|
Source: (consider it)
|
Thread: Hell: Blasphemous desecration
|
mousethief
Ship's Thieving Rodent
# 953
|
Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Mamacita:
How can it give you a yeast infection if it's unleavened bread?
![[Razz]](tongue.gif)
Seen from the other way 'round, if one had a yeast infection already, it wouldn't be unleavened for long.... ![[Projectile]](graemlins/puke2.gif)
[ETA: this would have to start a new page....]
[ 14. April 2005, 10:17: Message edited by: Mousethief ]
--------------------
This is the last sig I'll ever write for you...
Posts: 63536 | From: Washington | Registered: Jul 2001
| IP: Logged
|
|
Thurible
Shipmate
# 3206
|
Posted
It's a shame that it had to be about something as abhorrent to get a thread of mine to five pages!
Thurible
--------------------
"I've been baptised not lobotomised."
Posts: 8049 | Registered: Aug 2002
| IP: Logged
|
|
shareman
Shipmate
# 2871
|
Posted
I think 103 acted tactlessly, Anglicans should be more seemly ![[Smile]](smile.gif) I do find it odd, though, that everyone seems to pity this poor little old lady who they seem to think wandered in off the street to find she knew not what happening, but my the words sounded nice and made her feel all warm and fuzzy. Then everyone walked up to the front where they were given a little round thingy. She went along with the crowd and when she didn't know what to do with the round thingy and went to put it in her purse as a memento, she was accosted by some horrid young creature who made her feel all icky.
Come on! I have attended other churches, indeed the worship services of other religions. I have tried to find out what would be happening and the meaning behind it before I went. If I didn't, I didn't have the temerity to take part in rituals I didn't understand. That's just disrespectful. Unless of course she DID understand and was just being gauche. I think she has some responsibility for the situation, not that 103 handled it all that well, but, as has been said, he's young and needs to learn tact. I should think that people wandering into an Anglican church in England, not understanding a thing about what was going on, and presuming to take part anyway is at least as rare an occurrance as Satanists stealing the Host for nefarious purposes. The young (which she was not) unchurched might not understand much about Christianity, but surely to God other people's religious beliefs deserve respect.
As to objects being more important than people, well, the "object" in question is the Body of Christ. If you don't think It is, fine. I do, and I would be deeply offended if you treated It as another piece of flatbread. And, yes, I do think It is more important than the feelings of someone who couldn't be arsed to show a bit of respect for someone else's religious traditions. Looked at another way, why are the feelings of someone who doesn't have enough respect for people's religious beliefs to try to understand what she is doing before she takes part in their rituals more important than the people whose beliefs she shows such disrespect for?
--------------------
Israel also came into Egypt, and Jacob was a stranger in the land of Ham.
Posts: 516 | From: on a rock AND a hard place | Registered: May 2002
| IP: Logged
|
|
Fiddleback
Shipmate
# 2809
|
Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Mamacita:
How can it give you a yeast infection if it's unleavened bread?
That's probably why the discerning chavvie who wants to play black magic with his mates in his dad's garage makes sure he gets the goods from a nice Anglo Catholic church (as the Rev'd Dr Cosmo assures us he would) and not a Methodist one.
Posts: 2034 | Registered: May 2002
| IP: Logged
|
|
Peronel
The typo slayer
# 569
|
Posted
I can imagine that a wafer is easier to insert than white sliced, too. The latter is too floppy - you'd need to toast it first. And imagine the crumbs!
Peronel.
--------------------
Lord, I have sinned, and mine iniquity.
Deserves this hell; yet Lord deliver me.
Posts: 2367 | From: A self-inflicted exile | Registered: Jun 2001
| IP: Logged
|
|
Justinian
Shipmate
# 5357
|
Posted
It's a clear case of obtaining goods by deception. Deception is that he was going to take it there.
Cosmo, put up or shut up.
I know a number of Satanists. Most of them are Satanists because they want to lash back at intolerance or hurt inflicted by the Church or because they are melodramatic adolescents (of all ages) trying to rebel against everything. They wouldn't be organised enough to get a Host or run a real Black Mass and would probably find the entire process extremely distateful.
Also, where are the headlines? I can hardly see the tabloids (or even the broadsheets) passing up "Infant Murdered in Satanic Ritual" and it's a gory enough story that the press would be investigating for weeks.
Besides, God's big. He can take care of himself. And if people really are committing human sacrifice, I think we (and God) have bigger things to worry about than what people are doing with communion wafers.
103, Here abideth faith, hope and charity. These three, and the greatest of these is charity.
To speak with obvious pride of driving someone away from the Church over what was probably a minor breach of ettiquette is utterly abhorrent. It is that, rather than the direct actions that are getting you castigated. (Had you said something like "I regret that she may never come back, and wish I had handled it better, but to Catholics it is INCREDIBLY important ...", there wouldn't have been this outcry).
By your actions, you think you have hurt the Church and possibly put a lady's soul into peril. And you are proud of it.
[ 14. April 2005, 10:39: Message edited by: Justinian ]
--------------------
My real name consists of just four letters, but in billions of combinations.
Eudaimonaic Laughter - my blog.
Posts: 3926 | From: The Sea Coast of Bohemia | Registered: Dec 2003
| IP: Logged
|
|
dyfrig
Blue Scarfed Menace
# 15
|
Posted
An RCC disciplinary matter is not necessarily a criminal act, is it? And obtaining goods by deception presumes that there are "goods" to be obtained - if that's Jesus and not bread, that's not goods.
--------------------
"He was wrong in the long run, but then, who isn't?" - Tony Judt
Posts: 6917 | From: pob dydd Iau, am hanner dydd | Registered: Apr 2001
| IP: Logged
|
|
Thurible
Shipmate
# 3206
|
Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Justinian:
I think we (and God) have bigger things to worry about than what people are doing with communion wafers.
For goodness' sake, the whole point of this thread is that It is a lot more than a simple communion wafer. It has been consecrated so is the Sacramental Localised Presence of God!
Thurible
--------------------
"I've been baptised not lobotomised."
Posts: 8049 | Registered: Aug 2002
| IP: Logged
|
|
dyfrig
Blue Scarfed Menace
# 15
|
Posted
Might be common assault, although you'd actually have to prove that the bread was no longer bread and was a human being, and if you go down that line, you end up with multiple charges of s.20 serious wounding, wot with all those people biting him.
Tricky.
--------------------
"He was wrong in the long run, but then, who isn't?" - Tony Judt
Posts: 6917 | From: pob dydd Iau, am hanner dydd | Registered: Apr 2001
| IP: Logged
|
|
dyfrig
Blue Scarfed Menace
# 15
|
Posted
Oh, btw, reverting to B-t-F's statement that the CofE "teaches" Real Presence. It's true that para 22(?) of the Sacrament of Unity report asserts this - the problem is, it doesn't back this up with any reference as to where this teaching is found other than in this particular paragraph. I'm not aware of any official pronouncement upon, and I would be surprised if anyone other than saddoes like myself who read bishops' reports even know that this has been said. It would have bene helpful if the bishops had supported the assertion with reference to other pronouncements, because as it stands it's just a bald statement.
--------------------
"He was wrong in the long run, but then, who isn't?" - Tony Judt
Posts: 6917 | From: pob dydd Iau, am hanner dydd | Registered: Apr 2001
| IP: Logged
|
|
Justinian
Shipmate
# 5357
|
Posted
quote:
Originally posted by shareman:
Come on! I have attended other churches, indeed the worship services of other religions. I have tried to find out what would be happening and the meaning behind it before I went. If I didn't, I didn't have the temerity to take part in rituals I didn't understand.
That's you. Highly educated, highly intellectual and, I suppose, always right. Many do not understand things they do (I don't entirely understand this computer I'm using - but I still use it) and many are not driven to undersand. Blessed is he who has not seen and yet believes.
quote:
That's just disrespectful.
There are those who consider being slightly disruptive to be disrespectful - and therefore would take part in rituals.
quote:
Unless of course she DID understand and was just being gauche. I think she has some responsibility for the situation,
Who on earth said she didn't?
quote:
As to objects being more important than people, well, the "object" in question is the Body of Christ. If you don't think It is, fine.
Does that make it more important than lives and souls?
quote:
I do, and I would be deeply offended if you treated It as another piece of flatbread.
Please show me one comment in this thread that suggested that it was to be treated as just a piece of flatbread. Either that, or stop making strawman arguments.
quote:
And, yes, I do think It is more important than the feelings
If just feelings were an issue you would have a point. 103 specifically stated that she might never come back to the church. We're into the territory of souls rather than simple feelings here.
quote:
Looked at another way, why are the feelings of someone who doesn't have enough respect for people's religious beliefs to try to understand what she is doing before she takes part in their rituals more important than the people whose beliefs she shows such disrespect for?
Who on earth said they were? You've got a third strawman here.
--------------------
My real name consists of just four letters, but in billions of combinations.
Eudaimonaic Laughter - my blog.
Posts: 3926 | From: The Sea Coast of Bohemia | Registered: Dec 2003
| IP: Logged
|
|
Justinian
Shipmate
# 5357
|
Posted
quote:
Originally posted by dyfrig:
An RCC disciplinary matter is not necessarily a criminal act, is it? And obtaining goods by deception presumes that there are "goods" to be obtained - if that's Jesus and not bread, that's not goods.
Obtaining goods by deception to the value he e-bayed it for. Simple. (The deception was that he was going to take communion rather than sell the thing).
quote:
Originally posted by Thurible quote:
Originally posted by Justinian:
I think we (and God) have bigger things to worry about than what people are doing with communion wafers.
For goodness' sake, the whole point of this thread is that It is a lot more than a simple communion wafer. It has been consecrated so is the Sacramental Localised Presence of God!
And it is still a consecrated communion wafer, whatever its essence has been turned into. (Don't make me break out the chemistry set).
Are humans powerful enough to directly hurt God? If not, then human sacrifice is a far bigger evil than whatever is done to the Host - which was the point of my statement - and why in that paragraph I referred specifically to communion wafers.
For that matter, where is the presence of God needed more than in the middle of Satanic rituals? The incarnation was not for the saved, but for the sinners.
--------------------
My real name consists of just four letters, but in billions of combinations.
Eudaimonaic Laughter - my blog.
Posts: 3926 | From: The Sea Coast of Bohemia | Registered: Dec 2003
| IP: Logged
|
|
Marvin the Martian
Interplanetary
# 4360
|
Posted
A thought -
If God is truly in all places, then wasn't He there before any host insertion ?
--------------------
Hail Gallaxhar
Posts: 30100 | From: Adrift on a sea of surreality | Registered: Apr 2003
| IP: Logged
|
|
Nightlamp
Shipmate
# 266
|
Posted
quote:
Originally posted by shareman:
That's just disrespectful. Unless of course she DID understand and was just being gauche.
How do you know that she didn't come from a church tradition where it is normal to consume in your seat?
--------------------
I don't know what you are talking about so it couldn't have been that important- Nightlamp
Posts: 8442 | From: Midlands | Registered: May 2001
| IP: Logged
|
|
Thurible
Shipmate
# 3206
|
Posted
Presumably this woman wasn't the first person in the queue, so, presumably, would have seen that everyone else consumed at the Altar rail/station?
Thurible
--------------------
"I've been baptised not lobotomised."
Posts: 8049 | Registered: Aug 2002
| IP: Logged
|
|
Fiddleback
Shipmate
# 2809
|
Posted
quote:
Originally posted by shareman:
I do find it odd, though, that everyone seems to pity this poor little old lady who they seem to think wandered in off the street to find she knew not what happening, but my the words sounded nice and made her feel all warm and fuzzy. Then everyone walked up to the front where they were given a little round thingy.
Believe me, this happens often enough especially in this area where Christianity isn't even the nominal default religion of the majority of the population. Many of those who just wander in are more likely to be nominal Sikhs. (One of my regular altar servers is, strictly speaking, a Sikh, but that's another matter). People want to do what everyone else is doing, to fit in and not be rude, so they come up to the altar rail. The trouble is that what is placed in their hand does not immediately look like food - well perhaps it may resemble a miniature chapati - but looks like a round ticket. Folks look at it, look around to see what everyone else is doing, and if they still haven't got the idea, will be inclined to put it in their pocket, or even kindly leave it in their pew at the end, or hand it back with their hymn book.
One of my most faithful parishioners every Sunday morning breaks the host in half, consuming one half and putting the other in her handbag. I assume that she takes it home for her husband, but I have never liked to ask. Mind you, she does have an excessively floribund balcony on her eleventh floor flat.
Posts: 2034 | Registered: May 2002
| IP: Logged
|
|
Rev per Minute
Shipmate
# 69
|
Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Fiddleback:
One of my most faithful parishioners every Sunday morning breaks the host in half, consuming one half and putting the other in her handbag. I assume that she takes it home for her husband, but I have never liked to ask. Mind you, she does have an excessively floribund balcony on her eleventh floor flat.
Given the content of this thread, perhaps you should check that she's not the High Priestess of a Satanic cult taking it home for a ceremony with her husband, who is in fact Beelzebub?
Or perhaps you are Beelzebub, Fr Fiddleback (and doesn't Fiddleback sound like the name of one of the devils in The Screwtape Letters?) ![[Devil]](graemlins/devil.gif)
More likely that your parishioner doesn't properly understand your understanding of the Real Presence - rather like 103's unfortunate lady...
--------------------
"Allons-y!" "Geronimo!" "Oh, for God's sake!" The Day of the Doctor
At the end of the day, we face our Maker alongside Jesus. RIP ken
Posts: 2696 | From: my desk (if I can find the keyboard under this mess) | Registered: May 2001
| IP: Logged
|
|
Thurible
Shipmate
# 3206
|
Posted
Fiddleback,
Why do you allow her to do so?
Could asking her why she does it not provide an pastoral opportunity to minister to her husband?
Thurible
--------------------
"I've been baptised not lobotomised."
Posts: 8049 | Registered: Aug 2002
| IP: Logged
|
|
Nightlamp
Shipmate
# 266
|
Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Thurible:
Presumably this woman wasn't the first person in the queue, so, presumably, would have seen that everyone else consumed at the Altar rail/station?
Have you ever gone to another church and did what you normally did ie cross your self when no one else does or knelt when everyone else sat. What is wrong with people going to another church and following their own tradition?
--------------------
I don't know what you are talking about so it couldn't have been that important- Nightlamp
Posts: 8442 | From: Midlands | Registered: May 2001
| IP: Logged
|
|
Stephen
Shipmate
# 40
|
Posted
For myself I can't help wondering about a most important matter, that of tatology
I take it that Black Masses are celebrated - if that's the right word ![[Eek!]](eek.gif) - with black vestments, black altar frontals and black candles.But how many candles,2 or 6 ? Is the use modelled upon that of Rome or Sarum. Are the dreaded fiddlebacks used or do we favour something,um, well,you know, a little Gothic
And westward or eastward facing? None of this namby pamby use of nave altars in the Satanic Rite surely? Oh and what language is used? Old High Church Neolithic perhaps?
I think we should be told!! ![[Two face]](graemlins/scot_twoface.gif) ![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif)
[ 14. April 2005, 13:38: Message edited by: The Royal Spaniel ]
--------------------
Best Wishes
Stephen
'Be still,then, and know that I am God: I will be exalted among the nations and I will be exalted in the earth' Ps46 v10
Posts: 3954 | From: Alto C Clef Country | Registered: May 2001
| IP: Logged
|
|
Thurible
Shipmate
# 3206
|
Posted
When it comes to taking Communion at another church, I've always followed their tradition - I've even received sitting (though I felt very bad about it!).
Thurible
--------------------
"I've been baptised not lobotomised."
Posts: 8049 | Registered: Aug 2002
| IP: Logged
|
|
Og: Thread Killer
Ship's token CN Mennonite
# 3200
|
Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Thurible:
quote:
Originally posted by Justinian:
I think we (and God) have bigger things to worry about than what people are doing with communion wafers.
For goodness' sake, the whole point of this thread is that It is a lot more than a simple communion wafer. It has been consecrated so is the Sacramental Localised Presence of God!
Well, no, that might have been your intention, but this is hell, where the globalised presence of God meanders a bit.
--------------------
I wish I was seeking justice loving mercy and walking humbly but... "Cease to lament for that thou canst not help, And study help for that which thou lament'st."
Posts: 5025 | From: Toronto | Registered: Aug 2002
| IP: Logged
|
|
ken
Ship's Roundhead
# 2460
|
Posted
quote:
Originally posted by dyfrig:
Might be common assault, although you'd actually have to prove that the bread was no longer bread and was a human being, and if you go down that line, you end up with multiple charges of s.20 serious wounding, wot with all those people biting him.
Most men would regard being inserted in such a place as a less unpleasant experience than being eaten.
--------------------
Ken
L’amor che move il sole e l’altre stelle.
Posts: 39579 | From: London | Registered: Mar 2002
| IP: Logged
|
|
Chapelhead*
Ship’s Photographer
# 1143
|
Posted
A few points…
Firstly, according to today’s Daily Mail (so it must be true) the wafer was bought by a Catholic to avoid it falling into the wrong hands (but how do they know?).
Secondly, the question of whether theft or assault occurred surely depends to some extent on the state of the person taking the host. Although he (I’m assuming “he”) might not be a Catholic now he might have been when he took the host, and if not a Catholic then he might still have been a Christian. Which would make him part of the body of Christ. Although this doesn’t prevent him from being guilty of theft of a wafer, it would be harder to prove that he had stolen part of himself. Trying to work out whether part of a person can steal a different part of the same person would probably require the wisdom of Solomon vs Solomon (that’s a legal joke, allegedly).
Thirdly, God is omnipotent and could, therefore, stop any misuse of the host. Is failing to do so an indication of acquiescence to the act a case of volenti non fit injuria? If so, would this make a difference to the possible charges? I think that under English law (which would clearly not apply, but is the only area I can speak of) having a volunteer doesn’t mean that assault cannot take place. I seem to recall a case from some years back involving a group of men, some sandpaper and an unusual form of mutual activity where it was held that a person can be assaulted even if they agree to the act. Would this precedent apply?
Finally (almost), as Christians form the body of Christ, is it not the case that the body of Christ quite frequently gets put into all sorts of orifices? And than many of the people posting on this thread will have put bits of the body of Christ that they are into various locations - some of which I do not care to contemplate?
The moral of the story would seem to be that the world would be a much better place if we all went does the Methodists’ for a nice bit of Mother’s Pride – that way there would be a lot fewer black masses.
--------------------
Benedikt Gott Geschickt!
Posts: 7082 | From: Turbolift Control. | Registered: Aug 2001
| IP: Logged
|
|
Stephen
Shipmate
# 40
|
Posted
Aren't you supposed to let it melt in your mouth,like butter or maltesers, you know instead of all that biting ?
--------------------
Best Wishes
Stephen
'Be still,then, and know that I am God: I will be exalted among the nations and I will be exalted in the earth' Ps46 v10
Posts: 3954 | From: Alto C Clef Country | Registered: May 2001
| IP: Logged
|
|
Fiddleback
Shipmate
# 2809
|
Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Thurible:
Fiddleback,
Why do you allow her to do so?
Because I have done so for five years and see no reason not to.
quote:
Could asking her why she does it not provide an pastoral opportunity to minister to her husband?
He comes to mass on weekdays. I think he doesn't come on Sunday because there is something he listens to on the wireless.
Posts: 2034 | Registered: May 2002
| IP: Logged
|
|
Thurible
Shipmate
# 3206
|
Posted
Good to know that you could give a flying fuck about treating the Blessed Sacrament with decorum.
Thurible
--------------------
"I've been baptised not lobotomised."
Posts: 8049 | Registered: Aug 2002
| IP: Logged
|
|
Erin
Meaner than Godzilla
# 2
|
Posted
But don't we have to respect others' beliefs, Thurible? I mean, if Fiddleback doesn't consecrate the hosts with the intention of it being a little piece of Jesus in the flesh, you need to respect that belief. Otherwise, all your squawking in the OP is flat-out, bold-faced hypocrisy.
--------------------
Commandment number one: shut the hell up.
Posts: 17140 | From: 330 miles north of paradise | Registered: Mar 2001
| IP: Logged
|
|
Anselmina
Ship's barmaid
# 3032
|
Posted
quote:
Originally posted by shareman:
I think 103 acted tactlessly, Anglicans should be more seemly I do find it odd, though, that everyone seems to pity this poor little old lady who they seem to think wandered in off the street to find she knew not what happening, but my the words sounded nice and made her feel all warm and fuzzy. Then everyone walked up to the front where they were given a little round thingy. She went along with the crowd and when she didn't know what to do with the round thingy and went to put it in her purse as a memento, she was accosted by some horrid young creature who made her feel all icky.
I missed the bit about the woman trying to put the host in her purse. Could you point me to where that is please?
I don't think anyone, including 103, has made the experience sound as simple and Disney-esque as that. In fact, the problem probably arose because the situation was many-layered, and the people involved were complex human beings.
JFTR, sometimes there's nothing wrong with being made to feel welcome and comfortable during worship. Just as there's nothing necessarily bad about being challenged from time to time.
quote:
Come on! I have attended other churches, indeed the worship services of other religions. I have tried to find out what would be happening and the meaning behind it before I went. If I didn't, I didn't have the temerity to take part in rituals I didn't understand. That's just disrespectful. Unless of course she DID understand and was just being gauche.
So the choices are that anyone who acts as she did is either gauche or disrespectful? I still think the situation is complex enough to generate a few other possibilities, as have already been covered on the thread. You also say that you wouldn't have the temerity to take part in rituals you don't understand. Well, I don't understand the mysteries of the Eucharist - and I wouldn't be inclined to believe anyone if they told me they did. I suggest that what you mean is 'if people aren't familiar with the way we do things, they should leave well alone', which is a different debate altogether.
I think in doing your church research, too, you are definitely an exception, and not the rule. At least in the Anglican church, at any rate.
quote:
I think she has some responsibility for the situation, not that 103 handled it all that well, but, as has been said, he's young and needs to learn tact. I should think that people wandering into an Anglican church in England, not understanding a thing about what was going on, and presuming to take part anyway is at least as rare an occurrance as Satanists stealing the Host for nefarious purposes. The young (which she was not) unchurched might not understand much about Christianity, but surely to God other people's religious beliefs deserve respect.
People go into Anglican churches 'not understanding a thing about what's going on but presuming to take part anyway' all the time. Yes, admittedly mostly in baptisms, weddings, funerals, high days and holy days. But even in our little rural outpost we get a steady stream of visitors who drop in, often on spec, quite a few of whom are totally unfamiliar with either church or our way of doing church.
You seem to be saying that unfamiliarity is somehow equal to disrespect, that people 'dare' to join in with Christian worship, despite not having first served whatever apprenticeship it is you imagine they need to complete. There are plenty of churches that do indeed operate in this way. For me one of the attractions of most Anglican worship is that it generally doesn't operate like this.
quote:
It is more important than the feelings of someone who couldn't be arsed to show a bit of respect for someone else's religious traditions.
Once again, please direct me to where 103 said this was the woman's known attitude. If this is indeed the case I'll happily agree with this point.
quote:
QLooked at another way, why are the feelings of someone who doesn't have enough respect for people's religious beliefs to try to understand what she is doing before she takes part in their rituals more important than the people whose beliefs she shows such disrespect for?
Shareman, you don't know what her attitude was. You don't know if she was being disrespectful, so you can't state categorically she was. Her crime was not eating the host immediately at reception (or wouldn't have done apparently); she didn't moon the altar, or blow raspberry tarts during the sermon.
You know, if ever an attitude such as yours became widespread I'd be astonished if anyone, ever, at anytime, including the faithful, dared to go anywhere near a church.
--------------------
Irish dogs needing homes! http://www.dogactionwelfaregroup.ie/ Greyhounds and Lurchers are shipped over to England for rehoming too!
Posts: 10002 | From: Scotland the Brave | Registered: Jul 2002
| IP: Logged
|
|
Thurible
Shipmate
# 3206
|
Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Erin:
But don't we have to respect others' beliefs, Thurible? I mean, if Fiddleback doesn't consecrate the hosts with the intention of it being a little piece of Jesus in the flesh, you need to respect that belief. Otherwise, all your squawking in the OP is flat-out, bold-faced hypocrisy.
My understanding of Fr. Fiddleback's sacramentology is such that he does believe he is so consecrating, so fuck right off, Erin, there's a dear.
Thurible
--------------------
"I've been baptised not lobotomised."
Posts: 8049 | Registered: Aug 2002
| IP: Logged
|
|
Fiddleback
Shipmate
# 2809
|
Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Thurible:
Good to know that you could give a flying fuck about treating the Blessed Sacrament with decorum.
Heavens no. I've been known to allow lady priestesses to officiate at Benediction.
Posts: 2034 | Registered: May 2002
| IP: Logged
|
|
Thurible
Shipmate
# 3206
|
Posted
As opposed to male priestesses? I thought you weren't FinF! ![[Biased]](wink.gif)
Thurible
--------------------
"I've been baptised not lobotomised."
Posts: 8049 | Registered: Aug 2002
| IP: Logged
|
|
Scot
Deck hand
# 2095
|
Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Anselmina:
JFTR, sometimes there's nothing wrong with being made to feel welcome and comfortable during worship. Just as there's nothing necessarily bad about being challenged from time to time.
That's just crazy talk. If you start making everyone feel welcome, you'll end up all sorts of undesirables in your church. If you let them challenge you, there's a risk of losing control of what people think. Next thing you know, there'll be women wanting to be priests.
Better to nip it in the bud.
--------------------
“Here, we are not afraid to follow truth wherever it may lead, nor tolerate any error so long as reason is left free to combat it.” - Thomas Jefferson
Posts: 9515 | From: Southern California | Registered: Jan 2002
| IP: Logged
|
|
Anselmina
Ship's barmaid
# 3032
|
Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Thurible:
As opposed to male priestesses?
They're my favourite kind! Their frocks are always so much more lacy and ooh la la! than anything I wear ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif) !
--------------------
Irish dogs needing homes! http://www.dogactionwelfaregroup.ie/ Greyhounds and Lurchers are shipped over to England for rehoming too!
Posts: 10002 | From: Scotland the Brave | Registered: Jul 2002
| IP: Logged
|
|
Anselmina
Ship's barmaid
# 3032
|
Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Scot:
quote:
Originally posted by Anselmina:
JFTR, sometimes there's nothing wrong with being made to feel welcome and comfortable during worship. Just as there's nothing necessarily bad about being challenged from time to time.
That's just crazy talk. If you start making everyone feel welcome, you'll end up all sorts of undesirables in your church. If you let them challenge you, there's a risk of losing control of what people think. Next thing you know, there'll be women wanting to be priests.
Better to nip it in the bud.
You're so right. What was I thinking ![[Disappointed]](graemlins/disappointed.gif) ?
--------------------
Irish dogs needing homes! http://www.dogactionwelfaregroup.ie/ Greyhounds and Lurchers are shipped over to England for rehoming too!
Posts: 10002 | From: Scotland the Brave | Registered: Jul 2002
| IP: Logged
|
|
Pyx_e
Quixotic Tilter
# 57
|
Posted
Honest to God what is with all this “making people feel welcome” bollocks. They are there to offer up a sacrifice of Praise and Worship not have a nice little chat or have a warm wet moment. Get a grip you whiney fuckers.
P
--------------------
It is better to be Kind than right.
Posts: 9778 | From: The Dark Tower | Registered: May 2001
| IP: Logged
|
|
Erin
Meaner than Godzilla
# 2
|
Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Thurible:
quote:
Originally posted by Erin:
But don't we have to respect others' beliefs, Thurible? I mean, if Fiddleback doesn't consecrate the hosts with the intention of it being a little piece of Jesus in the flesh, you need to respect that belief. Otherwise, all your squawking in the OP is flat-out, bold-faced hypocrisy.
My understanding of Fr. Fiddleback's sacramentology is such that he does believe he is so consecrating, so fuck right off, Erin, there's a dear.
Thurible
Well CLEARLY his sacramentology is at odds with yours -- at the very least, he doesn't have a stroke when someone walks away from the altar without having proved they've swallowed -- so you need to shut the fuck up and start respecting other peoples' beliefs.
--------------------
Commandment number one: shut the hell up.
Posts: 17140 | From: 330 miles north of paradise | Registered: Mar 2001
| IP: Logged
|
|
Scot
Deck hand
# 2095
|
Posted
See, Anselmina? Pyx_e gets it.
--------------------
“Here, we are not afraid to follow truth wherever it may lead, nor tolerate any error so long as reason is left free to combat it.” - Thomas Jefferson
Posts: 9515 | From: Southern California | Registered: Jan 2002
| IP: Logged
|
|
Erin
Meaner than Godzilla
# 2
|
Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Pyx_e:
Honest to God what is with all this "making people feel welcome" bollocks. They are there to offer up a sacrifice of Praise and Worship not have a nice little chat or have a warm wet moment. Get a grip you whiney fuckers.
P
Damn straight! We don't want people thinking that they're acceptable in God's house! What is the matter with you heathens?
Although I don't quite get how "Praise and Worship" should be "a sacrifice". Do you slaughter hymnals on the altar?
--------------------
Commandment number one: shut the hell up.
Posts: 17140 | From: 330 miles north of paradise | Registered: Mar 2001
| IP: Logged
|
|
Joykins
Shipmate
# 5820
|
Posted
I'm getting the impression from this conversation that "fanny" means something entirely different in the UK than the US.
quote:
Originally posted by ReginaShoe:
"No, I don't want to worship THAT Antichrist, I want to worship the one from the 'Left Behind' novels! And I'm standing up for my right to desecrate those stupid little mini-saltines and plastic cups that I always got at First Assembly of God in Pleasantville!")
This is making me think of menstrual cups for some reason. I need to go wash my mind now.
Joy
Posts: 350 | From: Maryland, USA | Registered: Apr 2004
| IP: Logged
|
|
Emma Louise
Storm in a teapot
# 3571
|
Posted
Y'know. Normally the ship doesnt put me off any particular denomination (well sometimes maybe the orthodox with The Orthodox Plot, but I think I might just be comfortable with that now.... and it seems to confirm my fear of conservative evos.)
Anyway - this has well and truly put me off the RC/ High Anglicanism well more than I ever have been in the past.
Posts: 12719 | From: Enid Blyton territory. | Registered: Nov 2002
| IP: Logged
|
|
Thurible
Shipmate
# 3206
|
Posted
I know - me too. It's disgusting how we all respect that which we believe to be Our Lord, isn't it!
Thurible
--------------------
"I've been baptised not lobotomised."
Posts: 8049 | Registered: Aug 2002
| IP: Logged
|
|
Justinian
Shipmate
# 5357
|
Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Erin:
quote:
Originally posted by Pyx_e:
Honest to God what is with all this "making people feel welcome" bollocks. They are there to offer up a sacrifice of Praise and Worship not have a nice little chat or have a warm wet moment. Get a grip you whiney fuckers.
P
Damn straight! We don't want people thinking that they're acceptable in God's house! What is the matter with you heathens?
Although I don't quite get how "Praise and Worship" should be "a sacrifice". Do you slaughter hymnals on the altar?
And, if so, can I nominate "Mission Praise" and anything containing "Shine Jesus Shine"?
--------------------
My real name consists of just four letters, but in billions of combinations.
Eudaimonaic Laughter - my blog.
Posts: 3926 | From: The Sea Coast of Bohemia | Registered: Dec 2003
| IP: Logged
|
|
Og: Thread Killer
Ship's token CN Mennonite
# 3200
|
Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Scot:
See, Anselmina? Pyx_e gets it.
There is an orifice joke in this somewhere, but I'm sure people would get really offended.
--------------------
I wish I was seeking justice loving mercy and walking humbly but... "Cease to lament for that thou canst not help, And study help for that which thou lament'st."
Posts: 5025 | From: Toronto | Registered: Aug 2002
| IP: Logged
|
|
Erin
Meaner than Godzilla
# 2
|
Posted
I completely agree, Emma. I grew up going to RC schools, being indoctrinated by nuns who thought Vatican II was a dangerous heresy and who instilled a mortal fear of God and the fires of hell into every child that passed through the doors. So I routinely think I hear a call from Holy Mother Church to come home. Then God ever so thoughtfully provides a thread like this, with the raving loons out in full force, and I scamper back to the extreme protestant end of the ECUSA as fast as I can.
[ 14. April 2005, 14:57: Message edited by: Erin ]
--------------------
Commandment number one: shut the hell up.
Posts: 17140 | From: 330 miles north of paradise | Registered: Mar 2001
| IP: Logged
|
|
Og: Thread Killer
Ship's token CN Mennonite
# 3200
|
Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Erin:
... Although I don't quite get how "Praise and Worship" should be "a sacrifice". Do you slaughter hymnals on the altar?
A nice Powerpoint presentation would do the trick.
--------------------
I wish I was seeking justice loving mercy and walking humbly but... "Cease to lament for that thou canst not help, And study help for that which thou lament'st."
Posts: 5025 | From: Toronto | Registered: Aug 2002
| IP: Logged
|
|
Justinian
Shipmate
# 5357
|
Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Thurible:
I know - me too. It's disgusting how we all respect that which we believe to be Our Lord, isn't it!
Thurible
Respect is not the same thing as decorum. I suggest you contemplate the difference between the two.
Is your God too weak for a paritioner to carry a part of him off to give to another communicant paritioner? For that matter, is your God too weak to take on Satan himself? If not, why are you so worried about protecting God? Respect for an entity in my book involves allowing them to act where thy best can and not wrapping them in cotton wool.
--------------------
My real name consists of just four letters, but in billions of combinations.
Eudaimonaic Laughter - my blog.
Posts: 3926 | From: The Sea Coast of Bohemia | Registered: Dec 2003
| IP: Logged
|
|
Fiddleback
Shipmate
# 2809
|
Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Thurible:
My understanding of Fr. Fiddleback's sacramentology is such that he does believe he is so consecrating, so fuck right off, Erin, there's a dear.
Actually, sonny, I am an out-and-out mindless Anglo-Papalist transubstantiationist. That means my 'sacramentology' is not what yours would appear to be.
Posts: 2034 | Registered: May 2002
| IP: Logged
|
|
Leetle Masha
Cantankerous Anchoress
# 8209
|
Posted
quote:
Do you slaughter hymnals on the altar?
Erin, shush! Don't put ideas into their heads!
After all, didn't Baldwin the Fat try that in the Fourth Crusade? And didn't the Pope have to apologise for the mess all that caused?
Masher
--------------------
eleison me, tin amartolin: have mercy on me, the sinner
Posts: 6351 | From: Hesychia, in Hyperdulia | Registered: Aug 2004
| IP: Logged
|
|
mousethief
Ship's Thieving Rodent
# 953
|
Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Justinian:
Are humans powerful enough to directly hurt God?
Actually, I believe they once killed Him. He didn't stay dead, though, so perhaps that supports your point.
--------------------
This is the last sig I'll ever write for you...
Posts: 63536 | From: Washington | Registered: Jul 2001
| IP: Logged
|
|
|
Printer-friendly view
