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Source: (consider it)
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Thread: Cover your eyes, Jonny!
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Tubbs
Miss Congeniality
# 440
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by mr cheesy:
quote:
Originally posted by Tubbs:
High profile cases get publicity. Sympathetic reporting adds to the narrative that Christians are persecuted for doing every day, Christian stuff like praying or wearing a crucifix. This helps with fund-raising.
I don't think this is really about fund-raising. Christian Concern and the Christian Legal Centre have very small budgets and the lawyers work pro bono.
It's not a project to make or raise money, it's simply a crusade. An effort to get the message out.
quote:
It also helps is that people get bored with news stories so when verdict comes in - and they lose - there's less noise.
I always feel sorry for the poor saps who get involved with them. A good lawyer should, IMO, tell a client whether or not they have a reasonable case. Looking at some of the employment cases, it’s been obvious from the first story they were likely to lose.
Tubbs
I'd be very surprised if any of the clients ever were given the impression that they had a chance of winning.
The large “Donate” button on every page of the website must be a coincidence then. Every page.
You’re right, this is a crusade. If they win a case, it proves that Christians’ are being persecuted. If they don’t, it’s because the law is unfair and discriminatory. They totally have an agenda.
But I think you're wrong about the potential impression they give clients.
All the accounts of cases suggest that the client is completely blameless. Just innocently going about their Christian business. Inconvenient facts are glossed over. Such as the claimant ignoring requests to stop the behaviour after complaints from other staff / clients.
Everything suggests that the cases have a reasonable chance of success. (Just donate so they can fight on!)
I don’t believe they say anything different to clients. Even when it's glaringly obvious there is little chance of success.
For example:
Nurse sacked for occasionally offering to pray with patients was asked to stop after eight patients complained and didn't. One cancer sufferer claimed she told him he’d have a better chance of survival if he prayed.
Christian suspended for giving a Christian book to a Muslim college was disciplined for misusing her authority over a junior member of her staff and ignored warnings about the negative impact her spiritual life was having on her work.
Tubbs
(Fixed URL. Goddammit Tubbs...)
[ 13. September 2017, 11:58: Message edited by: Tubbs ]
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"It's better to keep your mouth shut and be thought a fool than open it up and remove all doubt" - Dennis Thatcher. My blog. Decide for yourself which I am
Posts: 12701 | From: Someplace strange | Registered: Jun 2001
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mr cheesy
Shipmate
# 3330
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Tubbs:
The large “Donate” button on every page of the website must be a coincidence then. Every page.
I don't think this disproves what I've said: namely that the funds they raise are relatively small, their costs are limited and they're not a wealthy organisation with palatal offices. The purpose of taking on cases is not to raise funds - and they make limited efforts to raise money.
quote:
You’re right, this is a crusade. If they win a case, it proves that Christians’ are being persecuted. If they don’t, it’s because the law is unfair and discriminatory. They totally have an agenda.
Right, but as I was making the case above, the agenda is not about anything other than signalling to a particular constituency.
Winning or losing is less relevant that being seen in the national media standing up for biblical values.
quote:
But I think you're wrong about the potential impression they give clients.
All the accounts of cases suggest that the client is completely blameless. Just innocently going about their Christian business. Inconvenient facts are glossed over. Such as the claimant ignoring requests to stop the behaviour after complaints from other staff / clients.
Everything suggests that the cases have a reasonable chance of success. (Just donate so they can fight on!)
I don’t believe they say anything different to clients. Even when it's glaringly obvious there is little chance of success.
OK, well that's not the impression I get. But you're going to have to read between the lines to get to what I think because I'm not prepared to spell it out here.
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arse
Posts: 10697 | Registered: Sep 2002
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Callan
Shipmate
# 525
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
quote:
Originally posted by Adeodatus:
quote:
Originally posted by Huia:
Maybe the real reason the boy was upset was because he wanted to wear a dress too. ![[Devil]](graemlins/devil.gif)
Huia
I wouldn't be surprised. Many's the time I've strolled through Marks', envious of the clothing choices women have. Men's clothes are so dull, and...
... and I'm saying this in public, aren't I? ![[Hot and Hormonal]](icon_redface.gif)
Hey, I'm as straight as a Roman Road but totally agree.
Blimey, what are you two like. The two biggest complaints I hear from women are a) high heels and b) inadequate pockets. If I had to dress like that I'd start thinking that Valerie Solanas was onto something.
And I speak as a man who begins wedding rehearsals with the line - you're a modern woman and I am an Anglo-Catholic clergyman so I can say with confidence that I have more experience of wearing a long white dress than you do.
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How easy it would be to live in England, if only one did not love her. - G.K. Chesterton
Posts: 9757 | From: Citizen of the World | Registered: Jun 2001
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Callan
Shipmate
# 525
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Tubbs:
quote:
Originally posted by Doc Tor:
Half a million quid a year. Make of that what you will.
Interesting definition of small ... ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
That's quite impressive. They see more money than my Grade 1 listed church does which has had the roof fixed at the governments expense and added an extension in the last couple of years and by several orders of magnitude to the PTA, whose accounts I am currently trying to sort out. I bet they are not in the same league as, say, the RSPCA or the British Legion, but half a million is a tidy sum of money for bringing frivolous lawsuits against the government.
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How easy it would be to live in England, if only one did not love her. - G.K. Chesterton
Posts: 9757 | From: Citizen of the World | Registered: Jun 2001
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jbohn
Shipmate
# 8753
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by mousethief:
quote:
Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
Often RSV ime.
I'm not sure anybody over here still uses the RSV. Maybe the United Methodists.
Spotted last week in the pews of our Lutheran congregation.
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We are punished by our sins, not for them.
--Elbert Hubbard
Posts: 989 | From: East of Eden, west of St. Paul | Registered: Nov 2004
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quetzalcoatl
Shipmate
# 16740
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Posted
It's the stupidity of such people that amazes me. The father said that trans kids weren't bullied or rejected, which of course, is what he is doing. They said that other parents should be consulted - why? They said that boys wearing skirts is not Biblical - really? So kilts are from Satan?
Why is there so much stupidity in the world? Has Satan poisoned them?
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I can't talk to you today; I talked to two people yesterday.
Posts: 9878 | From: UK | Registered: Oct 2011
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Bishops Finger
Shipmate
# 5430
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Posted
Logical, joined-up thinking is not to be expected from 'we-as-Christians' types, IME.
IJ
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Our words are giants when they do us an injury, and dwarfs when they do us a service. (Wilkie Collins)
Posts: 10151 | From: Behind The Wheel Again! | Registered: Jan 2004
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Helen-Eva
Shipmate
# 15025
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by quetzalcoatl:
They said that boys wearing skirts is not Biblical - really?
Jesus always seems to wear a skirt as here
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I thought the radio 3 announcer said "Weber" but it turned out to be Webern. Story of my life.
Posts: 637 | From: London, hopefully in a theatre or concert hall, more likely at work | Registered: Aug 2009
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Doc Tor
Deepest Red
# 9748
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Helen-Eva:
quote:
Originally posted by quetzalcoatl:
They said that boys wearing skirts is not Biblical - really?
Jesus always seems to wear a skirt as here
(this link auto-plays god-awful Christian music from the off - my ears are bleeding, so yours don't have to - DT HH)
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Forward the New Republic
Posts: 9131 | From: Ultima Thule | Registered: Jul 2005
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balaam
Making an ass of myself
# 4543
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Posted
Holy Crap. That is really, really bad. ![[Projectile]](graemlins/puke2.gif)
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Last ever sig ...
blog
Posts: 9049 | From: Hen Ogledd | Registered: May 2003
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Bishops Finger
Shipmate
# 5430
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Posted
From that bl**dy link:
'The friendliest little place on the
web for Christian Music, Worship CD's and Instrumentals. We make it easy to enjoy our Praise Music, just Click and Listen!'
DO NOT DO IT!
You. Have. Been. Warned.
IJ
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Our words are giants when they do us an injury, and dwarfs when they do us a service. (Wilkie Collins)
Posts: 10151 | From: Behind The Wheel Again! | Registered: Jan 2004
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Gee D
Shipmate
# 13815
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by quetzalcoatl:
It's the stupidity of such people that amazes me. The father said that trans kids weren't bullied or rejected, which of course, is what he is doing. They said that other parents should be consulted - why? They said that boys wearing skirts is not Biblical - really? So kilts are from Satan?
Why is there so much stupidity in the world? Has Satan poisoned them?
My father always said to be wary of men wearing skirts - they played the bagpipes. Hard to disagree with that.
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Not every Anglican in Sydney is Sydney Anglican
Posts: 7028 | From: Warrawee NSW Australia | Registered: Jun 2008
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Helen-Eva
Shipmate
# 15025
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by balaam:
Holy Crap. That is really, really bad.
Really sorry - I had my computer on mute and didn't realise!
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I thought the radio 3 announcer said "Weber" but it turned out to be Webern. Story of my life.
Posts: 637 | From: London, hopefully in a theatre or concert hall, more likely at work | Registered: Aug 2009
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mousethief
Ship's Thieving Rodent
# 953
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by jbohn:
quote:
Originally posted by mousethief:
quote:
Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
Often RSV ime.
I'm not sure anybody over here still uses the RSV. Maybe the United Methodists.
Spotted last week in the pews of our Lutheran congregation.
Go to.
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This is the last sig I'll ever write for you...
Posts: 63536 | From: Washington | Registered: Jul 2001
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Golden Key
Shipmate
# 1468
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Posted
mr cheesy--
quote:
Originally posted by mr cheesy:
This isn't entirely related, but this weeks episode of This American Life gave a thoughtful angle on a difficult issue. It's about a programme where a group of black students were recruited and placed in white majority schools with the deliberate intention to challenge racist attitudes.
Another one that deals with some similar issues is "550: Three Miles".
quote:
There’s a program that brings together kids from two schools. One school is public and in the country’s poorest congressional district. The other is private and costs $43,000/year. They are three miles apart. The hope is that kids connect, but some of the public school kids just can’t get over the divide. We hear what happens when you get to see the other side and it looks a lot better.
It's been a couple of years since I heard it. But IIRC some of it is wrenching. The African-American kids had a rough time. But it's a really good episode.
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Blessed Gator, pray for us!
--"Oh bat bladders, do you have to bring common sense into this?" (Dragon, "Jane & the Dragon")
--"Oh, Peace Train, save this country!" (Yusuf/Cat Stevens, "Peace Train")
Posts: 18601 | From: Chilling out in an undisclosed, sincere pumpkin patch. | Registered: Oct 2001
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jbohn
Shipmate
# 8753
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by mousethief:
quote:
Originally posted by jbohn:
quote:
Originally posted by mousethief:
quote:
Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
Often RSV ime.
I'm not sure anybody over here still uses the RSV. Maybe the United Methodists.
Spotted last week in the pews of our Lutheran congregation.
Go to.
Er...? (Not quite sure what you meant there...)
In any case, I was not quite correct - they use the New Revised Standard Version.
[ 18. September 2017, 15:01: Message edited by: jbohn ]
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We are punished by our sins, not for them.
--Elbert Hubbard
Posts: 989 | From: East of Eden, west of St. Paul | Registered: Nov 2004
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Martin60
Shipmate
# 368
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Posted
Obviously there are no Muslim boys at the school as they can wear BOTH concurrently!!!!
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Love wins
Posts: 17586 | From: Never Dobunni after all. Corieltauvi after all. Just moved to the capital. | Registered: Jun 2001
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LutheranChik
Shipmate
# 9826
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Posted
Back when dinosaurs ruled the earth and I was a teenager, we regularly cross- dressed in school for things like Spirit Week -- the male athletes would come to school in drag, somewhere between Mismatched Sock Day and School Colors Day. I'm sure that kind of thing could never happen now without some triggered Christians losing their minds.
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Simul iustus et peccator
http://www.lutheranchiklworddiary.blogspot.com
Posts: 6462 | From: rural Michigan, USA | Registered: Jul 2005
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Lyda*Rose
Ship's broken porthole
# 4544
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Posted
...or possibly fluidly gendered people who might see it as cultural appropriation.
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"Dear God, whose name I do not know - thank you for my life. I forgot how BIG... thank you. Thank you for my life." ~from Joe Vs the Volcano
Posts: 21377 | From: CA | Registered: May 2003
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