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Source: (consider it)
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Thread: leo
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leo
Shipmate
# 1458
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by la vie en rouge:
Furthermore, am I to understand that you have spent your entire working life doing something that you yourself admit you're not cut out for and gives you no pleasure whatsoever? That actually explains a lot.
No. I loved my job for 29 of the 30 years.
What gave/gives no pleasure is going out and doing more of the same after work. One needs balance, change, variety.
Otherwise you are saying that, e.g. a doctor should spend 8 hours in his/her surgery and then go to parties and listen to patients ailments every evening.
As a rule of thumb, if you work with people all day, you need a bit of peace and quiet in the evening.
If you work alone all day, you need to meet up with people in the evening.
[ 30. August 2012, 14:31: Message edited by: leo ]
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My Jewish-positive lectionary blog is at http://recognisingjewishrootsinthelectionary.wordpress.com/
My reviews at http://layreadersbookreviews.wordpress.com
Posts: 23198 | From: Bristol | Registered: Oct 2001
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Evensong
Shipmate
# 14696
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by la vie en rouge:
What I am offended about is your frankly repugnant off the cuff remark that I have no part in Christ (and yes, I do consider this very, very offensive).
He didn't say that.
You took it the wrong way.
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a theological scrapbook
Posts: 9481 | From: Australia | Registered: Apr 2009
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leo
Shipmate
# 1458
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by la vie en rouge:
FWIW leo, I am also definitely INJ, borderline on the T/F. And I think you're full of crap. Cut out the "I'm so rare and different and special" nonsense
The borderline T/F is fascinating and I am desperately trying to understand it since I am not on it - I changed dramatically from high F to high T within a mere three years space between 'taking the tests'.
MBTI is not about being superior but it definitely IS about acknowledging our differences and our special-ness and it is a 'fact' as far as MBTI research is concerned, that INFJ is only 2% of the population. There is nothing 'special', if by that you mean superior, about being in a tiny minority but nor is there any cause for shame, nor for feeling shame or guilt at not liking or flourishing in social situations, any more than fish need feel guilty a not wishing to spend a lot of time on dry land.
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My Jewish-positive lectionary blog is at http://recognisingjewishrootsinthelectionary.wordpress.com/
My reviews at http://layreadersbookreviews.wordpress.com
Posts: 23198 | From: Bristol | Registered: Oct 2001
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leo
Shipmate
# 1458
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by la vie en rouge:
I'm just waiting for ken to turn up and call Myers-Briggs a load of crap, TBH.
That would be another debate; one which may be found elsewhere on the ship.
(And the J part of INFJs hates revisiting old ground which has already been done and dusted and rarely bother to argue again what they have already argued before! That's will be my excuse!
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My Jewish-positive lectionary blog is at http://recognisingjewishrootsinthelectionary.wordpress.com/
My reviews at http://layreadersbookreviews.wordpress.com
Posts: 23198 | From: Bristol | Registered: Oct 2001
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The Great Gumby
Ship's Brain Surgeon
# 10989
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by leo:
I also dug out this little gem: quote:
Often INTJ are mistaken as arrogant when they are actually self confident
Oh, well there you are - leo isn't arrogant, he's just confident, and he's found a website that says so.
This means that in the name of making allowances because everyone's different, he can carry on being the same self-absorbed leotard while everyone else bends over backwards to accommodate him as if a few letters from a horoscope-style test equate to some terrible social handicap.
I can't believe it took so long to work it all out.
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The first principle is that you must not fool yourself, and you are the easiest person to fool. - Richard Feynman
A letter to my son about death
Posts: 5382 | From: Home for shot clergy spouses | Registered: Feb 2006
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Organ Builder
Shipmate
# 12478
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by leo:
I changed dramatically from high F to high T within a mere three years space between 'taking the tests'.
You know, something like this would be one of the first things to make me consider that the scientific reviews of MBTI which call it one step above astrology might have a point.
If it has given you a way to make sense of the inside of your head, I'll just say "how nice". But I'm sure you know that MBTI was always controversial, and is less and less creditable as more research is examined and more review is published.
So I'd probably be careful about ordering my life around an MBTI profile without further consideration, just as I'd be careful about ordering my life around the fact that I was born in the Year of the Dog under the star sign of Cancer.
As for introversion--an internet bulletin board is one of the few places you can expect almost everyone to have at least some introvert tendencies. If we were extroverts, we'd be playing outside with other people "in the flesh".
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How desperately difficult it is to be honest with oneself. It is much easier to be honest with other people.--E.F. Benson
Posts: 3337 | From: ...somewhere in between 40 and death... | Registered: Mar 2007
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Sine Nomine
Ship's backstabbing bastard
# 66
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by leo:
Performing seals have 'skills'.
Apparently that puts them one up on you.
(Actually everything you've posted screams that you feel inept in social situations and are trying to put the best possible spin on it.)
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Precious, Precious, Sweet, Sweet Daddy...
Posts: 16639 | From: lat. 36.24/lon. 86.84 | Registered: Dec 2002
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leo
Shipmate
# 1458
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Organ Builder:
quote:
Originally posted by leo:
I changed dramatically from high F to high T within a mere three years space between 'taking the tests'.
You know, something like this would be one of the first things to make me consider that the scientific reviews of MBTI which call it one step above astrology might have a point....I'd probably be careful about ordering my life around an MBTI profile without further consideration
Absolutely agree. It is a too for spiritual direction, not a master.
When i changed, i spent several hours with my SD exploring this and several more in my own meditation time.
The chief factor is that I went through several major lifestyle changes and circumstances in those three years.
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My Jewish-positive lectionary blog is at http://recognisingjewishrootsinthelectionary.wordpress.com/
My reviews at http://layreadersbookreviews.wordpress.com
Posts: 23198 | From: Bristol | Registered: Oct 2001
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(S)pike couchant
Shipmate
# 17199
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Posted
MBTI is utter pseudo-psychological nonsense. Real people don't fit into one of 16 types based on a series of nearly arbitrary polarities. The basic thinking behind that is at least 50 years out of date, and its application was exceptionally crude even then.
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'Still the towers of Trebizond, the fabled city, shimmer on the far horizon, gated and walled' but Bize her yer Trabzon.
Posts: 308 | From: West of Eden, East of England | Registered: Jul 2012
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la vie en rouge
Parisienne
# 10688
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Posted
A few things - I think MBTI is interesting as far as it goes*, but it's a fairly limited thing. AIUI it also refers primarily to innate preferences, which is to say, despite leo's protestations, that it is perfectly possible to learn to behave in a different way. i.e. I am naturally very introverted, my innate preference is for sitting about on my own with a book and Mozart and never talking to anyone, but I can perfectly well *learn* to be around people. It is NOT a pretext for saying "this is just how I am and I'm never changing, tough titty for everyone else".
Also, a tool that gets you thinking about the differences between people is not just so you can tell them how they need to accommodate you. It's just as importantly so you can learn to accommodate them. Yes, I want people to understand and respect my introversion, but the other side of the deal is that I need to learn to understand and accommodate those weirdo extroverts who always want to be bloody talking all the bloody time ![[Biased]](wink.gif)
And leo, I'm glad to hear you don't think you're a special flower. Now start behaving like it. Which means stop harping on how rare you are.
*i.e. insofar as it produces self-awareness. I make no comment about whether this has worked for leo ![[Razz]](tongue.gif)
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Rent my holiday home in the South of France
Posts: 3696 | Registered: Nov 2005
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la vie en rouge
Parisienne
# 10688
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Evensong:
quote:
Originally posted by la vie en rouge:
What I am offended about is your frankly repugnant off the cuff remark that I have no part in Christ (and yes, I do consider this very, very offensive).
He didn't say that.
You took it the wrong way.
Oh and while I'm here - yes he did say that. It might not have been what he meant, but it *was* what he said. It was judgmental and offensive in the extreme. If it wasn't what he meant, he needs to be more careful with his language. He may think "Christ has nothing to say to you" is a comment that doesn't mean much, but I don't.
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Rent my holiday home in the South of France
Posts: 3696 | Registered: Nov 2005
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Organ Builder
Shipmate
# 12478
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by la vie en rouge:
It might not have been what he meant, but it *was* what he said.
Exactly. If he had gone into more depth to begin with--BEFORE the damage was done--he would have had a chance to be less offensive in making his point. Doing so after the initial rudeness just means any point he may have had will always be tainted by that first response. A one-line post is never going to convey a complex and subtle train of thought, even if you're good at it (hi, mousethief).
I've long wondered if part of leo's perception problem on the ship (not all of it, mind you, but part of it) is that he is crap as a writer. When your posts consistently don't convey what you mean them to convey over a long period of time with a wide variety of shipmates, the problem usually isn't "other people".
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How desperately difficult it is to be honest with oneself. It is much easier to be honest with other people.--E.F. Benson
Posts: 3337 | From: ...somewhere in between 40 and death... | Registered: Mar 2007
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Ricardus
Shipmate
# 8757
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Posted
My understanding of Myers-Briggs is that, if the test says you are strongly I, then that is a sign you need to work on being more E, and vice versa. It's not supposed to excuse extreme I-ish behaviour.
For the sake of full disclosure: I read that on the Internet.
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Then the dog ran before, and coming as if he had brought the news, shewed his joy by his fawning and wagging his tail. -- Tobit 11:9 (Douai-Rheims)
Posts: 7247 | From: Liverpool, UK | Registered: Nov 2004
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The Great Gumby
Ship's Brain Surgeon
# 10989
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by leo:
quote:
Originally posted by The Great Gumby:
a horoscope-style test
MBTI is far from 'a horoscope-style test', though some misuse it as such.
Yes, how terrible that is. When they cling to a "diagnosis" and use it to proclaim that "this is just how I am, so you'll have to put up with it". Just as well no one here does that, eh?
If Myers-Briggs has any value, bearing in mind that the whole assessment is about reading your answers to various questions back at you in a slightly condensed form, it's in understanding and responding to not only your own inclinations, strengths and weaknesses, but also those of others. It's about understanding that other people think in different ways, that your way isn't right or wrong, it's just your way, that you're not a special, unique flower, and that it's not all about you.
Above all, it's about learning to communicate effectively with people who aren't you. For someone who loves MBTI so much, you don't seem to have got very far with that lesson.
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The first principle is that you must not fool yourself, and you are the easiest person to fool. - Richard Feynman
A letter to my son about death
Posts: 5382 | From: Home for shot clergy spouses | Registered: Feb 2006
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mdijon
Shipmate
# 8520
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Organ Builder:
I've long wondered if part of leo's perception problem on the ship (not all of it, mind you, but part of it) is that he is crap as a writer. When your posts consistently don't convey what you mean them to convey over a long period of time with a wide variety of shipmates, the problem usually isn't "other people".
This is compounded by not admitting a mistake or issuing an apology. If it had swiftly been followed with a "Sorry how that came across, I really didn't mean it quite as starkly as it looks as an unqualified one-liner, what I really meant was..." then damage would not be done.
Likewise this hell thread wouldn't have started in the first place had a similar apology been issued. And the plagiarism thread wouldn't have gone on had he admitted it instead of trying to bluster all through it.
I think leo often doesn't take much care in considering how he comes across. The frequent typos, short one-liners, and dismissive tone all go together.
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mdijon nojidm uoɿıqɯ ɯqıɿou
ɯqıɿou uoɿıqɯ nojidm mdijon
Posts: 12277 | From: UK | Registered: Sep 2004
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mousethief
Ship's Thieving Rodent
# 953
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by leo:
Performing seals have 'skills'.
They also have talent.
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This is the last sig I'll ever write for you...
Posts: 63536 | From: Washington | Registered: Jul 2001
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mousethief
Ship's Thieving Rodent
# 953
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Sine Nomine:
(And if I had a club and was standing in front of a baby seal and leo, I can tell you which one I'd go after…)
I'd have to see how soulful his eyes were.
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This is the last sig I'll ever write for you...
Posts: 63536 | From: Washington | Registered: Jul 2001
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Anselmina
Ship's barmaid
# 3032
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by orfeo:
quote:
Originally posted by leo:
It would be interesting to know how many people extolling the virtues of small talk are extroverts.
Introvert here. Small talk is vital. Can't stand vacuous talk, though, whether large or small.
Good distinction!
As you'll have seen leo I label myself as an extrovert - one who doesn't find small talk that easy as it happens, because I'm comfortable in my own company, and I'm quite an impatient sort of person: and I have to make an effort and work hard to make small talk work effectively, if it's not to be an empty gesture.
But this extrovert vs. introvert thing is surely a bit of a red herring. Introverts are not people who can't be bothered to make the effort of socializing, or who necessarily despise it or think it worthless; but are people who have a certain psychological approach and response to social occasions which make such occasions uncomfortable and hard to deal with in a more visceral than intellectual fashion. That's why I was concerned that misanthropism was being confused with introvertism (sp?).
It's one thing to deride small-talk as a time-waster and something not worth the effort; but that is an intellectual decision taken from a set of choices that could equally go the other way. But introverts classically, I presume, do not feel that that choice is really open to them, in the same way that an agarophobic sufferer is not really 'choosing' to stay indoors.
quote:
Originally posted by mousethief:
quote:
Originally posted by Sine Nomine:
(And if I had a club and was standing in front of a baby seal and leo, I can tell you which one I'd go after…)
I'd have to see how soulful his eyes were.
Choruses of 'See my vest, see my vest.....' running through my mind now. ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
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Irish dogs needing homes! http://www.dogactionwelfaregroup.ie/ Greyhounds and Lurchers are shipped over to England for rehoming too!
Posts: 10002 | From: Scotland the Brave | Registered: Jul 2002
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(S)pike couchant
Shipmate
# 17199
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by la vie en rouge:
In your parochial little corner of anglocatholicism maybe.
leo, an Anglo-Catholic! ![[Killing me]](graemlins/killingme.gif)
In case you hadn't noticed, Anglo-Catholicism is high on the (admittedly very long) list of things leo hates. It's one of the few things that unites him with ken. Although I think that they hate it for different reasons: ken is a pretty typical Evangelical in this regard, whilst leo sometimes hints at Anglo-Catholic youth but gives the impression that a bad experience with a maniple has left him with a bad case of PTSD.
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'Still the towers of Trebizond, the fabled city, shimmer on the far horizon, gated and walled' but Bize her yer Trabzon.
Posts: 308 | From: West of Eden, East of England | Registered: Jul 2012
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beachcomber
Shipmate
# 17294
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Posted
What is a maniple ? How bad do they get ?
Can a person learn to adjust to their post-maniple condition successfully ?
Have I missed something ?
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Helen-Eva:'This is all really interesting and intensely confusing stuff and I am now bewildered in a much more informed way than I was before.'
Posts: 144 | From: bagdad cafe | Registered: Aug 2012
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(S)pike couchant
Shipmate
# 17199
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by beachcomber:
What is a maniple ? How bad do they get ?
Can a person learn to adjust to their post-maniple condition successfully ?
Have I missed something ?
The entire posting history of our friend leo in Ecclesiantics, evidently.
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'Still the towers of Trebizond, the fabled city, shimmer on the far horizon, gated and walled' but Bize her yer Trabzon.
Posts: 308 | From: West of Eden, East of England | Registered: Jul 2012
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Angloid
Shipmate
# 159
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Posted
Ken doesn't hate anglo-catholics. He just thinks they are all liberals.
Pray for me, brethren. I wore a maniple on Tuesday for the first time in about 40 years.
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Brian: You're all individuals!
Crowd: We're all individuals!
Lone voice: I'm not!
Posts: 12927 | From: The Pool of Life | Registered: May 2001
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beachcomber
Shipmate
# 17294
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Posted
Congratulations Angloid.
Did you emerge unscathed ?
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Helen-Eva:'This is all really interesting and intensely confusing stuff and I am now bewildered in a much more informed way than I was before.'
Posts: 144 | From: bagdad cafe | Registered: Aug 2012
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The Silent Acolyte
Shipmate
# 1158
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by la vie en rouge:
I'm just waiting for ken to turn up and call Myers-Briggs a load of crap, TBH.
You don't need to wait for ken:
Myers-Briggs is a load of crap.
There. You can package it up with Enneagrams and ship them back to your favorite, meddlesome diocesan consultant.
Posts: 7462 | From: The New World | Registered: Aug 2001
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Doublethink.
Ship's Foolwise Unperson
# 1984
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Posted
Seconded.
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All political thinking for years past has been vitiated in the same way. People can foresee the future only when it coincides with their own wishes, and the most grossly obvious facts can be ignored when they are unwelcome. George Orwell
Posts: 19219 | From: Erehwon | Registered: Aug 2005
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Wesley J
Silly Shipmate
# 6075
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Angloid:
Pray for me, brethren. I wore a maniple on Tuesday for the first time in about 40 years.
You have been maniple-ated. ![[Votive]](graemlins/votive.gif)
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Be it as it may: Wesley J will stay. --- Euthanasia, that sounds good. An alpine neutral neighbourhood. Then back to Britain, all dressed in wood. Things were gonna get worse. (John Cooper Clarke)
Posts: 7354 | From: The Isles of Silly | Registered: May 2004
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QLib
Bad Example
# 43
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by The Silent Acolyte:
quote:
Originally posted by la vie en rouge:
I'm just waiting for ken to turn up and call Myers-Briggs a load of crap, TBH.
You don't need to wait for ken:
Myers-Briggs is a load of crap.
There. You can package it up with Enneagrams and ship them back to your favorite, meddlesome diocesan consultant.
quote:
Originally posted by Doublethink:
Seconded.
Yeah? Well, you're both so ESTJ. And ken.
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Tradition is the handing down of the flame, not the worship of the ashes Gustav Mahler.
Posts: 8913 | From: Page 28 | Registered: May 2001
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Ariston
Insane Unicorn
# 10894
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Posted
Yes, I've read Kiersey's books. On the one hand, they're an interesting read, one more way to understand that people are not like you and that, really, that's pretty surprising. Plus, the work Isabel Myers did, and the reasons behind it—getting women who had never worked before, never thought about working before, or even, if they were to work, what they would be good at, into the workforce during World War II—are certainly worth noting. Hanging on every work Kiersey says like Holy Writ? Give me a break. I mean, I realize that my INTP self loves to see theoretical support and dislikes touchy-feely self-aggrandizing (oh, and butchering Plato for your own purposes), but the sheer amount of "NF's are the best, oh, that's what I am" is enough to make you gag.
However, even Kiersey would be unlikely to agree with using the temperament sorter as a club to beat down others you see as shallow or uninteresting. So, using real psychological methods, it seems I skew heavily towards neuroticism and away from conscientiousness. That doesn't give me an excuse to be messy, disorganized, anxious, or moody. If anything, it kinda means I get handed official notice to clean up my act—and, if nothing else, realize other people, who are stable and type A, are not going to respond to the same things I will.
leo, stop making bullshit excuses for your bad behavior. You can't run intellectual rings around people here, so don't even try. Own up to having been a condescending jerk, and try to mend your ways, please? The bluster and guff have officially gotten old.
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“Therefore, let it be explained that nowhere are the proprieties quite so strictly enforced as in men’s colleges that invite young women guests, especially over-night visitors in the fraternity houses.” Emily Post, 1937.
Posts: 6849 | From: The People's Republic of Balcones | Registered: Jan 2006
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Lamb Chopped
Ship's kebab
# 5528
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by la vie en rouge:
... it has been proven time and again that calling leo to hell is a case-study in futility.
Well, yeah, but it's like chewing gum, right? A lot of work and you get absolutely nowhere, but sometimes that's what you feel like doing.
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Er, this is what I've been up to (book).
Oh, that you would rend the heavens and come down!
Posts: 20059 | From: off in left field somewhere | Registered: Feb 2004
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Stephen
Shipmate
# 40
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Angloid:
Pray for me, brethren. I wore a maniple on Tuesday for the first time in about 40 years.
Heavens!
I see the makings of a video nasty here
'The manacle and I : how I escaped the bondage of the Tridentine Rite'......... ![[Two face]](graemlins/scot_twoface.gif)
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Best Wishes
Stephen
'Be still,then, and know that I am God: I will be exalted among the nations and I will be exalted in the earth' Ps46 v10
Posts: 3954 | From: Alto C Clef Country | Registered: May 2001
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Stephen
Shipmate
# 40
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Posted
That should of course have been maniple....
But you knew that anyway!
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Best Wishes
Stephen
'Be still,then, and know that I am God: I will be exalted among the nations and I will be exalted in the earth' Ps46 v10
Posts: 3954 | From: Alto C Clef Country | Registered: May 2001
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Lamb Chopped
Ship's kebab
# 5528
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Posted
Hey, can I join the special flower club? Here's another alleged INTJ bordering on F or P or whatever the hell they're calling it nowadays. They made everybody at work do it and stand in groups so we could all see how many of us there were.
Leo, our group was more than twice as large as any of the others.
We're very special dandelions.
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Er, this is what I've been up to (book).
Oh, that you would rend the heavens and come down!
Posts: 20059 | From: off in left field somewhere | Registered: Feb 2004
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orfeo
Ship's Musical Counterpoint
# 13878
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by leo:
I have usually been 'assessed' as INFJ - the rarest personality type, consisting of only 2% of the general population. According to this: quote:
INFJs will suddenly withdraw into themselves, sometimes shutting out even their intimates. This apparent paradox is a necessary escape valve for them, providing both time to rebuild their depleted resources and a filter to prevent the emotional overload to which they are so susceptible as inherent "givers." As a pattern of behavior, it is perhaps the most confusing aspect of the enigmatic INFJ character to outsiders, and hence the most often misunderstood -- particularly by those who have little experience with this rare type
And this: quote:
Can find too much time with people, especially strangers, draining….need to ‘recharge’ alone when you have spent time with a larger group …INFJs want a meaningful life and deep connections with other people. They do not tend to share themselves freely but appreciate emotional intimacy with a select, committed few. Although their rich inner life can sometimes make them seem mysterious or private to others, they enjoy making authentic connections with people they trust….They think deeply and often need time to process and evaluate before they are ready to share their ideas.
Yes, yes. Join the club. Another INFJ here, sometimes considered by others to be INTJ, somewhere near the borderline.
When I was first rated as INFJ and discovered it was the rarest type, one of my close friends responded with "that'd be right. always has to be different."
So, I haven't caught up on everything in the thread yet, and so far that's you, me and la vie en rouge in the same category. And the other two of us think you're being silly. So you better come up with a different excuse.
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Technology has brought us all closer together. Turns out a lot of the people you meet as a result are complete idiots.
Posts: 18173 | From: Under | Registered: Jul 2008
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RooK
1 of 6
# 1852
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Posted
I'm also INTJ, and so far along the "I" axis that it made my clinical psychologist wife wonder if I was making my answers up. I need to use coping strategies whenever I'm in groups of more than 6.
And I still think leo is full of shit. Face it, leo: we aren't excused by our limitations. Whenever we stop trying to be polite to people with the very-easy-to-follow social constructs, we are deciding to be assholes. Simple as that. And you seem to be willing to just be an asshole a lot of the time.
Incidentally, the MBTI is definitely not a diagnostic tool. It is however a very handy mechanism for letting people explain what they think they are. Most people are wrong about themselves in amusing ways. Perspective is a bitch.
Posts: 15274 | From: Portland, Oregon, USA, Earth | Registered: Nov 2001
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Evensong
Shipmate
# 14696
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Posted
One of those funky websites told me I was ESTJ and being a military leader was a suitable career for me.
HELL YEAH
Posts: 9481 | From: Australia | Registered: Apr 2009
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Ariston
Insane Unicorn
# 10894
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Evensong:
One of those funky websites told me I was ESTJ and being a military leader was a suitable career for me.
HELL YEAH
And suddenly I'm filled with terror. There are certain people (you know, about two-thirds of the Ship) that just should not be trusted with nuclear weapons.
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“Therefore, let it be explained that nowhere are the proprieties quite so strictly enforced as in men’s colleges that invite young women guests, especially over-night visitors in the fraternity houses.” Emily Post, 1937.
Posts: 6849 | From: The People's Republic of Balcones | Registered: Jan 2006
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Kelly Alves
Bunny with an axe
# 2522
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Posted
Don't cry for me, Argentina...
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I cannot expect people to believe “
Jesus loves me, this I know” of they don’t believe “Kelly loves me, this I know.”
Kelly Alves, somewhere around 2003.
Posts: 35076 | From: Pura Californiana | Registered: Mar 2002
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Evensong
Shipmate
# 14696
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Posted
I think I'd considering giving Wealase Woderick a nuclear weapon. And maybe tclune.
Such sensible, unexcitable chaps.
(Yeah, I'm jealous).
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a theological scrapbook
Posts: 9481 | From: Australia | Registered: Apr 2009
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Patdys
Iron Wannabe
RooK-Annoyer
# 9397
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Evensong:
One of those funky websites told me I was ESTJ and being a military leader was a suitable career for me.
HELL YEAH
I think you'll find the J goes at the front.
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Marathon run. Next Dream. Australian this time.
Posts: 3511 | Registered: Apr 2005
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jacobsen
seeker
# 14998
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Posted
Somebody explain all those terms, please? I tried the site in Leo's link, but it seemed to be self indulgent mumbo jumbo. YMMV. I gather that Leo's does.
I wanna be a special dandelion - you know, one that's not like all the others? ![[Confused]](confused.gif)
Query: As adolescents we all wanted to be like the other dandelions. What went wrong? Oh, I see. we grew up. Or did we?
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But God, holding a candle, looks for all who wander, all who search. - Shifra Alon
Beauty fades, dumb is forever-Judge Judy
The man who made time, made plenty.
Posts: 8040 | From: Æbleskiver country | Registered: Aug 2009
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orfeo
Ship's Musical Counterpoint
# 13878
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Evensong:
One of those funky websites told me I was ESTJ and being a military leader was a suitable career for me.
HELL YEAH
Oddly plausible. In that it is consistent with the fact that many Shipmates repeatedly tell you how unsuited you would be to pastoral care.
[ 31. August 2012, 07:08: Message edited by: orfeo ]
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Technology has brought us all closer together. Turns out a lot of the people you meet as a result are complete idiots.
Posts: 18173 | From: Under | Registered: Jul 2008
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Ariston
Insane Unicorn
# 10894
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by jacobsen:
Somebody explain all those terms, please? I tried the site in Leo's link, but it seemed to be self indulgent mumbo jumbo. YMMV. I gather that Leo's does.
It comes from the Keirsey Temperament Sorter, which is a pretty common social dynamics/workplace personality test. Basically, you're given a short-ish test with questions like "Would you rather be just or merciful?" After answering them, your basic personality type is sorted out based on four pairs of variables.
There are a number of people who think it's Holy Writ, usually corporate management types who like to sort people into little boxes and assign them roles. Psychologists hate it—it's based in a watered-down version of Jungian psychoanalysis, and not much else. While I wouldn't call it "modern-day astrology," it's definitely closer to party game than serious tool for counseling sessions.
Oh, and I suspect I'm not the only person with a tendency to break the test, especially when it asks questions like the one about the just/merciful dichotomy. Many of the questions, especially for the thinking/feeling pair, are based on a very odd worldview and conception of people, one in which some people are guided by efficiency, others by ethics and concern for others. Kiersey, in his books, consistently typifies the rational temperaments (NT) as unethical and prone to viewing people as means to their own nefarious ends—which might be more believable if many of the greatest and most uncompromising moral philosophers (Plato, Aristotle, Aquinas, Kant, etc.) didn't show every single trait that Kiersey says INTP's are supposed to.
So yes. The most prominent ethicists of all time were unconcerned with ethics. Figure that one out for me.
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“Therefore, let it be explained that nowhere are the proprieties quite so strictly enforced as in men’s colleges that invite young women guests, especially over-night visitors in the fraternity houses.” Emily Post, 1937.
Posts: 6849 | From: The People's Republic of Balcones | Registered: Jan 2006
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Ariel
Shipmate
# 58
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Posted
That sort of thing is rubbish, and I'd hate to have my suitability for a job assessed on the strength of it. How do you answer questions like "would you rather be just or merciful" – it depends on the situation, doesn't it?
I've done the Myers Briggs thing about 9 times and got a different result each time so I can't say I place any credence in it.
Posts: 25445 | Registered: May 2001
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orfeo
Ship's Musical Counterpoint
# 13878
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Posted
Should those of us who keep getting much the same result place credence in it, then? Following the same logic.
(Logic! He says he's an F and he keeps talking about logic!)
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Technology has brought us all closer together. Turns out a lot of the people you meet as a result are complete idiots.
Posts: 18173 | From: Under | Registered: Jul 2008
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Ariston
Insane Unicorn
# 10894
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Posted
Right, aren't the F's supposed to be concerned with others, prizing personal relationships over the rigors of logic, making arguments based on communitarian goods and eschewing conflict and self-aggrandizement?
I think we have proof that someone, somewhere, got something very wrong.
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“Therefore, let it be explained that nowhere are the proprieties quite so strictly enforced as in men’s colleges that invite young women guests, especially over-night visitors in the fraternity houses.” Emily Post, 1937.
Posts: 6849 | From: The People's Republic of Balcones | Registered: Jan 2006
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