicars happily teaches at a Catholic Primary school. But - I'm not sure about this - she may have had to get some kind of RC "certificate" first.
Posts: 9750 | From: The other side of the Severn | Registered: Sep 2009
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Baptist Trainfan
Shipmate
# 15128
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Gramps49:
In short, I would have no problem sending my children to Roman Catholic schools if they can meet the educational standards of the public schools (they generally exceed them). I believe the students will get proper discipline that will encourage continued, life long learning.
In our town, the RD Secondary school is the "second best" and is quite near the "best" school.
Some Christian parents send their children to the RC school by choice, valuing its principles and nurture. However I suspect that, for other parents, it's the back-up choice, to be taken up if they aren't offered a place in the "best" school.
Posts: 9750 | From: The other side of the Severn | Registered: Sep 2009
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Albertus
Shipmate
# 13356
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Posted
One of my brother's contemporaries, in Kent back in the 80s, was sent to the local RC secondary by her parents (mother practising CofE, father I don't think anything) because they were socialists who didn't approve of selection at 11: we still had the 11 Plus but the RC schools had gone comprehensive.
Posts: 6498 | From: Y Sowth | Registered: Jan 2008
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no prophet's flag is set so...
Proceed to see sea
# 15560
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Posted
In western Canada, under the acts which created the provinces, both RC schools and public schools are supported by taxation and provincial departments of education. It comes up a lot here that non-RC children attend these "separate schools". The most recent is immigrant children from all over Africa and the Middle-East, India. I hope it helps these schools to have to diversify.
To illustrate one of the problems with the RC approach to "lifestyles education" and "values", I will tell a brief story, which I consider partly a cautionary tale and years later, amusing. The neighbour's child and our's played together a lot. The neighbour child attended the RC school, ours the public. This child asked mine where babies came from. My child answered all of the questions as asked. Thus the neighbour child came to understand about penises, vaginas, that one goes into the other, masturbation, periods, "Filipino tubes", "testtubials" and organ functions, pregnancy and birth. The neighbour child then informed several other children at the RC school, and ultimately 2 classes of 10 year old children (grade 4) came to understand rather openly about reproduction. This upset the RC school and a mini-scandal ensued. My wife, bless her heart, told the RC school principal (head teacher) who had the testubials to call us that if the information was accurate that the problem was entirely their's and good day. (BTW, we are 20+ years later good friends with these neighbours.)
We also noticed with subsequent discussion with the neighbours that RC approaches depended greatly on the specific teachers. I felt from speaking to them, that the RC students may miss out on the diversity of ideas and beliefs, and may at times fearfully prevent access by young minds to controversial issues. This is antithetical in my mind to being confident about one's own values and opinions, such that in the grown-up world you can discuss freely and defend your values and ideals well.
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Out of this nettle, danger, we pluck this flower, safety.
\_(ツ)_/
Posts: 11498 | From: Treaty 6 territory in the nonexistant Province of Buffalo, Canada ↄ⃝' | Registered: Mar 2010
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Tubbs
Miss Congeniality
# 440
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by St Deird:
I'm currently researching primary schools for my son, and am very interested in the local Catholic school. It, however, is not as interested in ME: its website assumes that all students would be Catholics (fairly reasonably).
So, two questions:
1) Protestants - would you have any concerns about sending your child to a Catholic school?
2) Catholics - would you consider it reasonable for a non- Catholic student to attend a Catholic school?
Ask the parents at nursery with older children as they may be able to give you an idea of how likely it is that a non-Catholic will get into the school.
It really depends.
Some schools have a big enough in-take that each year is a mixture of church attendance in that specific kind of church, people in the catchment area and other church goers.
Others are so over subscribed if you can't produce a letter from your local vicar that says you're the Right Kind of Super Christian, there's no point bothering.
The booklet you get from the Local Authority when you're due to apply tells you if there is any additional application criteria for faith schools. Most require some sort of form. There may also be limits on the number of schools you can apply for on faith grounds. Some only let you apply for one whilst others will let you apply for loads.
Good luck!
Tubbs
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"It's better to keep your mouth shut and be thought a fool than open it up and remove all doubt" - Dennis Thatcher. My blog. Decide for yourself which I am
Posts: 12701 | From: Someplace strange | Registered: Jun 2001
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Fr Weber
Shipmate
# 13472
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Posted
The mix of Catholic & non-Catholic teachers varies from school to school. Practically every RC parochial school that I know of has at least some non-Catholics as teachers.
There is a more concerted effort within the last several years to prevent teachers from undercutting Catholic doctrine, though. +Cordileone in San Francisco recently laid down some strict guidelines about what teachers in the archdiocese's Catholic schools are allowed to teach, and even how they conduct themselves in their public life outside of school, offending many San Franciscans who apparently had not realized the archbishop was Catholic.
Snark aside, one thing you might want to look into is whether the doctrinal and moral emphasis of the RC schools align with what you want your child to be taught.
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"The Eucharist is not a play, and you're not Jesus."
--Sr Theresa Koernke, IHM
Posts: 2512 | From: Oakland, CA | Registered: Feb 2008
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cliffdweller
Shipmate
# 13338
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Baptist Trainfan:
No, that's not what I was meaning. My point was the difference between "Voluntary Aided" and "Voluntary Controlled" church schools, neither of which I think correspond in any way to the American model of "Christian schools".
By the way the distinction is not understood by lots of Brits, too!
Ah, yes, I have no idea what that means... thankfully so?
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"Here is the world. Beautiful and terrible things will happen. Don't be afraid." -Frederick Buechner
Posts: 11242 | From: a small canyon overlooking the city | Registered: Jan 2008
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Forthview
Shipmate
# 12376
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Posted
In Scotland RC schools (about 20% of all schools) are completely integrated into state system and are, in theory, open to all.
Catholic bishops are allowed to vet those teachers who claim to be Catholic but not those who do not claim to be Catholic. Such vetting used to be quite strict in the past, but not now.
The only state sponsored all girls school in Scotland is Notre Dame in Glasgow.Many years ago it was a 'corporation/town council run but fee paying school' run by the sisters of Notre Dame de Namur. Nowadays girls wear up to date versions of the old school uniform - Moslem girls in various stages of all over cover and Western girls in various stages of undress.
Catholic schools have all sorts of teachers with all sorts of views, just as do non-Catholic schools. Catholic schools are valued by those who are Catholic and by others who value their sense of community and good pastoral care. Of course ,as with any other organisations, there are sometimes things which go wrong.
Posts: 3444 | From: Edinburgh | Registered: Feb 2007
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Pomona
Shipmate
# 17175
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Posted
State faith schools in England at least (VC or VA) must accept some pupils outside of that faith. Quite normal in my experience for Muslim parents to send their children to church schools, RC more than CoE in my experience but it may vary.
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Consider the work of God: Who is able to straighten what he has bent? [Ecclesiastes 7:13]
Posts: 5319 | From: UK | Registered: Jun 2012
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John Holding
Coffee and Cognac
# 158
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by no prophet's flag is set so...:
In western Canada, under the acts which created the provinces, both RC schools and public schools are supported by taxation and provincial departments of education.
Sorry, that's not so. In Manitoba when I lived there in the 1950s and 60s, the RC system was completely privately funded, with fees. Many, perhaps most, RC kids attended the public schools.
Since that time, the system has changed and the RC (and Jewish and Muslim and...) are supported by the taxpayer. But that is a modern innovation, it was not part of the system created by the Manitoba Act of 1869(?). (Indeed, under the Manitoba Act and until well into the 1940s, schools were also compelled to teach everything in English -- a provision ignored in most French areas of the province unless a schools inspector was seen in the distance.)
John
Posts: 5929 | From: Ottawa, Canada | Registered: May 2001
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no prophet's flag is set so...
Proceed to see sea
# 15560
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Posted
It's true for Sask and Alberta. BC's are not under the same constitutional requirements but there are separate schools. I'm afraid we generally don't think of Manitoba, except as the bridge to the east. Ontario is east for us.
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Out of this nettle, danger, we pluck this flower, safety.
\_(ツ)_/
Posts: 11498 | From: Treaty 6 territory in the nonexistant Province of Buffalo, Canada ↄ⃝' | Registered: Mar 2010
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Sober Preacher's Kid
Presbymethegationalist
# 12699
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Posted
![[Disappointed]](graemlins/disappointed.gif)
John, John, John.... Manitoba Schools Question?
Manitoba certainly is under Section 93 as incorporated into the Manitoba Act of 1870; the requirement was also incorporated into the Saskatchewan and Alberta Acts as it existed in the Northwest Territories Act too.
Manitoba just chose to ignore it and Parliament chose to do nothing about it.
-10 points for forgetting Canadian History.
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NDP Federal Convention Ottawa 2018: A random assortment of Prots and Trots.
Posts: 7646 | From: Peterborough, Upper Canada | Registered: Jun 2007
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la vie en rouge
Parisienne
# 10688
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Posted
Now I think about it… my university housemate came from a fairly deprived part of Sunderland where the local comprehensive schools were rather rough. Advice on school choices at the beginning of secondary was this: are you a lapsed Catholic (her mother was Italian)? Get your backside to mass and become an unlapsed one for a while so your daughter can get a place in that nice Catholic girls’ school with the nuns. She will be much happier there.
The result of going back to mass was that my housemate had a conversion experience in her teens and ended up becoming a fervent charismatic Catholic.
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Rent my holiday home in the South of France
Posts: 3696 | Registered: Nov 2005
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Gramps49
Shipmate
# 16378
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Posted
I think most RC schools now have pretty good, though conservative, sex education programs. That is not saying all of them do. I believe it has to do with the dioceses/parish/administration positions. I do know, given the recent sex scandals, the schools are being mandated to teach healthy boundaries/don't touch/report anything.
As far as protestant teacher certification is concerned, it is basically a promise that s/he will not dispute RC positions in class plush a thorough background check. Recently a few same sex teachers have gotten married to their partners in the US which has resulted in the teacher's dismissal from RC schools. However, the reactions of RC high school students have been interesting--they have pushed for reinstatement of the dismissed teachers.
Posts: 2193 | From: Pullman WA | Registered: Apr 2011
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Anselmina
Ship's barmaid
# 3032
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Posted
My cousin sends her kids to the Roman Catholic primary in her part of Co Antrim; she's in a 'mixed' marriage. It has a good reputation and has a fair number of Protestant kids at it. I believe the ethos is basically Catholic, which seems to be okay with parents - not surprisingly, of course. But there were complaints - from both Catholic and non-Catholic parents - on the day a local priest lectured parents and kids during a school event on how non-Catholics were probably going to hell. I can't imagine he put it quite as bluntly as that! But apparently parents and teachers were up in arms, however it was phrased, so I don't think this guy's pastoral approach to eduction could be considered typical of that particular school's spiritual formation of their youngsters!
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Irish dogs needing homes! http://www.dogactionwelfaregroup.ie/ Greyhounds and Lurchers are shipped over to England for rehoming too!
Posts: 10002 | From: Scotland the Brave | Registered: Jul 2002
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Ronald Binge
Shipmate
# 9002
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Anselmina:
My cousin sends her kids to the Roman Catholic primary in her part of Co Antrim; she's in a 'mixed' marriage. It has a good reputation and has a fair number of Protestant kids at it. I believe the ethos is basically Catholic, which seems to be okay with parents - not surprisingly, of course. But there were complaints - from both Catholic and non-Catholic parents - on the day a local priest lectured parents and kids during a school event on how non-Catholics were probably going to hell. I can't imagine he put it quite as bluntly as that! But apparently parents and teachers were up in arms, however it was phrased, so I don't think this guy's pastoral approach to eduction could be considered typical of that particular school's spiritual formation of their youngsters!
Dear God.
That must be a Northern thing.
I spent most of my primary and all of my secondary education in Catholic schools in or near Dublin, and never heard anything as cracked as that from any priest. I did have an ultra conservative teacher once, in fourth class, but even she never offered dumb opinions on "non-Catholics". She did call Franco a "great man" though, but that's another story..
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Older, bearded (but no wiser)
Posts: 477 | From: Brexit's frontline | Registered: Jan 2005
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Forthview
Shipmate
# 12376
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Posted
In a long connection with both Catholic schools and (what are called in Scotland) non-denominational schools I have never heard of a Catholic priest saying Protestants would probably go to Hell.
I have occasionally heard of Catholic children and adults wondering if those who were not Catholic would be saved, just as I have heard Protestant children and adults, even ministers ,doubting that Catholics would be saved if they had not accepted Jesus Christ as their personal Saviour. These ideas are, fortunately, nowadays rarely encountered.
All schools in Scotland are expected to provide some form of religious education. In some of the schools the religious element is Catholicism which underpins the corporate life of the school.They are not 'separate' schools, any more than there are separate schools in town and in the country . Some schools are large and some schools are small. Some schools provide information
about the Catholic religion and some schools don't. Like the two or three schools which operate under the control of the Scottish Episcopal church and the one in Glasgow which instructs its children in the Jewish religion they are all schools which are maintained by the local authorities for the benefit of the children of taxpayers, who can ask for a particular religion to be given prominence in that school, if there are sufficient parents who wish it.
Posts: 3444 | From: Edinburgh | Registered: Feb 2007
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Sober Preacher's Kid
Presbymethegationalist
# 12699
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Posted
Sorry if the Canadians are talking past everyone, but the Constitution Act, 1867 contains a unique provision, Section 93. Under that provision, Ontario, Saskatchewan and Alberta are obliged to provide funding for "Separate", that is Catholic, schools "as they existed at Confederation".
Quebec used to be under the same provision, but bailed out in 1998. Newfoundland had a unique denominational school system until 1997 too, but they ended that.
Separate schools are fully tax-supported on an equal basis with public schools.
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NDP Federal Convention Ottawa 2018: A random assortment of Prots and Trots.
Posts: 7646 | From: Peterborough, Upper Canada | Registered: Jun 2007
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VirginiaKneeling
Apprentice
# 18414
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Posted
We sent our daughter to Catholic high school in a neighboring city for several reasons, one of them being that she was the youngest in her class and we felt she might be lost in the gigantic local public high school. The Catholic school had under 500 students at the time as opposed to 1500 at the public high school. Also we were pretty dismayed at the education her older brother was getting at the public high school and she was a stellar student; we felt she would do better academically elsewhere but our options were limited. She has told me many times since that she's glad we did it, although there was some grumbling at the time. In fact, at the time they were living in that city, she considered sending her boys to the neighborhood Catholic school, and it was only because the local public school was so good that she didn't. I think if you can answer any questions your child might have about religious differences that come up and have honest discussions about them, the main focus should be on the educational advantages of the school. My daughter's high school had a limit of how many Protestants they accepted, and the tuition was higher, but it was definitely worth it to us. And she told me once that the religion classes made her a better Episcopalian.....
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Inasmuch as ye have done it to one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me..
Posts: 11 | From: Virginia, USA | Registered: May 2015
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Forthview
Shipmate
# 12376
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Posted
Sorry, SPK, if I complained about the term 'separate schools'. It is a term which is often used in Scotland, mainly by those who oppose the existence of Catholic schools.
It tends to emphasise the impression that some people have, that Catholics are somehow different from others. In fact they are mostly just the same as others , with proportions of good and kind people as well as those who are sly and hypocritical.
Although the term 'separate' schools is often used in Scotland, the official term used for a long time , though no longer, was 'transferred' schools. This avoided using publicly the term 'Catholic' and referred to the fact that Catholic schools were transferred in 1918 to the control of the state. Schools organised by many other Christian denominations, mainly the Church of Scotland, were transferred to state control about 1874.
Although we are all a mix of good and not so good, each one of us is a separate and unique individual, loved from the moment of conception by our creator, God.
Posts: 3444 | From: Edinburgh | Registered: Feb 2007
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Corvo
Shipmate
# 15220
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Posted
My (Anglican) children went to a catholic primary school (in England). It was a very good experience. My children had no idea they were 'different' until preparation for first communion began then they began to feel a bit excluded. Our vicar was sympathetic and it began the process in our parish of admitting children to communion 'before confirmation' which is now the norm here.
Posts: 672 | From: The Most Holy Trinity, Coach Lane, North Shields | Registered: Oct 2009
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SvitlanaV2
Shipmate
# 16967
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Posted
I was just wondering how many children from non-Catholic families can attend a school before it ceases to feel like a Catholic school. How many non-Catholic teachers?
Perhaps there's a sort of attractive Catholic ethos or atmosphere that requires very few actual Catholics in order to manifest itself. In fact, if there are too many Catholics the appeal might decline. This 'Catholic ethos' must be a very marketable thing if the balance is right.
Posts: 6668 | From: UK | Registered: Feb 2012
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Anselmina
Ship's barmaid
# 3032
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Ronald Binge:
quote:
Originally posted by Anselmina:
My cousin sends her kids to the Roman Catholic primary in her part of Co Antrim; she's in a 'mixed' marriage. It has a good reputation and has a fair number of Protestant kids at it. I believe the ethos is basically Catholic, which seems to be okay with parents - not surprisingly, of course. But there were complaints - from both Catholic and non-Catholic parents - on the day a local priest lectured parents and kids during a school event on how non-Catholics were probably going to hell. I can't imagine he put it quite as bluntly as that! But apparently parents and teachers were up in arms, however it was phrased, so I don't think this guy's pastoral approach to eduction could be considered typical of that particular school's spiritual formation of their youngsters!
Dear God.
That must be a Northern thing.
I spent most of my primary and all of my secondary education in Catholic schools in or near Dublin, and never heard anything as cracked as that from any priest. I did have an ultra conservative teacher once, in fourth class, but even she never offered dumb opinions on "non-Catholics". She did call Franco a "great man" though, but that's another story..
Well, as I said it was probably an unfortunate one-off that was regretted by mostly everybody! In fact, my grandfather went to the same primary school, too. And he still managed to find his way into both the Orange and Black Orders as an adult; ironically, leaving the Lodge when his son married a Roman Catholic. How mixed up is that?! Particularly, when he personally didn't have a problem with the marriage. So maybe it is a North thing?
I think there's a small number of children from non-Christian faiths attending, too. But that would be very, very small indeed.
When I lived in the Republic of Ireland, I wasn't generally aware of any problems of the Protestant kids attending Catholic (or state) primary schools. But we were fairly close knitted rural communities where religion didn't quite divide us as it might have done in other areas - possibly.
Secondary education, however, was a bit more complex. But that's not part of the OP.
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Irish dogs needing homes! http://www.dogactionwelfaregroup.ie/ Greyhounds and Lurchers are shipped over to England for rehoming too!
Posts: 10002 | From: Scotland the Brave | Registered: Jul 2002
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Banner Lady
Ship's Ensign
# 10505
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Posted
Here, Catholic schools endeavour to have around a quarter of their student intake non-Catholic.
The curriculum and school culture are inclusive. But a lot depends on the attitude of the priest or chaplain in charge of the school services. Over the years we have experienced hostile exclusion, disinterest, and wonderful support and joyous welcome as each of our four children in turn and now a grandson attended the same Catholic Primary school.
So my advice would be to attend a school mass as an observer, and maybe speak to some other parents there. If the priest is approachable, then make an appointment with him for a chat. You'll soon find out his attitude. At the moment we could not be happier with our grandson's school experience.
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Women in the church are not a problem to be solved, but a mystery to be enjoyed.
Posts: 7080 | From: Canberra Australia | Registered: Oct 2005
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SvitlanaV2
Shipmate
# 16967
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Banner Lady:
Here, Catholic schools endeavour to have around a quarter of their student intake non-Catholic.
Do they give a particular reason for this?
Posts: 6668 | From: UK | Registered: Feb 2012
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Cod
Shipmate
# 2643
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Posted
My children are at the local RC school. RC schools here have a strong reputation for adding value, although my observation is that the school my children attend is no better or worse academically than the surrounding state schools.
The RC ethos is very strong and highly emphasised. There is very, very little nonsense in the playground as far as I know, and I haven't heard of any bullying. The RE is very well taught and not overpoweringly Catholic - there is little for an Anglican to object to, although one does notice little things- like one of my kids being told that her parish church was the school RC parish church - not the Anglican church she actually goes to - non-Catholic stuff tends to be treated as if it doesn't exist (which rather reflects the RC church generally). This is a minor quibble though - I'm very grateful for how the school has been able to introduce my kids to philosophical concepts via the RE.
A lot of the staff are not RC, although I think many if not most are Christian of other denominations.
It feeds into sex-segregated high schools. The girls' school has a good academic reputation, although it is laughingly said locally that its pupils have a terrible reputation for promiscuity.
What my children's school teach their pupils on pubertal changes and reproduction is wholly inadequate. Until very recently, they didn't even teach the 11 year olds about periods, and the lessons on reproduction even now are all about what happens from conception, thus avoiding all the dangerous stuff like shagging, contraception and abortion.
On the whole I'm happy enough with the school.
Posts: 4229 | From: New Zealand | Registered: Apr 2002
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Banner Lady
Ship's Ensign
# 10505
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by SvitlanaV2:
quote:
Originally posted by Banner Lady:
Here, Catholic schools endeavour to have around a quarter of their student intake non-Catholic.
Do they give a particular reason for this?
The focus has changed from "looking after our own" to being places of outreach into their local community. This does not mean concerted prosleytising of non-Catholic students - that would create community backlash - but there is now a culture of openness and explanation of Catholic values (not Catholic doctrine). Pinned up on the outside wall of the main play area in the school is a list of these "values to live by".
I doubt any parent, Christian or non-Christian would object to any of them as they are all positive and encouraging. The Christian theology in them is traceable but inoffensive. There is no bullying at the school, and our grandsons behaviour has improved a great deal since attending it.
Non Catholic students watch their classmates preparing for Reconciliation and their First Mass, and take a support role alongside the teachers. The rite is explained but no pressure is applied towards the non Catholic or unbaptised to also undertake the rite. We would be quite happy for our grandson to do it, and so would he, but his parents are not. The school has not pressured them or him at all.
It may be different where you are, which is why it might be instructive to check out the school church services and the attitude of the priest.
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Women in the church are not a problem to be solved, but a mystery to be enjoyed.
Posts: 7080 | From: Canberra Australia | Registered: Oct 2005
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SvitlanaV2
Shipmate
# 16967
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Posted
I don't know what the policy is in my city, but the impression I get with RC schools (as well as CofE schools) in the country generally is that demand at least partially drives the selection policy.
What this means is that where there is a high demand for places among RCs religious requirements appear to come into play for prospective pupils. When the demand comes mostly from non-Catholics, a school may end up with a largely non-Catholic, and even a non-Christian, intake. This is my experience, anyway.
It would be interesting to know if and how the arrival of lots of Polish RC families in a good number of British towns and cities has modified the selection policies of the RC schools there.
Posts: 6668 | From: UK | Registered: Feb 2012
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Rev per Minute
Shipmate
# 69
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Zacchaeus:
In my experience it depends on the individual school.When we were looking at schools for my childrne the local RC school didn't taken non RC children
you may be best going to see and talking to the school.
If the OP comes from England or Wales (still a shared legal basis for education, though not for much longer), then RC state schools are not allowed to exclude non-Catholics. They can give preference to RC children, but are generally required to allow high-priority children (those 'looked after', those with special needs, etc.) admission first. I believe that even academies and 'free schools' ![[Projectile]](graemlins/puke2.gif) , along with academically selective schools, have to follow similar requirements.
As a survivor of a Catholic comprehensive (now attended by my niece and nephew), we had a number of non-Catholics in school. The only obvious difference was that they were allowed to miss Mass on saints' days and were exempt from the sweep to get congregants for weekly 'voluntary' Mass ![[Confused]](confused.gif)
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"Allons-y!" "Geronimo!" "Oh, for God's sake!" The Day of the Doctor
At the end of the day, we face our Maker alongside Jesus. RIP ken
Posts: 2696 | From: my desk (if I can find the keyboard under this mess) | Registered: May 2001
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Ferijen
Shipmate
# 4719
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Posted
In my RC sixth form, they had two beliefs they could deal with: RC, and Muslim. They weren't quite sure what to do with me, particularly when I announced my dad was a priest and his former girlfriend a nun. (She was also a former nun, and at that time a priest). ![[Snigger]](graemlins/snigger.gif)
On balance they decided I was closer to RC, as a musician I'd be involved in masses and whilst I never sought out communion, the chaplain would usually come over and say 'just take it'.
Posts: 3259 | From: UK | Registered: Jul 2003
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Talitha
Shipmate
# 5085
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Posted
My daughter goes to an RC primary school, and we're very happy with it.
We go to a Baptist church, but I figure Catholic beliefs are closer to ours than secular ones are ![[Smile]](smile.gif)
Posts: 554 | From: Cambridge, UK | Registered: Oct 2003
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