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Source: (consider it)
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Thread: Police Commissioners
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Jay-Emm
Shipmate
# 11411
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Posted
In the UK we have elections on the 19th for a new role of Police Commissioners.
As far as I understand it the purpose of Police Commissioners is to pick up the big red phone when the Police Chief admits defeat.
Anyone have any idea what the planned purpose is and if they will think it will work? Is it something we ought to vote, or should I just watch TV?
If say the BNP get in, does it have any serious effect other than being embarrassing or will they be able to change the shape of the whole police force*?
Have you received any information about the candidates? we received one flier (from labour) and UKIP had a table (I didn't visit) in the town centre.
*do I get points for avoiding Godwin
Posts: 1643 | Registered: May 2006
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Barnabas62
Shipmate
# 9110
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Jay-Emm:
Have you received any information about the candidates? we received one flier (from labour) and UKIP had a table (I didn't visit) in the town centre.
*do I get points for avoiding Godwin
You can get information and candidates' election statements from this website. Just stick in your post code. It worked for Norfolk, anyway.
[ 12. November 2012, 17:48: Message edited by: Barnabas62 ]
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Who is it that you seek? How then shall we live? How shall we sing the Lord's song in a strange land?
Posts: 21397 | From: Norfolk UK | Registered: Feb 2005
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Sioni Sais
Shipmate
# 5713
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Posted
Down our way (Gwent) the PCC election is on Thursday 15th!
We have four candidates. Two independent ex-police candidates, a Conservative who appears a bit short on substance and a Labour party lawyer who is very political (like the others aren't??)
I'm wary of having a policeman as Police Commissioner: they have to work closely but also critically with the Chief Constable: it would be like appointing the Prime Minister from the ranks of the senior civil service: good people, but not the right good people. The Conservative is about the best of the local Tories, but he's too callow, so it'll have to be the Labour man.
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"He isn't Doctor Who, he's The Doctor"
(Paul Sinha, BBC)
Posts: 24276 | From: Newport, Wales | Registered: Apr 2004
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Jay-Emm
Shipmate
# 11411
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Sioni Sais:
[QB] Down our way (Gwent) the PCC election is on Thursday 15th!
Good point, I really do need to make my mind up.
5 looks like a 9 when you're on a bike, passing a bus stop poster.
Posts: 1643 | Registered: May 2006
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Sober Preacher's Kid
Presbymethegationalist
# 12699
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Posted
In Ontario, Canada, the role of a municipality's Police Commission is to set the budget for the police, define local priorities for enforcement, apply for crime-prevention funds from provincial initiatives and if necessary administer a police services contract.
Ontario municipalities have the option of:
1) Forming their own police force.
2) Contracting another municipality to do it and not sitting on the force's Police Commission.
3) Having a joint-costs arrangement for a joint force with another municipality, with a joint Police Board.
4) Contracting with the Ontario Provincial Police for service, which still allows the local Police Board to set enforcement priorities, direct the OPP to enforce local bylaws and apply for prevention initiative funds. Contracts are fixed-price agreements for five years.
5) Do nothing, in which case the OPP assumes jurisdiction and bills the municipality for its yearly costs. The OPP will not enforce municipal bylaws and will not apply for prevention initiative funds.
Prevention Initiatives fund things like roadside alcohol and breathalyzer checks during Christmas and New Year's. Another favourite is the road from the Fall Fair since patrons may have overindulged at the Beer Tent.
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NDP Federal Convention Ottawa 2018: A random assortment of Prots and Trots.
Posts: 7646 | From: Peterborough, Upper Canada | Registered: Jun 2007
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leo
Shipmate
# 1458
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Posted
Unless one makes the effort to phone and ask for some printed material, one has to go on to a website that tells one next to nothing about the candidates.
The whole election is an ill-thought-out smokescreen in the semblance of democracy.
I shall turn out to vote for the mayor (i disagree with the idea but if we have to have a mayor i will have my say and refuse to accept a ballot paper for the police job so as not to be included in any low turnout figures. - this is the first time, ever, i have not voted when having the right to do so.)
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My Jewish-positive lectionary blog is at http://recognisingjewishrootsinthelectionary.wordpress.com/
My reviews at http://layreadersbookreviews.wordpress.com
Posts: 23198 | From: Bristol | Registered: Oct 2001
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Anglican't
Shipmate
# 15292
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by leo:
The whole election is an ill-thought-out smokescreen in the semblance of democracy.
Well it's more democratic than the current set up.
Posts: 3613 | From: London, England | Registered: Nov 2009
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passer
Indigo
# 13329
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Posted
The turnout is likely to be so low that the outcomes will be almost arbitrary. Then the winners will ply what they believe to be their trade for a term, and both they and the voters will have a better idea of what they are actually supposed to be doing, and what their limitations are. It could be quite chaotic.
Once people know what they want and what they can have, they'll be more energised to vote for something, but at the moment we seem to be in a thick fog of ignorance, because we don't have any precedent.
Posts: 1289 | From: Sheffield | Registered: Jan 2008
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Moth
Shipmate
# 2589
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Anglican't:
quote:
Originally posted by leo:
The whole election is an ill-thought-out smokescreen in the semblance of democracy.
Well it's more democratic than the current set up.
But is it? I used to be an independent member of my local police authority a few years back. I applied for the position, which was advertised in the local newspaper, and was appointed against strong competition after a lengthy interview process. There were 16 members, 5 independent like me, the rest a mix of local councillors and magistrates.
The authority was non-political in practice, and I thought very effective in holding the police to account. My own experience, coming from a non-policing background, was that the weak link in the tripartite system for police governance was the Home Office, which employed as stupid a bunch of people as it has ever been my misfortune to meet. I could tell any number of stories, but perhaps the most telling was the missive that informed is that 'all police forces must be performing in the top quartile by this time next year'.
I shall be spoiling my ballot in the forthcoming election by writing a little diatribe on the ballot paper against this silly and ill thought out scheme. I have read all the information put out by the candidates, and most of them have not the faintest idea what their powers will be, and keep promising things they won't have any power to deliver.
I suspect central government didn't like police authorities because they were too effective at telling the Home Office/ministry of Justice where to go. If we didn't think their plans would benefit Borsetshire, we didn't agree to them, and under the tripartite system, they couldn't make us. Central governments never want true localism. They want one has-been party member in place instead, to do what they want, or to be too clueless to object.
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"There are governments that burn books, and then there are those that sell the libraries and shut the universities to anyone who can't pay for a key." Laurie Penny.
Posts: 3446 | From: England | Registered: Apr 2002
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Doc Tor
Deepest Red
# 9748
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Posted
I'm going to be spoiling my paper also.
We have 4 candidates: two party apparatchiks (Labour and LibDem), one ex-copper (Con) and bloody UKIP. If there'd been an independent, I'd have voted for them, but as it is - none of the above.
Moth is right: while this superficially passes the Benn test, it's taking a broadly democratic system and turning it into a narrow one.
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Forward the New Republic
Posts: 9131 | From: Ultima Thule | Registered: Jul 2005
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Snags
Utterly socially unrealistic
# 15351
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Posted
I'm torn. I was largely against the whole thing, then something a mate said made me think. He's an academic, and his whole career is around social history and policing, and he's quite an activist. Which means I'm not longer against it in principle, but willing to consider it.
However ... here we've got 4 party-political candidates to choose from, and the Conservative will win because it's absolutely unthinkable that he shouldn't. If the Tories put up a used condom around here it will still win.
So I'm also seriously considering spoiling my paper. The only thing that's holding me back is that the Labour and Lib-Dem folks are at least anti-G4S, although I expect they'll have no influence there anyway.
Which means the choice is between two different ways of pissing into the wind.
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Vain witterings :-: Vain pretentions :-: The Dog's Blog(locks)
Posts: 1399 | From: just north of That London | Registered: Dec 2009
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chive
Ship's nude
# 208
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Posted
I intend to spoil my ballot too as I think it's just pseudo democracy and utterly irrelevant.
I do like the fact that they're police and crime commissioners. I'm not that bothered about commissioning police but it might be fun to commission some crime.
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'Edward was the kind of man who thought there was no such thing as a lesbian, just a woman who hadn't done one-to-one Bible study with him.' Catherine Fox, Love to the Lost
Posts: 3542 | From: the cupboard under the stairs | Registered: May 2001
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ArachnidinElmet
Shipmate
# 17346
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Posted
The 'partisanness' is the worst thing for me. If they have to stand, let them all be independant. What relevance is their political party; is there any chance that most commissioners aren't going to be picked along the same lines as MPs/councils.
After the mayoral referendum debacle where most cities decided they didn't need the expense of extra elections, there's no wonder we don't get to decide whether we want Police Commissioners.
What a waste of time and money. ![[Frown]](frown.gif)
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'If a pleasant, straight-forward life is not possible then one must try to wriggle through by subtle manoeuvres' - Kafka
Posts: 1887 | From: the rhubarb triangle | Registered: Sep 2012
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Ricardus
Shipmate
# 8757
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Anglican't:
quote:
Originally posted by leo:
The whole election is an ill-thought-out smokescreen in the semblance of democracy.
Well it's more democratic than the current set up.
Would you be in favour of having the Home Secretary directly elected, separately from Parliament?
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Then the dog ran before, and coming as if he had brought the news, shewed his joy by his fawning and wagging his tail. -- Tobit 11:9 (Douai-Rheims)
Posts: 7247 | From: Liverpool, UK | Registered: Nov 2004
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Sioni Sais
Shipmate
# 5713
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by ArachnidinElmet:
The 'partisanness' is the worst thing for me. If they have to stand, let them all be independant. What relevance is their political party; is there any chance that most commissioners aren't going to be picked along the same lines as MPs/councils.
After the mayoral referendum debacle where most cities decided they didn't need the expense of extra elections, there's no wonder we don't get to decide whether we want Police Commissioners.
What a waste of time and money.
"Independent" can easily be a false label, and the candidate subject to unknown, sometimes unaccountable and occasionally downright undesirable influence. Often it means "Too pigheaded to be adopted by any party with its head screwed on". I admit however that there have been exceptions, usually when the local Labour party has ballsed up the selection process.
The virtue of having party candidates is that you get some idea what you will get. It's probably the only one, but it's worth something.
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"He isn't Doctor Who, he's The Doctor"
(Paul Sinha, BBC)
Posts: 24276 | From: Newport, Wales | Registered: Apr 2004
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Curiosity killed ...
Ship's Mug
# 11770
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Posted
I have a choice of 6 candidates, Labour, Conservative, UKIP, English Democrat and two independents, one a(n ex-)police officer and the other the ex-vice chair of the police authority. The Conservative candidate has relevant experience, the Labour candidate .. does not. I suspect the Conservative will get in - this area has returned Tory MPs with increased majorities even when they were named prominently in expense scandals and the local party tried to get them deselected. It doesn't feel as if there is any choice.
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Mugs - Keep the Ship afloat
Posts: 13794 | From: outiside the outer ring road | Registered: Aug 2006
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Anglican't
Shipmate
# 15292
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Ricardus:
quote:
Originally posted by Anglican't:
quote:
Originally posted by leo:
The whole election is an ill-thought-out smokescreen in the semblance of democracy.
Well it's more democratic than the current set up.
Would you be in favour of having the Home Secretary directly elected, separately from Parliament?
No, but I don't think the Home Secretary is thought of as being as remote as police authorities currently are. Most people at least know that the Home Secretary exists.
Police Commissioners might not work, but I think they're worth a try.
Posts: 3613 | From: London, England | Registered: Nov 2009
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ArachnidinElmet
Shipmate
# 17346
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Sioni Sais:
[QB] "Independent" can easily be a false label, and the candidate subject to unknown, sometimes unaccountable and occasionally downright undesirable influence./QB]
True enough. It just annoys me that a number of people will probably vote for the party under the candidate's name without even reading what little information we're given. All dependant on anyone voting at all.
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'If a pleasant, straight-forward life is not possible then one must try to wriggle through by subtle manoeuvres' - Kafka
Posts: 1887 | From: the rhubarb triangle | Registered: Sep 2012
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the long ranger
Shipmate
# 17109
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Posted
It seems that candidates can promise all kinds of rubbish. One of my local candidates claims he will be empowered to declare
quote:
a “Drug Free Zone” there will be zero tolerance to the illegal taking or possession of drugs in Kent, this to include all illegal drugs “Soft and Hard”.
Really? Why does that sound terribly unlikely?
Incidentally, does anyone else think the English Democrats sound vaguely fascist?
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"..into the outer darkness where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth,” “But Rabbi, how can this happen for those who have no teeth?”
"..If some have no teeth, then teeth will be provided.”
Posts: 1310 | Registered: May 2012
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blackbeard
Ship's Pirate
# 10848
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by leo:
Unless one makes the effort to phone and ask for some printed material, one has to go on to a website that tells one next to nothing about the candidates.
The whole election is an ill-thought-out smokescreen in the semblance of democracy.
...
Indeed so. I will probably vote, but with a feeling of deep unease. It seems absurd to have an election with so little public interest, and this must have been obvious from the start. A waste of money and resources at best, and a random (since so few people can actually make an informed choice) method of filling the post.
The only documentation I have (apart from what I have gleaned from the net) consists of one voting card and an A5 bit of paper saying not much. Nothing from any candidate or from any party. A fair measure of a lack of interest, and is it also an indication of the importance of the post?
I was glad to see this thread, though; I was beginning to think that no one else had given the matter any thought at all.
Posts: 823 | From: Hampshire, UK | Registered: Dec 2005
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Marvin the Martian
Interplanetary
# 4360
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Posted
One thing I've found amusing is the Labour Propaganda Guff that came through my door about this farce of an election was trying to paint them as the "Tough on Crime" party.
None of the other parties have even bothered going to the expense of campaigning, so far as I can see. Not that it'd make any difference, of course - this area couldn't be any redder if you slit everyone's throat and let them bleed out on the streets...
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Hail Gallaxhar
Posts: 30100 | From: Adrift on a sea of surreality | Registered: Apr 2003
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Sioni Sais
Shipmate
# 5713
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by the long ranger:
It seems that candidates can promise all kinds of rubbish. One of my local candidates claims he will be empowered to declare
quote:
a “Drug Free Zone” there will be zero tolerance to the illegal taking or possession of drugs in Kent, this to include all illegal drugs “Soft and Hard”.
Really? Why does that sound terribly unlikely?
Incidentally, does anyone else think the English Democrats sound vaguely fascist?
If s/he gets elected then I'm sure the Chief Constable will shake them warmly by the hand and ask for the resources to achieve this!
The English Democrat candidates seem for the most part to be ex-Conservatives, UKIP and BNP. They are a sad bunch of populists.
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"He isn't Doctor Who, he's The Doctor"
(Paul Sinha, BBC)
Posts: 24276 | From: Newport, Wales | Registered: Apr 2004
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Moth
Shipmate
# 2589
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by the long ranger:
It seems that candidates can promise all kinds of rubbish. One of my local candidates claims he will be empowered to declare
quote:
a “Drug Free Zone” there will be zero tolerance to the illegal taking or possession of drugs in Kent, this to include all illegal drugs “Soft and Hard”.
Really? Why does that sound terribly unlikely?
Incidentally, does anyone else think the English Democrats sound vaguely fascist?
If you mean the English Democrat candidate in Kent, I know him, and vaguely fascist doesn't come into it. He is a total nut job. One of the few bits of fun around election time is when he calls and asks what we think about immigration. I tell him cheerfully that I am totally in favour of it, and that it's what made Britain the wonderful country it is today. That gets rid of him!
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"There are governments that burn books, and then there are those that sell the libraries and shut the universities to anyone who can't pay for a key." Laurie Penny.
Posts: 3446 | From: England | Registered: Apr 2002
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Curiosity killed ...
Ship's Mug
# 11770
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Posted
My local English Democrat is the party chairman, and there's nothing little about the fascism. He stands at all elections either for Parliament, Europe or locally, might have a seat on the council, but so does the BNP.
quote:
“It is criminals that should be afraid not good citizens! I will have zero tolerance to political correctness in [local] policing and focus [Shire] Police on traditional English Law and Order and cracking down on real criminals and gangs. When I say that my priority will be “more police – catching criminals!”, I mean it and I shall not hesitate to use the full powers this office to achieve it!
Really makes you want to vote for him, not?
Sadly the independent with the Police Authority experience has put out a very stilted personal statement.
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Mugs - Keep the Ship afloat
Posts: 13794 | From: outiside the outer ring road | Registered: Aug 2006
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fletcher christian
Mutinous Seadog
# 13919
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Posted
Sounds like a police state
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'God is love insaturable, love impossible to describe'
Staretz Silouan
Posts: 5235 | From: a prefecture | Registered: Jul 2008
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ArachnidinElmet
Shipmate
# 17346
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Curiosity killed, quoting from English Democrats campaigning stuff.
When I say that my priority will be “more police – catching criminals!”, I mean it and I shall not hesitate to use the full powers this office to achieve it!
Am I the only person imagining him giving a little foot stomp after "I mean it" like a five-year-old girl in a party dress?
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'If a pleasant, straight-forward life is not possible then one must try to wriggle through by subtle manoeuvres' - Kafka
Posts: 1887 | From: the rhubarb triangle | Registered: Sep 2012
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Eigon
Shipmate
# 4917
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Posted
Isn't it the case that the Police Commissioner will have the power to set budgets? I heard something rather disturbing about G4S already taking over some part of police services in Lincolnshire (IT and something else, I think), and there is this sort of vague suspicion that the replacement of police authorities with commissioners might be all about cutting budgets and privatising the police forces.
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Laugh hard. Run fast. Be kind.
Posts: 3710 | From: Hay-on-Wye, town of books | Registered: Aug 2003
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leo
Shipmate
# 1458
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Posted
I had to kick up a fuss at the polling station.
I stated that I did not want the police commissioner voting form, only the mayoral one.
If I took the police one, it would count as a spoilt paper, regardless of what i did with it. I did not want to contribute to the turnout figures.
They had to contact some chief person to discover that I was within my rights.
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My Jewish-positive lectionary blog is at http://recognisingjewishrootsinthelectionary.wordpress.com/
My reviews at http://layreadersbookreviews.wordpress.com
Posts: 23198 | From: Bristol | Registered: Oct 2001
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Chapelhead
I am
# 21
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Posted
I went down to the polling station this morning and watched the tumbleweed roll past as one person behind the desk explained to the other how to find names on the list of electors. It made me wonder if I was the first person to vote and so the first time she had had to locate a name - after all the polls had only been open three hours.
What a waste of time and money. The only people to benefit will be he Commissioners themselves, with their nice £70,000 a year jobs (pay varies by area), and perhaps the village halls which will appreciate the rental income from providing the polling stations.
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At times like this I find myself thinking, what would the Amish do?
Posts: 9123 | From: Near where I was before. | Registered: Aug 2001
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Sioni Sais
Shipmate
# 5713
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Posted
I did my duty and voted for a Police and Crime Commissioner. We didn't have a mayoral election. Maybe nobody wants to be Mayor of Newport.
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"He isn't Doctor Who, he's The Doctor"
(Paul Sinha, BBC)
Posts: 24276 | From: Newport, Wales | Registered: Apr 2004
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Doublethink.
Ship's Foolwise Unperson
# 1984
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Posted
I chose not to vote.
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All political thinking for years past has been vitiated in the same way. People can foresee the future only when it coincides with their own wishes, and the most grossly obvious facts can be ignored when they are unwelcome. George Orwell
Posts: 19219 | From: Erehwon | Registered: Aug 2005
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Boogie
Boogie on down!
# 13538
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Posted
I also chose not to vote - which is not like me at all.
Part of our school was used as a polling station and very few people came to vote.
I think the turn out will be very low indeed.
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Garden. Room. Walk
Posts: 13030 | From: Boogie Wonderland | Registered: Mar 2008
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EtymologicalEvangelical
Shipmate
# 15091
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Posted
I've been a very very naughty boy. I confessed on Facebook that I voted for a particular candidate in the PCC elections, and this is a response I got from a 'friend':
Did you have a really good reason for not voting for the excellent Christian independent candidate? I have to say that I am very disappointed that any Christian wouldn't vote for him.
This was my response:
I think Christians should be free to vote for whomever we like. This is a democracy not a theocracy. That is my "really good reason" for voting for the person I considered the best candidate for the job.
Really. I didn't realise that Christian tribalism was now attempting to subvert the democratic process here in dear old secular England!
God help us.
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You can argue with a man who says, 'Rice is unwholesome': but you neither can nor need argue with a man who says, 'Rice is unwholesome, but I'm not saying this is true'. CS Lewis
Posts: 3625 | From: South Coast of England | Registered: Sep 2009
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Doc Tor
Deepest Red
# 9748
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Posted
Good for you, EE. I have lots of Christian friends, but I wouldn't necessarily trust them to run a cake stall, let alone a police force.
Luther, I think, said "Better a good Turk than a bad Christian."
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Forward the New Republic
Posts: 9131 | From: Ultima Thule | Registered: Jul 2005
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Doublethink.
Ship's Foolwise Unperson
# 1984
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Posted
I have made a poll on this.
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All political thinking for years past has been vitiated in the same way. People can foresee the future only when it coincides with their own wishes, and the most grossly obvious facts can be ignored when they are unwelcome. George Orwell
Posts: 19219 | From: Erehwon | Registered: Aug 2005
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Callan
Shipmate
# 525
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Doublethink:
I chose not to vote.
I am very impressed by the way so many posters on this thread are nonchalantly expressing the view that this voting lark is all very well for new-fangled organisations like the College of Cardinals but Not The Way We Do Things Here. The spirit of the Earl of Home has been abroad across the land stirring up Apathy in the UK. One might almost hear the flapping of his wings.
One teensy consideration might be worth thinking about, however. The nuttersphere are going to be out in force today. Some of them can read and write and almost all of them can make an 'X' shape next to the insignia of their preferred candidate. Whilst the rest of you stay at home thinking beautiful thoughts the Kippers, the English Democrats and the Fash are going to be out there exercising their democratic prerogative. Low turn out and, in an insolent pout aimed in the general direction of the Liberal Democrats, a cheap and cheerful version of AV means the sort of people who usually lose their deposit are possibly going to be there or thereabouts when the half a dozen votes are totted up.
Let's just hope that tomorrow morning you don't wake up to find that your local domestic violence and anti-hate crime units haven't been disbanded and the officers reassinged to put together a prosecution of Tony Blair for treason for signing the Lisbon Treaty.
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How easy it would be to live in England, if only one did not love her. - G.K. Chesterton
Posts: 9757 | From: Citizen of the World | Registered: Jun 2001
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Doublethink.
Ship's Foolwise Unperson
# 1984
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Posted
I happen to think that low enough turnout will fuck with the mandate of the commissioners and neuter them. The alternative is to vote for one of two candidates about whom I have one paragraph of information - or to vote for one of various party candidates. I believe doing that will politicise the police - I think that is dangerous.
I will then lobby my MP, and hope others do likewise, to get police authorities reinstated. The bit where I engage with my MP, is about democracy.
FWIW I don't want coroners elected either, or judges. I want folk in those kinds of positions to make decisions based on the existing law and their professional judgement - not on what is the hot topic in the tabloids this week.
[ETA Unlike with mayors, we had no referendum on whether we wanted this change, and I don't recall it being in either ruling party's manifesto or mentioned in either campaign.]
[ETA OK seems I was totally wrong about that, and it was official policy at the time of the election - still think it is a shit idea though.]
[ 15. November 2012, 16:53: Message edited by: Doublethink ]
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All political thinking for years past has been vitiated in the same way. People can foresee the future only when it coincides with their own wishes, and the most grossly obvious facts can be ignored when they are unwelcome. George Orwell
Posts: 19219 | From: Erehwon | Registered: Aug 2005
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Darllenwr
Shipmate
# 14520
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Posted
I went in to vote at around 16:00. One of the Returning Officers is a friend of mine. She told me that I was the 32nd person to vote today. They opened the polling station at 07:00 and nobody came in until 10:00. This tells one a lot about the reaction of most people to this initiative.
In this area, not one of the (four) candidates made any attempt to make themselves known to the electors - if you didn't go online, you were left in complete ignorance. I happened to know about one candidate because his card had been placed on my car windscreen whilst parked in Abergavenny, 25 miles away.
My friend told me that everybody (all 32 of us!) who had come into the Polling Station was saying the same thing; "Why do we need this PCC at all?"
Why indeed.
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If I've told you once, I've told you a million times: I do not exaggerate!
Posts: 1101 | From: The catbox | Registered: Jan 2009
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Sioni Sais
Shipmate
# 5713
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Posted
Bugger, Gildas beat me to it.
I suppose we're lucky hereabouts. The nuttiest we have is an retired police sergeant who wants more bobbies on the beat.
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"He isn't Doctor Who, he's The Doctor"
(Paul Sinha, BBC)
Posts: 24276 | From: Newport, Wales | Registered: Apr 2004
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BroJames
Shipmate
# 9636
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Gildas:
Let's just hope that tomorrow morning you don't wake up to find that your local domestic violence and anti-hate crime units haven't been disbanded and the officers reassinged to put together a prosecution of Tony Blair for treason for signing the Lisbon Treaty.
…which was my main reason for voting. And I want to be able to say to whoever is elected either "it wasn't you I voted for - so not in my name", or "I voted for you, so pull your socks up and get on with the job"
Posts: 3374 | From: UK | Registered: Jun 2005
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Curiosity killed ...
Ship's Mug
# 11770
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Posted
But the only sensible candidate to vote for to ensure the nutters don't get in is the Tory guy ... and I feel that I need to be marched at gun point to the polling station to vote Tory at this present time.
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Mugs - Keep the Ship afloat
Posts: 13794 | From: outiside the outer ring road | Registered: Aug 2006
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Traveller
Shipmate
# 1943
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Posted
I voted a couple of weeks ago - by postal vote. The information on all 10 candidates (4 party political, 2 "independent" but Lib Dem councilors, 4 independent) was available on line, which was just as well as nothing has been delivered to the house.
A couple of the independents are real nut jobs. One has been discovered to have a string of County Court Judgements against him for debt, which apparently does not disqualify him from standing for this job.
I didn't think that an ex-policeman was the best candidate for the job either. The police, like many groups, can become very introspective and need a bit of reality check. (An IT group used to say that they could run a wonderful computer system - if it weren't for those pesky users.)
2 of the candidates seemed to have some userful life experience of running things and making things happen, so they got my votes in the funny voting system that applies.
I am not sure what difference the person elected will make. However, if I hadn't voted, I wouldn't feel I had a right to moan in the future.
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I will sing unto the Lord as long as I live:
I will praise my God while I have my being.
Psalm 104 v.33
Posts: 1037 | From: Wherever the car has stopped at the moment! | Registered: Dec 2001
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Doublethink.
Ship's Foolwise Unperson
# 1984
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Posted
I will feel I have the right to moan, as I voted for a party that didn't propose introducing this system in the first place.
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All political thinking for years past has been vitiated in the same way. People can foresee the future only when it coincides with their own wishes, and the most grossly obvious facts can be ignored when they are unwelcome. George Orwell
Posts: 19219 | From: Erehwon | Registered: Aug 2005
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Snags
Utterly socially unrealistic
# 15351
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Posted
Well, I'm supposed to be going away tonight, but I'm going to do my best to find the time to spoil my ballot before I do. Every candidate here is party-political, and that just feels profoundly wrong.
I've considered voting tactically, just to stop the Tory bloke who's pro-G4S, but there's absolutely no chance he won't win anyway around here.
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Vain witterings :-: Vain pretentions :-: The Dog's Blog(locks)
Posts: 1399 | From: just north of That London | Registered: Dec 2009
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GeoffH
Shipmate
# 133
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Moth:
quote:
Originally posted by Anglican't:
quote:
Originally posted by leo:
The whole election is an ill-thought-out smokescreen in the semblance of democracy.
Well it's more democratic than the current set up.
But is it? I used to be an independent member of my local police authority a few years back. I applied for the position, which was advertised in the local newspaper, and was appointed against strong competition after a lengthy interview process. There were 16 members, 5 independent like me, the rest a mix of local councillors and magistrates.
The authority was non-political in practice, and I thought very effective in holding the police to account. My own experience, coming from a non-policing background, was that the weak link in the tripartite system for police governance was the Home Office, which employed as stupid a bunch of people as it has ever been my misfortune to meet. I could tell any number of stories, but perhaps the most telling was the missive that informed is that 'all police forces must be performing in the top quartile by this time next year'.
I shall be spoiling my ballot in the forthcoming election by writing a little diatribe on the ballot paper against this silly and ill thought out scheme. I have read all the information put out by the candidates, and most of them have not the faintest idea what their powers will be, and keep promising things they won't have any power to deliver.
I suspect central government didn't like police authorities because they were too effective at telling the Home Office/ministry of Justice where to go. If we didn't think their plans would benefit Borsetshire, we didn't agree to them, and under the tripartite system, they couldn't make us. Central governments never want true localism. They want one has-been party member in place instead, to do what they want, or to be too clueless to object.
I spoit my voting paper
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Geoff H - an unreconstructed proddy
Posts: 305 | From: UK | Registered: May 2001
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Shire Dweller
Shipmate
# 16631
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Posted
The Polling Station is in my Church; a mid 1990's affair that the Church does own and control but is also used as a community centre, which is why elections are there rather than closing the local Primary school (Sorry children, I did enjoy it when my infants school was closed on polling day in the 1980s but you'll just have to go)
I don't know how much we get paid, but its nice to get paid and our PCC very much like rub-along time* of having community things go on in our Church
I was there at 08:15 and was told by a friend who's one of the Clerks, I was the first one. I voted for the independent as he won BBC Midlands Today Unsung Hero 2011. Seemed as good a reason to vote for him as anyone else!
*I was going to call it outreach opportunities but that's too strong a phrase as we don't stand there “being Christian” amongst the polling booths or Zumba class.
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Right around the Wrekin
Posts: 77 | From: Shropshire | Registered: Sep 2011
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Doublethink.
Ship's Foolwise Unperson
# 1984
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Posted
I rather liked Jeremy Hardy's advice on twitter:
quote:
Only vote for a police commissioner who will project a bat symbol on the sky
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All political thinking for years past has been vitiated in the same way. People can foresee the future only when it coincides with their own wishes, and the most grossly obvious facts can be ignored when they are unwelcome. George Orwell
Posts: 19219 | From: Erehwon | Registered: Aug 2005
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que sais-je
Shipmate
# 17185
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by leo:
If I took the police one, it would count as a spoilt paper, regardless of what i did with it. I did not want to contribute to the turnout figures.
It's true the spoiled ballots contribute to the turn out figures but the number of spoiled ballots is also recorded and gives a measure of disaffection.
I spoiled mine, so as we're both in Bristol maybe it cancels out!
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"controversies, disputes, and argumentations, both in philosophy and in divinity, if they meet with discreet and peaceable natures, do not infringe the laws of charity" (Thomas Browne)
Posts: 794 | From: here or there | Registered: Jun 2012
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