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Source: (consider it)
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Thread: Dead Horses: U.S. Supreme Court Decision
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Pigwidgeon
Ship's Owl
# 10192
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Posted
In a 5-4 decision, the Supreme Court justices have said that U.S. states cannot keep same-sex couples from marrying and must recognize their unions.
![[Smile]](smile.gif)
[ 08. April 2017, 01:55: Message edited by: Louise ]
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"...that is generally a matter for Pigwidgeon, several other consenting adults, a bottle of cheap Gin and the odd giraffe."
~Tortuf
Posts: 9835 | From: Hogwarts | Registered: Aug 2005
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RuthW
liberal "peace first" hankie squeezer
# 13
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Posted
Yay!!!!!!!!!!!!
Posts: 24453 | From: La La Land | Registered: Apr 2001
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Siegfried
Ship's ferret
# 29
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Posted
Majority opionion (by Justice Kennedy) states that marriage is a "fundamental right" and that equal protection applies.
Chief Justice's dissent (joined by all 4 dissenters) says that the "democratic process" should have been allowed to proceed.
Scalia threw a hissy fit in his dissent:
quote:
If, even as the price to be paid for a fifth vote, I ever joined an opinion for the Court that began: ‘The Constitution promises liberty to all within its reach, a liberty that includes certain specific rights that allow persons, within a lawful realm, to define and express their identity,’ I would hide my head in a bag. The Supreme Court of the United States has descended from the disciplined legal reasoning of John Marshall and Joseph Story to the mystical aphorisms of the fortune cookie.
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Siegfried
Life is just a bowl of cherries!
Posts: 5592 | From: Tallahassee, FL USA | Registered: May 2001
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quetzalcoatl
Shipmate
# 16740
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Posted
So is this saying that all states must recognize ssms which occurred in other states, or that no state can prohibit gay couples from marrying?
Anyway, I'll join in with Yay!
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I can't talk to you today; I talked to two people yesterday.
Posts: 9878 | From: UK | Registered: Oct 2011
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Siegfried
Ship's ferret
# 29
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by quetzalcoatl:
So is this saying that all states must recognize ssms which occurred in other states, or that no state can prohibit gay couples from marrying?
Anyway, I'll join in with Yay!
Both.
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Siegfried
Life is just a bowl of cherries!
Posts: 5592 | From: Tallahassee, FL USA | Registered: May 2001
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Tortuf
Ship's fisherman
# 3784
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Posted
It's about damn time.
Posts: 6963 | From: The Venice of the South | Registered: Dec 2002
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mousethief
Ship's Thieving Rodent
# 953
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Posted
Woe! Woe! Look for True Christians™ to be murdered in the streets, rounded up, terrorized, and made to get handgun permits in blue states! It's the beginning of the end, I tell you!
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This is the last sig I'll ever write for you...
Posts: 63536 | From: Washington | Registered: Jul 2001
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Brenda Clough
Shipmate
# 18061
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Posted
Alleluia! And the health care decision yesterday is going to make a big difference in the lives of creatives throughout the US. Most free-lance artists can't afford health insurance otherwise.
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Science fiction and fantasy writer with a Patreon page
Posts: 6378 | From: Washington DC | Registered: Mar 2014
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quetzalcoatl
Shipmate
# 16740
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Posted
Already I am looking at my wife with rheumy eye and palsied desire, as the gayz have soiled, sullied and spoliated my marriage. Perhaps divorce is the best option, then at least, I will not be in the same category as the shirt-lifters.
But surely God will punish us for this?
"Blow, winds, and crack your cheeks! rage! blow!
You cataracts and hurricanoes, spout
Till you have drench'd our steeples, drown'd the cocks!"
Drowned the what?
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I can't talk to you today; I talked to two people yesterday.
Posts: 9878 | From: UK | Registered: Oct 2011
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lilBuddha
Shipmate
# 14333
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by mousethief:
Woe! Woe! Look for True Christians™ to be murdered in the streets, rounded up, terrorized, and made to get handgun permits in blue states! It's the beginning of the end, I tell you!
Now we will descend into beastiality and paedophilia. Cause that that wouldn't happen when the guardians of heterosexual marriage were in charge.
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I put on my rockin' shoes in the morning
Hallellou, hallellou
Posts: 17627 | From: the round earth's imagined corners | Registered: Dec 2008
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Joan Rasch
Shipmate
# 49
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Posted
I suspect the concluding paragraph of the decision will turn up in secular marriage ceremonies, both mixed and same sex:
quote:
No union is more profound than marriage, for it embodies
the highest ideals of love, fidelity, devotion, sacrifice,
and family. In forming a marital union, two people become
something greater than once they were. As some of
the petitioners in these cases demonstrate, marriage
embodies a love that may endure even past death. It
would misunderstand these men and women to say they
disrespect the idea of marriage. Their plea is that they do
respect it, respect it so deeply that they seek to find its
fulfillment for themselves. Their hope is not to be condemned
to live in loneliness, excluded from one of civilization’s
oldest institutions. They ask for equal dignity in the
eyes of the law. The Constitution grants them that right.
The judgment of the Court of Appeals for the Sixth
Circuit is reversed.
It is so ordered.
cheers from Boston - Joan ![[Yipee]](graemlins/spin.gif)
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* A cyclist on the information bikepath
Posts: 509 | From: Boston, MA USA | Registered: May 2001
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orfeo
Ship's Musical Counterpoint
# 13878
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Posted
Oh great. Now all the decent men are going to move to America.
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Technology has brought us all closer together. Turns out a lot of the people you meet as a result are complete idiots.
Posts: 18173 | From: Under | Registered: Jul 2008
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Brenda Clough
Shipmate
# 18061
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Posted
Our rector is a canny man, full of forethought, and he has foreseen this Supreme Court decision. He knew the conservative wing of the church was on the losing end of the stick, and he's been doing Reconciliation and Reachout for months. I am certain that some members of our congregation have their hair on fire at this exact moment, and are planning to call for us to secede from the Union or something. He has been trying to put the brakes on the more rampant nuttery.
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Science fiction and fantasy writer with a Patreon page
Posts: 6378 | From: Washington DC | Registered: Mar 2014
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quetzalcoatl
Shipmate
# 16740
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Posted
Weddings already taking place, I've heard.
Well, it took you guys some time, a month after Ireland, but finally you got there.
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I can't talk to you today; I talked to two people yesterday.
Posts: 9878 | From: UK | Registered: Oct 2011
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Nicolemr
Shipmate
# 28
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Posted
![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif) Yay!
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On pilgrimage in the endless realms of Cyberia, currently traveling by ship. Now with live journal!
Posts: 11803 | From: New York City "The City Carries On" | Registered: May 2001
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Oscar the Grouch
Adopted Cascadian
# 1916
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by mousethief:
Woe! Woe! Look for True Christians™ to be murdered in the streets, rounded up, terrorized, and made to get handgun permits in blue states! It's the beginning of the end, I tell you!
If you're right, then it's victory upon victory.
Yay for the US!
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Faradiu, dundeibáwa weyu lárigi weyu
Posts: 3871 | From: Gamma Quadrant, just to the left of Galifrey | Registered: Dec 2001
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Crœsos
Shipmate
# 238
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Posted
Scalia's dissent is a thing of unhinged beauty. It reads more like a particularly deranged blog comment than a judicial opinion.
quote:
Of course the opinion’s showy profundities are often profoundly incoherent. “The nature of marriage is that, through its enduring bond, two persons together can find other freedoms, such as expression, intimacy, and spirituality.” (Really? Who ever thought that intimacy and spirituality [whatever that means] were freedoms? And if intimacy is, one would think Freedom of Intimacy is abridged rather than expanded by marriage. Ask the nearest hippie.
Fifty years later and still bent out of shape about 1960s counterculture.
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Humani nil a me alienum puto
Posts: 10706 | From: Sardis, Lydia | Registered: May 2001
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Pigwidgeon
Ship's Owl
# 10192
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Posted
I'm in Salt Lake City and am wandering over to the Episcopal General Convention in a few minutes. I imagine there has been much rejoicing, and I'm looking forward to visiting Integrity's booth.
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"...that is generally a matter for Pigwidgeon, several other consenting adults, a bottle of cheap Gin and the odd giraffe."
~Tortuf
Posts: 9835 | From: Hogwarts | Registered: Aug 2005
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LeRoc
Famous Dutch pirate
# 3216
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Posted
Congratulations USA.
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I know why God made the rhinoceros, it's because He couldn't see the rhinoceros, so He made the rhinoceros to be able to see it. (Clarice Lispector)
Posts: 9474 | From: Brazil / Africa | Registered: Aug 2002
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Brenda Clough
Shipmate
# 18061
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Posted
A friend of mine posted a (fictional) assessment by Barack Obama of the political implications: "We've lost Utah for a generation." The joke of course is that Utah is the reddest of red states and went for Romney by a landslide.
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Science fiction and fantasy writer with a Patreon page
Posts: 6378 | From: Washington DC | Registered: Mar 2014
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RuthW
liberal "peace first" hankie squeezer
# 13
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Posted
Same-sex marriage was already legal in Utah.
Posts: 24453 | From: La La Land | Registered: Apr 2001
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Starlight
Shipmate
# 12651
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Crœsos:
Scalia's dissent is a thing of unhinged beauty. It reads more like a particularly deranged blog comment than a judicial opinion.
That's pretty normal for him. I think he gets his news from Rush Limbaugh.
My favorite idiocy I've read thus far in the decision is this gem from Roberts' dissent:
"The fundamental right to marry does not include a right to make a State change its definition of marriage."
[ 26. June 2015, 22:23: Message edited by: Starlight ]
Posts: 745 | From: NZ | Registered: May 2007
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Porridge
Shipmate
# 15405
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Posted
Now can we call it what it's always been -- just "marriage"?
Posts: 3925 | From: Upper right corner | Registered: Jan 2010
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Golden Key
Shipmate
# 1468
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Posted
{Dances happily to raucous gospel music.}
I wish Scalia would just resign, so Obama could put a more moderate person on the court. However, Congress would probably drag out the process, to keep it from happening before O. leaves office--or at all.
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Blessed Gator, pray for us!
--"Oh bat bladders, do you have to bring common sense into this?" (Dragon, "Jane & the Dragon")
--"Oh, Peace Train, save this country!" (Yusuf/Cat Stevens, "Peace Train")
Posts: 18601 | From: Chilling out in an undisclosed, sincere pumpkin patch. | Registered: Oct 2001
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Golden Key
Shipmate
# 1468
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Pigwidgeon:
I'm in Salt Lake City and am wandering over to the Episcopal General Convention in a few minutes. I imagine there has been much rejoicing, and I'm looking forward to visiting Integrity's booth.
Integrity has a really nice celebration graphic.
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Blessed Gator, pray for us!
--"Oh bat bladders, do you have to bring common sense into this?" (Dragon, "Jane & the Dragon")
--"Oh, Peace Train, save this country!" (Yusuf/Cat Stevens, "Peace Train")
Posts: 18601 | From: Chilling out in an undisclosed, sincere pumpkin patch. | Registered: Oct 2001
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mousethief
Ship's Thieving Rodent
# 953
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Brenda Clough:
A friend of mine posted a (fictional) assessment by Barack Obama of the political implications: "We've lost Utah for a generation." The joke of course is that Utah is the reddest of red states and went for Romney by a landslide.
Of course his being Mormon might have had something to do with that as well.
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This is the last sig I'll ever write for you...
Posts: 63536 | From: Washington | Registered: Jul 2001
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Pigwidgeon
Ship's Owl
# 10192
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Golden Key:
quote:
Originally posted by Pigwidgeon:
I'm in Salt Lake City and am wandering over to the Episcopal General Convention in a few minutes. I imagine there has been much rejoicing, and I'm looking forward to visiting Integrity's booth.
Integrity has a really nice celebration graphic.
They were handing out these buttons like crazy today. I proudly wore mine, and saw LOTS of them being worn not only at the Convention but around town.
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"...that is generally a matter for Pigwidgeon, several other consenting adults, a bottle of cheap Gin and the odd giraffe."
~Tortuf
Posts: 9835 | From: Hogwarts | Registered: Aug 2005
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Palimpsest
Shipmate
# 16772
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Posted
It's a good day and unexpectedly soon. As the Christian right starts talking of their persecution, remember they should be put down humanely rather then left to prolonged suffering.
I'm glad Obama is happy, but it's amazing to watch how his position has evolved fast enough for him to lead the parade.
The Attorney General for Tennessee has said, it's happened and it's over. It will be interesting to see what happens in Alabama. It's amusing to here all the State's Rights rhetoric. I want to ask "Should states have the right to decide if interracial marriage is illegal? How about slavery. Those Federalists have a lot to answer for.
Posts: 2990 | From: Seattle WA. US | Registered: Nov 2011
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luvanddaisies
the'fun'in'fundie'™
# 5761
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by quetzalcoatl:
Well, it took you guys some time, a month after Ireland, but finally you got there.
Only a little bit behind Pitcairn too. ![[Biased]](wink.gif)
quote:
Originally posted by orfeo:
Oh great. Now all the decent men are going to move to America.
![[Killing me]](graemlins/killingme.gif)
It's nice to have a pleasant surprise on the news. Those of you in the USA; did you expect this decision, or is it as much of a surprise for you as it seems to be for most of us outside looking in?
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"Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines, sail away from the safe harbour. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover." (Mark Twain)
Posts: 3711 | From: all at sea. | Registered: Apr 2004
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Salicional
Shipmate
# 16461
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Posted
I'd say that most of the people who follow the decisions of the Supreme Court had an inkling that things were inevitably leading to this outcome. And I'm not at all surprised that Justice Kennedy was the swing vote.
Posts: 68 | From: near Lake Erie | Registered: Jun 2011
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orfeo
Ship's Musical Counterpoint
# 13878
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Posted
There were in fact articles months ago predicting this outcome, in large part because the court refused to interrupt the decisions that supported same-sex marriage and only took the matter on once there was a lower court that had ruled against same-sex marriage.
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Technology has brought us all closer together. Turns out a lot of the people you meet as a result are complete idiots.
Posts: 18173 | From: Under | Registered: Jul 2008
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Kelly Alves
Bunny with an axe
# 2522
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Posted
It's one of those things where I knew it would happen someday, but I still can't believe I am actually seeing it happen. It took me till this morning to weep for joy. Last night I was prtetty much stuck with going from FB status update to FB status update and posting " YEAHHH!"
One of my childhood friends is finally marrying the guy we all considered his husband anyway. YEAAH!
[ 27. June 2015, 14:56: Message edited by: Kelly Alves ]
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I cannot expect people to believe “
Jesus loves me, this I know” of they don’t believe “Kelly loves me, this I know.”
Kelly Alves, somewhere around 2003.
Posts: 35076 | From: Pura Californiana | Registered: Mar 2002
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Organ Builder
Shipmate
# 12478
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Posted
There was a time even recently when I couldn't imagine being able to marry-- not in Georgia! Now, after almost 14 years I am officially engaged and the date is set for our 14th anniversary in September.
This morning the joy was tempered a bit remembering a couple here in Atlanta who were together some 60+ years until one of them passed. It came too late for them, but it is because of them and others like them that I can get married in September. I am grateful for those who worked for this but were unable to enjoy the fruits of their labor.
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How desperately difficult it is to be honest with oneself. It is much easier to be honest with other people.--E.F. Benson
Posts: 3337 | From: ...somewhere in between 40 and death... | Registered: Mar 2007
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mousethief
Ship's Thieving Rodent
# 953
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Posted
Congratulations on your engagement, OB. Many more happy years.
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This is the last sig I'll ever write for you...
Posts: 63536 | From: Washington | Registered: Jul 2001
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Pigwidgeon
Ship's Owl
# 10192
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Posted
It's strange being here in Salt Lake City with thousands of Episcopalians. There's great elation at the General Convention.
But we're still in Utah, where SSM has only been legal because of a court decision. This morning's SLC paper had one letter with the usual "people will soon be able to marry their pets," and another saying that marriage can only be decided by the church (e.g., LDS) -- despite their ban on polygamy coming about only because the government said they had to end it in order to become a state. ![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif)
I was in a local shopping center yesterday and bought a wedding card for two (male) friends who are getting married this fall. It seemed to be a very appropriate day to find a card for them, and I'll be sure to tell them. The cashier asked me if I realized that the card said "Mr. and Mr." -- some people have misread it and at least one person brought it back for a refund. He seemed quite pleased when I said it was intentional and a great day to be buying it.
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"...that is generally a matter for Pigwidgeon, several other consenting adults, a bottle of cheap Gin and the odd giraffe."
~Tortuf
Posts: 9835 | From: Hogwarts | Registered: Aug 2005
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Brenda Clough
Shipmate
# 18061
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Posted
Wonderfully sane advice
I am only sorry that so many people in my church are going to be wildly upset about this. One must hope it will not lead to violence.
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Science fiction and fantasy writer with a Patreon page
Posts: 6378 | From: Washington DC | Registered: Mar 2014
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Baptist Trainfan
Shipmate
# 15128
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Posted
The one thing it perhaps misses out in the first section is a paragraph saying, "If you are a traditional husband and wife, this ruling won't affect your marriage relationship" - because it won't. Yet some folk seem to think it will. IMO that's bizarre.
Posts: 9750 | From: The other side of the Severn | Registered: Sep 2009
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Brenda Clough
Shipmate
# 18061
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Posted
I forget in which book of his it was, that C.S. Lewis suggested splitting the sacrament of marriage away entirely from the civil institution. Marriage on the civil side then would become something like the blood test and the marriage license, something you just do in advance of the big church wingding. Meanwhile churches of all denominations could keep charge of their ceremonies/rites/theologies and either marry, or not, whoever they felt doctrinally inclined to preside over.
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Science fiction and fantasy writer with a Patreon page
Posts: 6378 | From: Washington DC | Registered: Mar 2014
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LeRoc
Famous Dutch pirate
# 3216
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Brenda Clough:
I forget in which book of his it was, that C.S. Lewis suggested splitting the sacrament of marriage away entirely from the civil institution. Marriage on the civil side then would become something like the blood test and the marriage license, something you just do in advance of the big church wingding. Meanwhile churches of all denominations could keep charge of their ceremonies/rites/theologies and either marry, or not, whoever they felt doctrinally inclined to preside over.
This is the practice in most of continental Western Europe.
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I know why God made the rhinoceros, it's because He couldn't see the rhinoceros, so He made the rhinoceros to be able to see it. (Clarice Lispector)
Posts: 9474 | From: Brazil / Africa | Registered: Aug 2002
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mousethief
Ship's Thieving Rodent
# 953
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Posted
Oh God, the Orthosphere has gone batshit. We're soon to be rounded up and sent to the gulags when people sue the Orthodox Church for not performing gay multi-partner trans-species weddings. Sodom and Gomorrah have been trotted out, and the need for a return to the monarchy, and how America used to be this nice Christian country, and how this is the first step down a slippery slope to mandatory orgies in the street and sex with antelope.
All reason is lost. I am of course enduring a fair share of abuse for standing up for rationality. Not once having said the Orthodox Church should change its stance and marry gay people, mind. I know better in that crowd. Just trying to preach calmness and compassion and rationality.
I will expect my martyr's crown soon, of course. ![[Angel]](graemlins/angel.gif)
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This is the last sig I'll ever write for you...
Posts: 63536 | From: Washington | Registered: Jul 2001
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orfeo
Ship's Musical Counterpoint
# 13878
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Brenda Clough:
And he went to law school for this?
You cannot be serious.
You. Cannot.
Fuck law school. How can you get to his age without having come across the notion of a CIVIL WEDDING?!??
[ 27. June 2015, 19:59: Message edited by: orfeo ]
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Technology has brought us all closer together. Turns out a lot of the people you meet as a result are complete idiots.
Posts: 18173 | From: Under | Registered: Jul 2008
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Brenda Clough
Shipmate
# 18061
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Posted
I am being oppressed by a great many things like this. There are people who simply cannot grasp the difference between church and state.
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Science fiction and fantasy writer with a Patreon page
Posts: 6378 | From: Washington DC | Registered: Mar 2014
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Kelly Alves
Bunny with an axe
# 2522
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by orfeo:
quote:
Originally posted by Brenda Clough:
And he went to law school for this?
You cannot be serious.
You. Cannot.
Fuck law school. How can you get to his age without having come across the notion of a CIVIL WEDDING?!??
quote:
It was at this point that those in the court witnessed Chief Justice Roberts begin to whisper to fellow conservative Justices Scalia and Alito. Justice Roberts then became visibly red in the face at this point and some reports even state that you could audibly hear Roberts say, “Really!?”
Good God, you coudn't write a sketch as funny as this. The Three Stooges in " Supreme Stupidity."
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I cannot expect people to believe “
Jesus loves me, this I know” of they don’t believe “Kelly loves me, this I know.”
Kelly Alves, somewhere around 2003.
Posts: 35076 | From: Pura Californiana | Registered: Mar 2002
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Wilfried
Shipmate
# 12277
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Organ Builder:
This morning the joy was tempered a bit remembering a couple here in Atlanta who were together some 60+ years until one of them passed. It came too late for them, but it is because of them and others like them that I can get married in September. I am grateful for those who worked for this but were unable to enjoy the fruits of their labor.
I just had an image of Moses gazing across the Jordan at the Promised Land that he would never enter. ![[Frown]](frown.gif) ![[Votive]](graemlins/votive.gif)
Posts: 429 | From: Lefty on the Right Coast | Registered: Jan 2007
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SvitlanaV2
Shipmate
# 16967
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Baptist Trainfan:
The one thing it perhaps misses out in the first section is a paragraph saying, "If you are a traditional husband and wife, this ruling won't affect your marriage relationship" - because it won't. Yet some folk seem to think it will. IMO that's bizarre.
It won't have an effect upon individual marriages, but it obviously creates a re-definition of marriage in the public sphere. This surely has psychological ramifications both for those who are for and against.
Marriage has been re-defined many times in history depending on the circumstances, and I presume that religious groups have either had to absorb the changes, or withdraw and define themselves as culturally distinct from the people around them.
The problem here is that despite secularisation and/or the separation of church and state there are still vestiges of the 'Christian nation' idea in many Christians' heads. There's a sense that a particular kind of Christian morality should be honoured in the breach if not in observance; but changes in the marriage laws imply that their 'particular kind of Christian morality' is simply one choice among many, and is in no objective way morally superior to any other type of family formation. This is not how many Christians are used to feeling.
I think Western Christians, especially conservative American ones, need to accept that they live in a pluralistic context, and that modern religion exists more appropriately in the private than the public sphere. This seems easier for us English Christians tolerate, even though we have a state church.
Posts: 6668 | From: UK | Registered: Feb 2012
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Soror Magna
Shipmate
# 9881
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by SvitlanaV2:
It won't have an effect upon individual marriages, but it obviously creates a re-definition of marriage in the public sphere. This surely has psychological ramifications both for those who are for and against. ...
I'm curious about the psychological ramifications of marriage equality that apparently won't affect individual marriages. How's that work?
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"You come with me to room 1013 over at the hospital, I'll show you America. Terminal, crazy and mean." -- Tony Kushner, "Angels in America"
Posts: 5430 | From: Caprica City | Registered: Jul 2005
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mousethief
Ship's Thieving Rodent
# 953
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Posted
Did allowing mixed-race marriages change the definition of marriage? Or just broaden the category of couples who could participate?
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This is the last sig I'll ever write for you...
Posts: 63536 | From: Washington | Registered: Jul 2001
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orfeo
Ship's Musical Counterpoint
# 13878
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Kelly Alves:
quote:
Originally posted by orfeo:
quote:
Originally posted by Brenda Clough:
And he went to law school for this?
You cannot be serious.
You. Cannot.
Fuck law school. How can you get to his age without having come across the notion of a CIVIL WEDDING?!??
quote:
It was at this point that those in the court witnessed Chief Justice Roberts begin to whisper to fellow conservative Justices Scalia and Alito. Justice Roberts then became visibly red in the face at this point and some reports even state that you could audibly hear Roberts say, “Really!?”
Good God, you coudn't write a sketch as funny as this. The Three Stooges in " Supreme Stupidity."
Honestly, I don't find it funny, I find it bloody terrifying. If the highest judge in the land doesn't understand the basic legal construction of marriage, is it any wonder that large numbers of conservative Americans are displaying extraordinary degrees of stupid in their reactions to the Supreme Court decision?
You have a system of government that was explicitly and deliberately secular. The first 3 Presidents of the United States all made unambiguous statements about religion not having any place in the law of the land.
And yet the occupier of your highest judicial office had to be told that marriage wasn't legally a church thing.
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Technology has brought us all closer together. Turns out a lot of the people you meet as a result are complete idiots.
Posts: 18173 | From: Under | Registered: Jul 2008
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Golden Key
Shipmate
# 1468
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Brenda Clough:
I am being oppressed by a great many things like this. There are people who simply cannot grasp the difference between church and state.
Though that guy did at least acknowledge that *both* heterosexuals and homosexuals sin.
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Blessed Gator, pray for us!
--"Oh bat bladders, do you have to bring common sense into this?" (Dragon, "Jane & the Dragon")
--"Oh, Peace Train, save this country!" (Yusuf/Cat Stevens, "Peace Train")
Posts: 18601 | From: Chilling out in an undisclosed, sincere pumpkin patch. | Registered: Oct 2001
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