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Source: (consider it)
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Thread: Holy Week begins
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venbede
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# 16669
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Posted
Ta, leo.
Heaven forbid I should think Cranmer's bowdlerization of catholic liturgy in any way normative.
But thank also for answering the point as to why we have the passion gospel on Palm Sunday.
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Man was made for joy and woe;
And when this we rightly know,
Thro' the world we safely go.
Posts: 3201 | From: An historic market town nestling in the folds of Surrey's rolling North Downs, | Registered: Sep 2011
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BabyWombat
Shipmate
# 18552
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Posted
Went to a neighboring parish for their early Good Friday service. It was a simple TEC BPC Good Friday Liturgy of the Word plus solemn collects, but no veneration of the cross or communion (they’ll do that at the bigger service in the evening). Again a small congregation, mostly all retirees.
Simple yet very powerful homily referencing the poem Tenebrae by Paul Celan, and its repeated phrase “Pray Lord, you are near, pray to us.” The preacher suggested that today God indeed prays to us to make real the words of the collect: “let the whole world
see and know that things which were cast down are being
raised up, and things which had grown old are being made
new, and that all things are being brought to their perfection
by him through whom all things were made.”
It shook me deeply, for reasons I do not yet understand. And despite then going to complete holiday food shopping and several other chores, it haunts me still.
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Let us, with a gladsome mind…..
Posts: 102 | From: US | Registered: Feb 2016
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Forthview
Shipmate
# 12376
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Posted
As Leo points out the Palm ceremony was earlier on , a separate service from the Passion Sunday Mass.
Later on it was put immediately before the Mass. This is the reason why ,for those who use liturgies dating from before Vatican 2, the liturgical colour was red for the Palm ceremony and purple for the Mass of Passion Sunday.
Nowadays in the Roman liturgy (Ordinary form) the colour is red throughout
Posts: 3444 | From: Edinburgh | Registered: Feb 2007
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Gee D
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# 13815
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Posted
Yesterday, we had The Crucifixion by Henry Lawson as a reflexion. Very good, I'd not come across it before, and did not think Lawson had it in him.
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Not every Anglican in Sydney is Sydney Anglican
Posts: 7028 | From: Warrawee NSW Australia | Registered: Jun 2008
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moonfruit
Shipmate
# 15818
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Posted
We had Stations of the Cross today, using the set of images entitled Break Broken. I was particularly struck by the way the reader almost cried out "my God, my God, why have you forsaken me?" at the Crucifixion station - he really captured the desolation, and it sent shivers down my spine.
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All I know is that you came and made beauty from my mess.
Posts: 180 | From: Just outside the M25 | Registered: Aug 2010
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L'organist
Shipmate
# 17338
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Posted
We had our usual Christ's Cross with readings (mainly St John), motets and hymns.
Cross (plain, wooden) venerated at the beginning then just words and music, with pauses for reflection between.
Gobsmacked to find that the congregation was quadruple what we'd come to expect: discovered word has got out that (a) there are no sermons, and (b) that the music is good (I know, pride is a sin, etc).
After that we had choir tea and a short rehearsal for tomorrow and Sunday.
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Rara temporum felicitate ubi sentire quae velis et quae sentias dicere licet
Posts: 4950 | From: somewhere in England... | Registered: Sep 2012
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Albertus
Shipmate
# 13356
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Posted
Usual reflection, exposition of cross, and communion with pre-consecrated elements (which for some reason always seems a bit unneccessary to me). Small congregation, in the choir stalls. During the period of silence punctuated by organ music and bits of poetry and so on, which I tend to find rather intrusive, I took myself off round the church and did the Stations by myself, without a set guide. That worked very well for me.
Shan't be going to the Vigil tonight. I seem to find my liturgical tastes getting more and more stripped back these days, to a sort of plain 1662 with no need to say anything much to fill up the spaces inbetween.
Posts: 6498 | From: Y Sowth | Registered: Jan 2008
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leo
Shipmate
# 1458
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Posted
We hsd the usual - readings including John's Passion, veneration of the cross, solemn prayers and communion.
Additionally, a 'Good Friday' workshop aimed at kids, where they make things - lots of adults turned up too. My initial reaction is that the Liturgy alone should shape these days but tghese workshops seem to attract people who don't like words but are 'kinaesthetic.'
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My Jewish-positive lectionary blog is at http://recognisingjewishrootsinthelectionary.wordpress.com/
My reviews at http://layreadersbookreviews.wordpress.com
Posts: 23198 | From: Bristol | Registered: Oct 2001
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L'organist
Shipmate
# 17338
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Posted
Good Vigil service - and we had a baptism.
PP got the order of the readings out-of-kilter, but I think the choir were the only people who noticed.
Sang my favourite Easter hymn: Come, ye faithful, raise the strain of triumphant gladness to the tune St John Damascene - not only is it perfect for the vigil, but you also get to sing the wonderful word unmoistened
![[Biased]](wink.gif)
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Rara temporum felicitate ubi sentire quae velis et quae sentias dicere licet
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georgiaboy
Shipmate
# 11294
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Posted
My second Vigil here at the abbey. Excellent weather, and timing was such that we began after darkness fell.
Fire kindled in the plaza in front of the church, then all followed the Paschal Candle into the darkened building. (Including one of the community cats!)
A substitute sang the Exsultet very well, though the candle bearers flanking him held their lights too high, so not helpful to the singer.
Seven lessons, each with a responsory and a prayer. Magnificent reading of the creation saga, the reader had an understanding of Jewish poetry.
third lesson (crossing the Red Sea) led directly to the canticle following -- same lector doing both. Quite effective.
No baptisms or confirmations, but we all processed back to the font to dip our hands in the blessed water.
I miss the Litany of the Saints and feel that the blessing of the font should precede the beginning of the Eucharist; more dramatic and then the mass proceeds apace.
Brass trio with the organ sounded splendid.
Traditional Roman Canon with concelebrants taking parts of it.
Organist ended with Toccata from Widor 6th (not 5th, thank God!) and we ended precisely three hours after we began.
A lovely time was had by all -- except possibly the cat, who had to be removed at one point.
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You can't retire from a calling.
Posts: 1675 | From: saint meinrad, IN | Registered: Apr 2006
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leo
Shipmate
# 1458
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by georgiaboy:
and feel that the blessing of the font should precede the beginning of the Eucharist; more dramatic and then the mass proceeds apace.
Why? The baptisms and/or renewal of baptismal vows come instead of the creed - after the gospel.
Do do it before the mass - and the whole of the vigil is a mass - makes no sense.
If you go from the 'service of light' to the 'liturgy of initiation' that breaks with history - in the early days, the catechumens had their instruction in Old and New Testaments throughout the night before being baptised - not after their baptisms.
[ 28. March 2016, 08:47: Message edited by: leo ]
Posts: 23198 | From: Bristol | Registered: Oct 2001
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Gee D
Shipmate
# 13815
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Posted
The Apostles' Creed forms part of baptisms/renewal of vows here, rather than the renewal being an alternative to the Creed as your post suggests.
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Not every Anglican in Sydney is Sydney Anglican
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Ceremoniar
Shipmate
# 13596
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by leo:
quote:
Originally posted by georgiaboy:
and feel that the blessing of the font should precede the beginning of the Eucharist; more dramatic and then the mass proceeds apace.
Why? The baptisms and/or renewal of baptismal vows come instead of the creed - after the gospel.
Do do it before the mass - and the whole of the vigil is a mass - makes no sense.
If you go from the 'service of light' to the 'liturgy of initiation' that breaks with history - in the early days, the catechumens had their instruction in Old and New Testaments throughout the night before being baptised - not after their baptisms.
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Ceremoniar
Shipmate
# 13596
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by leo:
quote:
Originally posted by georgiaboy:
and feel that the blessing of the font should precede the beginning of the Eucharist; more dramatic and then the mass proceeds apace.
Why? The baptisms and/or renewal of baptismal vows come instead of the creed - after the gospel.
Do do it before the mass - and the whole of the vigil is a mass - makes no sense.
If you go from the 'service of light' to the 'liturgy of initiation' that breaks with history - in the early days, the catechumens had their instruction in Old and New Testaments throughout the night before being baptised - not after their baptisms.
Until 1970, the font was blessed as part of the vigil ceremonies before the start of the Mass itself. So it "makes sense" in that for many centuries that was the order of the rite, and still is for those who use the older form of the missal.
Posts: 1240 | From: U.S. | Registered: Apr 2008
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venbede
Shipmate
# 16669
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Posted
But at least there is not this silly C of E business of only blessing the Easter Candle after the OT readings. How can you read in the dark.
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Man was made for joy and woe;
And when this we rightly know,
Thro' the world we safely go.
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Adam.
Like as the
# 4991
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Posted
When you've lost any sense of the Easter Vigil being the place for Christian Initiation, it makes perfect sense to me to bless the font at around the same time as you're blessing the fire. AIUI, the post-conciliar reforms moved the blessing of the font to after the homily to restore the initiatory character of this service.
An Easter Vigil without baptisms has always felt a little like a Wellington with no beef to me, but I assume that's how it will always be in a monastery. If you don't have any baptisms, you don't get the Litany of the Saints. In a typical parish, this should be reason enough to evangelize and get some catechumens for next year! (Or a homegrown ordinand / religious vocation, so as you can attend the ordination / profession together and hear the litany there)
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Ave Crux, Spes Unica!
Preaching blog
Posts: 8164 | From: Notre Dame, IN | Registered: Sep 2003
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Brenda Clough
Shipmate
# 18061
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Posted
We have gotten good at reading in the dark, with the aid of those little clip-on halogen lights on a bendy neck. I suppose an I-pad would also do you.
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Science fiction and fantasy writer with a Patreon page
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leo
Shipmate
# 1458
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Adam.:
When you've lost any sense of the Easter Vigil being the place for Christian Initiation, it makes perfect sense to me to bless the font at around the same time as you're blessing the fire. AIUI, the post-conciliar reforms moved the blessing of the font to after the homily to restore the initiatory character of this service. profession together and hear the litany there)
I didn't know that - though i did know that it used to happen on Holy Saturday MORNING and that they used a triple candle.
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My Jewish-positive lectionary blog is at http://recognisingjewishrootsinthelectionary.wordpress.com/
My reviews at http://layreadersbookreviews.wordpress.com
Posts: 23198 | From: Bristol | Registered: Oct 2001
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leo
Shipmate
# 1458
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by venbede:
But at least there is not this silly C of E business of only blessing the Easter Candle after the OT readings. How can you read in the dark.
That's one alternative version in Times & Seasons. The other is the 'proper' order. We read the OT in the LIGHT (literally of the cancle) of the New.
This gives reasons why the 'proper' order is better.
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My Jewish-positive lectionary blog is at http://recognisingjewishrootsinthelectionary.wordpress.com/
My reviews at http://layreadersbookreviews.wordpress.com
Posts: 23198 | From: Bristol | Registered: Oct 2001
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Ceremoniar
Shipmate
# 13596
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Adam.:
When you've lost any sense of the Easter Vigil being the place for Christian Initiation, it makes perfect sense to me to bless the font at around the same time as you're blessing the fire. AIUI, the post-conciliar reforms moved the blessing of the font to after the homily to restore the initiatory character of this service.
An Easter Vigil without baptisms has always felt a little like a Wellington with no beef to me, but I assume that's how it will always be in a monastery. If you don't have any baptisms, you don't get the Litany of the Saints. In a typical parish, this should be reason enough to evangelize and get some catechumens for next year! (Or a homegrown ordinand / religious vocation, so as you can attend the ordination / profession together and hear the litany there)
In the pre-1970 rite, the font was never blessed "around the same time as you're blessing the fire." The blessing of the fire comes at the very beginning, followed by the blessing and procession of the paschal candle, then the spreading of the light among the faithful. The Exsultet is then sung. The OT prophecies follow, each with a psalm and prayer. This all takes quite a bit of time. Then the litany of saints follows, and then the blessing of the water and the font. whether or not anyone is to be baptized, because even if no one is coming in that night, there will be baptisms soon enough. Then the renewal of baptismal vows and sprinkling of the people.
While the rite is anciently connected to the baptism of catechumens, the baptismal theme extends throughout the Easter season. In fact, the water and font were until 1955 blessed again at the vigil of Pentecost, for any others who were to baptized at the close of the paschal season. This is the origin of the name Whitsunday for Pentecost, reflecting the baptismal robes to be worn. The moving of the rite of baptism to its position in the Ordinary Form after the homily does not really "restore the initiatory character of this service," as they are just as initiated, whether it is done earlier or later in the liturgy. It does, however, reflect the place in the missal of 1970 where the conferring of other rites and sacraments (confirmation, ordination, profession, etc.) generally takes place.
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Adam.
Like as the
# 4991
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Posted
![[Confused]](confused.gif)
Then, I don't understand your previous post where you told leo it "makes sense" to go straight "from the 'service of light' to the 'liturgy of initiation'" (his language) because "for many centuries that was the order of the rite, and still is for those who use the older form of the missal."
I think there's some talking cross-purposes going on, especially different people meaning different things by "before the Mass."
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Ave Crux, Spes Unica!
Preaching blog
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leo
Shipmate
# 1458
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Posted
What Ceremoniar said is correct - I looked it up and I was (partly wrong).
On a different tack, and before this thread gets closed, what did other shipmates notice about numbers attending this year?
In the 1970s, it was expected that most serious Christians would attend the whole Triduum.
This year, I felt depressed at the turnout:
Thursday - 33% of average Sunday attendance
Friday - 50%
Easter Vigil - 33%
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My Jewish-positive lectionary blog is at http://recognisingjewishrootsinthelectionary.wordpress.com/
My reviews at http://layreadersbookreviews.wordpress.com
Posts: 23198 | From: Bristol | Registered: Oct 2001
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Angloid
Shipmate
# 159
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Adam.:
An Easter Vigil without baptisms has always felt a little like a Wellington with no beef to me, but I assume that's how it will always be in a monastery.
In the (Anglican) monastery where I attended the Vigil this year, there was a baptism (and is, apparently, most years). This is because they run a theological college and the candidate was the son of one of the students.
Posts: 12927 | From: The Pool of Life | Registered: May 2001
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Angloid
Shipmate
# 159
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by leo:
On a different tack, and before this thread gets closed, what did other shipmates notice about numbers attending this year?
In the 1970s, it was expected that most serious Christians would attend the whole Triduum.
This year, I felt depressed at the turnout:
Thursday - 33% of average Sunday attendance
Friday - 50%
Easter Vigil - 33%
I suppose it depends what your Sunday attendance usually is. I've been resigned to such numbers for many years: in fact it is usually a struggle to get anybody to see the point of the Vigil at all (not for want of trying). In some places Maundy Thursday has been better supported than Good Friday, and Palm Sunday almost as well as Easter. Nowt so strange as folk.
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Brian: You're all individuals!
Crowd: We're all individuals!
Lone voice: I'm not!
Posts: 12927 | From: The Pool of Life | Registered: May 2001
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Fr Weber
Shipmate
# 13472
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Posted
Our Triduum attendance was only just below our usual Sunday attendance. I beat the drum for the Triduum all through Lent, so that may be part of it.
The thing we have to come to terms with, though, is that some people will always have the idea that church is for Sundays and Sundays only. I refuse to give in to that mentality by transferring feasts to the nearest Sunday; if folks want to celebrate Epiphany or All Saints, they'll have to make it to church on January 6 or November 1.
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"The Eucharist is not a play, and you're not Jesus."
--Sr Theresa Koernke, IHM
Posts: 2512 | From: Oakland, CA | Registered: Feb 2008
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stonespring
Shipmate
# 15530
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Angloid:
quote:
Originally posted by leo:
On a different tack, and before this thread gets closed, what did other shipmates notice about numbers attending this year?
In the 1970s, it was expected that most serious Christians would attend the whole Triduum.
This year, I felt depressed at the turnout:
Thursday - 33% of average Sunday attendance
Friday - 50%
Easter Vigil - 33%
I suppose it depends what your Sunday attendance usually is. I've been resigned to such numbers for many years: in fact it is usually a struggle to get anybody to see the point of the Vigil at all (not for want of trying). In some places Maundy Thursday has been better supported than Good Friday, and Palm Sunday almost as well as Easter. Nowt so strange as folk.
I've noticed that Triduum Services at Episcopal Parishes is much, much lower than at RC parishes. The three days of the Triduum are not "Holy Days of Obligation" for RCs (mostly because of the insistence that there be only one service (in each language, at least) at a parish on each day and the difficulty this causes with people's work schedules), although they are the holiest celebrations of the church year. The Easter Vigil often gets standing-room only attendance in RC parishes because it is the only day each year in adult RC converts are baptized, confirmed, and/or otherwise received into the church. In some parishes in communities where there is a lot of interaction of Catholics with non-Catholics, the Easter Vigil serves this purpose, but in many other parishes the Vigil serves as a sort of "adult religious education graduation day" for adults from Catholic families who were baptized Catholic as babies but for one reason or another did not receive First Communion or Confirmation when they were growing up. Then again, since the RC church seems to be a place of rapid growth in one place and decline in another, there are quite a few parishes where there are not even any adult Catholics to Confirm and give First Communion to at the Vigil. I was at at least one of these parishes, but its Vigil was pretty well attended, perhaps at least because the weekly Saturday Vigil Mass is just as well attended as the Sunday morning Mass (of which there is only one and is a bit too early for some people). Also, the Vigil service at many RC parishes is one of the premier musical events on the Church calendar, so that also tends to draw congregants.
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Brenda Clough
Shipmate
# 18061
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Posted
For years the sunrise service at our church was jammed. This year for the first time I saw empty seats in the pews. The second and third (there are 4) services I am tell were thronged in the usual way, so I hope it was only the concept of getting up and into your Easter best at sparrowfart that put everyone off.
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Science fiction and fantasy writer with a Patreon page
Posts: 6378 | From: Washington DC | Registered: Mar 2014
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Adam.
Like as the
# 4991
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by leo:
Thursday - 33% of average Sunday attendance
Friday - 50%
Easter Vigil - 33%
That's pretty much true by default for us: three almost full regular Sunday Masses; only one of each Triduum service. Each Triduum service is fuller than any one Sunday Mass, but we could simply never fit all of those people. The fact that the students get a four-day weekend means many of them go home (or elsewhere) which is probably the only thing that makes it work.
At my old parish, Good Friday was far better attended than any one Sunday Mass (but not as much as the four put together). Holy Thursday and the Vigil got less than our most popular regular Sunday time slot, but more than our least. Easter Sunday was bursting to the seams (which none of the Masses on a normal Sunday came close to).
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Ave Crux, Spes Unica!
Preaching blog
Posts: 8164 | From: Notre Dame, IN | Registered: Sep 2003
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Leorning Cniht
Shipmate
# 17564
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by leo:
This year, I felt depressed at the turnout:
Our numbers for the Great Vigil have been dropping year-on-year. At least partly that's because we have more young families: the reality of having small children is that at most one parent can make it to an evening service.
If one of the parents sings in the choir, or serves as a LEM or something, it'll be that parent. We're down to having the same number of people in (choir + altar party) as in the general congregation - about 30 each, which I suppose is about 40% of our ~150 ASE. ETA: That's a lie - I forgot to count the smaller service. Adding both services, we're more like 200 on a Sunday, so that's 30% for the Vigil.
I think our numbers for Thursday and Friday were similar, but I was at home with the small children.
ETA: We were down in numbers for Easter Sunday this year because it coincided with spring break, and several of our regular families were travelling.
[ 28. March 2016, 20:27: Message edited by: Leorning Cniht ]
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Albertus
Shipmate
# 13356
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by leo:
What Ceremoniar said is correct - I looked it up and I was (partly wrong).
On a different tack, and before this thread gets closed, what did other shipmates notice about numbers attending this year?
In the 1970s, it was expected that most serious Christians would attend the whole Triduum.
Really? In A-C parishes maybe, but among your average middle-of-the-road BCP/Series whatever CofE people? I wasn't there, but I'd have thought Easter communion, certainly; Good Friday, very likely; but the Easter Vigil? Would this have been a 'must attend', or indeed celebrated at all, at All Saints, Middlestump Parva or St Johns, Leafysuburb? Perhaps I'm wrong: as I say, I wasn't there at the time. But I am pretty sure that while the Church of my Yoof (small-m modern ASB Catholic, middling sized town in Kent, early 1980s) took Good Friday very seriously (proper 3 hour reflection and talks), it never did anything much at all on Holy Saturday.
[ 28. March 2016, 20:27: Message edited by: Albertus ]
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My beard is a testament to my masculinity and virility, and demonstrates that I am a real man. Trouble is, bits of quiche sometimes get caught in it.
Posts: 6498 | From: Y Sowth | Registered: Jan 2008
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Ceremoniar
Shipmate
# 13596
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Adam.:
Then, I don't understand your previous post where you told leo it "makes sense" to go straight "from the 'service of light' to the 'liturgy of initiation'" (his language) because "for many centuries that was the order of the rite, and still is for those who use the older form of the missal."
I think there's some talking cross-purposes going on, especially different people meaning different things by "before the Mass."
I think that you are confusing my post with someone else. I never used the term "service of light." The other words are my response to the claim that baptism only makes sense after the gospel and homily. That has been responded to and clarified by Leo.
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Adam.
Like as the
# 4991
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Posted
I think after long hours of praying, and probably not sleeping too much, many of us are misreading many others. I'm happy to drop whatever the point was...
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Ave Crux, Spes Unica!
Preaching blog
Posts: 8164 | From: Notre Dame, IN | Registered: Sep 2003
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leo
Shipmate
# 1458
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Angloid:
quote:
Originally posted by Adam.:
An Easter Vigil without baptisms has always felt a little like a Wellington with no beef to me, but I assume that's how it will always be in a monastery.
In the (Anglican) monastery where I attended the Vigil this year, there was a baptism (and is, apparently, most years). This is because they run a theological college and the candidate was the son of one of the students.
If that's where i think it is, quite a few students go elsewhere during the Triduum because of a woman priest (former curate of ours) is on the staff and might be the presider.
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My Jewish-positive lectionary blog is at http://recognisingjewishrootsinthelectionary.wordpress.com/
My reviews at http://layreadersbookreviews.wordpress.com
Posts: 23198 | From: Bristol | Registered: Oct 2001
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Angloid
Shipmate
# 159
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Posted
No 'might be' about it. More fool them if that's the case: though there were no obvious empty places in church and one wonders about their sense of priorities.
Posts: 12927 | From: The Pool of Life | Registered: May 2001
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Zappa
Ship's Wake
# 8433
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Angloid:
I've noticed that Triduum Services at Episcopal Parishes is much, much lower than at RC parishes. The three days of the Triduum are not "Holy Days of Obligation" for RCs ...
Holy Mary Mother of John Lennon - I don't think Anglopalians have obligated anything liturgio-sacramental (except in some quarters the Real Absence™ ) since Henry got his willy in a droop.
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TomM
Shipmate
# 4618
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Angloid:
No 'might be' about it. More fool them if that's the case: though there were no obvious empty places in church and one wonders about their sense of priorities.
Assuming we are all talking about the same college, and the one at which I am an ordinand...
Those opposed to the ordination of women generally attend all the liturgies in Holy Week with the rest of us. They also, along with any who wish to go with them, go to a local parish for some of the liturgies.
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Fr Weber
Shipmate
# 13472
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Zappa:
quote:
Originally posted by Angloid:
I've noticed that Triduum Services at Episcopal Parishes is much, much lower than at RC parishes. The three days of the Triduum are not "Holy Days of Obligation" for RCs ...
Holy Mary Mother of John Lennon - I don't think Anglopalians have obligated anything liturgio-sacramental (except in some quarters the Real Absence™ ) since Henry got his willy in a droop.
Not true; the canons of most Anglican bodies required that church members attend divine service regularly, and that they communicate at least 3 times a year.
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"The Eucharist is not a play, and you're not Jesus."
--Sr Theresa Koernke, IHM
Posts: 2512 | From: Oakland, CA | Registered: Feb 2008
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Bishops Finger
Shipmate
# 5430
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Posted
IIRC, the 1662 BCP requires that Easter be one of those three occasions, thus presumably making it the C of E's one and only Holyday of Obligation.
I.
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Our words are giants when they do us an injury, and dwarfs when they do us a service. (Wilkie Collins)
Posts: 10151 | From: Behind The Wheel Again! | Registered: Jan 2004
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Curiosity killed ...
Ship's Mug
# 11770
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Posted
The BCP says exactly that:
quote:
that every Parishioner shall communicate at least three times in the year, of which Easter to be one
I attended the Parish Church at Whitby on Easter Sunday. This is the church by the ruins of the Abbey. A monthly Matins service is usually provided but for Easter there was a BCP Communion Service. The links with Whitby, Easter and the Abbey of St Hilda were all in my mind.
It was a careful service with a good sermon and they were all very welcoming, but in lots of ways it felt very sad as there were about 30 people clustered around the coal heater in the centre and a few more up in the gallery. The parish is interregnum, but according to the Parish Profile, 30 is the usual congregation.
(There are two other CofE churches in the town, the huge Victorian edifice of St Hilda's which was built to be a cathedral and has a regular congregation of around 50, which I failed to get to for the Easter Vigil because it was tipping it down with rain and I didn't fancy getting soaked or the trip down and up the 199 steps in slippery conditions, and St John's, another large Victorian church, which apparently has a regular congregation of around 30.)
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Mugs - Keep the Ship afloat
Posts: 13794 | From: outiside the outer ring road | Registered: Aug 2006
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dj_ordinaire
Host
# 4643
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Posted
That's a shame, Curiosity Killed... A very interesting church and a perfect setting a BCP Holy Communion. I wonder if the church's position at the top of a very long flight of stairs up from the town might deter some of the older folk from making the trip?
Alos, do they still have the ear-trumpets that belonged to a former vicar's wife on display next to the [impressive double-decker] pulpit?
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Flinging wide the gates...
Posts: 10335 | From: Hanging in the balance of the reality of man | Registered: Jun 2003
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Nick Tamen
Ship's Wayfaring Fool
# 15164
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Curiosity killed ...:
The BCP says exactly that:
quote:
that every Parishioner shall communicate at least three times in the year, of which Easter to be one
Somehow, I was under the impression that meant during the Easter season, not necessarily Easter Day. Did I dream that, or perhaps confuse the BCP requirement with Catholic discipline?
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The first thing God says to Moses is, "Take off your shoes." We are on holy ground. Hard to believe, but the truest thing I know. — Anne Lamott
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Enoch
Shipmate
# 14322
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Nick Tamen:
Somehow, I was under the impression that meant during the Easter season, not necessarily Easter Day. Did I dream that, or perhaps confuse the BCP requirement with Catholic discipline?
Yes. I'm under the impression one is allowed a week's lee-way either side of Easter, but don't know where that comes from.
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Brexit wrexit - Sir Graham Watson
Posts: 7610 | From: Bristol UK(was European Green Capital 2015, now Ljubljana) | Registered: Nov 2008
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Angloid
Shipmate
# 159
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Posted
I wouldn't have thought that the original rule was meant to be particularly restrictive: 'around' Easter would cover it I should think. On the other hand, Communion services were few and far between in those days and if there was one on Easter Day (most likely) there wouldn't be another one for weeks.
Posts: 12927 | From: The Pool of Life | Registered: May 2001
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Bishops Finger
Shipmate
# 5430
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Posted
I was told that receiving the Sacrament during Easter Week (e.g. at home or in hospital) fulfilled the obligation.
Reverting to Holy Week itself, I gather that our numbers were well down for virtually all the services, owing to holidays and long-term sickness. There were some welcome visitors on Easter Day itself, though!
I.
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Our words are giants when they do us an injury, and dwarfs when they do us a service. (Wilkie Collins)
Posts: 10151 | From: Behind The Wheel Again! | Registered: Jan 2004
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Curiosity killed ...
Ship's Mug
# 11770
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by dj_ordinaire: That's a shame, Curiosity Killed... A very interesting church and a perfect setting a BCP Holy Communion. I wonder if the church's position at the top of a very long flight of stairs up from the town might deter some of the older folk from making the trip?
I wondered that, but the small numbers quoted in the Parish Profile for the two churches in the town - opposite the RC church and facing across the river high above the town on the other side - didn't seem to suggest that. According to the Whitby Museum site, that church can seat over 2000 with all the additions to the original church.
quote:
Alos, do they still have the ear-trumpets that belonged to a former vicar's wife on display next to the [impressive double-decker] pulpit?
The triple decker pulpit was used for the service, churchwarden/clerk on bottom deck, minister on second except for preaching, but I didn't see the ear trumpets.
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Mugs - Keep the Ship afloat
Posts: 13794 | From: outiside the outer ring road | Registered: Aug 2006
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Enoch
Shipmate
# 14322
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Posted
I'm slightly concerned if the service at Whitby Parish Church was just the 1662 BCP. From my memory of what the interior is like, should it not have been been Morning Prayer with the Athanasian Creed, the Litany, BCP Ante-communion in the Nave and then moving into the chancel for Holy Communion for those who had given in their names a week before to the incumbent? Also, I would hope that 'ye that have it in mind ... ' was read. I'm glad to read the pulpit was used correctly.
Did they use Sternhold and Hopkins like St Paul did, or are they innovators who have moved on to Tate and Brady?
[ 04. April 2016, 17:59: Message edited by: Enoch ]
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Brexit wrexit - Sir Graham Watson
Posts: 7610 | From: Bristol UK(was European Green Capital 2015, now Ljubljana) | Registered: Nov 2008
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Curiosity killed ...
Ship's Mug
# 11770
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Posted
Pretty much straight BCP Communion, straight through, no choir, mostly said. We were issued with the BCP with Hymns Ancient and Modern in one book, plus possibly a booklet for the service. I used the book.
(I also attended Choral Evensong on Monday night in the Quire at York Minster, which was pretty full - over 100 guessing, which purported to follow the BCP but departed from the book several times.)
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Mugs - Keep the Ship afloat
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