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Source: (consider it)
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Thread: Heaven: The green blade re-riseth (gardening thread anew)
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Firenze
Ordinary decent pagan
# 619
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Posted
Tell me, what do you do with a vegetable plot over autumn/winter?
Most of my little plot is still growing - but a couple of lines - the radishes and the peas - are over or soon will be.
I can't, for the next month or so, attempt any digging or tilling, or much really beyond a bit of light deadheading. Nevertheless, I don't want to leave it either as bare earth or a weed nursery. What can I sow with minimal effort that would cover the ground, and look half decent?
Posts: 17302 | From: Edinburgh | Registered: Jun 2001
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daisydaisy
Shipmate
# 12167
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Posted
If you get the chance to plant some brassicas you'll be harvesting those around January.
Whether or not you do plant those you could try sowing some clover seeds (by the end of August) - I got some white & some red (from Simpsons seeds in Warminster) that I'll be putting around my cabbage etc seedlings this weekend because the RHS advise this is a good way to confuse little beasties.
The clover should look pretty, give the bees something to sip on and then in the spring you can dig the clover in and give the soil some extra nitrogen.
Posts: 3184 | From: southern uk | Registered: Dec 2006
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LutheranChik
Shipmate
# 9826
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Posted
Dittos on the autumn brassicas and legumous cover crops.
Non-brassica root veggies like carrots can also benefit from "cold storage" in the ground in the garden; they just need some mulching.
You can also try a fall lettuce -- some varieties have been developed to mature in the autumn.
(I write this somewhat wistfully from here in the Upper Midwest US, where autumn/winter gardening is a dodgy proposition...although author/gardener Eliot Coleman, who lives in Maine, says it's very possible to enjoy four-seasons gardening even up here.)
I've heard conflicting advice on tilling winter-fallow gardens in the spring...some gardeners argue that keeping the soil layers intact lets Mother Nature do the best job of keeping the soil healthy, while other gardeners are all about the double-digging and whatnot. I'm not sure how no-till would work with cover crops. In our family the veggie plot always got a do-over in the spring.
Here's a question for any experts out there: What are your suggestions for garden soil with high clay content? This is a new experience for me -- I've always had sandy loam or sandy garden plots, and the lack of drainage with clay is very problematic.
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Simul iustus et peccator
http://www.lutheranchiklworddiary.blogspot.com
Posts: 6462 | From: rural Michigan, USA | Registered: Jul 2005
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jackanapes
Shipmate
# 12374
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Firenze:
Tell me, what do you do with a vegetable plot over autumn/winter?
I grew kale over the winter last year - Pentland Brig and Cavolo Nero. They looked good, fed us, and laughed at the frosty weather. Oh, and they'd love to be planted next to old pea roots!
Posts: 468 | From: The bottom of my heart | Registered: Feb 2007
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daisydaisy
Shipmate
# 12167
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by LutheranChik:
...
I've heard conflicting advice on tilling winter-fallow gardens in the spring...some gardeners argue that keeping the soil layers intact lets Mother Nature do the best job of keeping the soil healthy, while other gardeners are all about the double-digging and whatnot. I'm not sure how no-till would work with cover crops. In our family the veggie plot always got a do-over in the spring.
...
In late autumn one of my allotment neighbours plans where his runner beans will go next year and digs a trench (about a foot deep) between the lines. Then during the winter he puts his kitchen compostables straight into there. Just before planting the beans he covers them over, leaving a shallow trench that he can throw buckets of water into during the growing season. He always has vast quantities of runner beans.
This is something I'd like to get organised with this year, now that I've got most of the allotment more under control.
Apart from that I seem to spend the winter catching up with friends who I've neglected and then in March (after the ground thaws) begin the allotment cycle again with a frantic dig, ready to plant in May.
Posts: 3184 | From: southern uk | Registered: Dec 2006
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LutheranChik
Shipmate
# 9826
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Posted
That's an interesting technique...Coleman talks about an old gardener he met in France who dug trenches in his cucumber bed and filled them with raw egg -- grew amazingly big cukes, supposedly.
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Simul iustus et peccator
http://www.lutheranchiklworddiary.blogspot.com
Posts: 6462 | From: rural Michigan, USA | Registered: Jul 2005
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Ferijen
Shipmate
# 4719
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Posted
In my copy of "Grow your own" magazine, which arrived today, the Dobies summer catalogue popped out, full of things you can buy now to plant through the autumn.
Potatos which should be ready for Christmas, carrot seeds which will cope with cold weather, brassicas, winter lettuces, and over wintering onions and garlic are all on my list.
Posts: 3259 | From: UK | Registered: Jul 2003
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Firenze
Ordinary decent pagan
# 619
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by daisydaisy:
The clover should look pretty, give the bees something to sip on and then in the spring you can dig the clover in and give the soil some extra nitrogen.
That sounds like an excellent idea. If it escapes into the neighbouring lawn, well and good. It can start a punch-up with the creeping buttercup.
I mean to have the plot redug and extended next spring in any case (plus new shed and small greenhouse).
Posts: 17302 | From: Edinburgh | Registered: Jun 2001
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Roseofsharon
Shipmate
# 9657
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Posted
I'm never sufficiently organised to do the green-manuring thing over winter, so have some ground-cover membrane to cover the beds once they are emptied. I can always remove it, or fold it back if I do get round to putting in anything to grow over the winter.
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Posts: 3060 | From: Sussex By The Sea | Registered: Jun 2005
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daisydaisy
Shipmate
# 12167
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Firenze:
.... new shed...
oo - I dream of a new shed. This spring some charming ![[Mad]](angryfire.gif) person tried to break into mine and got as far as pulling away the wall with the door. As a result that side is Decidedly Dodgy, and when I tried to fix it yesterday the whole structure shuddered. The situation is possibly not helped by the neighbour taking down a structure that had been tacked onto the side of it (a lean to!). But I refuse to give in and need to work out some Heath Robinson (every allotment holders architect!) solution.
Yesterday I also created a curved frame from water pipes that I had found in the shed - the idea is to cover it with netting and put it over the planted area to keep the pigeons off now that they've worked out that the owl keeping an eye on things is plastic. When I tried the frame out I realised (yet again) how much more useful it would be if I had planted in straight rows ![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif) but the current planting was to optimise some irrigation pipes that come from a rain barrel - an experiment that I'll probably not repeat.
Posts: 3184 | From: southern uk | Registered: Dec 2006
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Lamb Chopped
Ship's kebab
# 5528
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Posted
LC--we are cursed/blessed with heavy clay as well. My first suggestion would be "make adobe." But you want to grow stuff in it.
Lots and lots and lots and lots of compost.* Dig the stuff in and then pile more right on top as it becomes available. We don't dig year after year--just keep piling the compost on top and let the earthworms do their thang. Pretty good results--it's been about six years now for one plot.
Avoid the pesticides too. Our garden mostly takes care of its own pests--we usually have one crop that goes bust, but something else makes up for it. And we never get plagues of anything except squirrels (now you know I've jinxed myself). Lots of birds around to scarf up the nasties. Oh, and we had a groundhog. Does one groundhog constitute a plague? I'd say yes.
* When I say "compost" I'm using the term in a horribly loose way. We pile all our grass clippings straight on the beds immediately (slightly away from whatever plants happen to be living in it at the moment). We chop up all the leaves in fall and do the same. Potato peels, Christmas tree needles, rotten tomatoes--all tossed into the garden. (which is how we get our volunteer tomatoes). Very improper, but it works. And when spring comes, we just rake the bed to make it look a bit neater (spreading out the half-rotted leaves, etc.) and pull any weeds that have materialized. Then plant.
We don't dig clay. ![[Eek!]](eek.gif)
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Er, this is what I've been up to (book).
Oh, that you would rend the heavens and come down!
Posts: 20059 | From: off in left field somewhere | Registered: Feb 2004
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LutheranChik
Shipmate
# 9826
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Posted
I just raked about 10 pounds of weeds out of our pond...all headed for the compost pile. (I alternate the "green" layers with a bit of dirt from the woods, then dead leaves or straw; whatever is easier to procure at the moment.) If this keeps up all summer I'm going to wind up with some excellent "black gold" for the garden.
I'm also, I think, going to go for the "green manure" option and plant some clover in the fall.
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Simul iustus et peccator
http://www.lutheranchiklworddiary.blogspot.com
Posts: 6462 | From: rural Michigan, USA | Registered: Jul 2005
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Laurie17
Shipmate
# 14889
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Posted
Gosh, this is very interesting ! It recommends what my (messy)instincts lead me to. But i avoid as it is against all the rules. OR was till now ! Anything that works....
Could this work on nonclay soil too, I wonder ?
quote:
Originally posted by Lamb Chopped:
LC--we are cursed/blessed with heavy clay as well. My first suggestion would be "make adobe." But you want to grow stuff in it.
Lots and lots and lots and lots of compost.* Dig the stuff in and then pile more right on top as it becomes available. We don't dig year after year--just keep piling the compost on top and let the earthworms do their thang. Pretty good results--it's been about six years now for one plot.
Avoid the pesticides too. Our garden mostly takes care of its own pests--we usually have one crop that goes bust, but something else makes up for it. And we never get plagues of anything except squirrels (now you know I've jinxed myself). Lots of birds around to scarf up the nasties. Oh, and we had a groundhog. Does one groundhog constitute a plague? I'd say yes.
* When I say "compost" I'm using the term in a horribly loose way. We pile all our grass clippings straight on the beds immediately (slightly away from whatever plants happen to be living in it at the moment). We chop up all the leaves in fall and do the same. Potato peels, Christmas tree needles, rotten tomatoes--all tossed into the garden. (which is how we get our volunteer tomatoes). Very improper, but it works. And when spring comes, we just rake the bed to make it look a bit neater (spreading out the half-rotted leaves, etc.) and pull any weeds that have materialized. Then plant.
We don't dig clay.
I really really enjoyed reading this too.
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when thee touched my heart
I were undone like dropped blossom
Daw'r ffordd yn glir yn araf deg.
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Laurie17
Shipmate
# 14889
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Posted
So no complicated compost bins and regimes and recipees then ? This sounds very possible, practical. I am new to all this, and the books and pundits --even Gardeners Question Time, make it sound so complex involved and arcane. So this is a good antidote !
Thanks
quote:
Originally posted by LutheranChik:
I just raked about 10 pounds of weeds out of our pond...all headed for the compost pile. (I alternate the "green" layers with a bit of dirt from the woods, then dead leaves or straw; whatever is easier to procure at the moment.) If this keeps up all summer I'm going to wind up with some excellent "black gold" for the garden.
I'm also, I think, going to go for the "green manure" option and plant some clover in the fall.
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when thee touched my heart
I were undone like dropped blossom
Daw'r ffordd yn glir yn araf deg.
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Roseofsharon
Shipmate
# 9657
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Posted
I have done the straight-on-the garden thing in the past, when the amount of grass clippings coming off the garden is too much for the compost heap, for instance, and when a leylandii 'hedge' was cut back and the prunings shredded.
Haven't ever put kitchen waste directly on the soil - I can't see my neighbours putting up with the smell of rotting onion and celery (which seems to be the bulk of mine), and I can't say I much fancy it competing with the plants I grow for their fragrance.
There are snags - the grass clippings contained seeds, quite a lot of seeds as it turned out, and the beds turned into lawn (weedy lawn at that). I'm still struggling with a major grass infestation several years later.
The leylandii shreddings, unmixed with anything else are very dry, and although weed seed germination was cut right back, so was the germination of seeds I wanted to grow. I think leylandii shreddings are quite acid, too, which didn't help. This will be OK once they are completely incorporated into the soil, particularly as ours is quite alkaline, but it has been a nuisance.
The main problem with using uncomposted material is that as it rots down it uses up nitrogen - which you really want to have feeding your plants. This isn't such a problem on clay, which is very fertile anyway, but could be a problem on lighter and less fertile soils.
Also, there is a risk of spreading any plant diseases that might be on the unrotted vegetation.
Composting the stuff first will kill off most weed seeds and many plant diseases - but it is quite hard work, and time consuming to do it properly.
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Posts: 3060 | From: Sussex By The Sea | Registered: Jun 2005
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daisydaisy
Shipmate
# 12167
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Posted
the most entertaining garden I've visited used spent mushroom compost around their plants, so guess what grew prolifically in their beds ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
Posts: 3184 | From: southern uk | Registered: Dec 2006
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Ferijen
Shipmate
# 4719
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Laurie17:
So no complicated compost bins and regimes and recipees then ? This sounds very possible, practical. I am new to all this, and the books and pundits --even Gardeners Question Time, make it sound so complex involved and arcane. So this is a good antidote !
Thanks
Composting isn't complicated. I suppose if you wanted the best stuff possible, it would be, but put stuff on a heap, and if it looks a bit dry, put some wet stuff on it (vegetables etc. and a bucket of water) and if it looks a bit wet, put some dry stuff on it (I use paper shreddings). Leave it to stew and it does turn into the right stuff eventually!
Posts: 3259 | From: UK | Registered: Jul 2003
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Laurie17
Shipmate
# 14889
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Amos:
Vines like sun, and require hard pruning in the early spring. We had a couple in Boston (I doubt they were Glenora); the grapes were delicious, and they were very easy once you remembered to prune ruthlessly.
Is that Boston Lincs --or somehere warmer ? I'm in south Englandand ahve south facing warm to hot garden.
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when thee touched my heart
I were undone like dropped blossom
Daw'r ffordd yn glir yn araf deg.
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Lamb Chopped
Ship's kebab
# 5528
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Posted
Okay, time for the caveats.
If we let the grass go so long that it goes to seed (quite possible in a three week heat wave), then those clippings don't go on a garden bed. We leave them on the lawn (except, I suppose, in front where the neighbors might pitch a fit--those we would gather up and throw on a bare lawn spot in the backyard, hoping for seeds!)
Same with anything very weedy-and-seedy or known to be far too apt to grow from cuttings. Or anything that does not compost within a human lifetime (such as morning glory vines). Those get piled in a traditional (but not properly tended, boo hoo!) compost pile in the back, or else given to the city for composting. ![[Two face]](graemlins/scot_twoface.gif)
That still means we've plenty of ordinary grass clippings, leaves, miscellaneous weeds, etc. to throw into the beds. (We steal from our neighbors, too.) And I've been told that this does not in fact rob nitrogen from the soil in any appreciable amount, at least, unless you till it in. Which makes it disappear all the more quickly, so is not really recommended except at the very beginning with solid clay.
If your neighbors are apt to be offended by onion smells, you can always throw a shovel of garden dirt over the top--or do what I've seen recommended elsewhere, dig a hole in the garden bed, throw scraps in there, and keep it covered the rest of the time with a pot or earth, etc. And obviously if you have a rat problem in the neighborhood, you will want to keep their favorites out of the garden.
If you want to start a new bed, you can also try the old newspaper trick--layer about 10 sheets over the grass, etc. and cover it with mulch. Leave for six months. Then plant through the paper. Works pretty well (though we did remove the turf first).
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Er, this is what I've been up to (book).
Oh, that you would rend the heavens and come down!
Posts: 20059 | From: off in left field somewhere | Registered: Feb 2004
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Roseofsharon
Shipmate
# 9657
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Lamb Chopped:
If you want to start a new bed, you can also try the old newspaper trick--layer about 10 sheets over the grass, etc. and cover it with mulch. Leave for six months. Then plant through the paper. Works pretty well (though we did remove the turf first).
Being a bit slow to getting round to actually doing the planting through, I found that paper/cardboard rotted away and a new crop of weeds had grown before I was ready. For longer-term vegetation-smothering ground-cover I am finding some old carpet I scrounged from work when it was being replaced with new is very effective.
Can't be planted through, but it doesn't blow about in the wind when you let the retaining mulch dry out ![[Hot and Hormonal]](icon_redface.gif) and lasts for years ![[Biased]](wink.gif)
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Posts: 3060 | From: Sussex By The Sea | Registered: Jun 2005
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LutheranChik
Shipmate
# 9826
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Posted
For our compost pile I made a modest ($38 US) investment in a black plastic bin -- actually a thick but flexible sheet of ventilated black plastic that came with mounting posts; I made an oblong bin maybe 4 feet wide. I started with a foot-and-a-half layer of "brown," i.e., dead/dry organic matter -- which can be dry leaves, straw, fine sawdust, even shredded cardboard or undyed paper. I covered this with a thin layer of soil -- I actually just emptied some overwintered pots I'd neglected to empty at the time over the first layer and spread it out -- then began to layer the "green" -- kitchen peelings, washed eggshells; basically any kind of organic kitchen garbage not containing meat or fat, plus pulled weeds and other fresh plant materials. The recommended ratio, I understand, is about 2 to one brown vs. green. If the green becomes odiferous or attracts gnats and such, you can always add a thin layer of soil to cover it up.
You build three or four brown/green layers over several weeks, then turn it over in the bin with a pitchfork or other implement and let that mixture "work." You can start building new layers atop it, or top the whole thing with some straw or other dry material and then simply push some back to add green waste material, then cover it back up with the straw. If the compost doesn't seem to be breaking down quickly enough, some organic fertilizer or packaged manure can be added to it to help fuel the process.
This is the method that was explained to me, anyway. I don't think my compost pile is nearly as "hot" as the experts would recommend, since a canteloupe from some discarded innards is growing happily out of one of the ventilation holes;-), but it does seem to be breaking down gradually. We haven't had an issue with odor (although that may be because the bin is downwind of the house, at the bottom of a hill), although it sometimes attracts gnats when I'm working on a green layer.
I know people who just throw everything in/on a straw pile, without any fencing at all, and turn it over once in awhile. My research tells me this isn't the best way to compost; that nutrients are lost, and that the components take longer to break down.
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Simul iustus et peccator
http://www.lutheranchiklworddiary.blogspot.com
Posts: 6462 | From: rural Michigan, USA | Registered: Jul 2005
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daisydaisy
Shipmate
# 12167
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Roseofsharon:
...... For longer-term vegetation-smothering ground-cover I am finding some old carpet I scrounged from work when it was being replaced with new is very effective....
I became notorious for raiding skips for carpet for the allotment - it has worked wonders for suppressing the weeds before I dig. I had some reasonable sized scraps that I have put around some new fruit bushes to keep the weeds at bar, but I have learned the hard way that carpets are great hiding places for slugs so I now remove them from within striking distance of young tender tasty plants once they've done their weed-suppressing job.
Posts: 3184 | From: southern uk | Registered: Dec 2006
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Roseofsharon
Shipmate
# 9657
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Posted
I have two 3ft square compost boxes made from pieces of timber that slot together, so can be built up, or lowered to accommodate whatever quantity of compost is in each.
I have a very slow heap, which probably doesn't get nearly hot enough, so I don't compost anything with roots or seeds attached - they get cut off the bigger weeds and go to the council composter, and I use the leaves and stalks. Because we have a large 'lawn' the majority of our compostable material is grass cuttings, so to avoid a nasty slimy pan of decaying grass I save all my other compostable stuff in large, 40 litre tree-planters until Mr RoS gets the mower out, then mix the two together as it is put into the compost box. I also occasionally give it a half-hearted stir with a garden fork.
I don't get nearly enough brown material, but it seems to work OK, just very slowly. I add some newspaper, but tearing and scrunching the pages is tedious. Shredded confidential documents go in, ashes from our (wood) fire, the contents of the vacuum cleaner, cat fur, and the product of Mr RoS's infrequent haircuts. Shredded prunings get saved separately and are mixed with the grass when other material is in short supply - the grass has needed mowing all through the winter in recent years.
Each year's compost goes into one box. The other contains the previous year's compost which is still slowly cooking. In the spring the more mature mix is emptied out, either onto the beds, or into old potting compost/ bark mulch bags until I'm ready to use it. The more recent mix then gets turned into the newly emptied box, which is covered and left to cook for a further year.
Mostly it doesn't smell - only when there's a lot of kitchen waste near the top, so that also gets saved until it can go in under a load of garden waste.
Now the water butts, that's another matter I have one that is really smelly this year. Any suggestions? I've tried potassium permanganate, which has helped in the past, and there is an almost solid layer of charcoal on the top of the water. That worked for a while, but I've noticed that it's getting a bit whiffy again.
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Posts: 3060 | From: Sussex By The Sea | Registered: Jun 2005
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Wesley J
Silly Shipmate
# 6075
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Posted
My parsley, which I've had for two years now, appears to be beginning to bloom - which I think I don't want, or do I? - It's on the balcony in a rather large pot.
I may have heard that you need to replace parsley after two years or so - any suggestions?
Thank you, experts of The Green Blade! ![[Smile]](smile.gif)
[ 04. July 2009, 08:13: Message edited by: Wesley J ]
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Be it as it may: Wesley J will stay. --- Euthanasia, that sounds good. An alpine neutral neighbourhood. Then back to Britain, all dressed in wood. Things were gonna get worse. (John Cooper Clarke)
Posts: 7354 | From: The Isles of Silly | Registered: May 2004
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jackanapes
Shipmate
# 12374
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Posted
Yep, parsley is a biennial, which means it completes its life cycle over two years. When it starts to produce flower stalks, you can remove them to prolong its life, but it will cark it eventually at some point this year. Once it has flowered, you can collect seed from it for the next generation!
Posts: 468 | From: The bottom of my heart | Registered: Feb 2007
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Wesley J
Silly Shipmate
# 6075
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Posted
Lovely, jackanapes. Thank you very much!
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Be it as it may: Wesley J will stay. --- Euthanasia, that sounds good. An alpine neutral neighbourhood. Then back to Britain, all dressed in wood. Things were gonna get worse. (John Cooper Clarke)
Posts: 7354 | From: The Isles of Silly | Registered: May 2004
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Wesley J
Silly Shipmate
# 6075
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Posted
Re parsley: I guess I'll get some new ones then. RIP. They've served me well.
What companion plant would you recommend for parsley? I've actually got it in a largish rectangular pot with lovage, which seem to go together quite well.
I've got space for one other herb. (I've already got chives, lemon balm, mint and lemon thyme in other, separate pots.)
[ 04. July 2009, 08:51: Message edited by: Wesley J ]
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Be it as it may: Wesley J will stay. --- Euthanasia, that sounds good. An alpine neutral neighbourhood. Then back to Britain, all dressed in wood. Things were gonna get worse. (John Cooper Clarke)
Posts: 7354 | From: The Isles of Silly | Registered: May 2004
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daisydaisy
Shipmate
# 12167
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Wesley J:
What companion plant would you recommend for parsley?
Dill ?
Posts: 3184 | From: southern uk | Registered: Dec 2006
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LutheranChik
Shipmate
# 9826
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Posted
According to my gardening books parsley does well next to asparagus and tomatoes. If you let it flower, I think it also gets points for generally attracting good, pollinating insects to the garden.
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Simul iustus et peccator
http://www.lutheranchiklworddiary.blogspot.com
Posts: 6462 | From: rural Michigan, USA | Registered: Jul 2005
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Ferijen
Shipmate
# 4719
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by daisydaisy:
quote:
Originally posted by Roseofsharon:
...... For longer-term vegetation-smothering ground-cover I am finding some old carpet I scrounged from work when it was being replaced with new is very effective....
I became notorious for raiding skips for carpet for the allotment - it has worked wonders for suppressing the weeds before I dig. I had some reasonable sized scraps that I have put around some new fruit bushes to keep the weeds at bar, but I have learned the hard way that carpets are great hiding places for slugs so I now remove them from within striking distance of young tender tasty plants once they've done their weed-suppressing job.
Mmm I know however that some allotments ban carpet, because the backing becomes part of the ground as it rots, causing massive problems if you want to dig it in in the future (there's also something about the plastic in carpets leaking toxins, but i'm not sure how much of that is a scare story). Cardboard - if you can get enough of it - is another thing to use, though not as heavy. I've got various black plastic sacks flattened on the ground but the ground's not been levelled properly and its not very effective (bind weed manages to escape out of the gaps!)
Posts: 3259 | From: UK | Registered: Jul 2003
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Roseofsharon
Shipmate
# 9657
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Ferijen:
I've got various black plastic sacks flattened on the ground but the ground's not been levelled properly and its not very effective (bind weed manages to escape out of the gaps!)
I've used black plastic in the past (Mr RoS used to get me pieces about 6ft square that had covered pallets of stuff being delivered to work, and were just thrown out).
They were very useful, (and still are, after several years) but made lovely moist hiding places for slugs - much worse than the carpet pieces.
The trouble I have with leaving ground covered, or any bits of garden undisturbed by regular cultivation or mowing, or plantpots not moved frequently, is ants. Dozens of colonies, eating all the organic matter where they are living and turning the ground into fine clay particles, which if left long enough set like concrete.
I have had many plants killed by ants nesting in their roots.
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Posts: 3060 | From: Sussex By The Sea | Registered: Jun 2005
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daisydaisy
Shipmate
# 12167
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Ferijen:
.....the backing becomes part of the ground as it rots, causing massive problems if you want to dig it in in the future (there's also something about the plastic in carpets leaking toxins, but i'm not sure how much of that is a scare story)....
which is why I am careful to only use hessian backed wool carpets.
quote:
Originally posted by Roseofsharon:
I have had many plants killed by ants nesting in their roots.
me too - there seems to be nothing they won't tackle.
Posts: 3184 | From: southern uk | Registered: Dec 2006
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Lamb Chopped
Ship's kebab
# 5528
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Posted
Dang--do you know what kind of ants you have, and what they are after? A source of water comes to mind.
We are much blessed, appparently--there's only one plant that routinely has ants in its roots, and it's a weed.
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Er, this is what I've been up to (book).
Oh, that you would rend the heavens and come down!
Posts: 20059 | From: off in left field somewhere | Registered: Feb 2004
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daisydaisy
Shipmate
# 12167
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Posted
little black ones, and they are after food - has to be food because there is water around for birds, cats and (I would think) ants. Either that or they are just plain mean
Posts: 3184 | From: southern uk | Registered: Dec 2006
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Ferijen
Shipmate
# 4719
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Posted
Good carpets where you live Daisydaisy
Well I have spent an industrious day on the plot. We have a new shed, managed to transport it to the allotment in bits and pieces on the roof rack and got it up with minimal cursing. Very exciting.
Sadly, things growing on the plot aren't doing particularly well. The onions and garlic are OK, but the peas are being nibbled (and not growing particularly impressively), my pak choi ran straight to seed, and the potatos have been a disaster. My beans look good, so its not all bad news, but I'm wondering if I can get in another sowing of peas now before the frost comes down...
Posts: 3259 | From: UK | Registered: Jul 2003
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Lamb Chopped
Ship's kebab
# 5528
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Posted
Dang. I can't think of anything but poison that would put an ant off food, and you probably don't want to do that. Can you rent an anteater?
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Er, this is what I've been up to (book).
Oh, that you would rend the heavens and come down!
Posts: 20059 | From: off in left field somewhere | Registered: Feb 2004
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daisydaisy
Shipmate
# 12167
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Ferijen:
Good carpets where you live Daisydaisy
Oh I have my agents scouting the skips far and wide
This evening I took advanage of the long days, cool evening and full-ish moon to sow some seeds - while I prepared the soil I put the seed packet on the ground and while my back was turned somethingnibbled at the packet and left a trail of seeds all the way to a little hole that looks too small for a mouse. Hopeflly its little stomach is too full now to be interested in the remaining seeds that I scattered.
Posts: 3184 | From: southern uk | Registered: Dec 2006
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Roseofsharon
Shipmate
# 9657
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Posted
I get two kinds of ants; black ants who live under the paved areas and get up into the plant pots, and nasty biting brown ants that live in the soil and heap up mounds of fine soil amongst the plants at the lawn/flowerbed edges.
They are not after anything in particular, they just like living there, building nests and laying eggs.
You can get nematodes that kill off the larvae, but you have to dig open the nests and apply the stuff there. I have used it, and found it effective, but once the pack of nematodes is opened you have to use it all straight away.
My problem is that I have such a lot of ant colonies, and you have to locate them, dig them and treat them all in one go - and the little varmints move to another site pdq once they are disturbed.
Which is the method I am currently using - disturbing the nests as soon as I find one, so they don't get too settled and do too much damage to the plants growing there.
I look for the place where they are most active and turn the ground over with a fork to uncover their eggs. They rush around like mad things trying to move the eggs to a safer place - and just to make sure they get the message I give them a good dusting with some nasty ant-killing power. It will get washed away next time it rains, but the surviving ants have moved on by then, anyway.
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Talk about books -any books- on our rejuvenatedforum http://www.bookgrouponline.com/index.php?
Posts: 3060 | From: Sussex By The Sea | Registered: Jun 2005
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LutheranChik
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# 9826
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Posted
I was once told to kill ants by mixing dry sugar and baking soda and placing the result along their trails. The theory was that the ants would ingest the baking soda while going after the sugar, and explode. (Hey -- I don't make these things up; I just report them.) It sounded too improbable, as well as macabre, to try. But that's just me.
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Simul iustus et peccator
http://www.lutheranchiklworddiary.blogspot.com
Posts: 6462 | From: rural Michigan, USA | Registered: Jul 2005
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Lamb Chopped
Ship's kebab
# 5528
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Posted
[TANGENT ON] Why is it that odd mixtures of food are always supposed to explode, rather than doing something like turning the victim green or rotting his innards out? But no, it's "explode" every time. And does this have anything to do with cultural tendencies on the Fourth of July? ![[Snigger]](graemlins/snigger.gif) [TANGENT OFF]
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Er, this is what I've been up to (book).
Oh, that you would rend the heavens and come down!
Posts: 20059 | From: off in left field somewhere | Registered: Feb 2004
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Laurie17
Shipmate
# 14889
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Posted
poor ants
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when thee touched my heart
I were undone like dropped blossom
Daw'r ffordd yn glir yn araf deg.
Posts: 659 | From: off hand | Registered: Jun 2009
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Laurie17
Shipmate
# 14889
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Posted
my ficus elastica is doing really well now. With groups of 3,4 or5 leaves bursting out at each node and , little buds forming all the way up the stem. Also three moderate sized new leaves have burst out right at the top among the remaining 2 or 3 olde leaves ! I am so pleased (I'd really thought I was gonna lose it in the winter, at one point. )
I think this regeneration augurs well.
[ 09. July 2009, 16:37: Message edited by: Laurie17 ]
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when thee touched my heart
I were undone like dropped blossom
Daw'r ffordd yn glir yn araf deg.
Posts: 659 | From: off hand | Registered: Jun 2009
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mrs whibley
Shipmate
# 4798
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Posted
Help - I have cucumbers!
My landlady gave me a cucumber plant which she had been given by a friend (actually 3 plants but 2 of mine and all hers died).
It lives in the greenhouse and is producing loads of bumpy cucumbers. I only know about the smooth ones that come in plastic from the supermarket. How soon can I eat them? Is my Mum correct that they will go bitter if I handle them too much? Should I cut any off to give the others more room?
Any cucumber advice gladly received.
Posts: 942 | From: North Lincolnshire | Registered: Aug 2003
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LutheranChik
Shipmate
# 9826
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Posted
You don't mention the size of the bumpy cucumbers, but I'm assuming that what you are growing is a classic all-purpose cuke rather than the more highfalutin' smooth hothouse cucumbers. If that is so, your fruit are still relatively young -- am I right? -- will grow much larger and smoother as they develop, and you can use them as you would the supermarket cucumbers. Actually at the bumpy stage they make wonderful pickles, but that is a process you need to both financially and emotionally invest in, which most casual/small-scale gardeners can't or don't wish to do.
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Simul iustus et peccator
http://www.lutheranchiklworddiary.blogspot.com
Posts: 6462 | From: rural Michigan, USA | Registered: Jul 2005
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daisydaisy
Shipmate
# 12167
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Posted
mrs whibley, I was given a cuke plant that sounds just like yours - I've already eaten 2 of them and they were about 4 to 6 inches long - delicious, not at all unripe. I think these spiny ones are supposed to be smaller.
Posts: 3184 | From: southern uk | Registered: Dec 2006
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LutheranChik
Shipmate
# 9826
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Posted
Woot! My "Dwarf Bees" runner beans have flowers. We had the misfortune of very cold, wet, April-esque temperatures for about a week and a half right after I planted them, and maybe only half actually came up...so I cherish each surviving plant. I planted them around my squash hills -- I'd read somewhere that they made a good match. Depending on the flavor of the resulting beans, I'll have to double the order next year. (Perhaps because they're not very popular here, and/or some people use them in edible landscaping, the seed packets only have half as many seeds as other bean varieties.)
Meanwhile, the "Dragon Langerie" beans are growing exponentially, the succession rows of "Masai" and "Roma II" are well into their second leafing out, and even the disastrous first plantings of these two varieties have slowly come back from near death because of cold and insects...a couple of plants I thought had been lost to cutworms are fighting back with a new set of leaves.
A couple of the squashes are sprouting flower buds...some moribund "Delicata" squash plants I rescued from the trash heap are actually flowering, but perhaps only due to stress...my bought-from-starts canteloupe are also flowering, but I have my doubts that anything will come of this because the vines are still so small.
The "Irish Cobbler" potatoes are growing inches every day, which is keeping me busy trying to mulch them with straw up to the leaves. All the tomatoes are doing well, and as my late aunt used to tell me with confidence, the seed-raised plants are growing twice as fast as their storebought counterparts as if trying to catch up. And I think they might. The "Stupice" has an infant 'mato on it, and other varieties are just beginning to bloom. (These are all venerable OP heirlooms, so I have no aspirations of growing the first ripe tomato in the neighborhood. I just want the best-tasting.;-))
Everything else is slow and steady. My "Mascara" leaf lettuce, which is the most intensely red lettuce I've ever seen, is just a few days away from the first harvest.
Considering the sad state of this garden this spring -- acid soil completely covered with moss and filled with tree roots that I hand-pulled and cut with pruning shears for hours just to be able to cultivate the plot, "the big chill," flooding at one end -- it's doing very well for its first year, I think.
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Simul iustus et peccator
http://www.lutheranchiklworddiary.blogspot.com
Posts: 6462 | From: rural Michigan, USA | Registered: Jul 2005
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M.
Ship's Spare Part
# 3291
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Posted
Lutheranchick wrote:
quote:
Meanwhile, the "Dragon Langerie" beans are growing exponentially...
Was I the only one who boggled at the idea of Dragon Lingerie?
Anyway...
Our vine has grapes for the first time this year: is there anything I should know? At the moment, they are swelling visibly day by day with the rain but I suppose I need to hope for sun later in the year. We will net them as they get bigger but - anything else, anyone?
(We're in southern England, vine is outside in a pot in a sunny corner)
M.
Posts: 2303 | From: Lurking in Surrey | Registered: Sep 2002
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