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Source: (consider it)
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Thread: Aging Parents
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Thyme
Shipmate
# 12360
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Lamb Chopped:
Penny, I've stayed out of this so far, because I know your heart is in the right place. But you are not helping either him or her by continuing to do what you are doing. And I say this as someone who's spent thirty years in a helping position and who was the codependent daughter of an alcoholic.
There is a problem, not just with your new lodger (and yes, she is your lodger, she has no intention of returning home, no matter what she says) but with her son. Much as you care for him, he is not treating you decently. I don't know if this is due to diagnosable issues of his own, but it's still a reality. Not only has your life become consumed with his mother (not yours, his) but he is now allowing you to be exposed to legal liability.
I don't know what precisely is driving you to accept this state of affairs, and you appear to be a competent adult, capable of making your own decisions. But if you think for a bit, you must realize that you are enabling both of them to ignore the natural consequences of their own behavior. Essentially you have created a padded, virtual room for them, where nothing has negative outcomes and all their wants will be supplied by someone else's efforts. That isn't healthy for a human being, however old or helpless (and I don't think either is wholly helpless.).
Please, for everyone's sake--hers, his, yours--there needs to be some serious reality injected into this scenario. And as you are the most rational and also hold all the power in the scenario, it's you who gets to do it.
I second this. I spent years and exhausted myself trying to deal with my parents issues. I should have stayed out of it. Offering sympathy and constructive advice but leaving them to find their own solutions. Actually, in hindsight I became as mad as they were under the illusion I was helping.
I have been exercising huge restraint in posting here in response to your posts but have finally cracked. You are not actually helping either your friend or his mother. Nothing is going to get better until you stop. You have no legal status in the situation as far as I can see and the authorities have no reason to take any notice of you. You have become the problem. Sorry.
Oh, and I don't know how to quote from different posts but I second Lamb Chopped's comment about how God might be speaking to you through us.
Maybe God isn't listening because your solutions are not God's solutions. You need to change. Maybe then things will start to get better for you and possibly for them. If you carry on as you are I am really not sure what anyone can say in response to your posts other than, 'Oh, that sounds difficult'and a candle.
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The Church in its own bubble has become, at best the guardian of the value system of the nation’s grandparents, and at worst a den of religious anoraks defined by defensiveness, esoteric logic and discrimination. Bishop of Buckingham's blog
Posts: 600 | From: Cloud Cuckoo Land | Registered: Feb 2007
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Sarasa
Shipmate
# 12271
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Posted
PP and Mrs S - Hope the imminent and prospective moves for your aging P's go smoothly. My mother did mention in passing the other day that she'd consider living in a hotel. I was wondering how easy it would be to pass off a care home as being a 'sort of hotel'. Probably not very easy at the moment, but something to bear in mind when she really needs to move.
Zappa - Good your mother is more upbeat and happy with reduced meds. It's good that medical staff always give AP's the positive spin on their various ailments and problems, but it does mean children and carers have to live with being told that there is nothing wrong as Dr X says I'm doing really well so I don't need carers, a care home etc.
Penny S - You've been given excellent advice - tough though it must be to hear it. I hope you manage to act on it.
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'I guess things didn't go so well tonight, but I'm trying. Lord, I'm trying.' Charlie (Harvey Keitel) in Mean Streets.
Posts: 2035 | From: London | Registered: Jan 2007
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North East Quine
Curious beastie
# 13049
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Posted
Sarasa, my late grandmother spent the last year of her life in a care home. She sometimes thought she was in a hotel, and sometimes thought the home was some sort of stately home, which she owned.
One of her younger sisters observed, somewhat tartly, that even dementia couldn't stop my grandmother from having delusions of grandeur.
Posts: 6414 | From: North East Scotland | Registered: Oct 2007
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Thyme
Shipmate
# 12360
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Posted
My father referred to his care home as a hospital 'When one is in hospital....etc)
I finally lost it and told him very forcefully he was in a residential home. He had a lifelong habit of rearranging the facts so he could ignore reality and I cracked. I could see him making a huge effort not to use the 'h' word with me afterwards. I suspect he carried on with everyone else.
I feel very guilty now as it wouldn't have hurt to have left him with his delusions if they helped him cope. But part of the being in hospital thing was so he could pretend a) he wasn't in a care home, b) he would go home at some point which meant he didn't have to make a decision about selling the house....And meant my sister and I had to collude in this fiction and fantasies about going home....
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The Church in its own bubble has become, at best the guardian of the value system of the nation’s grandparents, and at worst a den of religious anoraks defined by defensiveness, esoteric logic and discrimination. Bishop of Buckingham's blog
Posts: 600 | From: Cloud Cuckoo Land | Registered: Feb 2007
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The Intrepid Mrs S
Shipmate
# 17002
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Sarasa:
My mother did mention in passing the other day that she'd consider living in a hotel. I was wondering how easy it would be to pass off a care home as being a 'sort of hotel'.
Sarasa, one of the care homes I've visited would certainly have passed for a hotel in the reception and sitting areas! The rooms were perhaps not quite so swept-up. It does make you wonder if calling them 'Care Hotels' or something might help with acceptance....
The Dowager is back to being confused over the telephone, and has a pain in her groin (though she refers to it as her hip, which is Confusing). That's another worry - the nice place I filled the forms in for only does residential and dementia care (not nursing).
Oh well, it will all come right in the end. If it isn't all right, it isn't the end.
Mrs. S, philosophising
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Don't get your knickers in a twist over your advancing age. It achieves nothing and makes you walk funny.
Prayer should be our first recourse, not our last resort
'Lord, please give us patience. NOW!'
Posts: 1464 | From: Neither here nor there | Registered: Mar 2012
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Brenda Clough
Shipmate
# 18061
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Posted
I know of at least one old lady who, instead of pouring a fortune into a home, simply takes cruises around the world. The cost is about the same, the services very similar (they're all handicapped-accessible, for instance), and she gets to get off at various ports and see the world. She knows the entire crew, and they take care of her.
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Science fiction and fantasy writer with a Patreon page
Posts: 6378 | From: Washington DC | Registered: Mar 2014
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Jane R
Shipmate
# 331
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Posted
I've heard of one or two British pensioners who do the same, though it's not an option open to those who have their care funded by the local council.
M-i-l is out of hospital! I just got back from visiting her in the care home! ![[Yipee]](graemlins/spin.gif)
Posts: 3958 | From: Jorvik | Registered: May 2001
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Amanda B. Reckondwythe
Dressed for Church
# 5521
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Posted
I've heard of it too, and I'd love to do it if I had the money.
I doubt, though, that the ship's staff would be willing to bathe and dress her and wipe her bum for her when the time comes that she can't do it herself.
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"I take prayer too seriously to use it as an excuse for avoiding work and responsibility." -- The Revd Martin Luther King Jr.
Posts: 10542 | From: The Great Southwest | Registered: Feb 2004
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The Intrepid Mrs S
Shipmate
# 17002
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Posted
Ain't that the truth, Miss Amanda.
Also the increased possibility of falling/breaking bones/needing medical attention? Otherwise believe me the Dowager would be sitting on the dock at Southampton, waiting for a boat...
Mrs. S, somewhat wistful
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Don't get your knickers in a twist over your advancing age. It achieves nothing and makes you walk funny.
Prayer should be our first recourse, not our last resort
'Lord, please give us patience. NOW!'
Posts: 1464 | From: Neither here nor there | Registered: Mar 2012
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Sarasa
Shipmate
# 12271
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Posted
The 'posh' care home that I went to visit did describe itself as a 'stationary cruise ship'. I've nver been on one, but I got the idea, lots of activities, food on tap and a general relaxed holiday type atmosphere. There was also more or less a member of staff per resident and a lot of one to one interaction going on, which I doubt is usual on cruise ships. They also said they tried to keep residents there however complex their needs became, which is soemthing I liked. It's all pie in the sky as my mother couldn't afford it, and certainly at present has no intention of moving anywhere.
My latest AP 'problem' is the planning for the 90th birthday, next March. Mum has set her heart on a party with dancing in a local hall. From a quick look at the website I'm not sure if they allow parties there for a start, the only people who are likely to dance are her and me and finally mum only wants to invite about twenty people which would mean us all rattling round in a large space. My idea of an 'at home' was met with scorn on the grounds that other residents in the flats would complain about the music etc. I'm not sure what mum had in mind, but I can't really imagine a party of OAPs turning into a rave.
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'I guess things didn't go so well tonight, but I'm trying. Lord, I'm trying.' Charlie (Harvey Keitel) in Mean Streets.
Posts: 2035 | From: London | Registered: Jan 2007
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Jane R
Shipmate
# 331
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Posted
Sarasa: quote:
I'm not sure what mum had in mind, but I can't really imagine a party of OAPs turning into a rave.
You've never met my mum (76 and still partying) ![[Two face]](graemlins/scot_twoface.gif)
Some hotels do private parties... what kind of dancing did she have in mind, disco or ballroom? Or you might be able to get a smaller church hall.
If most of the guests are OAPs and will be dancing, giving them plenty of room for self-expression is a Good Thing. We made the mistake of taking my parents to a church ceilidh and they hated it because it was too crowded - they didn't feel safe on the dance floor.
If her heart is set on that particular hall you could make it look less cavernous by setting up tables and chairs (with plenty of room for manoeuvering zimmer frames around them) on part of the dance floor...
Posts: 3958 | From: Jorvik | Registered: May 2001
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Sarasa
Shipmate
# 12271
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Posted
My mum is still a party animal too, Jane R, and has gone and booked the hall. In one way I'm glad, it's what she'd set her heart on and so if it turns out not to be a great idea, she can't blame the rest of the family for the venue. I can see there are going to be months of very tedious conversations though. We had one yesterday where I was trying to persuade her not to worry about food and music but leave the planning up to me and my sister-in-law who does events professionally. What really made me cross though was her saying she was not sure about inviting one granddaughter who has epiplepsy in case she got 'too excited' and had a seizure. As she is the only one from that bit of the family who actually stays in close contact with mum it sounded at best ignorant of her condition and at worst down right mean.
In other news she went to the opthalmologist at the hospital yesterday to see if they could find glasses that would help her read. I couldn't go but according to mum they've decided no glasses will work, but are having her back to look at other aids that could help. They are also sending someone round to look at making using appliances in her flat easier. I hope the person also strongly suggests getting help in. It was obvious from mum's conversation that they were concerned about her living on her own without any extra help.
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'I guess things didn't go so well tonight, but I'm trying. Lord, I'm trying.' Charlie (Harvey Keitel) in Mean Streets.
Posts: 2035 | From: London | Registered: Jan 2007
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Penny S
Shipmate
# 14768
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Posted
I'm glad things are looking positive for you. Somehow I'm seeing the hall something like the Rivoli Ballroom at Brockley, all red velvet and gilt and chandeliers and much used in period filming, where a friend had a major birthday party, and D had a great evening out.
In more news, the visiting district nurses have noted things which should have been noted, and a senior one who came today (and had been roundly slagged off for getting above her station and nagging about elevating legs, instead of humble washing feet as she should) sought a private talk with D's son. This took place in the supermarket car park round the corner, as D watches from the window to make sure no-one is talking about her. The nurse wanted to know who the care manager was (who?) and which social workers were involved (again, who?)* and will now be involving a specialist team for assessment**, communicating with D's real GP, and has raised the possibility of fluctuating capacity, which opens the possibility of getting things done.
Further, having given in to the nagging, D now has new skin on her ankles and is not needing nearly so much work done on her wrapping, and is back to alternate days visiting.
*So we shouldn't have been left to fumble through without any guidance. How on earth people further down the bell curve manage I shudder to think.
**They have a specialist name that doesn't indicate that they are interested in mental health at all. There seem to be names drawn out of the same sort of place that police operations are, but aiming for pretty.
[ 23. August 2017, 18:51: Message edited by: Penny S ]
Posts: 5833 | Registered: May 2009
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Huia
Shipmate
# 3473
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Posted
Yay Penny- fingers crossed that it all goes well.
Huia
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Charity gives food from the table, Justice gives a place at the table.
Posts: 10382 | From: Te Wai Pounamu | Registered: Oct 2002
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The Intrepid Mrs S
Shipmate
# 17002
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Posted
Sarasa - wishing you good luck and patience!
I took the Dowager to visit quite a posh care home today - very like a hotel, but with very pleasant staff, menus, facilities etc. They also have a mixture of residents - young handicapped, elderly residential only, etc etc, who are all mixed up together. I thought that might be better for Mum than being cooped up with only other dementia patients - that was well under control this morning, but after that trip and lunch with my cousin's wife she was really very confused indeed.
They suggest that she goes in for a week or two on a trial basis, and then if she likes it she can stay. Well, we'll see after the assessment if she will take that step; she knows she has to, but she can always think of a dozen reasons why not!
She then spent about half an hour trying to explain to me a new medical condition she thinks she's developed since her last time in hospital (given that she couldn't even remember that she'd been in hospital, this all has to be taken with a bushel of salt). She started off by saying she'd begun to have periods again, but only on one side of her body ![[Ultra confused]](graemlins/confused2.gif) After a great deal of questioning I'm still not absolutely clear on what the problem is, but now I'm wondering what I should do with this bit of information ![[Help]](graemlins/help.gif)
In addition, she had cut the wrist strap of a brand new mac, because it had got tangled up in something in the cupboard. Given that it was fastened at the other end with a popper I am completely at a loss to know why she couldn't just unfasten the popper and pull the strap through the tangle!
God grant us all patience...
Mrs. S, struggling
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Don't get your knickers in a twist over your advancing age. It achieves nothing and makes you walk funny.
Prayer should be our first recourse, not our last resort
'Lord, please give us patience. NOW!'
Posts: 1464 | From: Neither here nor there | Registered: Mar 2012
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Sarasa
Shipmate
# 12271
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Posted
Praying for patience for you Mrs S. God knows we all need it when faced with elderly relatives.
My husband and I went to visit today. Mum is beginning to find various things such as using the microwave and washing machine more difficult. We put coloured dots on the right buttons, but I think part of the problem she is beginning to forget which order she should actualy press the buttons if she could see them in the first place. She was still talking about finding the magic glasses that would help her use a computer. If the opthalmologist at a leading hospital couldn't help, I don't think there is a solution out there.
My brother, in what I can only assume was a fit of madness or an ill judged joke, told her he'd tried to get the fabled love of her life aka holiday rep from five years ago to the party. She keeps on talking about it and is beginning to build it up as something that could possibly happen. My husband was very blunt and told her it wouldn't, so not to think about it. I hope the message sinks in.
Penny S - I wish the hall was like the Rivoli ballroom (i've never been, but have a friend who used to be a regular there). It sounds nice enough, but looking at it on the website it is more scout hut than strictly come dancing. I've agreed to go to one of mum's keep fit classes, so i can see it for myself. Well I guess I could do with some extra exercise.
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'I guess things didn't go so well tonight, but I'm trying. Lord, I'm trying.' Charlie (Harvey Keitel) in Mean Streets.
Posts: 2035 | From: London | Registered: Jan 2007
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Aravis
Shipmate
# 13824
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Posted
Penny,
I should probably warn you that social services will not normally allocate someone a care manager unless they are receiving formal care in some way, which D is not. (The district nurses are providing health care, which is different. Social services and the NHS may all be funded by public money, but it's different budgets and generally different computer systems.)
It is not possible to provide formal care for everyone in the UK who has a physical or mental health problem; there are simply too many of them. Most social workers are overstretched and many councils are using unqualified social work assistants where possible to save money.
I'm not a social worker, but I work closely with them. If the social workers are breathing a sigh of relief and letting you get on with managing D yourself, it's not because they don't care or because they want to put their feet up for a bit; it's because they have too many cases, many of which are much worse. D is elderly, unwell and somewhat confused, but she's safe in a house, is fed, washed and clothed (better than many people are) and has someone who lives in the same house and sorts things out for her. There is absolutely no way she would be a high priority for a social worker as she is quite comfortable and not at risk.
I don't quite understand, looking back over the thread, why you accepted D back at your house when she was last discharged. Is this now her formal address? Is she paying you rent or utilities or anything? Is her son living there too?
I'm not sure what you should do if you don't want the current situation to continue. If she can't leave the house, you can't exactly put her out on the street. It may be difficult to do anything until she's admitted to hospital again, at which point you need to refuse, absolutely, to have her back. They can't discharge her onto the streets; the hospital will have to ensure she is being discharged to a safe environment, and if they can't find one, D will have to remain in hospital at vast expense, which will make her case a much higher priority. If she can return home they would probably put agency carers in.
Until that happens, if you would like me to ask for general advice from a senior social worker, please let me know. I don't know where you live but I think procedures should be fairly similar across the UK.
Posts: 689 | From: S Wales | Registered: Jun 2008
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mark_in_manchester
not waving, but...
# 15978
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Posted
Following the last post -
My mate looked after his father at home, a very, very long way into his terminal decline.
He had a lot of conversations with social workers along the lines of 'how are we going to deal with this as we get to the point I can't do this anymore?' Social workers in his area were stretched to the point where these discussions were always, always inconclusive.
He decided he was going to have to get in a cab with his (lost to dementia) Dad, drive to a police station, and leave his Dad there. He rang the social workers to tell them this was about to happen. Wheels started to move. But you might have to actually do it.
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"We are punished by our sins, not for them" - Elbert Hubbard
(so good, I wanted to see it after my posts and not only after those of shipmate JBohn from whom I stole it)
Posts: 1596 | Registered: Oct 2010
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Ethne Alba
Shipmate
# 5804
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Posted
Hmmm. We've come back to this again.
Aging Parent wants the family photos put into different coloured light plastic frames so that the other sides of them can be seen.
Photos are blu tac'd up on cupboards. And can n-e-v-e-r be placed on top of cupboards or on tables, or displayed in any other eye catching but different manner. (goodness, even the mug has to be in the Exact Same Place each time now or AP can't leave the room)
Last time this was discussed, a sensible carer at the home said
" Now.. think about this.....how are you going to be able to see through the photos to read what is on the back?"
And was told,
' It'll be reflected by the glass.'
Saturday's visit is going to be interesting......
[ 06. September 2017, 11:10: Message edited by: Ethne Alba ]
Posts: 3126 | Registered: Apr 2004
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Huia
Shipmate
# 3473
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by mark_in_manchester:
He decided he was going to have to get in a cab with his (lost to dementia) Dad, drive to a police station, and leave his Dad there. He rang the social workers to tell them this was about to happen. Wheels started to move. But you might have to actually do it.
I read a short story where a woman and her son were at their wit's end looking after a grandmother with dementia and no one would help. They took her to the local swimming baths, dressed her in bathing suit and left her there with no ID. It was quite chilling, even more so because I could understand the desperation.
Huia
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Charity gives food from the table, Justice gives a place at the table.
Posts: 10382 | From: Te Wai Pounamu | Registered: Oct 2002
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Curiosity killed ...
Ship's Mug
# 11770
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Posted
Another person who works closely with social workers here: Those who have just joined our service are talking about case loads of 70 being the norm. I know from the meetings I attend, those meetings can take half a day, plus paperwork, fitting in home visits, court cases and other work. It is an impossible case load. It is not surprising that the threshold for social care involvement is high and getting higher. We have a lot of despairing conversations about cases that are falling through the net in situations we can see are deteriorating, but we cannot get the right people involved to put any support mechanisms in place.
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Mugs - Keep the Ship afloat
Posts: 13794 | From: outiside the outer ring road | Registered: Aug 2006
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The Intrepid Mrs S
Shipmate
# 17002
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Posted
It was my birthday yesterday. I wasn't expecting the Dowager to remember, because as far as I can tell she needs me to remind her of everyone else's birthdays.
What I was not prepared for was her to know perfectly well that it was my birthday, but not to think for one moment that this required action on her part ![[Eek!]](eek.gif)
When I called her today she was Utterly Mortified that she had not thought to pick up the phone and call me to say Happy Birthday, still less to think in advance to post a card.
She went through this so very many times that I wished I hadn't breathed a word about it!
Mrs. S, sorrowing
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Don't get your knickers in a twist over your advancing age. It achieves nothing and makes you walk funny.
Prayer should be our first recourse, not our last resort
'Lord, please give us patience. NOW!'
Posts: 1464 | From: Neither here nor there | Registered: Mar 2012
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Uncle Pete
Loyaute me lie
# 10422
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Posted
I join in this thread as An Aging Parent honoris causa to tell you young whippersnappers what it's like from the other side.
Getting old is not for youngster.
Yes, we repeat ourselves, yes we repeat ourselves. It's payback for all the times we had to listen to you when you were little. That plus wiping your stinky bottoms.
Suck it up, buttercups!
![[Razz]](tongue.gif)
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Even more so than I was before
Posts: 20466 | From: No longer where I was | Registered: Sep 2005
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The Intrepid Mrs S
Shipmate
# 17002
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Posted
Uncle Pete, you mistake me.
I was not complaining about how many times my mother the Dowager (whose bottom I have had to wipe, I might add) apologised for not doing anything about my birthday.
What bothered me was the indication of how badly she was upset at her own failure, as she saw it, that she said 'sorry' so many times. Believe me, I'd rather she'd never known than have her upset herself over something she can't help.
I didn't expect her to remember, but I was surpised at my own distress at this disconnect. Buttercup indeed.
Mrs. S, a thistle or nothing
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Don't get your knickers in a twist over your advancing age. It achieves nothing and makes you walk funny.
Prayer should be our first recourse, not our last resort
'Lord, please give us patience. NOW!'
Posts: 1464 | From: Neither here nor there | Registered: Mar 2012
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Piglet
Islander
# 11803
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Posted
I think I get what you're saying, Mrs. S. - it's a further manifestation of the Dowager's declining faculties, which, along with perceiving her distress, is bound to be distressing for you.
I also think Uncle Pete's post was written with the tongue very firmly in the cheek - at least I hope it was ... ![[Devil]](graemlins/devil.gif)
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I may not be on an island any more, but I'm still an islander.
alto n a soprano who can read music
Posts: 20272 | From: Fredericton, NB, on a rather larger piece of rock | Registered: Sep 2006
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Tina
Shipmate
# 63
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Posted
Been lurking and praying on this thread for a long time without ever plucking up the courage/focus to post ...
Short version: my mum (73) has mobility problems, and my dad (80) has been her carer for a few years. Earlier this year my dad developed moderate-severe depression, and since then his physical health has declined. He's been in hospital for the last month, with mobility problems of his own, and incontinence which he hasn't yet learned to manage without help. My mum, mercifully, has been coping very well at home alone with twice-daily carer visits, but wouldn't be able to look after Dad with his current level of dependency, unless they had a very comprehensive care package.
Tomorrow Mum and I are going to vist Dad in hospital (I live 70 miles away and work full-time, so haven't been up for a couple of weeks). We're also going to meet his allocated social worker to discuss plans. I suspect he'll end up going for some respite care at the very good (but also expensive!) care home my parents stayed in for a couple of weeks recently. At least there he'll have activities available if he feels like it - his mental health had improved in the last few weeks, and I hope that's continuing.
So if you have any prayers to spare ... advice also welcomed, within reason ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
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Kindness is mandatory. Anger is necessary. Despair is a terrible idea. Despair is how they win. They won't win forever.
Posts: 503 | From: South London | Registered: May 2001
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Doone
Shipmate
# 18470
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Posted
Tina, I have no advice but can certainly pray for you and your parents ![[Votive]](graemlins/votive.gif)
Posts: 2208 | From: UK | Registered: Sep 2015
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Jane R
Shipmate
# 331
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Posted
for Tina and her family. Sounds like you are doing all the right things. It's difficult when you're a long way away, isn't it.
Posts: 3958 | From: Jorvik | Registered: May 2001
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Sarasa
Shipmate
# 12271
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Posted
Tina and her family. I hope the meeting went well today. It's a pain that all the nice care homes are so jolly expensive, and even the not so nice oens aren't cheap.
Mrs S - How are the plans for getting the Dowager to move going?
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'I guess things didn't go so well tonight, but I'm trying. Lord, I'm trying.' Charlie (Harvey Keitel) in Mean Streets.
Posts: 2035 | From: London | Registered: Jan 2007
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The Intrepid Mrs S
Shipmate
# 17002
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Posted
Slowly, Sarasa, slooooowly!
When I went down to visit her on Wednesday, the manager of our selected care home came out to assess Mum. That went well - too well, really, because Mum was doing so well that the manager probably had no clue quite how bad the memory loss can be.
For instance, Wednesday is her cleaning lady's day - apparently, last week, Carol was greeted at the door with 'my cleaning lady hasn't come'
'But I'm here now, Dowager'
'YOU'RE not my cleaning lady!'
Sounds like one of those toddlers' books - 'That's not my puppy!' but less fun.
Anyway, she is beginning to see how dark and lonely her world will become when the clocks go back, it rains too much to go out, and her macular degeneration kicks in (as it does). So the plan is to get her in for a couple of weeks' respite care and hope she likes it (Where's the 'fingers crossed' emoji?)
She is also worried about the cost, but I pointed out that even before we needed to sell the house, her liquid assets would keep her in luxury* for about 5 years, and I personally wasn't looking beyond a 5-year horizon!
* whatever you like for breakfast; choice of 3 starters, 2 mains and 2 desserts for lunch; choice of two mains and two desserts for supper; plus a cake and coffee trolley twice a day, with cheese and biscuits etc in the evenings. You can also have wine, beer, cider etc at lunch or supper, and if you don't fancy what's on offer, if it's in the building they will cook it for you
At least she shouldn't starve...
Mrs. S, about to call the financial advisor!
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Don't get your knickers in a twist over your advancing age. It achieves nothing and makes you walk funny.
Prayer should be our first recourse, not our last resort
'Lord, please give us patience. NOW!'
Posts: 1464 | From: Neither here nor there | Registered: Mar 2012
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Amanda B. Reckondwythe
Dressed for Church
# 5521
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by The Intrepid Mrs S:
Wednesday is her cleaning lady's day - apparently, last week, Carol was greeted at the door with 'my cleaning lady hasn't come'
'But I'm here now, Dowager'
'YOU'RE not my cleaning lady!'
My mother once told my sister: "There's a man who comes to see me who looks exactly like your father, but he isn't your father."
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"I take prayer too seriously to use it as an excuse for avoiding work and responsibility." -- The Revd Martin Luther King Jr.
Posts: 10542 | From: The Great Southwest | Registered: Feb 2004
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The Intrepid Mrs S
Shipmate
# 17002
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Posted
Yes, I think that's actually a recognised medical condition, isn't it?
Well, I've booked her in for a fortnight and arranged to go away for a week in the middle of it!
The Dowager has so far been consistently negative about it - will she have to take her own furniture? what will she do about having to have all her clothes named (well. Mum, it won't be you who has to worry about that, will it?) and now she's worried that'care homes go bust all the time' ![[Mad]](angryfire.gif)
Give me strength - and please pray she likes it so much she'll want to stay
Good thoughts going out to anyone trying to travel this particular road ![[Angel]](graemlins/angel.gif)
Mrs. S, one among many, I suspect
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Don't get your knickers in a twist over your advancing age. It achieves nothing and makes you walk funny.
Prayer should be our first recourse, not our last resort
'Lord, please give us patience. NOW!'
Posts: 1464 | From: Neither here nor there | Registered: Mar 2012
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Piglet
Islander
# 11803
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Posted
Mrs. S. and the Dowager
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I may not be on an island any more, but I'm still an islander.
alto n a soprano who can read music
Posts: 20272 | From: Fredericton, NB, on a rather larger piece of rock | Registered: Sep 2006
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Jane R
Shipmate
# 331
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Posted
The Dowager sounds a bit like my mum - in the sense that she likes worrying about things, that is. My mum doesn't have dementia but still manages to be annoying.
Last time I phoned her it was 'We're really worried about [my Other Half] visiting London, with all these terrorist attacks.'
Well, that's nice that you're concerned Mum. But he can't stop going because it's a REQUIREMENT OF HIS JOB and he hasn't been blown up or stabbed yet.
Besides, if he does stop going because of the (small) risk of being injured or killed in a terrorist attack the terrorists will have won, and we can't have that, whatever the Daily Heil may say.
Haven't told her yet that I am going to London for a business meeting the week after next. May not bother... it's not like she'd find out from anyone else.
Meanwhile, Mother-in-Law seems to be getting more confused - last time I visited she kept calling me by my daughter's name... ![[Frown]](frown.gif)
Posts: 3958 | From: Jorvik | Registered: May 2001
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Sarasa
Shipmate
# 12271
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Posted
Great that you've got something sorted for the Dowager, Mrs S, and even better news that you get to have a holiday too.
It is becomming very obvious that my going away even for a weekend worries my mother. I have three short breaks coming up (two weekends visitng friends/family) and a short holiday abroad in the next two months. I've told my mum the plans a few times and every time she frets I won't be around to do various things for her, even though I've assured her I will be. She also seems to have very little idea of when these events are happening, she asked me the other day where I was, forgetting that the first of these events isn't for three weeks and that I am so deaf I'm unlikely to use any other phone other than my own super-loud home one. The unspoken message I got from the call is that mum is aware she is beginning to really struggle to cope on her own but doesn't want to admit it as she doesn't want to put in train all the things that would follow, extra help etc. She's asked me a few times to go to her keep fit class so I can see the hall she'd booked for her party next March. I think I'll try to go on Monday and see if any of her friends will give me an opinion on how they think she is.
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'I guess things didn't go so well tonight, but I'm trying. Lord, I'm trying.' Charlie (Harvey Keitel) in Mean Streets.
Posts: 2035 | From: London | Registered: Jan 2007
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The Intrepid Mrs S
Shipmate
# 17002
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Posted
Well, I deposited the Dowager at her care home yesterday, and drove away feeling a) as if I had abandoned a small child at prep school, or b) as if I had set her adrift in an open boat ![[Waterworks]](graemlins/bawling.gif)
She was very good about it; we had a long chat over lunch about how - even though she doesn't feel ready for it - the alternative, i.e. living at home alone - seems less and less appealing. There were two young adults there with multiple care needs, who were a bit lairy; another eight or so old ladies who were all in wheelchairs and needed bibs to eat their lunch; and maybe four or five older people who could hold a conversation. The contrast was that Mum was at her best yesterday; on another day she might not have looked so much like a fish out of water.
We shall see...
The cruel irony is that we had only a short time to book a holiday, and booked a week in Menorca. Fine, you might say - but the airline went into administration last night
Hope other people's Aging P's are faring all right?
Mrs. S, unsure whether to laugh or cry
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Don't get your knickers in a twist over your advancing age. It achieves nothing and makes you walk funny.
Prayer should be our first recourse, not our last resort
'Lord, please give us patience. NOW!'
Posts: 1464 | From: Neither here nor there | Registered: Mar 2012
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Piglet
Islander
# 11803
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by The Intrepid Mrs S:
... but the airline went into administration last night
Monarch? What a bummer.
About 10 years ago they advertised flights from Gatwick to Deer Lake in Newfoundland, and D's parents were booked to come over with them - we'd arranged to hire a bigger car and drive out to meet them and then take them round some of the sights in the north of the island. His mum phoned at some godless hour the morning before they were due to fly and said their flights had been cancelled; I think it was some problem with a planned holiday resort in the vicinity that had gone belly-up.
Air Canada were going to charge £1,000 each way to get them over the same day, but I think in the end they waited a couple of days until they could get flights at a decent price.
Will you be able to recoup your fares or work out some kind of Plan B?
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I may not be on an island any more, but I'm still an islander.
alto n a soprano who can read music
Posts: 20272 | From: Fredericton, NB, on a rather larger piece of rock | Registered: Sep 2006
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Sarasa
Shipmate
# 12271
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Posted
Mrs S - what a total pain about your holiday. I hope you manage to do something/go somewhere and that you get some money back. In the meantime I hope the Dowager is settling in well to the home. Do you have others as back up in case this one doesn't suit?
[ 03. October 2017, 15:10: Message edited by: Sarasa ]
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'I guess things didn't go so well tonight, but I'm trying. Lord, I'm trying.' Charlie (Harvey Keitel) in Mean Streets.
Posts: 2035 | From: London | Registered: Jan 2007
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The Intrepid Mrs S
Shipmate
# 17002
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Posted
Thank you all - we are making a claim on the credit card we booked all this on (the holiday insurance being less than useful ) and have booked a few days in Wales, rather on the 'at least it isn't here' principle!
However, just think how lucky we were - we hadn't flown already; we hadn't been scrimping and saving all year for this; and best of all, we didn't go to Las Vegas so if we lose the lot, hey, it really is only money.
Also, thank the Lord for Miss S, who battled down to see her grandmother the Dowager in the face of motorway closures - it was today or not for weeks, so she Just Did It. The Intrepid Grandson was on good form, apparently, so I expect he caused riots
Sarasa, Other Care Homes are available, but the nice ones seem to be full and the available ones not so appealing (obvs, I suppose). Here's hoping she settles in well (I didn't dare ask Miss S how the Dowager was )
Mrs. S, aka Pollyanna
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Don't get your knickers in a twist over your advancing age. It achieves nothing and makes you walk funny.
Prayer should be our first recourse, not our last resort
'Lord, please give us patience. NOW!'
Posts: 1464 | From: Neither here nor there | Registered: Mar 2012
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Sarasa
Shipmate
# 12271
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Posted
Hope you had/are having a nice time in Wales Mrs S. and the weather is kind. My son went to university in North Wales and was always talking about the Bangor cloud, I think it rained most days he was there. Any news as to how the Dowager is doing?
Mum and I went to see Vincent and Flavia (well just Flavia, Vincent ws injured) ex-Strictly dancers in a tango show yesterday afternoon. It was an early Christmas present from her to me. The show was lovely, but I'm not at all sure how much of it mum could see, as the stage was rather darkly lit. She got in a grump with me over various things, all of which worries me even more about how much longer she can live independently. She seems to get cross as a defence mechanism,when its obvious she can't do something. She is also worrying herself into a frazzle about the party she's organising for her 90th next March. I did ask her if she wanted to cancel the whole thing. If she carries on like this she won't enjoy it one bit.
I feel I ought to sit her down and tell her she can't carry on in the way she is doing, though her flat is pretty ideal, as the days get shorter and the weather worse I can see her becoming more or less housebound. However if I do that she will just lose her temper, which will make me lose my temper and we'll get nowwhere.
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'I guess things didn't go so well tonight, but I'm trying. Lord, I'm trying.' Charlie (Harvey Keitel) in Mean Streets.
Posts: 2035 | From: London | Registered: Jan 2007
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Penny S
Shipmate
# 14768
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Posted
Oh God. Prayers going up.
Yesterday in the fellowship type church we went to because of a bereavement there, the sermon was about not trusting in our own strength but putting our hope in God.
Came back to accusations about being nasty frequent times to D's deceased cousin, who I only met once, when I drove them to D's semi-estranged husband's funeral, a very fraught occasion. Apparently I refused to let him drive my car, though he had third party insurance, and kept moving away from him, though this meant that D had to keep moving into the sun which she didn't want to do because she was in the sun the day before. And he was a lovely man much loved by her granny. This was years ago. (Decades?)
I'm afraid I eventually stormed out of the kitchen declaring that I wouldn't provide further services if that sort of thing continued. But I did. It is only to be expected that thinking of someone's death would bring up other remembrances. And there could have been much more difficult echoes of that funeral, which I am glad remained out of mind.
Posts: 5833 | Registered: May 2009
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Ethne Alba
Shipmate
# 5804
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Posted
And breathe......
Ten days ago it was looking like rehydration at a local hospital. Mercifully our AP instead decided to actually Drink the wretched liquids instead of sitting and eyeing them until they turned warm and therefore undrinkable.
Tiptoeing out of bed at unspeakable hours, after first hanging out of bed and removing the mat that alerted staff to such adventures, has also been stopped.
"But i don't want to disturb the staff"
'Well we understand that, but given the number of falls you've had recently, you may NOT get out of bed on your own at night. And certainly not after hanging out half upside down and at odd angles to stealthily remove the mat!'
"Well....."
Well indeed.
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[ 09. October 2017, 20:09: Message edited by: Ethne Alba ]
Posts: 3126 | Registered: Apr 2004
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Penny S
Shipmate
# 14768
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Posted
Oh my goodness.
One almost admires the ingenuity and determination.
Posts: 5833 | Registered: May 2009
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Ethne Alba
Shipmate
# 5804
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Posted
My thoughts entirely!
But it would have caused a stir had it continued.....
Posts: 3126 | Registered: Apr 2004
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Huia
Shipmate
# 3473
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Posted
At this distance I can admire it, but when a similar mat was put beside my late Mum's bed to stop her wandering, she used to dance on it.
Huia ![[Tear]](graemlins/tear.gif)
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Charity gives food from the table, Justice gives a place at the table.
Posts: 10382 | From: Te Wai Pounamu | Registered: Oct 2002
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Karl: Liberal Backslider
Shipmate
# 76
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Posted
Anyone know about these Care Fee Plans? They're basically annuities; you put down a lump sum based on an actuary's guess as to how long until you pop your clogs, and they pick up the care fees (or the shortfall between your income and the fees) for that period. They're gambling you're going to snuff it early; you're gambling you're going to live longer than they think.
Dad's 75; he's moved into a care home. His mobility is poor to non-existent and he needs help with virtually everything. I have no idea how he and my mother were managing before she died last year, but he has gone really badly downhill very quickly.
My instinct is against. On paper, he could be expected to last ten years or so (I hate talking this way but best to just be up front about how these things work and after a year of dealing with probate and sorting out their house and whatnot I'm now firmly in the "people die" camp, not "pass away, pass over, depart" etc.) which would bump up the cost (it's like life insurance in reverse) whereas he's on an AND (used to be DNR) and has no will to live. So come another health issue and he could go just like that. But perhaps I'm talking rubbish. Perhaps he's like my Auntie Amy who was dying from the age of 35 and lasted into her 90s, dying all the time.
So anyway, do people think these are a good idea or are they just a way to hand a very large some of money over so that the FA can be given a nice fat cut and then smile on when the undertaker turns up and they dance into the sunset with the capital?
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Might as well ask the bloody cat.
Posts: 17938 | From: Chesterfield | Registered: May 2001
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Jane R
Shipmate
# 331
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Posted
Haven't looked into care fee plans, but it sounds like a sucker bet to me. If your dad has a large chunk of money, get advice from an independent financial advisor about the best course of action.
Posts: 3958 | From: Jorvik | Registered: May 2001
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Piglet
Islander
# 11803
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Posted
I'm curious as to what happens if your AP survives past the "expiry" date of the fee plan (i.e. the date the actuary predicted he/she would die). Does he/she have to start coughing up the costs of their care-home, or is that the flip-side - that the company has "lost the bet" as to how long he/she will live, and they have to pay until your AP dies?
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I may not be on an island any more, but I'm still an islander.
alto n a soprano who can read music
Posts: 20272 | From: Fredericton, NB, on a rather larger piece of rock | Registered: Sep 2006
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