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Source: (consider it)
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Thread: Doctor Who: The Eleventh Incarnation
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Roseofsharon
Shipmate
# 9657
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Ariel:
Why was the Doctor doing Tommy Cooper impersonations?
Well, they had to have something visual for us to ell the 'then' Doctor from the 'now' as he was popping backwards and forwards in time.
Even with the fez I was confused as to when exactly each appearance was happening.
Loved it, though - and particularly pleased to see the explanation for that scene with Amy in the forest of the Treeborgs.
I found myself grinning from ear to ear in the final scenes, and I loved the way they fitted in the wedding rhyme
Something old,
Something new,
Something borrowed,
Something blue
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Posts: 3060 | From: Sussex By The Sea | Registered: Jun 2005
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Dafyd
Shipmate
# 5549
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Roseofsharon:
Something old,
Something new,
Something borrowed,
Something blue
I am not the only person on the internet who suspects that Amy's entire character arc was written for that moment.
The first entrance of grown-up Amy was great.
So was the modern re-appearance of Rory.
Is this the first time in Doctor Who that someone has escaped from a dalek by climbing down the stairs?
The Doctor dancing. (Three would certainly have been able to waltz or tango.)
I'm ok with Amy bringing the Doctor back by remembering him because that's been hinted at as a rule for the cracks throughout the series and was so heavily emphasised in this episode that you wonder why the characters hadn't come to the conclusion earlier.
The Amy - Rory relationship has got a lot more solid since episode one. I think one of Moffatt's aims in this series must have been to utterly defuse the idea that the Doctor and companion must have some sort of romantic relationship.
Down sides:
The time bracelet was a bit too versatile. It makes the tardis look clumsy. Also, it didn't bother me at the time, but the Doctor going back in time so Rory can let him out so he can go back in time is unsatisfactory.
I wish they'd found something for young Amelia to do in the museum instead of getting rid of her.
And as for the Doctor's companions all showing mercy, I don't think the daleks ever ran into Leela, but they had met Ace.
Other than that, it was sufficiently fast that I didn't have time to think about any niggles; the ending, while utterly predictable (see above), was still fun; and all the cast were being brilliant.
I don't know that Matt Smith is a better actor than David Tennant. But the writing and directing trusts him to do the work which he does handsomely, while Tennant was too often landed with dialogue that tried to do the work for him.
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we remain, thanks to original sin, much in love with talking about, rather than with, one another. Rowan Williams
Posts: 10567 | From: Edinburgh | Registered: Feb 2004
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tessaB
Shipmate
# 8533
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Dafyd:
I wish they'd found something for young Amelia to do in the museum instead of getting rid of her.
Oh but Amelia was the most important bit. The pandoricon needed her DNA to bring Amy back to life.
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tessaB
eating chocolate to the glory of God
Holiday cottage near Rye
Posts: 1068 | From: U.K. | Registered: Sep 2004
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Dafyd
Shipmate
# 5549
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by tessaB:
Oh but Amelia was the most important bit. The pandoricon needed her DNA to bring Amy back to life.
I meant once she'd done that. As it was, it felt as if she was being used for the sake of older Amy and then no longer needed.
Anyway, speculation time:
I hope the man that River shot doesn't turn out to be Rory. I don't see how anyone - Amy, the Doctor - would ever forgive her. I won't.
So the tardis is headed off to deal with an Egyptian goddess on the Orient Express. Is this a clue? The villain behind everything is apparently an old enemy. Could it be Sutekh?
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we remain, thanks to original sin, much in love with talking about, rather than with, one another. Rowan Williams
Posts: 10567 | From: Edinburgh | Registered: Feb 2004
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The Rogue
Shipmate
# 2275
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Posted
I want a fez. fezzes are cool!
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If everyone starts thinking outside the box does outside the box come back inside?
Posts: 2507 | From: Toton | Registered: Feb 2002
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Gill H
Shipmate
# 68
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Posted
Bit worried about the vortex manipulator being taken 'off the wrist of a handsome time agent'. (Actually not even off the wrist.)
Not *that* handsome time agent, I hope?
Oh, and I want to know about Space Florida now. Does it have a Space Disney World?
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*sigh* We can’t all be Alan Cresswell.
- Lyda Rose
Posts: 9313 | From: London | Registered: May 2001
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Dormouse
Glis glis – Ship's rodent
# 5954
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Posted
I loved the fact that Rory was willing to guard Amy for 2,000 years - and that the Doctor wistfully referred to him as "The boy who waited 2,000 years". I have gone from thinking "Why on earth would a woman like Amy want to marry a wimp like Rory?" to "Why on earth would such a lovely bloke like Rory want to be saddled with a hussy like Amy?"!
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40 days, 40 reflections, 40 acts of generosity. Join the #40acts challenge for #Lent and let's start a movement. www.40acts.org.uk
Posts: 3042 | From: 'twixt les Bois Noirs & Les Monts de la Madeleine | Registered: May 2004
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angelica37
Shipmate
# 8478
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Posted
I loved it, this is so well written and finished up the series beautifully, looking forward to seeing River Song again soon (I like her she shoots Daleks!)
Posts: 1351 | From: Suffolk | Registered: Sep 2004
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Paul.
Shipmate
# 37
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Ceannaideach:
I liked the Hitchhikers guide to the galaxy reference in last weeks episode. The message carved in the side of the cliff face in huge letters many feet high.
And this time the plot revolved around being able to extrapolate the entire universe from the atoms inside the Tardis.
Also launching the Pandorica into the heart of the sun aka exploding Tardis.
quote:
Originally posted by Dormouse:
I loved the fact that Rory was willing to guard Amy for 2,000 years - and that the Doctor wistfully referred to him as "The boy who waited 2,000 years". I have gone from thinking "Why on earth would a woman like Amy want to marry a wimp like Rory?" to "Why on earth would such a lovely bloke like Rory want to be saddled with a hussy like Amy?"!
Yeah and after all that she's still flirting with the Doctor and wanting to kiss him at her own wedding.
Not a fan of the episode I'm afraid. Too much techno-babble made up on the spot to justify what's basically a big reset button. "Oops did we accidentally destroy all of space and time? Oh well let's just bring it back then."
Clearly what they were more interested in was playing out the relationship stuff between Rory, Amy and the Doctor. Fair's fair Matt Smith looks good in formal wear but not good enough to make up for the rest of it.
Posts: 3689 | From: UK | Registered: Jun 2004
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rufiki
Ship's 'shroom
# 11165
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Dafyd:
Also, it didn't bother me at the time, but the Doctor going back in time so Rory can let him out so he can go back in time is unsatisfactory.
I agree. I also think there should have been wider consequences of the Doctor being erased from history. When David Tennant's Doctor was killed, all sorts of nasty things happened to Earth because he wasn't around to stop them.
And how come Amy is allowed to touch young Amy when Rose wasn't allowed to touch baby Rose?
ETA: Mind you, Matt Smith in a Tux makes up for quite a lot. ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
[ 27. June 2010, 20:46: Message edited by: rufiki ]
Posts: 1562 | Registered: Mar 2006
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Dafyd
Shipmate
# 5549
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by rufiki:
I also think there should have been wider consequences of the Doctor being erased from history. When David Tennant's Doctor was killed, all sorts of nasty things happened to Earth because he wasn't around to stop them.
I think a lot of those had already been eaten by cracks. Amy didn't remember daleks invading earth and the Victorian cyberman had already vanished from history. Things only came back through the cracks if Amy tried to remember them.
(There are other fan speculation explanations about time trying to straighten itself out around things that have disappeared as much as possible - but I think the above is the main one in the programs themselves.)
quote:
And how come Amy is allowed to touch young Amy when Rose wasn't allowed to touch baby Rose?
I think it's safe to say that the paradox thingies - whatever they were called - had worse things to worry about. Assuming they still even existed.
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we remain, thanks to original sin, much in love with talking about, rather than with, one another. Rowan Williams
Posts: 10567 | From: Edinburgh | Registered: Feb 2004
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The Great Gumby
Ship's Brain Surgeon
# 10989
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Dafyd:
Down sides:
The time bracelet was a bit too versatile. It makes the tardis look clumsy. Also, it didn't bother me at the time, but the Doctor going back in time so Rory can let him out so he can go back in time is unsatisfactory.
The time bracelet was a rather clunky and suspiciously precise plot device, I agree (especially when the whole series started out with the Doctor unable to get the Tardis to hit the right decade), introduced so that River could join in and to permit the second of your gripes. I'm sufficiently sad that after the first episode, I spent a lot of time thinking about possible ways of resolving the story, and this one (cf the Terminator Paradox of how Dyson developed the first Terminator by reverse-engineering another one), while intensely irritating, is so much better than the various "and-they-woke-up-and-it-was-all-a-dream"-flavoured alternatives. Of course it's flawed, but if the sleight of hand is concealed with sufficiently charming patter, it isn't glaring.
I also found the nature of this collapse of the universe annoyingly vague, considering that so much of the plot rested on it. If everything was collapsing in on itself with the Earth at the centre, how come the stars disappeared instantly, rather than whenever the light from their supernovas reached us, or (if they were "exploding" into never-existedness) when the collapse reached them? Why did the collapse destroy everything up to and including the Sun, but then sit around twiddling its thumbs for 2,000 years and only start to close in on Earth at the exact point young Amy returned? Why should the collapse of everything that ever was or will be happen chronologically anyway, as suggested by frequent references to the collapse closing in?
For all that, it flowed well enough that I was prepared to forgive the plot holes. For once, the second half of a two-parter seemed like a real story, rather than a messy and half-baked resolution. The story didn't revolve around the Daleks again, as I briefly feared, and the conclusion, while predictable, was well-handled.
I love Matt Smith as the Doctor, like Amy (although it seems to work better with Rory as well), and was generally very impressed with Steven Moffat's episodes. The others were far more hit and miss, possibly because he has a looser hand on the tiller than RTD, but the development of the storyline through the whole series was a huge improvement on a series of unrelated stories clumsily tied together at the end. I just hope we get some more new interesting baddies next series, rather than the same ones over and over. The Weeping Angels just about worked this time, but are in danger of overexposure, and we all know about the Cybermen and Daleks.
One last thought: Given that the trap was baited from Amy's mind, and RoboRory programmed on that basis, it occurred to me that we have no idea whether Rory really would have waited and guarded Amy for 2,000 years (he may have done, or he may not), just that Amy believed he would. I suppose that's good enough as a starting point for a marriage. ![[Cool]](cool.gif)
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The first principle is that you must not fool yourself, and you are the easiest person to fool. - Richard Feynman
A letter to my son about death
Posts: 5382 | From: Home for shot clergy spouses | Registered: Feb 2006
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Jay-Emm
Shipmate
# 11411
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Posted
a germ of a theory?
A-G In order From the point of view of the universe
1-7 In order from the point of view of Amy
A5)The Universe lives almost as normal
B1)Dr sees little Amy
B6)Tardis goes kewbowee
C7)The universe collapses however until Amy is picked up the event doesn't happen, the Tardis is banned from double appearances (hence the jumps).
D2)Amy grows up with no stars, ducks, cybermen etc...
E3)The Dr picks up Amy
E8)The universe recreated
F4)The Universe lives as normal
So because the Dr fixes things the Universe only has a little bubble of minimal existance.
(the dates of the explosion ought to be at E, and regeneration seems to happen at C7 but next see adult Amy. I suppose the time event could happen retrospectively.
C8 The Universe is healed but because the Tardis needs to be there to be healed it's always being destroyed until it exploded.
E7 The Tardis blows up, destroying the Universe (but then Amy isn't needed)
[edit would this then allow Rory to have a closed time loop-don't think so as have dead and married Rory]
[ 27. June 2010, 23:10: Message edited by: Jay-Emm ]
Posts: 1643 | Registered: May 2006
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Robert Armin
All licens'd fool
# 182
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Posted
Another really good episode, IMNSVHO. Rory remaining on guard for centuries was genuinely moving (but the Doctor's remark, "The boy who waited," was reminiscent of, "The boy who lived," - hope they don't go down that line). The reappearance at the wedding was fantastic, and I'm sure there's a sermon in the power of story lurking there somewhere. I also liked the revelation about the nature of the "sun" that had been keeping the earth going all this time - the Tardis is as noble as its owner, it seems. Glad too to have Amy AND Rory stil as companions, and married off (is this the first time we've had married companions?). Finally the teaser for the special was great. At last everything is starting to come together.
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Keeping fit was an obsession with Fr Moity .... He did chin ups in the vestry, calisthenics in the pulpit, and had developed a series of Tai-Chi exercises to correspond with ritual movements of the Mass. The Antipope Robert Rankin
Posts: 8927 | From: In the pack | Registered: May 2001
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Sparrow
Shipmate
# 2458
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Posted
So please explain to me, cos I was really confused .. the Rory that went off with the Doctor and Amy at the end, was that the "real" Rory brought back somehow, or a plastic Nestene recreation with Rory's memories?
![[Confused]](confused.gif)
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For I am persuaded that neither death, nor life,nor angels, nor principalities, nor things present nor things to come, nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, will be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.
Posts: 3149 | From: Bottom right hand corner of the UK | Registered: Mar 2002
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Matt Black
Shipmate
# 2210
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Posted
Yeah, I was wondering what happened to Auton-Centurion Rory - was he 'made human' by the Big Bang or was his existence erased so that Rory Williams was the only Rory to have ever existed?
[ETA - other than that, really loved it]
[ 28. June 2010, 08:52: Message edited by: Matt Black ]
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"Protestant and Reformed, according to the Tradition of the ancient Catholic Church" - + John Cosin (1594-1672)
Posts: 14304 | From: Hampshire, UK | Registered: Jan 2002
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Dafyd
Shipmate
# 5549
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Posted
Rory-Auton never existed I think - although some of his memories seem to have jumped track into human Rory. Maybe it's only those memories that Amy was around for.
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we remain, thanks to original sin, much in love with talking about, rather than with, one another. Rowan Williams
Posts: 10567 | From: Edinburgh | Registered: Feb 2004
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Matt Black
Shipmate
# 2210
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Posted
That would be a shame - I think the (redeemed?) Auton-Rory guarding his beloved for 1900 years was really sweet.
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"Protestant and Reformed, according to the Tradition of the ancient Catholic Church" - + John Cosin (1594-1672)
Posts: 14304 | From: Hampshire, UK | Registered: Jan 2002
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Ariel
Shipmate
# 58
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Posted
Not for the first time, I'm going to be a lone voice here. The bit at the wedding where Amy gets up and launches into a passionate speech about how the most important person in her life was missing made me cringe. I don't know what Rory sees in her, but anyone who waits 1900 years for someone like Amy has to be a bit of a mug. She'd drop him like a shot if the Doctor even showed the slightest sign of changing his mind. (Yes, I do know it's just fiction.)
Still, Mr Pond (because that's the way it is) seems to be developing as a more rounded character, so hopefully he'll play a more active role in future episodes, assert himself more, etc etc.
Re married companions, Ian and Barbara were the first pair I think. (Did they actually travel with the Doctor as such?)
Posts: 25445 | Registered: May 2001
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Jay-Emm
Shipmate
# 11411
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Posted
quote:
Re married companions, Ian and Barbara were the first pair I think. (Did they actually travel with the Doctor as such?)
First marriage of Dr Who companion Susan and resistance man.
I don't think so. It's Ian Chesterton and Barbara Wright and a 60s children's show. But they end up together after the chase. [And Barbara never tries to run away with the Dr. So is a better fiancee even before it's official]
Several get married out Vikki (to become Troilles&Cressida guess that ends well...),
Ben&Polly leave together..
[ 28. June 2010, 18:10: Message edited by: Jay-Emm ]
Posts: 1643 | Registered: May 2006
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Jahlove
Tied to the mast
# 10290
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Posted
Was ok. I liked the Romans and I thought the tarnished, dust-laden museum-piece dalek-that-reactivated more scary that the ones with the eye-bleeding spanking-new paint jobs.
Wish someone would tell the Doctor that bow ties are really, srsly uncool except as part of formal evening wear (which DID look good ![[Smile]](smile.gif) )
Another vote in disfavour of Amy Pond who has become extremely irritating; at one point I wondered if she keeps an onion permanently lodged behind her ear.
And Alex Kingston acts everyone else off the screen, imo.
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“Sing like no one's listening, love like you've never been hurt, dance like nobody's watching, and live like its heaven on earth.” - Mark Twain
Posts: 6477 | From: Alice's Restaurant (UK Franchise) | Registered: Sep 2005
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Matt Black
Shipmate
# 2210
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Posted
I'm kind of glad Amy's real (although I sometimes find it difficult to like her) rather than just like Dawn from Buffy.
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"Protestant and Reformed, according to the Tradition of the ancient Catholic Church" - + John Cosin (1594-1672)
Posts: 14304 | From: Hampshire, UK | Registered: Jan 2002
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Jen.
Godless Liberal
# 3131
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Matt Black:
I'm kind of glad Amy's real (although I sometimes find it difficult to like her) rather than just like Dawn from Buffy.
Yes! I hated the whole Dawn thing.
[code]
[ 29. June 2010, 11:47: Message edited by: Jenny Ann ]
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Was Jenny Ann, but fancied being more minimal.
Posts: 5318 | From: Manchester, England | Registered: Aug 2002
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Hugal
Shipmate
# 2734
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Posted
The implication with the time traveling wrist watch is that it not totally safe and can back fire. Thus using it in a limited way is useful but using it too much is dangerous.
I quite liked the episode. For me the big reset button was pushed and Rory is Rory. The relationships in the TARDIS will have to change.
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I have never done this trick in these trousers before.
Posts: 1887 | From: london | Registered: Apr 2002
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Off Centre View
Shipmate
# 4254
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Hugal:
The implication with the time traveling wrist watch is that it not totally safe and can back fire. Thus using it in a limited way is useful but using it too much is dangerous.
I quite liked the episode. For me the big reset button was pushed and Rory is Rory. The relationships in the TARDIS will have to change.
I think the time travelling watch being so useful in that episode was kind of handwaved by the universe collapsing in on itself (or something), so it was "easier" to hop around as the Doctor did, as well as it being very harmful so it's possibly the last time we've seen the device (but it's kind of a handy semi deus ex machina to keep floating around).
Rory looks like he's back to his normal human self again, albeit with his memories as his time as an auton (he was overheard saying something like "I was plastic..." at the wedding banquet) and all that character development fresh in his mind (and in Amy's too) - so it's likely that things will change. It's cool to have a tardis crew of three for a change.
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Looking for Authenticity in the Corporate Abyss? Change Your Self, Change Your Workplace, Change Your World: www.corporateabyss.com
Posts: 1685 | From: wherever I may wander | Registered: Mar 2003
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Dafyd
Shipmate
# 5549
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Off Centre View:
It's cool to have a tardis crew of three for a change.
Funnily enough, it's not that much of a change.
The First and Second Doctors were never travelling with a single female on screen. (The First Doctor had Susan before the series started of course.)
The Third Doctor was mostly surrounded by UNIT, although he did occasionally travel with only Jo or Sarah Jane.
The Fourth Doctor spends quite a lot of time with only Sarah Jane or Leela or Romana, but he has Harry at the start of his tenure and Adric at the end.
The Fifth Doctor is travelling with at least two companions until his final story. (He never spends a full story with only one companion.)
Eight doesn't travel with anyone on television.
Nine has Jack for a few episodes. (Adam doesn't count.)
Ten has only one companion (if you don't count Mickey, who travels with him only for the story he gets written out in).
So only Six, Seven, and Ten conform to the model for the whole of their careers.
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we remain, thanks to original sin, much in love with talking about, rather than with, one another. Rowan Williams
Posts: 10567 | From: Edinburgh | Registered: Feb 2004
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Angloid
Shipmate
# 159
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Posted
Finally convinced me that Matt Smith is great in the role: I wasn't sure until this episode. And glad that his dancing skills are no better than mine.
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Brian: You're all individuals!
Crowd: We're all individuals!
Lone voice: I'm not!
Posts: 12927 | From: The Pool of Life | Registered: May 2001
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The Rogue
Shipmate
# 2275
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Posted
Dad dancing taken to the extreme!
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If everyone starts thinking outside the box does outside the box come back inside?
Posts: 2507 | From: Toton | Registered: Feb 2002
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Dafyd
Shipmate
# 5549
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Posted
I've just been watching Remembrance of the Daleks and Ace was indeed as impressive as I remember.
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we remain, thanks to original sin, much in love with talking about, rather than with, one another. Rowan Williams
Posts: 10567 | From: Edinburgh | Registered: Feb 2004
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ken
Ship's Roundhead
# 2460
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Dafyd:
I've just been watching Remembrance of the Daleks and Ace was indeed as impressive as I remember.
One of the best Dr Who stories ever. And quite clearly part of the Time War between Daleks and the Time Lords.
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Ken
L’amor che move il sole e l’altre stelle.
Posts: 39579 | From: London | Registered: Mar 2002
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Adeodatus
Shipmate
# 4992
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by ken:
quote:
Originally posted by Dafyd:
I've just been watching Remembrance of the Daleks and Ace was indeed as impressive as I remember.
One of the best Dr Who stories ever. And quite clearly part of the Time War between Daleks and the Time Lords.
... But also, interestingly, part of the Dalek civil war being fought between Davros's Daleks and the Dalek Supreme's Daleks. When did the Time War start? Was Genesis of the Daleks a pre-emptive strike in it?
Anyhoo, just checking in after a week away to say I thought The Big Bang was great, even though I'm still not sure how it all worked (as I suspect Steven Moffat isn't, either). What really made it for me was Matt Smith's performance - especially his parting speeches to Amy and Amelia. He is a brilliant actor - every inflexion, every gesture was just perfect, and those scenes were very touching. I even wibbled a bit when he murmured, "Live well. Love Rory ... Bye bye, Pond." Absolutely superb.
I've always liked Amy - nice to have a companion with a bit of attitude - but I'm glad Rory's sticking around too. (Real Rory or Auton Rory? - The script is ambiguous. If you listen carefully, when the TARDIS arrives at the wedding he says something like, "How could we forget the Doctor? I was plastic. He was the stripper at my stag.")
And now that I've had a few days to get used to the idea, I also quite like that there are unanswered questions for the future. The Silence has not yet fallen....
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"What is broken, repair with gold."
Posts: 9779 | From: Manchester | Registered: Sep 2003
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Gill H
Shipmate
# 68
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Posted
Since Ace has been mentioned, perhaps I can brag about my signed copy of Graeme Curry's The Happiness Patrol which is much better as a book than it was on TV. Largely because I don't have to cope with Evil Bertie Bassett.
I worked in the same office as Graeme until recently, and the atmosphere of impending redundancies, relocation and general doom made it very relevant reading. We would often greet the latest announcement from on high with 'Happiness Will Prevail'.
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*sigh* We can’t all be Alan Cresswell.
- Lyda Rose
Posts: 9313 | From: London | Registered: May 2001
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Dafyd
Shipmate
# 5549
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by ken:
One of the best Dr Who stories ever. And quite clearly part of the Time War between Daleks and the Time Lords.
If I'd seen more Classic Doctor Who I'd probably be able to agree with you. It compares very well next to Genesis of the Daleks and Pyramids of Mars (to name two of the most widely admired Tom Baker stories).
I get the impression that the two Sylvester McCoy - Ace seasons are underappreciated among the Doctor Who fandom. The classic fandom seem to have dropped off mostly during the Colin Baker years.
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we remain, thanks to original sin, much in love with talking about, rather than with, one another. Rowan Williams
Posts: 10567 | From: Edinburgh | Registered: Feb 2004
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Adeodatus
Shipmate
# 4992
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Posted
Ah, Classic Who - how shall I sing thee? I'd recommend watching more Classic Who to almost anyone. Beg, borrow, or in extreme circumstances buy some of the DVDs and treat yourself to the history of British tv drama 1963-1989, in microcosm.
Take a good look at the really old ones, recorded almost live (it had to be a real disaster before they'd do a re-take) in tiny studio sets sometimes no bigger than your living room. Marvel at the old painted backdrops that can even now almost make you believe there's a petrified forest or an Aztec city back there. Listen to how much of the drama has to be conveyed in dialogue simply because the action it's describing would have been impossible to stage. Listen especially to how writers like Anthony Coburn and John Lucarotti use words, in a way that you couldn't possibly now.
But then see also how experimental it all was, simply because there was nothing like it on tv. The floor-level camera angles that made the Daleks look so menacing. The weird and beautiful music scores, like Richard Rodney Bennett's for The Aztecs. The first tentative bits of location filming from The Dalek Invasion of Earth onwards.
Old Who - especially really old Who at its best was magnificent.
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"What is broken, repair with gold."
Posts: 9779 | From: Manchester | Registered: Sep 2003
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Dafyd
Shipmate
# 5549
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by The Rogue:
Dad dancing taken to the extreme!
Contrast with Nine. 'I've just remembered I know how to dance.' Also a Moffat script.
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we remain, thanks to original sin, much in love with talking about, rather than with, one another. Rowan Williams
Posts: 10567 | From: Edinburgh | Registered: Feb 2004
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Dormouse
Glis glis – Ship's rodent
# 5954
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Posted
As Mr D said " Oooh! "
[ 30. August 2010, 18:27: Message edited by: Dormouse ]
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What are you doing for Lent?
40 days, 40 reflections, 40 acts of generosity. Join the #40acts challenge for #Lent and let's start a movement. www.40acts.org.uk
Posts: 3042 | From: 'twixt les Bois Noirs & Les Monts de la Madeleine | Registered: May 2004
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El Greco
Shipmate
# 9313
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Posted
Wow.
Quick question:
What does he mean, in the interview, by "rubber green people"?
quote:
It's a decent budget. I beg for money and more rubber green people and eventually they say OK, you can have a third rubber green person.
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Ξέρω εγώ κάτι που μπορούσε, Καίσαρ, να σας σώσει.
Posts: 11285 | Registered: Apr 2005
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Dafyd
Shipmate
# 5549
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by El Greco:
Quick question:
What does he mean, in the interview, by "rubber green people"?
I believe it is an allusion to Classic Doctor Who alien costumes.
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we remain, thanks to original sin, much in love with talking about, rather than with, one another. Rowan Williams
Posts: 10567 | From: Edinburgh | Registered: Feb 2004
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El Greco
Shipmate
# 9313
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Posted
Ah, OK, thnx!
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Ξέρω εγώ κάτι που μπορούσε, Καίσαρ, να σας σώσει.
Posts: 11285 | Registered: Apr 2005
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Hedgehog
Ship's Shortstop
# 14125
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Adeodatus:
Ah, Classic Who - how shall I sing thee? I'd recommend watching more Classic Who to almost anyone. Beg, borrow, or in extreme circumstances buy some of the DVDs and treat yourself to the history of British tv drama 1963-1989, in microcosm.
Take a good look at the really old ones, recorded almost live (it had to be a real disaster before they'd do a re-take) in tiny studio sets sometimes no bigger than your living room. Marvel at the old painted backdrops that can even now almost make you believe there's a petrified forest or an Aztec city back there. Listen to how much of the drama has to be conveyed in dialogue simply because the action it's describing would have been impossible to stage. Listen especially to how writers like Anthony Coburn and John Lucarotti use words, in a way that you couldn't possibly now.
But then see also how experimental it all was, simply because there was nothing like it on tv. The floor-level camera angles that made the Daleks look so menacing. The weird and beautiful music scores, like Richard Rodney Bennett's for The Aztecs. The first tentative bits of location filming from The Dalek Invasion of Earth onwards.
Old Who - especially really old Who at its best was magnificent.
Bless you. You have it absolutely correct. There was so much brilliance in Really Early Who. TV made by people who already knew they were blazing new trails and did not have to conform to anything.
I even adore the fact that they would keep the cameras running if an actor fluffed a line, because it is much more realistic. Which person, in real life, always speaks in letter-perfect fashion, never stumbling over words and never using the wrong word? I get annoyed at people who mock Bill Hartnell's fluffs because they are so realistic. Take The Chase for example. Ian and Barabara are leaving the Doctor using a strange Dalek-made time vehicle. The Doctor is upset both at the risk they are running and the fact that they are leaving. Trying to dissuade them, he makes a dire prediction about them ending up as "cinders flying around in spain" (when, of course, he meant "space"). But, really, if you are angry and spluttering at somebody, do you never use the wrong word? I know I do. It is completely realistic. More so than the amazingly tongue-twisting dialogue that more recent Doctors spew out without hesitation.
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"We must regain the conviction that we need one another, that we have a shared responsibility for others and the world, and that being good and decent are worth it."--Pope Francis, Laudato Si'
Posts: 2740 | From: Delaware, USA | Registered: Sep 2008
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Ariel
Shipmate
# 58
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Hedgehog:
I even adore the fact that they would keep the cameras running if an actor fluffed a line, because it is much more realistic.
Well, quite. There was the memorable occasion when the Fourth Doctor was heard to tell Davros to "spack off!".
Posts: 25445 | Registered: May 2001
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Lord Jestocost
Shipmate
# 12909
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Ariel:
quote:
Originally posted by Hedgehog:
I even adore the fact that they would keep the cameras running if an actor fluffed a line, because it is much more realistic.
Well, quite. There was the memorable occasion when the Fourth Doctor was heard to tell Davros to "spack off!".
They had their limits, though. (See around the 45 second mark.)
Posts: 761 | From: The Instrumentality of Man | Registered: Aug 2007
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+Chad
Staffordshire Lad
# 5645
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Jahlove:
Wish someone would tell the Doctor that bow ties are really, srsly uncool...
No, no, no. Eccentric. Individual. More bow ties.
quote:
Another vote in disfavour of Amy Pond who has become extremely irritating; at one point I wondered if she keeps an onion permanently lodged behind her ear.
And another.
Donna had attitude, Amy Pondlife is an irritating, self-centred little witch who would dump Rory for the Doctor in a heartbeat.
quote:
As Ariel posted:
Still, Mr Pond (because that's the way it is) seems to be developing as a more rounded character, so hopefully he'll play a more active role in future episodes, assert himself more, etc etc.
Rory and the Doctor would do well to leave Amy behind and head off together into the mists of time.
This could be the start of a beautiful friendship!
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Chad (The + is silent)
Where there is tea there is hope.
Posts: 2698 | From: The Backbone of England | Registered: Mar 2004
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Angloid
Shipmate
# 159
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by +Chad:
quote:
Another vote in disfavour of Amy Pond who has become extremely irritating; at one point I wondered if she keeps an onion permanently lodged behind her ear.
And another.
Donna had attitude, Amy Pondlife is an irritating, self-centred little witch who would dump Rory for the Doctor in a heartbeat.
Sorry, I disagree. Probably because I find red-haired women with Scottish accents unbelievably sexy. You might be right otherwise.
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Brian: You're all individuals!
Crowd: We're all individuals!
Lone voice: I'm not!
Posts: 12927 | From: The Pool of Life | Registered: May 2001
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Ariel
Shipmate
# 58
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by +Chad:
Amy Pondlife is an irritating, self-centred little witch who would dump Rory for the Doctor in a heartbeat.
I agree with everything except the witch bit. Not sure what you mean by this, exactly, but she doesn't strike me as magical, glam, or even particularly crone-like.
Unfair to witches IMO.
Posts: 25445 | Registered: May 2001
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Dafyd
Shipmate
# 5549
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by +Chad:
quote:
Originally posted by Jahlove:
Wish someone would tell the Doctor that bow ties are really, srsly uncool...
No, no, no. Eccentric. Individual. More bow ties.
The Doctor is a time-travelling alien. 'Cool' is not a concept he does well.
That's not quite true. The Third Doctor was cool. For the 1900s. He was stuck in the 1970s.
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we remain, thanks to original sin, much in love with talking about, rather than with, one another. Rowan Williams
Posts: 10567 | From: Edinburgh | Registered: Feb 2004
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Paul.
Shipmate
# 37
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Posted
Anyone see University Challenge tonight? One of the sets of questions was to identify the actor(s) who played the Doctor based on the version of the theme tune being used at the time.
They got them all right. "See nothing is wasted" said Paxman.
I thought of this thread.
Posts: 3689 | From: UK | Registered: Jun 2004
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