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Source: (consider it)
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Thread: Epiphany Calendar Question (TEC)
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Albertus
Shipmate
# 13356
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Og, King of Bashan:
...frigid temperatures (about 0 on the F scale) and six inches of snow. Although the kids who were supposed to portray the Magi dropped out.
not quite in the spirit imagined by Lancelot Andrewes*, is it?
quote:
... A cold coming they had of it at this time of the year, just the worst time of the year to take a journey, and specially a long journey. The ways deep, the weather sharp, the days short, the sun farthest off, in solsitio brumali, the very dead of winter.
... With them it was but vidimus, venimus ; with us it would have been but veniemus at most. Our fashion is to see and see again before we stir a foot, specially if it be to the worship of Christ. Come such a journey at such a
time? No; but fairly have put it off to the spring of the year, till the days longer, and the ways fairer, and the weather warmer, till better travelling to Christ. Our Epiphany would sure have fallen in Easter week at the soonest.
*Dead these 400 years, Hosts, so safely out of copyright
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My beard is a testament to my masculinity and virility, and demonstrates that I am a real man. Trouble is, bits of quiche sometimes get caught in it.
Posts: 6498 | From: Y Sowth | Registered: Jan 2008
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Og, King of Bashan
Ship's giant Amorite
# 9562
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Posted
Eliot, of course, borrows those lines for his "Journey of the Magi," which we read. Seemed particularly appropriate.
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"I like to eat crawfish and drink beer. That's despair?" ― Walker Percy
Posts: 3259 | From: Denver, Colorado, USA | Registered: May 2005
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keibat
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# 5287
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Posted
I've been ruminating on one of the original questions in this thread, viz., if the celebration of the Epiphany to the Magi is transferred to the Sunday following 6 January, what happens to the festival of the Baptism of our Lord? and pace the current rubrics and the various liturgical commissions, mandating the Baptism onto the immediately following Monday, it seems to me that its transfer to the subsequent Sunday, i.e. the second Sunday after 6 Jan, makes excellent pastoral and liturgical sense. There's little benefit in bewailing the dystrophy of weekday celebrations of festivals etc , and the consequent transfer to an appropriate Sunday the sabbaths and the feria were made for humankind, no vice versa; and in most parishes, Sunday congregations do offer the most obvious context to celebrate the cycle of the Church's year. So if the Epiphany occupies one Sunday, why not celebrate the Baptism also on a Sunday?
and incidentally, this is of course in any case what will happen in years where the 6 January falls on a Sunday!
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keibat from the finnish north and the lincs east rim
Posts: 93 | From: Alford, Lincs + Turku, Finland | Registered: Dec 2003
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sonata3
Shipmate
# 13653
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by keibat:
it seems to me that its transfer to the subsequent Sunday, i.e. the second Sunday after 6 Jan, makes excellent pastoral and liturgical sense. There's little benefit in bewailing the dystrophy of weekday celebrations of festivals etc , and the consequent transfer to an appropriate Sunday the sabbaths and the feria were made for humankind, no vice versa; and in most parishes, Sunday congregations do offer the most obvious context to celebrate the cycle of the Church's year. So if the Epiphany occupies one Sunday, why not celebrate the Baptism also on a Sunday?
This would, in a sense, restore a feature of the old Roman calendar, in which the Octave of the Epiphany was The Baptism of Our Lord.
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"I prefer neurotic people; I like to hear rumblings beneath the surface." Stephen Sondheim
Posts: 386 | From: Between two big lakes | Registered: Apr 2008
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Gee D
Shipmate
# 13815
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Posted
Accepting that the OP concerned TEC: the Christmas holidays here are mid-summer, schools on a long break, many people (including us) away at the beach/coast. Mid-week services work during Lent and Holy Week, but there would be no-one at one now. So St Sanity observed Epiphany last Sunday and tomorrow will observe the Baptism of Christ. Not sure what will be done tomorrow here, we shall find out.
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Not every Anglican in Sydney is Sydney Anglican
Posts: 7028 | From: Warrawee NSW Australia | Registered: Jun 2008
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Tobias
Shipmate
# 18613
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Og, King of Bashan:
Lessons and Carols type format, with readings from Luke (the Shepherds arriving at the manger and the Circumcision) Matthew (the Wise Guys appear through the Holy Innocents, broken up into four parts), TS Eliot, Rumi, and Isiah (Arise Shine).
I'm intrigued by the mention of a reading from Rumi - it could be quite appropriate, on the feast of Christ's manifestation to the Gentiles. Can you provide a link or a reference to the text you used? I would be most interested.
I've heard the T.S. Eliot reading used at Epiphany services, but it's rather too austere for my liking on what should be a festal day - and of course singularly inappropriate in this part of the world, where Epiphany is in summer!
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Vocatus atque non vocatus, Deus aderit.
Posts: 269 | From: Terra Australis Incognita | Registered: Jul 2016
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Forthview
Shipmate
# 12376
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Posted
Someone asked about the rationale for the Baptism of the Lord being celebrated on a Monday if the Epiphany is celebrated on a Sunday,be that 6th January or 7th or 8th January.I cannot answer for TEC but can explain the ideas behind the Roman calendar (which usually gives a certain inspiration to the TEC).
Epiphany is a festival commemorating the public manifestation of Christ.It may or may not have as its first inspiration a water festival held on the Nile on 6th Jan. At any rate it commemorated the baptism of Christ. The Romans took this Greek festival and added a festival commemorating the actual birth of Christ and his manifestation to the shepherds. They then commemorated principally on 6th Jan the manifestation of Christ to the ( three) Wise Men.
The Roman liturgy forgot about the Baptism recalling it however on the Octave of the Epiphany on 13th Jan with an Epiphany liturgy as on 6th Jan but the Gospel recalling the Baptism of Christ.It wasn't until 1955 that this day by decree of Pius XII took the name Baptism of Christ.It is highly unlikely, that the TEC had a Feast of the Baptism of Christ before that time.
Pope Paul VI fixed the Feast of the Baptism of Christ as the first Sunday after Epiphany or if there wasn't one on the Monday after the Sunday of Epiphany.
There is a reason for this. Before Vatican 2 weekdays without a particular feast repeated the Sunday liturgy. Since the changes following Vatican 2 every weekday has its own liturgy.
Immediately after the Sunday after or of Epiphany begins Ordinary Time and the Readings are those of the First week in Ordinary Time.If Epiphany is celebrated on a Sunday then you are only taking one day away from the Readings of Ordinary Time by celebrating the Baptism of Christ on the Monday.
Following Vatican 2 the weekly cycle of Biblical readings in the daily liturgy have received greater importance and the weekday liturgies are not simply a repeat of the Sunday liturgical readings nor indeed are there as many commemorations of saints, unless they are important to the local community.
This, at least is the rationale for the date of the Baptism of Christ which closes the Christmas cycle, apart from the Presentation of the Lord which follows 40 days after Christmas.
Posts: 3444 | From: Edinburgh | Registered: Feb 2007
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Og, King of Bashan
Ship's giant Amorite
# 9562
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Tobias:
quote:
Originally posted by Og, King of Bashan:
Lessons and Carols type format, with readings from Luke (the Shepherds arriving at the manger and the Circumcision) Matthew (the Wise Guys appear through the Holy Innocents, broken up into four parts), TS Eliot, Rumi, and Isiah (Arise Shine).
I'm intrigued by the mention of a reading from Rumi - it could be quite appropriate, on the feast of Christ's manifestation to the Gentiles. Can you provide a link or a reference to the text you used? I would be most interested.
I was hoping to find a link with just the text, but this is the best I have found. First poem on the left column, starting "Last Night I saw the realm of joy and pleasure." Read between the Magi finding Jesus, and the Magi returning by a different road.
We have been using it for a while now. I do not know what went into the decision to use it, but I think it works well.
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"I like to eat crawfish and drink beer. That's despair?" ― Walker Percy
Posts: 3259 | From: Denver, Colorado, USA | Registered: May 2005
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Tobias
Shipmate
# 18613
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Posted
What a wonderful poem - thank you!
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Vocatus atque non vocatus, Deus aderit.
Posts: 269 | From: Terra Australis Incognita | Registered: Jul 2016
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