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Source: (consider it)
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Thread: TechGeek Thread
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Jengie jon
Semper Reformanda
# 273
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Posted
Well I can tell you seriously that a lot of re-writing of the student registration system happened the year after we put the programmers who wrote it on the registration desks. They were there because we desperately needed people to work on the desks, not so they would get to use the system.
Jengie
[ 20. May 2015, 14:28: Message edited by: Jengie jon ]
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"To violate a persons ability to distinguish fact from fantasy is the epistemological equivalent of rape." Noretta Koertge
Back to my blog
Posts: 20894 | From: city of steel, butterflies and rainbows | Registered: May 2001
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lilBuddha
Shipmate
# 14333
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Posted
Response to Amorya:
Well, no. Not to say all the problems you state don't exist, they do. Just that programmers, left to their own devices, would not develop some wonderful, user-friendly interface.
Not saying they are more fucked up than any other part of the system, just that they are not less.
[ 20. May 2015, 14:33: Message edited by: lilBuddha ]
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I put on my rockin' shoes in the morning
Hallellou, hallellou
Posts: 17627 | From: the round earth's imagined corners | Registered: Dec 2008
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Karl: Liberal Backslider
Shipmate
# 76
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Amorya:
quote:
Originally posted by Jengie jon:
Actually the big problem is most of the programmers whether Windows or Mac do not use the interface. They are programmers, they write code. I would not mind betting a good number of them had a very unfriendly form of linux on their machine.
That's not fair! Most programmers use the system they develop for.
You want someone to blame for programs that are hard and illogical to use? Blame clients who want it done next week, and then change their mind on what 'it' is on Thursday. Blame project managers who go along with that rather than push back, and then tell their developers to work overtime for a while to make it happen. Blame everyone who promises to work miracles on crazy deadlines, then delivers something half-arsed. Blame anyone who doesn't know the difference between a graphic designer and an interaction designer, and commissions the former to do the latter's job.
Blame programmers in general, for not forming a union, gaining some professional pride, and telling their bosses that it is unreasonable to demand the impossible. But don't blame any one individual programmer — fighting against this industry alone would be a quick way to get fired!
It sucks to deliver a bad, rushed, cobbled together app. But the situation wasn't set up by the programmer. It's like blaming the cashier because the you don't like the range of merchandise in a shop.
Not so fast. It's programmers who write software that demands write access to protected areas of the file system at run time. It's programmers who write software that cannot cope with a move of a file data store without a reinstallation of the entire app. God knows why, unless they enjoy making life hell for system admins and forcing insecure configurations for their crap to run.
[ 20. May 2015, 14:37: Message edited by: Karl: Liberal Backslider ]
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Might as well ask the bloody cat.
Posts: 17938 | From: Chesterfield | Registered: May 2001
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Amorya
Ship's tame galoot
# 2652
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
Not so fast. It's programmers who write software that demands write access to protected areas of the file system at run time. It's programmers who write software that cannot cope with a move of a file data store without a reinstallation of the entire app. God knows why, unless they enjoy making life hell for system admins and forcing insecure configurations for their crap to run.
And I'd wager for every one of those, there was an awkward conversation with a manager:
"We need that data file loading code finished this week! What's it's status?"
"It's mostly working, but we need to make sure it can cope with moving the file without having to reinstall the app."
"How long will that take?"
"I'm not sure… a couple of days?"
"That's too long. How many customers are likely to move data files about?"
"Erm…"
"1%? 10?"
"More like 1%. But…"
"Leave it, it's not important. We'll come back to it for version 2."
*programmer goes back to desk, well aware that nobody will ever revisit this for version 2, but that there are more important things to push back on, such as how the login flow currently rejects anyone with accented characters in their name.*
Posts: 2383 | From: Coventry | Registered: Apr 2002
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lilBuddha
Shipmate
# 14333
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Posted
Good gods, this is all so bullshit I don't know who to deride first.
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I put on my rockin' shoes in the morning
Hallellou, hallellou
Posts: 17627 | From: the round earth's imagined corners | Registered: Dec 2008
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Sioni Sais
Shipmate
# 5713
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Amorya:
quote:
Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
Not so fast. It's programmers who write software that demands write access to protected areas of the file system at run time. It's programmers who write software that cannot cope with a move of a file data store without a reinstallation of the entire app. God knows why, unless they enjoy making life hell for system admins and forcing insecure configurations for their crap to run.
And I'd wager for every one of those, there was an awkward conversation with a manager:
"We need that data file loading code finished this week! What's it's status?"
"It's mostly working, but we need to make sure it can cope with moving the file without having to reinstall the app."
"How long will that take?"
"I'm not sure… a couple of days?"
"That's too long. How many customers are likely to move data files about?"
"Erm…"
"1%? 10?"
"More like 1%. But…"
"Leave it, it's not important. We'll come back to it for version 2."
*programmer goes back to desk, well aware that nobody will ever revisit this for version 2, but that there are more important things to push back on, such as how the login flow currently rejects anyone with accented characters in their name.*
Why worry? Is anyone ever going to test the bloody thing before it goes live? No, they wait until it fails, usually last thing Friday then get in a panic demanding an even more hurried fix (plus the head of John the Baptist on a plate).
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"He isn't Doctor Who, he's The Doctor"
(Paul Sinha, BBC)
Posts: 24276 | From: Newport, Wales | Registered: Apr 2004
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no prophet's flag is set so...
Proceed to see sea
# 15560
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Posted
Whatever the platform, i.e., the operating system, the future should be interoperability. Things should just go. If you want to tinker you should be able to, but there should be no requirement to do so.
I like the open source model of software as well. Which is free as in beer. If something does not run right, others can tinker with it and fix it.
My office software and hardware costs have gone from ~$10K per year to less than $1000 by running everything open source and not caring what devices or operating systems people want to us. Security is taken care of by one-time passwords.
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Out of this nettle, danger, we pluck this flower, safety.
\_(ツ)_/
Posts: 11498 | From: Treaty 6 territory in the nonexistant Province of Buffalo, Canada ↄ⃝' | Registered: Mar 2010
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Stercus Tauri
Shipmate
# 16668
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by lilBuddha:
[QUOTE]
...Difficult to learn? My nephew, who learned computers on Win 7 had no difficulty switching to Win 8. He also has no problem with Linux. Children, IME, have no problems switching. .
Children do not, or ought not to, use the computer for their daily employment - they play with them. Being forced to take several days out of work without notice, with people waiting for you to learn a new system, and then finding that some of your critical software will no longer run is as stupid and unnecessary as disabling the engine in your car because the manufacturer wants to sell you a new one before you have any need for it. The computer is a power tool, confound it, a domestic appliance, not an end in itself.
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Thay haif said. Quhat say thay, Lat thame say (George Keith, 5th Earl Marischal)
Posts: 905 | From: On the traditional lands of the Six Nations. | Registered: Sep 2011
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Karl: Liberal Backslider
Shipmate
# 76
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Amorya:
quote:
Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
Not so fast. It's programmers who write software that demands write access to protected areas of the file system at run time. It's programmers who write software that cannot cope with a move of a file data store without a reinstallation of the entire app. God knows why, unless they enjoy making life hell for system admins and forcing insecure configurations for their crap to run.
And I'd wager for every one of those, there was an awkward conversation with a manager:
"We need that data file loading code finished this week! What's it's status?"
"It's mostly working, but we need to make sure it can cope with moving the file without having to reinstall the app."
"How long will that take?"
"I'm not sure… a couple of days?"
"That's too long. How many customers are likely to move data files about?"
"Erm…"
"1%? 10?"
"More like 1%. But…"
"Leave it, it's not important. We'll come back to it for version 2."
*programmer goes back to desk, well aware that nobody will ever revisit this for version 2, but that there are more important things to push back on, such as how the login flow currently rejects anyone with accented characters in their name.*
That excuse might just wash for the data directory move, but there's no excuse for writing code that demands write access to HKLM\Software or %PROGRAMFILES%\ at run time in the first place. Just don't. Ever.
Posts: 17938 | From: Chesterfield | Registered: May 2001
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lilBuddha
Shipmate
# 14333
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Stercus Tauri:
Children do not, or ought not to, use the computer for their daily employment - they play with them. Being forced to take several days out of work without notice, with people waiting for you to learn a new system,
Hire people who are less stupid. Seriously, it isn't rocket surgery.
And your currently beloved OS faced the same change in the past. People survived.
quote:
Originally posted by Stercus Tauri:
and then finding that some of your critical software will no longer run
OK, it is annoying when the software you have won't run on the new OS. And sometimes it is the fault of the OS. But forever needing to support legacy shite is one thing that keeps MS in the past and causes many, many, many problems.
And again, users users have been complaining for years about lack of real change and bugs and patches.
quote:
Originally posted by Stercus Tauri:
is as stupid and unnecessary as disabling the engine in your car because the manufacturer wants to sell you a new one before you have any need for it.
The flip side of this is you would be still knapping flint with antler bone and binding it to a stick with rawhide strips if your philosophy prevailed.
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I put on my rockin' shoes in the morning
Hallellou, hallellou
Posts: 17627 | From: the round earth's imagined corners | Registered: Dec 2008
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Penny S
Shipmate
# 14768
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Posted
There may have been a very good set of reasons why people went on knapping flint long after the introduction of metal tools. Which they did.
Heck, I still use unknapped flint up the garden if I can't find a purpose made tool to hand. Probably not a good argument, that one, though, because it's to do with my wanting the job done now this minute and not wanting to put everything down and go and find the tool. Laziness in other words. My garden is over full of flints. Some of which someone seems to have worked on for me, though not to museum standard.
But back in the past, reasons would have included:
1. Flint was sharper.
2. Flint did the job better.
3. Individual users could produce their own tools without having to go to the supplier (the smith) for a new one.
4. Individual users could maintain their own tools without having to go to technical support (the smith again).
5. Flint was cheaper.
6. Flint was not constantly being redesigned, superseding the previous version and requiring completely new skills. It was possible, until truly modern man came along, to use the same design successfully for thousands of years. And even then, no-one would insist that you immediately adopted the new cutting edge version in order for consistency across the region.
7. Flint did not result in all tool supply being monopolised by a few producers who controlled what you could use.
Posts: 5833 | Registered: May 2009
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lilBuddha
Shipmate
# 14333
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Posted
And yet, we are communicating on computers, not passing messages through traveling merchants.
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I put on my rockin' shoes in the morning
Hallellou, hallellou
Posts: 17627 | From: the round earth's imagined corners | Registered: Dec 2008
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anoesis
Shipmate
# 14189
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Amorya:
quote:
Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
Not so fast. It's programmers who write software that demands write access to protected areas of the file system at run time. It's programmers who write software that cannot cope with a move of a file data store without a reinstallation of the entire app. God knows why, unless they enjoy making life hell for system admins and forcing insecure configurations for their crap to run.
And I'd wager for every one of those, there was an awkward conversation with a manager:
"We need that data file loading code finished this week! What's it's status?"
"It's mostly working, but we need to make sure it can cope with moving the file without having to reinstall the app."
"How long will that take?"
"I'm not sure… a couple of days?"
"That's too long. How many customers are likely to move data files about?"
"Erm…"
"1%? 10?"
"More like 1%. But…"
"Leave it, it's not important. We'll come back to it for version 2."
*programmer goes back to desk, well aware that nobody will ever revisit this for version 2, but that there are more important things to push back on, such as how the login flow currently rejects anyone with accented characters in their name.*
I can attest to this, vicariously. My partner is a software development manager and has worked for several companies who are marketing products for which you would think "It works - all the time" would be an absolutely critical specification, but no, as far as I can tell, the only thing that prevails in the minds of bean-counters are - well, beans. He has reached a point where he is perpetually stressed out and unhappy, and as far as I can tell, the major contributors to this are a.) as a technical person, extreme discomfort with having accept things being done badly in a technical sense, and b.) as a manager, extreme discomfort with having to ask/require/encourage other technical people to lower their standards and just get on and do things quickly and shoddily. And then c.) having to put in considerable work to shore up all the poor morale that this approach causes among technical people. It's so utterly fucked up it's almost more fucked up than working for a quasi-governmental institution in which everything happens unimaginably slowly because even though practically everyone working in the place has a higher degree, no-one can so much as crack their thumbs without consulting a policy manual, which is a reasonable description of my own place of work.
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The history of humanity give one little hope that strength left to its own devices won't be abused. Indeed, it gives one little ground to think that strength would continue to exist if it were not abused. -- Dafyd --
Posts: 993 | From: New Zealand | Registered: Oct 2008
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Stercus Tauri
Shipmate
# 16668
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by lilBuddha:
quote:
Originally posted by Stercus Tauri:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Stercus Tauri:
[qb]
is as stupid and unnecessary as disabling the engine in your car because the manufacturer wants to sell you a new one before you have any need for it.
The flip side of this is you would be still knapping flint with antler bone and binding it to a stick with rawhide strips if your philosophy prevailed.
Note the key phrase:
...the manufacturer wants to sell you a new one before you have any need for it.
I am not so stupid that I can't recognise the need for a more capable tool for the job that I want to do, but I prefer to make that decision for myself - as I have done many times - and not have it forced on me at a time when work will be seriously disrupted.
The concept of real work and delivering real things to real customers in real time is difficult to explain to people whose gods are software companies and computers that can only be satisfied with living sacrifices.
But you can ignore all this. I'll get over it - until next time.
(We haven't got any flint around here. It's mostly limestone where it isn't gravel beds, so we have to make do with the antlers and bones).
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Thay haif said. Quhat say thay, Lat thame say (George Keith, 5th Earl Marischal)
Posts: 905 | From: On the traditional lands of the Six Nations. | Registered: Sep 2011
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Alan Cresswell
Mad Scientist 先生
# 31
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Posted
Here's a question.
Who is forcing you to get a new computer? If you are satisfied with the one you have got, if it runs the software you rely on, you're familiar with the OS etc, why change?
If you get new work that requires a particular piece of software that needs a computer with more resources, a particular OS etc then get that computer. It doesn't stop you continuing to use the old one - at least for the period of time it takes you to port stuff over to the new one with minimal disruption.
OK, there are issues of maintaining older computers. The steam driven 486s running some instruments we have are probably at the end of their maintainability - getting replacement parts to keep them going is getting difficult. But, that's probably an extreme example.
But, if you insist on getting the latest OS as soon as it's released and upgrading all your software every few months ... well, if that's what you want then you will have to live with the inconvenience that causes. On the other hand, Windows XP didn't stop working just because Microsoft stopped issuing updates.
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Don't cling to a mistake just because you spent a lot of time making it.
Posts: 32413 | From: East Kilbride (Scotland) or 福島 | Registered: May 2001
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Stercus Tauri
Shipmate
# 16668
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Posted
I'd been hanging on to an HP desktop that had a Pentium or equivalent, and it ran like a train with XP, flawlessly, for ages. There were eventually hardware problems that had to be fixed when some motherboard electrolytic capacitors visibly began to fail, but the real problems started when I had to install XP SP3 to be able to use Office 2010, and then numerous functions failed. It was odd that both XP machines that I used (the other is a netbook) began to behave erratically after continuing XP updates and neither would boot up normally or keep running. So a new machine was essential, meaning having to use W7, and henceforth my familiar CAD program and a number of others in daily use malfunctioned or ceased to function at all. There really wasn't any way to go back and recreate the old machine and I had no wish to do so, but this is why I am so aggravated at having the timing taken out of my own hands.
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Thay haif said. Quhat say thay, Lat thame say (George Keith, 5th Earl Marischal)
Posts: 905 | From: On the traditional lands of the Six Nations. | Registered: Sep 2011
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RuthW
liberal "peace first" hankie squeezer
# 13
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Alan Cresswell:
On the other hand, Windows XP didn't stop working just because Microsoft stopped issuing updates.
No, but there's reason they issue security patches on the operating systems they are supporting, and there are potential negative consequences to continuing to run a OS which they are no longer supporting. Google is still supporting Chrome for XP, but that will stop at the end of this year. A non-tech-savvy person should not at this point be running XP on a computer hooked up to the internet.
Posts: 24453 | From: La La Land | Registered: Apr 2001
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Penny S
Shipmate
# 14768
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Posted
So why don't they deliver software that doesn't need security patches in the first place?
I am still using XP on a netbook and a laptop, both of which have no problems online (both have up-to-date antivirus etc). The netbook could not run with SP3 as it filled up the C: drive (which was not a partition, before anyone mentions that) with that and all the updates, and then wouldn't work. So it's on SP2 and not all of the available updates, which it has squirreled away somewhere but I prevent it from installing. And it's fine.
It should have been Linux, but I was in the middle of work when my laptop needed repair and I didn't have time to learn a new OS, so I got the XP version instead.
I have a number of things which will only talk to XP - I really don't see why I should have to "upgrade" to something that doesn't do what I want it to do and which the old stuff does, just because someone somewhere wants to sell me a whole new suite of kit. And the more tech-savvy people become pensioners, but want to go on doing computery stuff, the more people are going to complain about having to spend money they don't have to keep on doing what they have been doing just fine.
And yes, I agree that that new microlith device is just brilliant for trimming sinews for sewing clothes, but it is going to take ages to try and cut up that mammoth with it.
Posts: 5833 | Registered: May 2009
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Karl: Liberal Backslider
Shipmate
# 76
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Penny S:
So why don't they deliver software that doesn't need security patches in the first place?
Because no-one, no, not even Linux' developers, has yet managed to create such an OS.
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Might as well ask the bloody cat.
Posts: 17938 | From: Chesterfield | Registered: May 2001
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Amazing Grace
High Church Protestant
# 95
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
quote:
Originally posted by Penny S:
So why don't they deliver software that doesn't need security patches in the first place?
Because no-one, no, not even Linux' developers, has yet managed to create such an OS.
And in the unlikely event that it should happen, it will probably just be temporary anyway till someone finds a hole.
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WTFWED? "Remember to always be yourself, unless you suck" - the Gator
Memory Eternal! Sheep 3, Phil the Wise Guy, and Jesus' Evil Twin in the SoF Nativity Play
Posts: 6593 | From: Sittin' by the dock of the [SF] bay | Registered: Jul 2003
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Ariel
Shipmate
# 58
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Penny S:
So why don't they deliver software that doesn't need security patches in the first place?
Because if people only bought one version and no updates then manufacturers would go out of business.
The whole thing is a rat-race. It's designed to keep you constantly spending: more and more increasingly bloated software at relatively frequent intervals, download lots of updates, until your computer can no longer handle it, so buy a new computer, and get a new operating system. Spend, spend, spend. You can only hold out for so long before the error messages flash up - "You're using an out of date version of [Something]. You won't be able to access our site/download whatever/open these files/do whatever you want until you shell out a lot more money for a new version which you probably won't like."
They could, with some care, produce versions that last longer. They just don't want to.
I'm getting sick of glowing screens, clattering keyboards, endless tiny mouse movements, a surplus of logons and passwords that all have to be changed at frequent intervals, clicking on tiny Xs, buttons that say "OK", pages that hang, stupid and unnecessary timeouts on things that don't need it, menus that begin options with "My...", and constant updates.
Posts: 25445 | Registered: May 2001
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balaam
Making an ass of myself
# 4543
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Ariel:
quote:
Originally posted by Penny S:
So why don't they deliver software that doesn't need security patches in the first place?
Because if people only bought one version and no updates then manufacturers would go out of business.
[snip]
I'm getting sick of glowing screens, clattering keyboards, endless tiny mouse movements, a surplus of logons and passwords that all have to be changed at frequent intervals, clicking on tiny Xs, buttons that say "OK", pages that hang, stupid and unnecessary timeouts on things that don't need it, menus that begin options with "My...", and constant updates.
At work we are still on Office 2003, everything we use is there, and the IT dept sees to maintenance.
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Last ever sig ...
blog
Posts: 9049 | From: Hen Ogledd | Registered: May 2003
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Amanda B. Reckondwythe
Dressed for Church
# 5521
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Posted
I'm still running Office 2003, with the Office 2007 compatibility pack on a Windows 7 Home Premium laptop, and everything is fine. I see no reason to upgrade from Office 2003. I did try Office 2007 but hated it and put 2003 back on. The laptop came with Office 2010 -- it just has to be "activated" (and paid for, of course) but I see no reason to do so.
[ 21. May 2015, 20:37: Message edited by: Amanda B. Reckondwythe ]
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"I take prayer too seriously to use it as an excuse for avoiding work and responsibility." -- The Revd Martin Luther King Jr.
Posts: 10542 | From: The Great Southwest | Registered: Feb 2004
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Penny S
Shipmate
# 14768
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Posted
And I hate ads that follow up on places I have been looking at. And now I don't know how they are doing it. I don't use Google. I don't use IE. I use Firefox and DuckDuckGo, and I can't find anything that works like whatever I did in IE and Google to stop it. Except deleting a load of cookies one at a time. I don't want to delete all of them, obviously. There were a suspicious number with "ad" in them. I'd like them never to arrive.
Posts: 5833 | Registered: May 2009
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orfeo
Ship's Musical Counterpoint
# 13878
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Posted
Many years ago there was an amusing bit of comedy about what it'd be like if any other industry tried to sell you things that weren't quite ready yet or needed continued 'upgrades', the way that computer folk do.
I think they used cars as an analogy. Although of course one does maintenance on a car, that's not quite the same as either "we'll add doors later" or "we'll keep putting so many extra features on your car each time we service it that eventually you'll need a bigger engine".
I was mightily pissed off when I upgraded my iPhone to iOS 7. Look at all the exciting extra bits of motion! The lurid colours! All the stuff that hasn't actually changed the functionality, but is making my old phone struggle to keep up!
I found out later that a number of reviews had recommended not upgrading to iOS7 on my model of phone, even though Apple offered the upgrade. But of course by then it was too late.
My phone is now slightly over 4 years old. I'm planning on buying a new one soon. But occasionally I remember that my old one might not have some of its current problems if not for the 'helpful' upgrade it received.
[ 22. May 2015, 03:06: Message edited by: orfeo ]
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Technology has brought us all closer together. Turns out a lot of the people you meet as a result are complete idiots.
Posts: 18173 | From: Under | Registered: Jul 2008
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Sioni Sais
Shipmate
# 5713
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by orfeo:
Many years ago there was an amusing bit of comedy about what it'd be like if any other industry tried to sell you things that weren't quite ready yet or needed continued 'upgrades', the way that computer folk do.
I think they used cars as an analogy. Although of course one does maintenance on a car, that's not quite the same as either "we'll add doors later" or "we'll keep putting so many extra features on your car each time we service it that eventually you'll need a bigger engine".
It's here.
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"He isn't Doctor Who, he's The Doctor"
(Paul Sinha, BBC)
Posts: 24276 | From: Newport, Wales | Registered: Apr 2004
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no prophet's flag is set so...
Proceed to see sea
# 15560
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Posted
Re MS Office. There's no reason to use any versions of paid office word processing or office suit of products. LibreOffice.org provides no cost opensource that runs on my business's server just fine. They wanted some $600 per user yearly licensing costs for MS products which is a lot of cash if you've many users. You can save in the xml docx versions of documents in Libreoffice if you want but the documents are up to 30% larger from odt which is open document format. MS products will open odt. OpenOffice is the closed source version of the same office suite.
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Out of this nettle, danger, we pluck this flower, safety.
\_(ツ)_/
Posts: 11498 | From: Treaty 6 territory in the nonexistant Province of Buffalo, Canada ↄ⃝' | Registered: Mar 2010
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Alan Cresswell
Mad Scientist 先生
# 31
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Posted
I've got OpenOffice installed on this computer (personal, so no one else to pay for MS Office). It does some really strange things opening PowerPoint files and Word documents (especially .docx ones). OK, so if someone sends me a .docx by email I can read it ... but the result isn't pretty. Plain text is OK, just don't insert a figure, table or equation.
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Don't cling to a mistake just because you spent a lot of time making it.
Posts: 32413 | From: East Kilbride (Scotland) or 福島 | Registered: May 2001
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Baptist Trainfan
Shipmate
# 15128
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Alan Cresswell:
It does some really strange things opening PowerPoint files and Word documents (especially .docx ones).
Yes, we have a laptop we use for presentations in our church. It's fine for ordinary use, but:
- it doesn't like quite a lot of the fonts we use, so substitutes others which might be a different size;
- it doesn't like fancy slides and animations;
- if showing a continuous loop, you get an extra "blank" slide each time round.
I tend to bring in my own laptop most times ...
Posts: 9750 | From: The other side of the Severn | Registered: Sep 2009
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Paul.
Shipmate
# 37
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Posted
The irony about the car joke is that cars are increasingly computerised and it's due to go to a whole new level with Apple and Google (and others) vying to be the standard "car OS" - and that's before we get to self-driving cars.
Posts: 3690 | From: UK | Registered: Jun 2004
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Baptist Trainfan
Shipmate
# 15128
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Posted
Perhaps you shouldn't have told me that - I picked up my new car TODAY!
Posts: 9750 | From: The other side of the Severn | Registered: Sep 2009
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no prophet's flag is set so...
Proceed to see sea
# 15560
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Posted
While it is possible to locate the fault with documents with Word as with Open/libre Office, though I might lean towards blaming Word and Microsoft because when thorough inter-operability was being discussed, Microsoft asserted its standard:
quote:
The ISO standardization of [Microsoft] Office Open XML was controversial and embittered, with much discussion both about the specification and about the standardization process.
Further info Is DOCX really an open standard?
quote:
ISO ... adopted the ODF (Open Document Format) back in 2006 to solve the document standardization crisis. This is the format that is used by Libre and Open office, along with most other open office suites. Such a format becoming successful would of course threaten Microsoft's already established monopoly ...[so].. they decided to create their own open standard with [docx]... when you save a document in MS Office 2010 or prior in any of the ‘X’ formats, you are not saving them in the advertised OpenXML format. This document will hence NOT be properly readable by other software such as Libre and Open Office and they will make changes to the document when they are opened and saved within them. The problem hence lies with the former [i.e. Microsoft docx], not the latter.
All of this said, I get that people married to MS Word will complain about documents not in its format. But I'm not willing to pay to fix a 'not my problem'. Saving documents in .doc or proper .odt (Open Document Format Text Document) which is used by every other word processor. Though I generally ship documents to others in .pdf instead.
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Out of this nettle, danger, we pluck this flower, safety.
\_(ツ)_/
Posts: 11498 | From: Treaty 6 territory in the nonexistant Province of Buffalo, Canada ↄ⃝' | Registered: Mar 2010
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RooK
1 of 6
# 1852
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Posted
It's also amusingly wrong-headed to think that cars are flawless when put into production, or that they haven't changed massively during their evolution. Door locks, requiring keys to start, seatbelts, bumpers, headlights, windshields, windshield wipers, ABS, airbags, crumple zones, side-impact reinforcements - all bloatware that makes cars heavier than before! Waaaah!
The main difference between software and classic physical products is the evolutionary cycle time.
Posts: 15274 | From: Portland, Oregon, USA, Earth | Registered: Nov 2001
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Baptist Trainfan
Shipmate
# 15128
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Posted
Yes.
Model T Ford: 540kg.
Fiat Topolino: 550kg.
Morris Minor: 775kg.
VW Up! (a tiny car): 950kg.
Posts: 9750 | From: The other side of the Severn | Registered: Sep 2009
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Penny S
Shipmate
# 14768
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by no prophet's flag is set so...:
While it is possible to locate the fault with documents with Word as with Open/libre Office, though I might lean towards blaming Word and Microsoft because when thorough inter-operability was being discussed, Microsoft asserted its standard:
quote:
The ISO standardization of [Microsoft] Office Open XML was controversial and embittered, with much discussion both about the specification and about the standardization process.
Further info Is DOCX really an open standard?
quote:
ISO ... adopted the ODF (Open Document Format) back in 2006 to solve the document standardization crisis. This is the format that is used by Libre and Open office, along with most other open office suites. Such a format becoming successful would of course threaten Microsoft's already established monopoly ...[so].. they decided to create their own open standard with [docx]... when you save a document in MS Office 2010 or prior in any of the ‘X’ formats, you are not saving them in the advertised OpenXML format. This document will hence NOT be properly readable by other software such as Libre and Open Office and they will make changes to the document when they are opened and saved within them. The problem hence lies with the former [i.e. Microsoft docx], not the latter.
All of this said, I get that people married to MS Word will complain about documents not in its format. But I'm not willing to pay to fix a 'not my problem'. Saving documents in .doc or proper .odt (Open Document Format Text Document) which is used by every other word processor. Though I generally ship documents to others in .pdf instead.
That's odd. When my roofer sent stuff in docx, my old MS programs wouldn't open it, but StarOffice (also OpenOffice) would. They are the only people who send me stuff in that format.
Posts: 5833 | Registered: May 2009
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orfeo
Ship's Musical Counterpoint
# 13878
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Posted
The TechGeek thread is thataway.
*points randomly away from Hell*
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Technology has brought us all closer together. Turns out a lot of the people you meet as a result are complete idiots.
Posts: 18173 | From: Under | Registered: Jul 2008
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RooK
1 of 6
# 1852
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Posted
I beg to differ.
Posts: 15274 | From: Portland, Oregon, USA, Earth | Registered: Nov 2001
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orfeo
Ship's Musical Counterpoint
# 13878
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Posted
You Bastard.
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Technology has brought us all closer together. Turns out a lot of the people you meet as a result are complete idiots.
Posts: 18173 | From: Under | Registered: Jul 2008
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Leorning Cniht
Shipmate
# 17564
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by lilBuddha:
Was, grandfather, was.
It's time for Grandpa to have another whinge. Well, the same whinge, really. This time, it's the new flat-look trend for UIs. On a phone, that probably makes sense. Your phone has a limited number of pixels, and a limited size.
On a full-size computer screen, it doesn't. 3-D cues add information. Removing them in aid of making everything a phone is unhelpful. (But yes, 3-D can be taken too far *cough* Motif *cough*).
Posts: 5026 | From: USA | Registered: Feb 2013
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RooK
1 of 6
# 1852
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Leorning Cniht:
This time, it's the new flat-look trend for UIs.
I am personally quite relieved that the irritating anachronism of skeuomorphic design is finally abating. There much more efficient ways to communicate functional transitions without wasting bandwidth by pretending to be a physical object. It is offensive to my aesthetic of form & function to bother with such mincing affectations. Especially when they're something awful, like pretending to be leather-bound.
Posts: 15274 | From: Portland, Oregon, USA, Earth | Registered: Nov 2001
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lilBuddha
Shipmate
# 14333
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by RooK:
It is offensive to my aesthetic of form & function to bother with such mincing affectations.
01010001 01110101 01101001 01110100 01100101
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I put on my rockin' shoes in the morning
Hallellou, hallellou
Posts: 17627 | From: the round earth's imagined corners | Registered: Dec 2008
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RooK
1 of 6
# 1852
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Posted
Funny.
Posts: 15274 | From: Portland, Oregon, USA, Earth | Registered: Nov 2001
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orfeo
Ship's Musical Counterpoint
# 13878
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Posted
In my mind I'm idly speculating whether the rules about writing in English are equipped to deal with a situation where a Shipmate writes in a transformed version of English, and provides a link to enable the transformation to be reversed...
Kind of reminds me of the time a printer decided it would print out a document in Wingdings font.
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Technology has brought us all closer together. Turns out a lot of the people you meet as a result are complete idiots.
Posts: 18173 | From: Under | Registered: Jul 2008
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Kelly Alves
Bunny with an axe
# 2522
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Posted
Not to change the subject, but is everybody else who has Chrome finding it is wilting like a Southern Belle in summer lately? I have had to reinstall the damn thing three times within a month.
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I cannot expect people to believe “
Jesus loves me, this I know” of they don’t believe “Kelly loves me, this I know.”
Kelly Alves, somewhere around 2003.
Posts: 35076 | From: Pura Californiana | Registered: Mar 2002
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Lamb Chopped
Ship's kebab
# 5528
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Posted
I want to know why in the hell every fucking program or website has decided to put their forms etc. into a combination of white on very light almond. Is contrast suddenly Evil™ or what? It makes me feel ancient when I can't even find the fucking box to type crap into, because I can't barely see it on the frigging screen. And if the designers are going to be such assholes about this, why is it always pale pale almond and not randomly pale pale green, or pink, or some other freaking color? You'd swear the almond conglomerate of the world is planning a takeover any minute...
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Er, this is what I've been up to (book).
Oh, that you would rend the heavens and come down!
Posts: 20059 | From: off in left field somewhere | Registered: Feb 2004
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Alan Cresswell
Mad Scientist 先生
# 31
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Posted
How do you manage to say all that about almond, and not mention anything about it being nuts?
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Don't cling to a mistake just because you spent a lot of time making it.
Posts: 32413 | From: East Kilbride (Scotland) or 福島 | Registered: May 2001
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Doc Tor
Deepest Red
# 9748
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by lilBuddha:
01010001 01110101 01101001 01110100 01100101*
Sigh. You don't get a pass on this because it's 'post-ironic' or 'meta' or whatever you young folk say these days.
Posts that are not in English require a translation immediately below. No exceptions.
DT
HH
*Quite
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Forward the New Republic
Posts: 9131 | From: Ultima Thule | Registered: Jul 2005
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Kelly Alves
Bunny with an axe
# 2522
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Alan Cresswell:
How do you manage to say all that about almond, and not mention anything about it being nuts?
Shhh, don't stop her, she's cussing like a sailor! ![[Eek!]](eek.gif)
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I cannot expect people to believe “
Jesus loves me, this I know” of they don’t believe “Kelly loves me, this I know.”
Kelly Alves, somewhere around 2003.
Posts: 35076 | From: Pura Californiana | Registered: Mar 2002
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