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Source: (consider it)
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Thread: The Only Real Game: Baseball 2016
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Hedgehog
Ship's Shortstop
# 14125
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Posted
quote:
The only real game in the world, I think, is baseball.
--Babe Ruth, in his "Babe Ruth Day Speech" at Yankee Stadium, April 27, 1947
Pitchers and catchers report this week, the official start of Spring Training.
Any thoughts for the start of the season? The early Las Vegas odds favor (of all teams) the Chicago Cubs. But, of course, at this time last year the odds favored the Washington Nationals to win it all--and they didn't even make the playoffs! The Cubs are in the same division with the St. Louis Cardinals and Pittsburgh Pirates, so if they make it, you can't say they didn't earn it!
There is another interesting development this year, as this is scheduled to be the debut year of Euro League Baseball, featuring teams from Amsterdam, Bologna, Bonn, Brno, Munich-Haar, Regensburg, Rotterdam, Rouen, San Marino and Senart. It might be fun to follow that this year as well!
For myself, my Phillies are still in rebuilding mode, but I have hopes that they will win more than they did last year. To be fair, it will be tough to lose more...
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"We must regain the conviction that we need one another, that we have a shared responsibility for others and the world, and that being good and decent are worth it."--Pope Francis, Laudato Si'
Posts: 2740 | From: Delaware, USA | Registered: Sep 2008
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Hedgehog
Ship's Shortstop
# 14125
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Posted
In USA Today today, they presented their projections for the 2016 season.
I am not sure what shocks me more: that they think the Cubbies will win more than 100 games, or that they think three teams in the NL will lose 100 games!
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"We must regain the conviction that we need one another, that we have a shared responsibility for others and the world, and that being good and decent are worth it."--Pope Francis, Laudato Si'
Posts: 2740 | From: Delaware, USA | Registered: Sep 2008
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Sioni Sais
Shipmate
# 5713
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Posted
I'm pretty sure the Pirates were underrated before last season, and our pre-season was dreadful too. If we're better than six behind at the All-Star break I reckon we're good for the play-offs but while we make the play-offs nowadays we still haven't (just my view) got the killer pitcher to win that one game that just has to be won.
Posts: 24276 | From: Newport, Wales | Registered: Apr 2004
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Hedgehog
Ship's Shortstop
# 14125
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Posted
The Baseball Prospectus site just issued their pre-season predictions.
They are more optimistic about the Pirates (or perhaps more pessimistic about the Cardinals--read it how you will). Elsewhere on the site, they have already apologized/made excuses for their ranking the defending World Series champion (Kansas City) as finishing last in their division. They use the PECOTA system (and I don't know what PECOTA stands for), which is apparently purely statistics based. The explanation is that if, for example, a player suddenly got better, the prediction (based on past stats) would be off, and would stay off for a few years until the prior bad years got out of the system. So, for example, if a player was blind for four years and then got an eye transplant for Year 5, PECOTA would still predict him, in Year 5, to play as if he was blind. And the next future year predictions would still take into account the blind years. Having really good young players who don't have many prior year stats to look at will also screw up the predictions. Essentially, something of the kind has happened with Kansas City--its ranking is being pulled down by old bad years that have little realistic bearing on the current team.
I will note that, while USA Today had one team winning 100 games and 3 losing 100 games, the Baseball Prospectus predicts zero 100 game winners and zero 100 game losers.
All of this predicting stuff is bogus when you can have no idea which players will go down with injuries. But, until actual baseball play starts, there isn't a whole lot for me to obsess over, so I browse predictions from various sources. Please bear with me. Game play will start soon.
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"We must regain the conviction that we need one another, that we have a shared responsibility for others and the world, and that being good and decent are worth it."--Pope Francis, Laudato Si'
Posts: 2740 | From: Delaware, USA | Registered: Sep 2008
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Hedgehog
Ship's Shortstop
# 14125
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Posted
There was an interesting note from the Phillies camp in today's paper. You may have noticed, in a lot of ballparks, there is posted (usually on the wall behind home plate) the rather cryptic phrase "No Pepper." Well, it turns out that the Phillies' newish manager (IIRC he started about two-thirds of the way through last season) has decided to use pepper to spice up the camp.
The article is the first time I have had a decent explanation as to what "pepper" is--basically a fielding practice game with some batting hand-eye coordination thrown in. It still isn't clear why it is banned in so many parks (although the article makes some reference to groundskeepers--so maybe it is hard on the grass?). I do like, however, that Pete Mackanin is going old school in spring training.
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"We must regain the conviction that we need one another, that we have a shared responsibility for others and the world, and that being good and decent are worth it."--Pope Francis, Laudato Si'
Posts: 2740 | From: Delaware, USA | Registered: Sep 2008
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Barnabas62
Shipmate
# 9110
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Posted
I welcome the return of a baseball thread! I've just noticed it - Purg and RL have kept me away from Circus visits recently.
Thanks for the health warning re the linked predictions Hedgehog. I note they predict a wild card for my beloved Giants and I'd be delighted if they did as well as that. Even in an even-numbered year!
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Who is it that you seek? How then shall we live? How shall we sing the Lord's song in a strange land?
Posts: 21397 | From: Norfolk UK | Registered: Feb 2005
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Baker
Shipmate
# 18458
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Posted
Well of course the Kansas City Royals will take it again! They make my heart stop sometimes, but I love 'em.
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Ad astra per aspera
Posts: 108 | From: Tottering-on-the-Brink | Registered: Aug 2015
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Hedgehog
Ship's Shortstop
# 14125
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Posted
Certainly as defending champs, KC cannot be ignored. But it is very, very difficult to win back-to-back World Series. The last time it happened, it was the Yankees, who won 3 in a row (1998-2000).
While I am a Phillies fan, I do have some fondness for KC because my local minor league team (the Wilmington Blue Rocks) are a single-A affiliate of the Royals.
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"We must regain the conviction that we need one another, that we have a shared responsibility for others and the world, and that being good and decent are worth it."--Pope Francis, Laudato Si'
Posts: 2740 | From: Delaware, USA | Registered: Sep 2008
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Hedgehog
Ship's Shortstop
# 14125
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Posted
Some "Baseball Diplomacy" going on right now, as the Tampa Bay Rays play the Cuba National Team in Cuba, with the Presidents of both countries in attendance. Currently, the Rays lead 3-0 in the 5th.
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"We must regain the conviction that we need one another, that we have a shared responsibility for others and the world, and that being good and decent are worth it."--Pope Francis, Laudato Si'
Posts: 2740 | From: Delaware, USA | Registered: Sep 2008
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Hedgehog
Ship's Shortstop
# 14125
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Posted
Final score: Tampa Bay 4 - Cuba 1.
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"We must regain the conviction that we need one another, that we have a shared responsibility for others and the world, and that being good and decent are worth it."--Pope Francis, Laudato Si'
Posts: 2740 | From: Delaware, USA | Registered: Sep 2008
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Hedgehog
Ship's Shortstop
# 14125
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Posted
Opening Day! Four games on today, but the first is St. Louis at Pittsburgh, starting at 1:05pm EST.
The other games are the Cubbies at La Angels; Toronto at Tampa Bay; and the Mets at Kansas City.
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"We must regain the conviction that we need one another, that we have a shared responsibility for others and the world, and that being good and decent are worth it."--Pope Francis, Laudato Si'
Posts: 2740 | From: Delaware, USA | Registered: Sep 2008
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Barnabas62
Shipmate
# 9110
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Posted
A double header on BT Sports (ESPN) tonight, featuring Cards/Pirates and Blue Jays/Rays. I'll be there with my popcorn for the first one.
And Giants/Brewers tomorrow, featuring Bumgarner and Peralta. Now that ought to be a bit tasty! Don't think there will be live TV coverage in the UK, but Gameday is my friend.
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Who is it that you seek? How then shall we live? How shall we sing the Lord's song in a strange land?
Posts: 21397 | From: Norfolk UK | Registered: Feb 2005
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Sioni Sais
Shipmate
# 5713
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Posted
A Pirates win on opening day! Against the Cards with Wainwright starting!
We weren't perfect, but a win is a win.
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"He isn't Doctor Who, he's The Doctor"
(Paul Sinha, BBC)
Posts: 24276 | From: Newport, Wales | Registered: Apr 2004
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Hedgehog
Ship's Shortstop
# 14125
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Sioni Sais:
A Pirates win on opening day! Against the Cards with Wainwright starting!
And the first RBI of the new season belongs to...the pitcher! Pittsburgh's Liriano smashed a grounder through the right side of the infield to drive the run in.
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"We must regain the conviction that we need one another, that we have a shared responsibility for others and the world, and that being good and decent are worth it."--Pope Francis, Laudato Si'
Posts: 2740 | From: Delaware, USA | Registered: Sep 2008
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sharkshooter
Not your average shark
# 1589
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Hedgehog:
... It still isn't clear why it is banned in so many parks (although the article makes some reference to groundskeepers--so maybe it is hard on the grass?). I do like, however, that Pete Mackanin is going old school in spring training.
quote:
Exercise:
Pepper is a common pre-game exercise where one player hits brisk grounders and line drives to a group of fielders who are standing around twenty feet away. The fielders throw to the batter who uses a short, light swing to hit the ball on the ground towards the fielders. The fielders field the ground balls and continue tossing the ball to the batter. This exercise keeps the fielders and batter alert, and helps to develop quickness and good hand-eye coordination.
Banning:
Some ballparks have banned pepper games because of the danger of balls landing in the stands and injuring spectators or because its concentrated play damages the grass on the field. Many ballparks display "NO PEPPER" warnings behind or near home plate.
Sure, it is from wikipedia, but it may provide some understanding of why no pepper behind home plate. I would place more emphasis on possible damage to the field than risk to spectators, due to the screens behind home plate.
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Let the words of my mouth, and the meditation of my heart, be acceptable in thy sight, O LORD, my strength, and my redeemer. [Psalm 19:14]
Posts: 7772 | From: Canada; Washington DC; Phoenix; it's complicated | Registered: Oct 2001
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Hedgehog
Ship's Shortstop
# 14125
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by sharkshooter:
I would place more emphasis on possible damage to the field than risk to spectators, due to the screens behind home plate.
I agree. Even the spectators along the lines are relatively safe, since the hitting is done with a "short, light swing"--by that standard, batting practice would be far more dangerous for the spectators, and nobody bans that. It must be the damage to the grass.
Roughly 1.5 hours until my Phillies open the season (in Cincinnati). Of course, as things stand right now, the Phillies have a half-game lead over the Mets in the standings. ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
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"We must regain the conviction that we need one another, that we have a shared responsibility for others and the world, and that being good and decent are worth it."--Pope Francis, Laudato Si'
Posts: 2740 | From: Delaware, USA | Registered: Sep 2008
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Caissa
Shipmate
# 16710
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Posted
My beloved Blue Jays are 1-0; 161 games to go.
Posts: 972 | From: Saint John, N.B. | Registered: Oct 2011
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Barnabas62
Shipmate
# 9110
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Hedgehog:
Roughly 1.5 hours until my Phillies open the season (in Cincinnati). Of course, as things stand right now, the Phillies have a half-game lead over the Mets in the standings.
Not any more. Commiz, Hedgehog.
Meanwhile, the Giants slaughter the Brewers, including back-to-back-to-back homers, Span hits 5 RBIs and an off-colour Bumgarner still manages 5 innings and 101 pitches for the win.
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Who is it that you seek? How then shall we live? How shall we sing the Lord's song in a strange land?
Posts: 21397 | From: Norfolk UK | Registered: Feb 2005
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Hedgehog
Ship's Shortstop
# 14125
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Posted
The Phillies game was strange. In the first 3 innings they had 5 hits (and 2 runs), but had only one hit in the 6 innings after that. They held the Reds for 7 innings, giving up only one unearned run, but then the bullpen came in and the Reds ran rampant, scoring 5 runs in the 8th.
I fear it is a sign of things to come for this season.
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"We must regain the conviction that we need one another, that we have a shared responsibility for others and the world, and that being good and decent are worth it."--Pope Francis, Laudato Si'
Posts: 2740 | From: Delaware, USA | Registered: Sep 2008
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basso
Ship’s Crypt Keeper
# 4228
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Posted
If you check yesterday's box score for the Giants game, you'll notice an interesting thing near the end of the SF lineup. Mad Bum batted eighth.
For the moment, that's the plan for the season. Bochy has moved all of his pitchers into the eight slot, so that he can bat a Real Hitter™ just before the leadoff spots.
I think this makes some sense. We´ll have to see how it plays out.
Posts: 4358 | From: Bay Area, Calif | Registered: Mar 2003
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Sioni Sais
Shipmate
# 5713
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by basso:
If you check yesterday's box score for the Giants game, you'll notice an interesting thing near the end of the SF lineup. Mad Bum batted eighth.
For the moment, that's the plan for the season. Bochy has moved all of his pitchers into the eight slot, so that he can bat a Real Hitter™ just before the leadoff spots.
I think this makes some sense. We´ll have to see how it plays out.
It's a fair option, especially if your pitcher isn't so bad at bat. The Pirates could consider it with Liriano and Cole. However, if they can barely see a pitch, and should therefore be in the American League, then nine is probably better.
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"He isn't Doctor Who, he's The Doctor"
(Paul Sinha, BBC)
Posts: 24276 | From: Newport, Wales | Registered: Apr 2004
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Barnabas62
Shipmate
# 9110
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Posted
No 9 becomes the new No 1 after the first 8 at bats? I suppose there might be something in that. May the odds be ever in your favour?
Cueto had a good outing, Crawford a HR, Romo and Casilia held on for the Giants in a tight game. An even-numbered year is off to a decent start for them. Plus quite a few others (including the Cubs, Pirates, Dodgers and White Sox).
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Who is it that you seek? How then shall we live? How shall we sing the Lord's song in a strange land?
Posts: 21397 | From: Norfolk UK | Registered: Feb 2005
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Hedgehog
Ship's Shortstop
# 14125
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Posted
Cincinnati batted their pitcher 8th in the season opener as well. There was a discussion about doing that on MLB Radio yesterday morning. I forget which host it was, but he was not in favor of the idea. Here is his analysis:
Why do you put your top hitters at the top of the batting order? Because they will get more plate appearances than those lower in the order. So, the first spot will, over the season, bat more frequently than the guy in the 2nd spot, and so on, and so on.
It follows, then, that your #8 spot is going to be at more frequently than the #9 spot. That being the case, why would you want your weaker hitter (the pitcher, presumably) to be batting more than whoever you put in the 9th spot? If the theory is that the pitcher is an "automatic out" (and I think there are a lot of pitchers where that is not true--like I said above, Liriano drove in the first RBI of the major league season this year!), but if the pitcher is an automatic out, why have that spot come up more frequently?
If the theory is that, if the pitcher gets on base, he will be clogging up the base for the top of the order, what are you gaining by batting him 8th? He will still be clogging up the bases for who comes later--and, that being true, wouldn't it be better to follow him with people more likely to get hits or even hit homers--i.e., the top of the order?
That all makes sense to me, but I suppose we need to wait for the stats to come in over a full season to see if placing the pitcher in 8th makes any positive difference. I certainly have been wrong about such things in the past. But absent a statistical proof, my belief is that one should put your worse hitter (usually the pitcher) in 9th.
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"We must regain the conviction that we need one another, that we have a shared responsibility for others and the world, and that being good and decent are worth it."--Pope Francis, Laudato Si'
Posts: 2740 | From: Delaware, USA | Registered: Sep 2008
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Sioni Sais
Shipmate
# 5713
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Posted
I've been wondering about this convention that the pitcher bats at nine (as one who hasn't studied baseball much or for very long!)
Anyway, does it make sense for the batter immediately before your top three to be halfway decent, ie a player who has been selected to some degree on his batting ability? That would increase the likelihood that a player would be on base when the top three bat and hence the chance of a run. That would have to set against the fewer players on base after your pitcher has batted, say at eight, but I'm sure the stats already exist!
[ 06. April 2016, 20:38: Message edited by: Sioni Sais ]
Posts: 24276 | From: Newport, Wales | Registered: Apr 2004
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Hedgehog
Ship's Shortstop
# 14125
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Posted
Another thought: Presumably the players more likely to get on base are higher up on the batting order, including 5, 6 and 7. So why move the pitcher up in the order? To drive them in? Wouldn't you want a better batter there to drive in some runs before the pitcher gets up to bat?
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"We must regain the conviction that we need one another, that we have a shared responsibility for others and the world, and that being good and decent are worth it."--Pope Francis, Laudato Si'
Posts: 2740 | From: Delaware, USA | Registered: Sep 2008
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sharkshooter
Not your average shark
# 1589
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Posted
Of course you could always adopt the designated hitter rule. ![[Smile]](smile.gif)
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Let the words of my mouth, and the meditation of my heart, be acceptable in thy sight, O LORD, my strength, and my redeemer. [Psalm 19:14]
Posts: 7772 | From: Canada; Washington DC; Phoenix; it's complicated | Registered: Oct 2001
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Hedgehog
Ship's Shortstop
# 14125
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by sharkshooter:
Of course you could always adopt the designated hitter rule.
Heathen!!!! Heretic!!!!! ![[Mad]](angryfire.gif)
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"We must regain the conviction that we need one another, that we have a shared responsibility for others and the world, and that being good and decent are worth it."--Pope Francis, Laudato Si'
Posts: 2740 | From: Delaware, USA | Registered: Sep 2008
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Hedgehog
Ship's Shortstop
# 14125
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Posted
A couple of records have been set this season.
In Colorado, Trevor Story is the first rookie to hit a homer in his first three games. Amazingly, he has 4 hits in three games--and all four were homers! ![[Eek!]](eek.gif)
Meanwhile, the San Diego Padres have managed to be shut out in their first three games, thereby setting a major league record of the most innings to start a season without scoring (27....and counting). The previous record for scoreless innings at the start of a season was held by the 1943 St. Louis Browns (a team that would become the Baltimore Orioles in 1954).
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"We must regain the conviction that we need one another, that we have a shared responsibility for others and the world, and that being good and decent are worth it."--Pope Francis, Laudato Si'
Posts: 2740 | From: Delaware, USA | Registered: Sep 2008
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Sioni Sais
Shipmate
# 5713
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Posted
The Pirates opening streak continues, but they needed a grand slam in the 8th to win by one run.
Finally the Padres have a run. They managed twelve more besides, to trounce the Rockies.
Posts: 24276 | From: Newport, Wales | Registered: Apr 2004
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Barnabas62
Shipmate
# 9110
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Posted
That was a close one! Pirates did very well to remain 100% along with only a couple of other AL teams I think.
Curious win for the Giants. A rookie outpitches Cain than gets pulled while still on no hitter. The reliever gives up the first Giants hit, a HR 2RBI (other runner a walk), to level at 2-2. It goes to extra innings, then Crawford wins it for the Giants with a HR in the 10th. Giants have two hits all night compared to the Dodgers 9, but still win to go 4-1. And tonight will be tasty - Kershaw v Bumgarner. Something will have to give ...
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Who is it that you seek? How then shall we live? How shall we sing the Lord's song in a strange land?
Posts: 21397 | From: Norfolk UK | Registered: Feb 2005
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Hedgehog
Ship's Shortstop
# 14125
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Barnabas62:
That was a close one! Pirates did very well to remain 100% along with only a couple of other AL teams I think.
Yes, the annual race to be the last team to lose and the last team to win has been pretty short this year. With the Pirates and Detroit both losing today, one week in to the season the only undefeated team is the Baltimore Orioles (and, to be fair, they are only 4-0, which the Pirates also were before tonight's game...it is just that Baltimore's game today was "snowed out").
The Phillies won today, 1-0, against the Mets. The only teams to not have a win yet this year are Atlanta (who are about to lose their 4th again St. Louis unless they score 9 runs in the bottom of the ninth) and Minnesota, who have started 0-5.
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"We must regain the conviction that we need one another, that we have a shared responsibility for others and the world, and that being good and decent are worth it."--Pope Francis, Laudato Si'
Posts: 2740 | From: Delaware, USA | Registered: Sep 2008
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RuthW
liberal "peace first" hankie squeezer
# 13
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Barnabas62:
Curious win for the Giants. A rookie outpitches Cain than gets pulled while still on no hitter. The reliever gives up the first Giants hit, a HR 2RBI (other runner a walk), to level at 2-2. It goes to extra innings, then Crawford wins it for the Giants with a HR in the 10th. Giants have two hits all night compared to the Dodgers 9, but still win to go 4-1.
I think Dodgers manager Dave Roberts made the right decision pulling Stripling when he did. Stripling is coming back from Tommy John surgery, and he never threw more than 80 pitches in spring training games. He was at 100 when Roberts pulled him, and he was starting to fade. It's a shame to lose a game, especially to the Giants, but the season is brand new, and better a loss than a wrecked pitching arm.
quote:
And tonight will be tasty - Kershaw v Bumgarner. Something will have to give ...
And Bumgarner hit a home run off Kershaw! Kershaw only really made two mistakes, but he paid for both of them. At least this time the Dodgers held onto their lead. One more in the series ...
[ 10. April 2016, 17:28: Message edited by: RuthW ]
Posts: 24453 | From: La La Land | Registered: Apr 2001
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Sir Kevin
Ship's Gaffer
# 3492
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Posted
Yesterday's was a very trying game, but at least we had Vin doing the television broadcast instead of the the buffoons from the Major League Baseball Channel, or worse the ex-manager from Arizona!
Can we start winning on a regular basis now?
Kazimir making progress? My eye! Thant's malarkey!
![[brick wall]](graemlins/brick_wall.gif)
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If you board the wrong train, it is no use running along the corridor in the other direction Dietrich Bonhoeffer
Writing is currently my hobby, not yet my profession.
Posts: 30517 | From: White Hart Lane | Registered: Oct 2002
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Hedgehog
Ship's Shortstop
# 14125
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Posted
The Cubs' Jake Arrieta has a no-hitter going into the bottom of the 9th. He is pitching against the Cincinnati Reds. He is at 103 pitches.
The Cubs are leading 16-0, so even if he loses the no-hitter, he isn't likely to lose the game!
Facing the first batter in the bottom of the 9th (Scott Schebler)......walks him on 6 pitches. At 109 pitches.
Batter #2 (Tucker Barnhart): pop up to shortstop. One out. At 112 pitches.
Batter #3 (Zack Cosart): Lined to center. Two outs. At 114 pitches.
Batter #4 (Eugenio Suarez): Flied out to right!! Three outs and he has his no-hitter!!! That is the second one of his career.
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"We must regain the conviction that we need one another, that we have a shared responsibility for others and the world, and that being good and decent are worth it."--Pope Francis, Laudato Si'
Posts: 2740 | From: Delaware, USA | Registered: Sep 2008
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Hedgehog
Ship's Shortstop
# 14125
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Posted
Last night, the Pirates Andrew McCutchen hit three home runs in one game.
By contrast, the Atlanta Braves as a team have hit only three home runs all season.
I still can't quite get my head around that.
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"We must regain the conviction that we need one another, that we have a shared responsibility for others and the world, and that being good and decent are worth it."--Pope Francis, Laudato Si'
Posts: 2740 | From: Delaware, USA | Registered: Sep 2008
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Sioni Sais
Shipmate
# 5713
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Hedgehog:
Last night, the Pirates Andrew McCutchen hit three home runs in one game.
By contrast, the Atlanta Braves as a team have hit only three home runs all season.
I still can't quite get my head around that.
Shows Cutch's value to the Bucs. And the game for that matter.
Posts: 24276 | From: Newport, Wales | Registered: Apr 2004
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Og, King of Bashan
Ship's giant Amorite
# 9562
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Posted
Not to take anything away from McCutchen, but the Braves haven't gotten to bat against the Rockies pitching staff yet. (Jorge De La Rosa, the starter responsible for two of those home runs, has a season ERA of 10.18. You want to talk about unbelievable...)
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"I like to eat crawfish and drink beer. That's despair?" ― Walker Percy
Posts: 3259 | From: Denver, Colorado, USA | Registered: May 2005
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Sioni Sais
Shipmate
# 5713
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Posted
Pitchers aside, doesn't the elevation of Coors fieeld have an effect too? A quick scan of Wike etc suggests that a good hit travels 9% further if you are a mile further up.
Then again, the field might be larger, to compensate.
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"He isn't Doctor Who, he's The Doctor"
(Paul Sinha, BBC)
Posts: 24276 | From: Newport, Wales | Registered: Apr 2004
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Hedgehog
Ship's Shortstop
# 14125
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Posted
Famously, the Rockies have been using a humidor to counteract the effect of the field elevation. The thin atmosphere probably still has some effect, but not as much as it used to have.
But, really, the point was not so much that McCutchan hit three home runs in one game--other players have done that over the years. The amazing fact was that the Braves only had three for the season.
Actually, I think they got another one last night, so they are now up to four on the year. There are still a LOT of individual players who have hit more home runs this year than the entire Braves team has hit.
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"We must regain the conviction that we need one another, that we have a shared responsibility for others and the world, and that being good and decent are worth it."--Pope Francis, Laudato Si'
Posts: 2740 | From: Delaware, USA | Registered: Sep 2008
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Og, King of Bashan
Ship's giant Amorite
# 9562
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Sioni Sais:
Then again, the field might be larger, to compensate.
They just raised the outfield fences to turn a few more cheep home runs into doubles and try to bring the park more in line with the rest of the National League. (Three AL parks- Baltimore, Toronto, and New York- yielded more home runs last year, possibly because of the designated hitter rule.)
A major part of the problem is that the team owners are more interested in selling tickets than putting together a good team. They create a fun atmosphere at the park, they keep the tickets affordable, and they put together a team of hitters that will be able to stay in games played in Denver, so that when you have your office party at Coors Field, you have a better than 50% chance of seeing a Rockies win, and usually a high scoring game. (Road games are a totally different story, but no one is watching, so who cares?) It's not enough to get anywhere close to the playoffs in most years, but it pays the bills and then some for the owners.
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"I like to eat crawfish and drink beer. That's despair?" ― Walker Percy
Posts: 3259 | From: Denver, Colorado, USA | Registered: May 2005
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Hedgehog
Ship's Shortstop
# 14125
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Posted
A bit of baseball trivia: This weekend, four division leaders (Boston Red Sox, Chicago White Sox, Washington Nationals and Chicago Cubs) are all playing in one city--Chicago. This is the first time in history that that has happened.
To be fair, from 1876 to 1968 it was impossible to have it happen, because you could only have had, at best, 2 division leaders (one NL , one AL). But, still, in the 48 years when it was theoretically possible, this is the first time it has happened.
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"We must regain the conviction that we need one another, that we have a shared responsibility for others and the world, and that being good and decent are worth it."--Pope Francis, Laudato Si'
Posts: 2740 | From: Delaware, USA | Registered: Sep 2008
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Prester John
Shipmate
# 5502
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Posted
So this happened. I will say if Bautista had a problem he should have went after the pitcher instead of going after the knees of the second baseman. Mr. Bat-flip deserved that punch from Odor. I'm also a little surprised that there was a baseball player that could actually deliver a clean hit.
Posts: 884 | From: SF Bay Area | Registered: Feb 2004
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Imaginary Friend
Real to you
# 186
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Posted
That was awesome!
Also, while it's not strictly baseball*, did you guys see this? Also really, really impressive.
* Softball is close enough, right? ![[Biased]](wink.gif)
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"We had a good team on paper. Unfortunately, the game was played on grass."
Brian Clough
Posts: 9455 | From: Left a bit... Right a bit... | Registered: May 2001
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Hedgehog
Ship's Shortstop
# 14125
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Posted
We have had the first Manager Casualty of the year, as the Atlanta Braves have announced that manager Fredi Gonzalez is out.
Granted, they have the worse record in MLB, but it is not clear to me what anybody expected with that roster. I think Gonzalez did as best he could with what he had. Still, the Phillies' fortunes started improving last year after we fired our manager (Sanberg--who is still available for hire, come to think of it...). So we'll see how the Braves respond to a new manager.
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"We must regain the conviction that we need one another, that we have a shared responsibility for others and the world, and that being good and decent are worth it."--Pope Francis, Laudato Si'
Posts: 2740 | From: Delaware, USA | Registered: Sep 2008
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Og, King of Bashan
Ship's giant Amorite
# 9562
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Prester John:
So this happened. I will say if Bautista had a problem he should have went after the pitcher instead of going after the knees of the second baseman. Mr. Bat-flip deserved that punch from Odor. I'm also a little surprised that there was a baseball player that could actually deliver a clean hit.
Agreed on the second baseman lash out.
That said, is anyone really offended by a bat flip, especially in a big moment? I know it's "just not done" under the "unwritten rules" and so forth, but come on, you hit a series winning home run, in my book, you get to show some emotion. Coming at the guy with a bean ball seven months later seems like far worse sportsmanship to me.
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"I like to eat crawfish and drink beer. That's despair?" ― Walker Percy
Posts: 3259 | From: Denver, Colorado, USA | Registered: May 2005
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Barnabas62
Shipmate
# 9110
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Posted
I see that Johnny Cueto has followed MadBum's lead on Tuesday by pitching another complete game for the Giants yesterday. Both games against the Padres.
Hedgehog, how unusual are consecutive complete games by the visiting team's pitchers? I'm sure it's happened before, but it struck me as a rare event.
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Who is it that you seek? How then shall we live? How shall we sing the Lord's song in a strange land?
Posts: 21397 | From: Norfolk UK | Registered: Feb 2005
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Hedgehog
Ship's Shortstop
# 14125
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Posted
I am having a hard time getting Baseball-Reference to give me the right info, namely not just completes games (CGs), but on consecutive games while being a visiting team. That fault is solely mine, as I firmly believe the info is on the site if I knew how to call it up. The Home-Away part is easy, because it will generate the info for such "splits," but I don't know how to tell it to give me consecutive games.
Still, in modern ball it must be a rare feat for the simple fact that CGs are increasingly rare.
- 2016: 18 CGs out of 1198 games (1.5%)
2015: 104 CGs out of 4858 games (2.14%)
2014: 118 CGs out of 4860 games (2.43%)
2013: 124 CGs out of 4862 games (2.55%)
2012: 128 CGs out of 4860 games (2.63%)
2011: 173 CGs out of 4858 games (3.56%)
By contrast, 100 years ago, in 1916, there were 1314 CGs out of 2494 games (52.69%). And if you go back to 1885, 1710 CGs out of 1780 (96.07%).
So, just from the stats, 100 years ago it was a lot more likely that you would have consecutive CGs (indeed, it would be mathematically impossible NOT to have some of them consecutive!) and almost certainly many of those consecutive games would be while playing an away game.
In the contemporary game, it is far more unlikely. For example, at the current rate for 2016 (1.5%), the average team, in a 162 games season, could only expect 2.43 CGs all year. That those games would be consecutive and then while the team was playing away seems highly unlikely. Even if you use the 2015 rates (since we are only one-quarter of the way through 2016), 2.14% of 162 games is 3.47 per team on average--still unlikely to even have those on consecutive games, much less while away from home. Even with the comparatively "high" rate of 2011 (3.56%), an average team could only expect 5.77 CGs per year.
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"We must regain the conviction that we need one another, that we have a shared responsibility for others and the world, and that being good and decent are worth it."--Pope Francis, Laudato Si'
Posts: 2740 | From: Delaware, USA | Registered: Sep 2008
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Barnabas62
Shipmate
# 9110
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Posted
That's a fascinating insight. I suppose the current tendency to limit starting pitchers to round about 100 pitches, plus the development of specialist closers, has severely reduced the numbers of CGs per season. And the stats are probably demonstrating those trends.
I think you are like me about one aspect of the game. I love great pitching and I really enjoy pitching duels, where both starters are really on their game. But I've got used to the rarity of the starter getting as far as the 9th inning. And I think specialist closers have also added something to the modern game.
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Who is it that you seek? How then shall we live? How shall we sing the Lord's song in a strange land?
Posts: 21397 | From: Norfolk UK | Registered: Feb 2005
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Hedgehog
Ship's Shortstop
# 14125
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Posted
I've realized that part of my trouble with Baseball-Reference is that, to get FULL reports, I actually have to become a paid subscriber. So I can tell you, for example, that since 1960, one team managed to have 12 consecutive CGs...but I don't know who or when unless I cough up some money.
I can tell you (from the partial report, which starts at #10 on the list) that in 1962, two teams (Twins & Giants) each had streaks of 7 consecutive CGs, but they were all at home. And the Giants had a double-header in their streak, so they managed two CGs in a single day.
Side note: A CG does not necessarily mean a win. The Twins were 5-2 in that 7 game stretch.
However, I did discover that the 1979 Yankees put together a streak of 6 consecutive CGs, of which 4 were Away games (the Yanks were 2-2 in those 4 games). There may be other examples.
I then restricted the search to CG streaks from Year 2000 on. The top streaks (which I cannot see the details of) are only 3 games long. But I can see that, in 2012, at least 4 teams had back-to-back CGs. On June 29 & 30, 2012, the Reds had CGs away against the Giants (Mike Leake and Mat Latos being the pitchers).
But here is a real freak show: On May 1 & 2 of 2012, the Angels, at home, won CGs against the Twins. Then, on May 3 & 4, the Angels lost to CGs on the part of the Blue Jays. Thus, fans at Angels Stadium saw 4 consecutive CGs: two for the Home team followed by two for the Visitors!
In case you are wondering, Jerome Williams & Jered Weaver did it for La Angels, while Brandon Morrow and Henderson Alvarez did it for the Blue Jays.
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"We must regain the conviction that we need one another, that we have a shared responsibility for others and the world, and that being good and decent are worth it."--Pope Francis, Laudato Si'
Posts: 2740 | From: Delaware, USA | Registered: Sep 2008
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Sioni Sais
Shipmate
# 5713
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Posted
I'm no baseball historian but wasn't the era of CG's a time when the ball was subject to far more abuse, eg the spitball and emeryball, which all gave pitchers an advantage? If the pitcher simply didn't too throw so many pitches, then CGs would be far more common and from my (brief) reading some methods made the ball a lot more lively so the pitcher could throw a virtually unplayable strike, because of very late movement. It looks like there was also an expectation that starters would complete a game which doesn't happen now unless you are in the World Series, your gun pitcher is in awesome form and he just has to go the Whole Nine Yards.
What is the lowest number of pitches in a complete game? I've found record of a 58!
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"He isn't Doctor Who, he's The Doctor"
(Paul Sinha, BBC)
Posts: 24276 | From: Newport, Wales | Registered: Apr 2004
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