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Source: (consider it)
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Thread: Circus: Mafia on the Planet Dimthing Tourist Bus
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Dafyd
Shipmate
# 5549
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Posted
You have chosen to evict Otto. He was
...drum roll....
innocent.
Night actions please.
A quick reminder of a rule in case it should be relevant: if two persons have each received the same number of votes the casting vote goes to the last person to have been killed by the Possessed.
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we remain, thanks to original sin, much in love with talking about, rather than with, one another. Rowan Williams
Posts: 10567 | From: Edinburgh | Registered: Feb 2004
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Gwai
Shipmate
# 11076
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Posted
Damn it.
I really thought so too. Was so sure.
Looking back though, I should have seen it coming. What two people were almost completely agreed on everything but are suddenly turning on each other dramatically to avoid obvious collusion?
Who would say things like this about Eliabulon, who we all know is super-tricky and admits to being as tricky as they come:
quote:
Originally posted by Autenrieth Road:
I agree with you infinitely, Eliabulon. These are the kinds of things that convince me you are Innocent. If you were Guilty, it would be infinitely easy for you to say nothing at all, and wait and see if John would inadvertently help you. But you said something instead.
Perhaps someone who trusts him because she knows his win condition is the same as hers.
Also, why did Ios make her most persuasive post against Eliabulon after everyone, even herself had already voted? (I'm not going to quote it here but it is the post that began quote:
Eliabulon has been very wicked
That was the post that persuaded me Eliabulon was guilty. Did she perhaps avoid giving that evidence out until it was too late? Heck, her post two hours before it was very useful too. Why was it held back?
I've been arguing all along that the guilty will be the ones who resist giving analysis because good analysis is hard to fake. Even Ios, who is both tricky and very good at bogus analysis, who could do it if anyone could had to hold back some her best talk until it was conveniently too late to convince anyone. Is that perhaps because you know you have John convinced and don't need to worry about failing a night kill?
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A master of men was the Goodly Fere,
A mate of the wind and sea.
If they think they ha’ slain our Goodly Fere
They are fools eternally.
Posts: 11914 | From: Chicago | Registered: Feb 2006
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Autenrieth Road
Shipmate
# 10509
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Posted
No, Possessed Codine, it is not because I am Possessed that you have observed all these things. It's because I've been unsure of myself, because there's been a lot to sort through which I have been spending a lot of time, thought, and posting trying to do (and you have not), and because as my knowledge gets more sure, and as I reflect on things more, I become more certain in what I want to say vs. what remains confused internal speculation on my part.
Of course my strongest statement against Eliabulon came when, because of the Otto vote, there was no longer any doubt that she and you are the two Possessed. I didn't have any doubts to distract me any more.
I note that when you recently indicated that perhaps the Possessed would find it hard to construct fake cases against the Innocent, because the Possessed know the Innocent are really Innocent, it appears that you were telling a great big giant fib. Why, look how busy you and Eliabulon have been, constructing a case against me.
Why is it, Codine, that after being so uncommunicative for the entire bus trip, you're suddenly so chatty? Could it be because you're trying to improve the odds that a murder will happen tonight, by sowing confusion for John?
I don't think I need to bother saying anything else to you and Eliabulon.
John The Less, if you want me to address anything, including any of the frantic array of so-called evidence that Codine and Eliabulon are mucking about with, just say so and I'll be happy to oblige. I've propped open the door to the HHH with the Lesley Memorial Button so you won't get locked in by accident. I'll be in the front seat, watching the stars. I think Codine and Eliabulon are hiding out in the Choey Memorial Water Closet, an apt place for manufacturing their wicked schemes.
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Truth
Posts: 9559 | From: starlight | Registered: Oct 2005
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Autenrieth Road
Shipmate
# 10509
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Posted
Dimthing through day seven
Nominees, votes, and deaths both by our collective hand and beyond our control:
Dimthing day one:
15 passengers
Nominations:
John nominates No Lynching
Joostein nominates Eliabulon
Eliabulon nominates Joostein
Zapaterietxe nominates Reppik Tew
Reppik Tew nominates Lovely Lesley
Votes:
Early votes before polls open:
Lady Celandine: No Lynching
Choey: No lynching
Votes after polls open:
Zapaterietxe: Reppik Tew
Lady Celandine: No Lynching
Ja'ayem: No Lynching
Otto: Joostein
Hophtrig: No Lynching
Eliabulon: Joostein
[Lovely Lesley invalidly votes for Hophtrig]
Lovely Lesley: No Lynching
Crimson: No Lynching
John: No Lynching
Codine: No Lynching
Ios: Joostein (this was a crosspost with Codine)
Joostein: No Lynching
Reppik Tew: No Lynching
Daisy shows up just before the polls close and pleads an attack of Real Lyfe. She asks whether her vote still can make a difference (it can't), and doesn't vote.
Result:
10 - No Lynching
3 - Joostein
1 - Reppik Tew
1 - No Vote Cast
The airlock stays closed.
Dimthing night one
Police Inspector Crimson is murdered.
Dimthing day two
14 passengers
Nominations:
Hophtrig nominates Otto
John nominates Reppik Tew
Otto nominates Hophtrig
Votes:
Choey: Hophtrig
Ja'ayem: Otto
Hophtrig: Otto
Zapaterietxe: Reppik Tew
Lady Celandine: Reppik Tew
Lovely Lesley: No Lynching
John: Reppik Tew
Ios: Reppik Tew
Otto: Reppik Tew
Joostein: Otto (to gather information about the people voting after him, he says)
Eliabulon: Reppik Tew
Reppik Tew: No Lynching
Daisy: Reppik Tew (mentions an imminent upcoming lengthy appointment with Real Lyfe)
Codine: Reppik Tew (cites a timing issue involving the Real Lyfe Leave Work Challenge and the Real Lyfe Arrive Home Challenge to explain her late vote)
Results:
8 - Reppik Tew
3 - Otto
1 - Hophtrig
2 - No Lynching
Possessed Symbiont (Unreadable) Reppik Tew is wrestled out the airlock by...
... Innocent Lovely Lesley
Dimthing night two
Detective Lady Celandine is murdered.
Dimthing day three
11 passengers
Nominations:
John nominates Otto
Joostein nominates Eliabulon
Choey nominates Hophtrig
Eliabulon nominates Joostein
Joostein claims to be the doctor.
John claims to be the doctor.
All hell breaks loose.
Votes:
Eliabulon: Joostein
Ios: Joostein
Choey: Joostein
John: Joostein
Ja'ayem: Joostein
Codine: Joostein
Hophtrig: Joostein
Otto: Joostein
Zapaterietxe: Joostein
Daisy: Joostein
Joostein: Joostein
Results:
11 - Joostein
Innocent Joostein is lynched
Dimthing night three
Daisy is murdered.
Dimthing day four
9 passengers
Nominations:
Zapaterietxe nominates Choey
Choey nominates Hophtrig
John nominates Ja'ayem
Ja'ayem nominates Ios
Votes: (I may have a few out of order)
John: Ja'ayem
Ios: Ja'ayem
Codine: Ja'ayem
Zapaterietxe: Ja'ayem
Hophtrig: Ja'ayem
Choey: Ja'ayem
Otto: Ja'ayem
Ja'ayem: Ja'ayem
Eliabulon: Ja'ayem
9 - Ja'ayem
Sympathiser Ja'ayem is lynched
Dimthing night four
An attempt on John is foiled by Dr. John himself. No-one is murdered.
Dimthing day five
8 passengers
Nominations:
Eliabulon nominates Choey
Choey nominates Codine
John nominates Hophtrig
Votes:
Otto: Codine
Zapaterietxe: Choey
John: Choey
Ios: Choey
Otto: tries to change to Choey, but not allowed
Hophtrig: Choey
Choey: Codine
Codine: Choey
Eliabulon: Choey
Results:
6 - Choey
2 - Codine
Innocent Choey is lynched
Dimthing night five
No-one is murdered
Dimthing day six
7 passengers
Nominations:
Ios nominates Hophtrig
John The Less nominates Otto
Hophtrig nominates Eliabulon
Votes:
Otto: Hophtrig
Hophtrig: Eliabulon
John The Less: Hophtrig
Zapaterietxe: Otto
Ios: Hophtrig
Codine: Hophtrig
Eliabulon: has not yet voted
Results so far:
4 - Hophtrig
1 - Eliabulon
1 - Otto
Innocent Hophtrig is lynched
Dimthing night six
Innocent Symbiote (Unreadable) Zapaterietxe is murdered
Dimthing day seven
5 passengers
Nominations:
John The Less nominates Otto
Ios nominates Eliabulon
Votes:
Eliabulon: Otto
Otto: Eliabulon
John The Less: Otto
Codine: Otto
Ios: Eliabulon
3 - Otto
2 - Eliabulon
Innocent Otto is lynched
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Truth
Posts: 9559 | From: starlight | Registered: Oct 2005
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Eliab
Shipmate
# 9153
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Posted
Und so it all comes down to John.
Vell, vun thing zat I agree vith Ios about is zat Codine is Possessed. But only because zere is no vun else it could be.
So I vill say a grudging "vell done" to Codine. To get as far as zis vith no real suspicion aimed at you, except for Ios's (hastily withdrawn) accusation based on missing John out of a list, zat is impressive. Even now, knowing you to be guilty, I cannot see any ozer mistakes.
Obviously I vill not know fall into ze trap of thinking zat you are arguing in good faith. Clearly you have to attack your conspirator now zat ze only innocent person (apart from John) knows zat ze ozer 'unknowns' are guilty, so part of your cover must be to acuse Ios, as her's is to accuse you. But I vill pick up on vun thing you say because zere is a clue to truth in it:
quote:
Originally posted by Gwai:
That was the post that persuaded me Eliabulon was guilty. Did she perhaps avoid giving that evidence out until it was too late? Heck, her post two hours before it was very useful too. Why was it held back?
Ios has ze start of an answer zere: she 'knew' I vas guilty ven she realised zat you und Otto could not both be innocent, und zen all ze pieces fell into place. It ignores ze point zat she had all ze pieces before zen, but zere is some sense to it. But thinking of zat makes me realise zat I vas wrong on an important point today, und Ios vas ahead of me.
I said zat it did not matter to ze killers vich of ze two innocents zey kill. Zat vas a mistake. It did matter - it mattered because you und Ios vanted not just to kill an innocent today, but to leave alive ze innocent zat you calculated zat John vould be least likely to protect. You vanted not only to kill vun of Otto or I, but also to undermine ze ozer. Und I note zat your approach today vas to nudge John to lynch Otto vile keeping ze door open to lynch me - saying you vould not nominate me, not because you thought me innocent, but only because you preferred Otto. Vereas Ios did ze opposite - pushed for my nomination, but not, as you observe, vith all ze force she might (both nominees vere innocent, she did not need to) vile leaving enough suspicion of Otto. I think zat, in ze end either of us vould have served your purpose, but it vas a bit more nuanced a play zan simply lynching vun innocent, no matter vich. You vere already setting up tonight.
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"Perhaps there is poetic beauty in the abstract ideas of justice or fairness, but I doubt if many lawyers are moved by it"
Richard Dawkins
Posts: 4619 | From: Hampton, Middlesex, UK | Registered: Mar 2005
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Autenrieth Road
Shipmate
# 10509
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Posted
I would rather stick needles in my eyes than read any more of this cant.
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Truth
Posts: 9559 | From: starlight | Registered: Oct 2005
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Eliab
Shipmate
# 9153
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Posted
You vill vant to read zis, Ios. You do not make many mistakes, but zis is vun, und I am sure zat you vill vant to learn from it in future lives.
I thought zat I remembered something, und I vas right. Zis post by Ios is ze key:
quote:
Originally posted by Autenrieth Road:
quote:
Originally posted by Eliab:
I am now thinking vether Otto is genuinely convinced by Ios's analysis of Codine's views, or trying to head off ze vote against Choey.
Or the two remaining Possessed are Otto and Codine, and Otto is working to build a cast-iron claim to be Innocent.
Ze context is ze start of ze vote ven ze evicted Choey. Ios had posted her soon-to-be-retracted suspicion of Codine. Otto had declared an intention to vote for him, following Ios's accusation.
Vy is zis significant? Because of zis:
quote:
Originally posted by Autenrieth Road:
By my calculations, we must lynch a Possessed today and then John must keep himself alive by protecting himself every night. (So that if we get down to one Innocent and one Possessed, the Innocent will be self-protecting John and the Possessed won't be able to murder that night.). Then we are guaranteed a win.
I vas arguing at ze time (vithout spelling out ze analysis – zere vas no reason not to leave some room for ze Possessed to make a mistake) zat sacrifices by ze killers at zat point vere unlikely, because ze guilty could not afford any losses.
Ze point of Ios' post about ze endgame is zat she had vorked zat out too. Indeed, I vould hardly expect her to miss it. So vy, if she genuinely suspected Codine, und genuinely thought Otto might be guilty but still follow her in voting to lynch him? On ze facts Ios knew, if zat vere right, Otto vas on ze brink of making an unrecoverable, losing, mistake. Und she discouraged him! She drew attention to ze suspicious spin she vould put his vote if he voted to lynch Codine, und Codine vas later seen to be guilty. Vy vould somevun who really suspected Codine do zat?
Vat a time to express ze vun real suspicion ve ever had of Codine, as vell. Everyvun thought Ja'ayem had tried to shield Choey or Hophtrig*, und most of us thought it was Choey. She vas clearly ze favoured suspect. Zere vas no safer time for Ios und Codine to stage zeir mock-suspicion. Even so, ven Otto looked like he vould bite, Ios gave vun of ze subtle steers zat she is so very good at. Und ze crucial point is zat an innocent-Ios vould have positively velcomed a sacrifice play by ze guilty, because she had ze analytical skill to realise zat if zey did zis, it vas a certain loss of zem. Ze real Ios did ze opposite.
(*Except ze guilty, of course. Und it is vorth noting zat Ja'ayem's double-bluff to shield Choey und Hophtrig vas accompanied by ze equally devious bluff of nominating Ios. It should also be noted zat Ios herself voted for Choey in a vun vord post, vith no explanation of ze change of mind, und BEFORE Codine had answered ze accusation against him. Und ze vote only stood at two to vun at zat point, so ze result vas still open. Read ze transcript – ze bottom half of page 23).
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"Perhaps there is poetic beauty in the abstract ideas of justice or fairness, but I doubt if many lawyers are moved by it"
Richard Dawkins
Posts: 4619 | From: Hampton, Middlesex, UK | Registered: Mar 2005
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Autenrieth Road
Shipmate
# 10509
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Posted
Ios is one f*cking mass of contradictions and couldn't pour piss out of a boot if the instructions were written on the heel, that's why.
Ios is phenomenally stupid.
I haven't read most of the junk you just posted, Eliabulon, because I just don't care. You outwitted us at every turn. Hophtrig and Otto started raising the alarm earlier, because they thought I was Innocent and so they had one fewer variable to play with. And also because they're smart and I'm stupid. But no-one listened. Stupid us.
I don't care any more. Maybe John will foil a murder, and then we'll see if the two Innocents (by which I mean John and Ios) can finally stick together long enough to lynch a Possessed Being. Or maybe the Memory of Zapaterietxe will take over John's mind again and John will become convinced that Eliabulon has got to be Innocent. And both Codine and Eliabulon will be hammering that Ios should be lynched, and there goes our last wisp of hope.
Ironic isn't it? Of our two Beings who came on this bus with a fixed preconception about Eliabulon, the one who wasn't believed was right and the one who was believed was wrong.
Gee, isn't it interesting that BOTH Eliabulon and Codine are busy arguing that I must be Possessed? A bit contradictory, don't you think? If either of them is correct, it means the other is busily arguing against his/her own partner in crime.
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Truth
Posts: 9559 | From: starlight | Registered: Oct 2005
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Autenrieth Road
Shipmate
# 10509
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Posted
Another possibility is that John is Possessed and a false medical claimant, and we have another living Being on this bus who is even stupider than I: an undeclared real Doctor who has left it this late in the bus tour to declare.
But I don't believe either Eliab or Gwai are that stupid, so Eliabulon and Codine, don't you even try making a false claim, because I might piss myself laughing at you.
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Truth
Posts: 9559 | From: starlight | Registered: Oct 2005
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Autenrieth Road
Shipmate
# 10509
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Posted
John, I don't actually believe you're a false claimant, but I've been running in my mind through all sorts of bizarre possibilities that could conceivably take place.
Incidentally, even if one of us is killed tonight, there is still a remote chance that we Innocents can win. So don't give up hope no matter how things appear in the morning.
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Truth
Posts: 9559 | From: starlight | Registered: Oct 2005
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Eliab
Shipmate
# 9153
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Autenrieth Road:
Gee, isn't it interesting that BOTH Eliabulon and Codine are busy arguing that I must be Possessed? A bit contradictory, don't you think? If either of them is correct, it means the other is busily arguing against his/her own partner in crime.
But it is obvious vy zis must be ze case.
Zere are two killers left. Zere are three people who might be killers. Vun of zose three knows zat she (or he, but in fact it is me) is innocent, und zerefore zat ze ozer two are guilty.
It does not matter how good you or Codine have been in concealing yourselves - because I am innocent I know zat you can't be. I must accuse you both.
Und Codine, knowing zis, must act as if she vere ze vun innocent person und you und I vere ze killers. So ve vill both accuse you. Und both of us vill accuse each ozer. Und zat vould be true if it vere him who vas guily, und even if ve both vere.
It cannot be any ozer vay. Zere is only vun innocent left apart from John Everyvun vill claim to be zat person.
I think zat anyvun reading ze transcript I referred to, und you conspicuously have not sought to explain, vill conclude zat neither you nor Codine is innocent. Though I confess zat I have ze advantage of knowing for certain zat you are both guilty.
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"Perhaps there is poetic beauty in the abstract ideas of justice or fairness, but I doubt if many lawyers are moved by it"
Richard Dawkins
Posts: 4619 | From: Hampton, Middlesex, UK | Registered: Mar 2005
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Eliab
Shipmate
# 9153
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Autenrieth Road:
But I don't believe either Eliab or Gwai are that stupid, so Eliabulon and Codine, don't you even try making a false claim, because I might piss myself laughing at you.
Codine may try zis if he vishes. I believe zat you und I have both expressly disclaimed having any special role.
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"Perhaps there is poetic beauty in the abstract ideas of justice or fairness, but I doubt if many lawyers are moved by it"
Richard Dawkins
Posts: 4619 | From: Hampton, Middlesex, UK | Registered: Mar 2005
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Autenrieth Road
Shipmate
# 10509
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Eliab:
I think zat anyvun reading ze transcript I referred to, und you conspicuously have not sought to explain,
I haven't bothered seeking to explain because fictitious A. has had quite enough of trying to reason in her Fake Life with a pathological liar, and has finally succeeded in cutting the cancer out of her life. Bus Tour Ios is feeling pretty much the same.
And also because Ios and A. both just Don't. Give. A. Shit. any more.
If John and I are both alive in the morning, and John wants me to answer anything about what you or Codine has posted, I will. Or if John during this Dimthing night wants me to answer or explain anything, I will. Until then, produce as much lying crap as you want. Smear my name. I. Don't. Care.
Fictitious A. is in fear of having her reputation trashed left right and center in her own church by a Manipulative Narcissistic Bastard, and, in the Life imitates Art imitates Life imitates Art sweepstakes, if you and Codine want to run me off this bus by manipulating John into thinking I'm Possessed without John at least having the grace to ask me what I have to say, then Just Go Ahead and F*cking Do It.
I hear that in the afterlife Innocent Beings get to see the Sapphire Falls. Possessed Beings who survive to the end after killing all the Innocents find themselves trapped on a stranded bus surrounded by xtonic radiation with nothing to eat but Roo Power Bars composed of raw Roo Power. Good thing Choey left you with a big supply as she left the bus.
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Truth
Posts: 9559 | From: starlight | Registered: Oct 2005
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Autenrieth Road
Shipmate
# 10509
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Posted
John, another reason why I didn't trot out all of my reasons to suspect Eliabulon until too late are that I didn't think I had to. You had said you would support lynching Eliabulon, Otto was sure to vote to lynch Eliabulon, I had no idea you were going to rush in and have to vote early, I thought I had time to look carefully at both Otto and Eliabulon one more time before voting and that I also had time to figure out how to lay out all of my thinking coherently before you and I voted, if it turned out that you needed more persuasion after hearing from Eliabulon after I nominated her.
More fool me.
If I'd been more decisive and decided that I was going to force the vote by voting early against Eliabulon, discussion and cooperation be damned, then we wouldn't be in this pickle.
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Truth
Posts: 9559 | From: starlight | Registered: Oct 2005
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Autenrieth Road
Shipmate
# 10509
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Posted
Fictitious Gwai, I find you absolutely terrifying. Even knowing you're Possessed by the process of elimination, I can't find one frigging suspicious thing about you.
No, there's one thing: you always vote late. So no suspicion can attach to you as causing any Being's death. Except once when Ja'ayem was obviously Naughty, and you swooped in early to vote. No-one was going to get the chance to say you tried to save that obvious criminal! And then, surprise surprise, here you are finding the time in your busy schedule to lynch Otto quickly.
[ETA: Oh, and your smile. Codine's smile has always creeped me out. But Innocent Lovely Lesley also had an explicitly creepy smile, and she was Innocent. So that's nothing to go on, more's the pity.]
[ 18. April 2014, 02:33: Message edited by: Autenrieth Road ]
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Truth
Posts: 9559 | From: starlight | Registered: Oct 2005
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Barefoot Friar
Ship's Shoeless Brother
# 13100
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Posted
You two Possessed fools are cracking me up! I think I'm going to start charging admission. The circus ain't got nothin' on this.
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Do your little bit of good where you are; its those little bits of good put together that overwhelm the world. -- Desmond Tutu
Posts: 1621 | From: Warrior Mountains | Registered: Oct 2007
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Autenrieth Road
Shipmate
# 10509
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Posted
Ios settles herself more firmly in the front seat, Choey and Hophtrig's Zardoc screwdriver firmly in her hand. She's not sure if it's to defend herself as needed, or to gouge her own eyes out to escape from the stratospheric level of fibs going on.
Fictitious A. whispers -- "See, you're just like me. I liked Mel Gibson's Passion of the Christ torture porn. And you keep tormenting yourself by reading this thread. E & C don't care about you anyway, they're just trying to get at John. So leave them to it, and come do something nice like sit with me and the Blessed Sacrament in the Garden of Repose."
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Truth
Posts: 9559 | From: starlight | Registered: Oct 2005
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Barefoot Friar
Ship's Shoeless Brother
# 13100
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Autenrieth Road:
John, another reason why I didn't trot out all of my reasons to suspect Eliabulon until too late are that I didn't think I had to.
I am sorry.
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Do your little bit of good where you are; its those little bits of good put together that overwhelm the world. -- Desmond Tutu
Posts: 1621 | From: Warrior Mountains | Registered: Oct 2007
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Autenrieth Road
Shipmate
# 10509
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Posted
Thanks, John.
This whole bus tour has been a terrifying case study in how very different we all are from each other, and even with our best intentions this makes it incredibly difficult for all of us to work together.
I think there's a sermon topic there.
Seriously, I'm looking forward after this tour ends to gathering in Valhalla and talking about how on Dimthing anyone in Fake Life manages to trust and work together with anyone else. If Fake Life avatars thought that 25% of the people they met were out to kill them, would that destroy society the way it's been so thoroughly destroyed here on the Dimthing bus tour?
There are probably oodles of case studies, both far away and right out our Fake Life back doors, to suggest that the answer is, "Yes."
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Truth
Posts: 9559 | From: starlight | Registered: Oct 2005
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Ariston
Insane Unicorn
# 10894
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Posted
There have been many beings who have died on the bus over the last several days—but strange things happen in the radiation belts of Dimthing, moon of Fail, and some of the beings were extraordinarily powerful, able to create objects out of thin air, or having pouches and pockets without bottom. Somehow, in the collective ectoplasm, a box of popcorn appears where Zapatereitxe's very worn and battered hat once was, dusted in a faint red substance. A bit of it disappears, as if being munched by an unseen being, and is then replenished—there are no doubt many hungry ghosts watching and enjoying the recent proceedings.
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“Therefore, let it be explained that nowhere are the proprieties quite so strictly enforced as in men’s colleges that invite young women guests, especially over-night visitors in the fraternity houses.” Emily Post, 1937.
Posts: 6849 | From: The People's Republic of Balcones | Registered: Jan 2006
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Autenrieth Road
Shipmate
# 10509
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Posted
Ios stabs the ghostly box of popcorn with her Zardoc screwdriver. The Zardoc screwdriver has many talents besides simply screwing screws: the box of popcorn vanishes, along with the contented feeling of the assembled munching ghosts.
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Truth
Posts: 9559 | From: starlight | Registered: Oct 2005
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no prophet's flag is set so...
Proceed to see sea
# 15560
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Posted
A feather, iridescent in the dark, as if creating its own light floats gently, almost falling and then floating up again, changing colour, and the fading. It almost seems to be dancing, or is it hopping?, keeping time to heartbeat of life, and of death. The fabulous feather fades from view, fluttering down, seeming to alight, but was it really ever there?
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Out of this nettle, danger, we pluck this flower, safety.
\_(ツ)_/
Posts: 11498 | From: Treaty 6 territory in the nonexistant Province of Buffalo, Canada ↄ⃝' | Registered: Mar 2010
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Ariston
Insane Unicorn
# 10894
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Posted
Unfortunately for Ios and her magic screwdriver, ghosts are aspacial and omnipresent. An overhead luggage compartment opens, the popcorn box rematerializes, and an odd unpopped kernel or two pops her in the head.
Ghosts do not take kindly to having their popcorn disturbed.
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“Therefore, let it be explained that nowhere are the proprieties quite so strictly enforced as in men’s colleges that invite young women guests, especially over-night visitors in the fraternity houses.” Emily Post, 1937.
Posts: 6849 | From: The People's Republic of Balcones | Registered: Jan 2006
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Autenrieth Road
Shipmate
# 10509
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Posted
Ios is meditating on the beautiful feather. She's still not sure she saw it, but she's going to live as if she saw it.
In the meantime, she has been reading over fictitious A.'s shoulder while fictitious A. reads about a bunch of fools on a ship. Ios decides that if fictitious Hegel is anything like his most vocal exponent (angelic variety) on board the Dimthing bus, that means Hegel will be overweeningly confident in all his beliefs and yet actually be wrong FIVE TIMES OUT OF SIX. She advises A. that the best course of action is to completely ignore Hegel, and Ios will ignore all angels and any of their descendants who sign up for bus tours.
Furthermore Ios hopes the angel chokes on his popcorn.
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Truth
Posts: 9559 | From: starlight | Registered: Oct 2005
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Ariston
Insane Unicorn
# 10894
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Posted
A bag of roasted arboreal kernels appears in Ios' hand.
The label reads "To You."
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“Therefore, let it be explained that nowhere are the proprieties quite so strictly enforced as in men’s colleges that invite young women guests, especially over-night visitors in the fraternity houses.” Emily Post, 1937.
Posts: 6849 | From: The People's Republic of Balcones | Registered: Jan 2006
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Eliab
Shipmate
# 9153
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Autenrieth Road:
John, another reason why I didn't trot out all of my reasons to suspect Eliabulon until too late are that I didn't think I had to. You had said you would support lynching Eliabulon, Otto was sure to vote to lynch Eliabulon, I had no idea you were going to rush in and have to vote early, I thought I had time to look carefully at both Otto and Eliabulon one more time before voting and that I also had time to figure out how to lay out all of my thinking coherently before you and I voted, if it turned out that you needed more persuasion after hearing from Eliabulon after I nominated her.
In ozer vords, vith two innocent nominations, you vere setting up a “sorry zat I did not try harder to lynch ze ozer vun” excuse, rather zan a “sorry I got it wrong but he looked so guilty” excuse. Or perhaps you vould have been happy vith either.
You are a sly vun, Ios, und I say zat vith all ze respect due to a fine enemy.
quote:
Originally posted by Autenrieth Road:
Fictitious Gwai, I find you absolutely terrifying. Even knowing you're Possessed by the process of elimination, I can't find one frigging suspicious thing about you.
Und vun thing ve can agree on is zat Codine has played zis very vell. Anozer foe vorthy of respect.
My vun hope, possibly a vain vun, is to live long enough to see at least vun of you dead so zat I may drink to your memory und pray to ze gods of ze Wrik zat in futures lives ve might be on ze same team.
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"Perhaps there is poetic beauty in the abstract ideas of justice or fairness, but I doubt if many lawyers are moved by it"
Richard Dawkins
Posts: 4619 | From: Hampton, Middlesex, UK | Registered: Mar 2005
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Wet Kipper
Circus Runaway
# 1654
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Posted
Part of me is considering a new game where in each phase (suspicion, nomination, voting) each person is limited to 1 post, of a maximum 140 characters
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- insert randomly chosen, potentially Deep and Meaningful™ song lyrics here -
Posts: 9841 | From: further up the Hill | Registered: Nov 2001
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Autenrieth Road
Shipmate
# 10509
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Posted
E: blah blah blah.
WK: chirp chirp! tweet tweet!
You have 93 characters left.
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Truth
Posts: 9559 | From: starlight | Registered: Oct 2005
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Autenrieth Road
Shipmate
# 10509
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Posted
quote:
pray to ze gods of ze Wrik zat in futures lives ve might be on ze same team.
Picked this up while scrolling past your post since it happened to be at the end. (Not bothering to read otherwise, oh Eliabulon Speaker With Forked Tongue.)
Yes, it would be fun to be Possessed together. We could utterly terrorize the populace.
To be Innocent together, not so easy. E and C have pretty much poisoned the well as far as any trust their Innocent descendants might hope to get from an equally Innocent Ios-heir on future bus trips.
I'm thinking I'll do my nominating and voting by random number generator on the next bus tour. Expecting the poor abused (but infinitely thanked for reading this encyclopedia of mayhem) hosts to recover enough to permit that in about 2018.
[ 18. April 2014, 12:04: Message edited by: Autenrieth Road ]
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Truth
Posts: 9559 | From: starlight | Registered: Oct 2005
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Starbug
Shipmate
# 15917
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Posted
In the outer reaches of the darkness, at the point just beyond the corner of the eye, a shadowy figure with an aristocratic bearing appeared. Silently, it sat down in mid-air next to Zapatereitxe, reached across him for a handful of invisible popcorn and began to munch.
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“Oh the pointing again. They're screwdrivers! What are you going to do? Assemble a cabinet at them?” ― The Day of the Doctor
Posts: 1189 | From: West of the New Forest | Registered: Sep 2010
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Autenrieth Road
Shipmate
# 10509
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Posted
Ios wonders why she needs a bag full of nuts when she's already spent the week with a bus full of nuts.
Oh. Of course. She's been left holding the bag.
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Truth
Posts: 9559 | From: starlight | Registered: Oct 2005
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Jay-Emm
Shipmate
# 11411
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Wet Kipper:
Part of me is considering a new game where in each phase (suspicion, nomination, voting) each person is limited to 1 post, of a maximum 140 characters
[Once it's permitted I intend to open (or resurrect Daffyd's) a thread for many thoughts that go wider than this game.]
Posts: 1643 | Registered: May 2006
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Banner Lady
Ship's Ensign
# 10505
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Posted
In the silence, a snatch of distant flute music seems to be accompanied by ethereal voices faintly singing:
And their ghosts may be seen as you pass by the Sapphire Falls, you'll come a-waltzing with Hophtrig and me...
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Women in the church are not a problem to be solved, but a mystery to be enjoyed.
Posts: 7080 | From: Canberra Australia | Registered: Oct 2005
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Autenrieth Road
Shipmate
# 10509
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Posted
A horrible thing, which parallels fictitious A.'s Life imitating Art imitating Life imitating Art recent nightmare, is that you keep remembering things that you trusted, and now you find out may well have been big fat fibs. And mostly, you'll never know; just throw out everything you were ever told from that source, because it's completely unreliable.
For example, the touching story of Eddie Eli and why Clan Eliab was nervous for a while after, but expresses that nervousness no more... absolutely true? Or was the Grafinn tap-dancing like crazy there?
I'll probably never know.
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Truth
Posts: 9559 | From: starlight | Registered: Oct 2005
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Alban
Shipmate
# 9047
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Posted
A previously unnoticed Holovision set flickers into life for a moment
"... all such good friends to Hophtrig..."
then off again
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Whoever you are, wherever you go, Hophtrig is your friend!
Posts: 722 | From: Under a (long white) cloud | Registered: Feb 2005
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Barefoot Friar
Ship's Shoeless Brother
# 13100
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Posted
In the off chance we have two innocents in the morning, I intend to lynch Codine first.
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Do your little bit of good where you are; its those little bits of good put together that overwhelm the world. -- Desmond Tutu
Posts: 1621 | From: Warrior Mountains | Registered: Oct 2007
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Autenrieth Road
Shipmate
# 10509
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Posted
OK. I have no idea why you're choosing that way, but I'll go with either C or E, whichever you choose.
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Truth
Posts: 9559 | From: starlight | Registered: Oct 2005
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Eliab
Shipmate
# 9153
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Barefoot Friar:
In the off chance we have two innocents in the morning, I intend to lynch Codine first.
On ze vun hand, good, because he is guilty.
On ze ozer, I vould sincerely urge you to listen und think vith an open mind, but to say little zis evening. Vy? Because you have no vun to persvade of anything. Apart from you, everyvun still alive knows everything. Ze killers know who is guilty by direct knowledge, ze ozer innocent by elimination. Vun person is on your side und is telling ze truth. Two are lying.
Everything now depends on you making ze right decision. My real fear is zat if, even after reading ze transcript I asked you to look at, you think zat I am guilty und say so ze killers know zat I vill be unprotected tonight, und zey vill kill me. Naturally, a Pavian Landsgraf vill never admit to a fear of death, but my murder vould also mean zat ve lose, und zat I very much vish to avoid.
As you do not know for sure who is innocent, ze only prudent thing for you to do is to let ze killers imagine zat anyvun might be protected. A declaration zat you do not trust somevun, if zat person is actually innocent, dooms zem, und means ze innocents lose.
It does not matter so much zat you do not trust Codine - he is a killer - but I do urge you to be careful vat you say, as it could give ze killers a clue vat you vill do tonight. Our hopes depend on you getting ze choice right.
You can, I hope, see zat zis advice makes sense whoever it is zat is innocent. I vant you to realise zat I am innocent (und, tomorrow, our lives likely depend on you seeing zat), but zat can vait until morning. Right now, ze thing zat matters is stopping ze murder. So even if you do not see zat I am innocent, even if you are utterly convinced zat I am guilty, please do not give ze killers information zey can use tonight. If zey out-guess you, zey vin.
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"Perhaps there is poetic beauty in the abstract ideas of justice or fairness, but I doubt if many lawyers are moved by it"
Richard Dawkins
Posts: 4619 | From: Hampton, Middlesex, UK | Registered: Mar 2005
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Barefoot Friar
Ship's Shoeless Brother
# 13100
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Posted
Truth.
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Do your little bit of good where you are; its those little bits of good put together that overwhelm the world. -- Desmond Tutu
Posts: 1621 | From: Warrior Mountains | Registered: Oct 2007
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Autenrieth Road
Shipmate
# 10509
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Posted
Now that I'm less angry:
Eliab probably really knows this, despite Eliabulon's professed expressions of disbelief (which are probably as unreliable as everything else Eliabulon has said):
Eliabulon's coming out against Second Partridge so decisively is what got me wondering again about Eliabulon as a possibility for Possessed. Eliabulon protests that she considered it, but her explanation was incredibly poor at communicating that to me. But I still had a very hard time believing that either Eliabulon or Codine were Possessed, because they had said, and continued to say, so many things which were very smooth and believable to me.
I was absolutely serious when I said to Hophtrig that it would be a nasty shock to me if Hophtrig wasn't Possessed, because it would mean at least one of either Eliabulon or Codine were Possessed (*). You can see how much I was convinced E & C were Innocent by how blithely I left control of the Hophtrig vote up to them. I'm not sure if I could have affected the outcome in any case, but it never even occurred to me that we were in danger precisely because Eliabulon and Codine were now in control of the outcome. I'm grateful to Hophtrig for making his comment about "prepare for a nasty shock." It didn't convince me enough to convince me not to vote for Hophtrig (sorry Hophtrig), but it did get me turning the possibility (of E and/or C's Possession) over more in my mind, so that when Hophtrig was confirmed to be Innocent the shock was not as nasty as it would have been.
Once Hophtrig was confirmed as Innocent, then I had to confront the fact that at least one of Eliabulon or Codine were Possessed. Once I had to acknowledge that at least one of those convincing smooth-talkers was Possessed, it was also possible that both were. So Eliabulon's feigned shock about how I went from stating that I was convinced she was Innocent early on, to outing her as Possessed with such conviction on this latest Dimthing day, is entirely fake and also supremely stupid in its reasoning.
I still had a really hard time believing Codine might be Possessed, because unlike Eliabulon, Codine had thrown up no specific suspicious flags apart from the late voting pattern I mentioned. And even that voting pattern could easily be explained away. I think that's why I instinctively went for Eliabulon instead of Codine as my nominee: because I could make a case against Eliabulon, whereas I couldn't make much of a case against Codine yet. (And I still can't make much of a case against Codine, except that I know that by process of elimination he must be Possessed.)
For the Otto vote, I was much more suspicious of Eliabulon than of Otto by the time the vote started. Then Eliabulon and Codine's votes came in, and after taking time to consider all sorts of very low percentage possibilities, I had proof of the guilt of E & C. That proof of course allowed me to be much more strong and convincing in my denunciation of Eliabulon, because I didn't have to be distracted by doubts such as "oh it could have another explanation if E is Innocent."
I don't think A. could have a hypothetically Possessed Ios fake anger as she has expressed recently. Shock and outrage as after Joostein's false claim, yes. Incandescently coruscating anger, no. That's because of my belief about the potential effect of even faked anger on Innocent targets and their Fake Life friends. So if someone really knows me, they might take that as evidence of my Innocence. I don't know if anyone, either here on the bus, or even here on the ship, would have any reason to know me that well.
(*) curious, I see I am wavering on whether or not to use the subjunctive in this sentence, and have made different choices in the two clauses. Perhaps fictitious Gwai the editor-nerd would have an opinion on whether Hophtrig-clause should get the subjunctive as well? signed, fictitious A., lover of the rare traces of the distinguishable subjunctive left in English.
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Truth
Posts: 9559 | From: starlight | Registered: Oct 2005
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Autenrieth Road
Shipmate
# 10509
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Ios the Idiot:
For the Otto vote, I was much more suspicious of Eliabulon than of Otto by the time the vote started.
Alas, I wasn't convinced enough to pull the trigger right away when voting opened and vote for Eliabulon immediately. Hopefully that would have forced John to vote for Eliabulon.
Who knows, though, an early Eliabulon vote by me might not have made any difference. Maybe John was so convinced that Otto was Possessed that the two of us, Otto and me, both voting for Eliabulon so quickly would have caused John's head to explode and once he picked up the pieces he might have decided that I must be Possessed along with Otto, and he would have voted for Otto anyway.
[ 19. April 2014, 14:58: Message edited by: Autenrieth Road ]
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Truth
Posts: 9559 | From: starlight | Registered: Oct 2005
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Autenrieth Road
Shipmate
# 10509
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Posted
Who knows? There may be several more flip-flops to come.
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Truth
Posts: 9559 | From: starlight | Registered: Oct 2005
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Autenrieth Road
Shipmate
# 10509
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Posted
Fictitious A. thanks fictitious Gwai re: subjunctive and also re: previous well-wishes.
quote:
Originally posted by Gwai:
Codine maintains his innocence against claims by Eliabulon and Ios, but isn't going to make any more big speeches because everyone's mind is probably made up.
Codine on the other hand is a snake-in-the-grass. A brilliantly wicked snake-in-the-grass.
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Truth
Posts: 9559 | From: starlight | Registered: Oct 2005
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Autenrieth Road
Shipmate
# 10509
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Posted
Wishing blessed Easter greetings to all assembled Beings, Ghosts, Fictitious Friends, The Absolute Dafyd, Long-Suffering Hosts, and all Lurkers. Christ is Risen!
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Truth
Posts: 9559 | From: starlight | Registered: Oct 2005
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Eliab
Shipmate
# 9153
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Autenrieth Road:
Now that I'm less angry:
Ios, zose vere arguments of desperation, not anger.
Zis is, perhaps, ze most obviously veak:
quote:
You can see how much I was convinced E & C were Innocent by how blithely I left control of the Hophtrig vote up to them. I'm not sure if I could have affected the outcome in any case, but it never even occurred to me that we were in danger precisely because Eliabulon and Codine were now in control of the outcome.
Zis is (vun) simply not true, und (two) vould not be evidence if it vas.
You did not leave ze outcome to Codine und I. Your vote for Hophrig put Otto in ze clear. Codine (or I if I had voted first) had ze choice of lynching Hophtrig or no vun, vith ze choice passing to me if he chose no vun. Ve did not have ze option of evicting Otto after your vote (Zapaterietxe's vote removed ze possibility of lynching me except by suicide).
But even if ve suppose you had left it to us, vat does zat prove? Ze options John has to consider are:
A) Ios is innocent, Codine and Eliabulon are Possessed;
B) Ios is Posessed, und so is Codine, Eliabulon is innocent;
C) Ios is Posessed, und so is Eliabulon, Codine is innocent.
For ze purpose of zis analysis, B und C can be viewed together.
You say zat it is A. On zat hypothesis, it is possible zat, wrongly thinking zat Codine und Eliabulon innocent, because ze killers are Otto und Hophtrig, you leave ze choice to lynch a suspected killer to somevun you think is on your side.
But suppose is it B or C. Zen you know for sure zat ze vuns at risk, Otto und Hophtrig, are innocent, und you have a co-conspirator still to vote. On either of zese hypotheses, you know zat it does not matter, vich victim you lynch, so can safely leave ze choice to ze ozers.
On any available hypothesis, your vote is consistent vith ze facts. It is zerefore, in itself, evidence of nothing, eqvally plausible und explicable if you are guilty or if you are innocent.
Vat is suspicious is ze fact you misrepresent it as leaving ze outome up to ozers, ven in fact it left us vith exactly vun possible victim. Zat is ze sort of thing you need to say to explain vy you apparently trusted two people, vun of whom you vant him to accuse, und vun you must of necessity now pretend to betray. Zat is something ze guilty person must lie about. Ze innocent person vould have a true answer to give*. Zat you misrepresent ze facts IS evidence, because it is something ze guilty must do und ze innocent need not.
(*It is fair to give mine. Ios und Codine played zis vell. Zere vere times zat I vas suspicious of Ios (especially in her support of Hophtrig's insane scheme) but zere vas alvays somevun who looked more guilty, sometimes rightly und sometimes wrongly. Codine never really moved out of ze 'no real evidence' category. Both vere apparently usefully analytical, Ios ze more so. I vas never convinced zat both vere innocent, because I know both to be very good at duplicity, but zey never topped my list of suspects, nor, I think, anyvun else's. Ze only case against Codine vas made by Ios herself, but not backed by Ios's actual vote. I do not need to invent or slant any facts to say any of zat. You need only look back on my vords und see zat everything I have said or done, even ze mistakes, are fully consistent vith innocence, und vun highly significant action (ze analysis zat led to finding ze conspirator) is really only consistent vith innocence).
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"Perhaps there is poetic beauty in the abstract ideas of justice or fairness, but I doubt if many lawyers are moved by it"
Richard Dawkins
Posts: 4619 | From: Hampton, Middlesex, UK | Registered: Mar 2005
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