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Source: (consider it)
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Thread: Hell: Blasphemous desecration
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Marvin the Martian
Interplanetary
# 4360
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by RuthW:
quote:
Originally posted by Marvin the Martian:
quote:
Originally posted by Erin:
103 DOES have other options. He's chosen not to exercise them.
Yes, he does. Just like the person with a gun to their head DOES have the option to accept death rather than do what the holder of the gun says.
Pretty much what I was thinking in the middle of my lunch hour, which is when you posted this, Marvin. I'm not sure I want to make a habit of having the same thought simultaneously with you. ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
Come to the Dark Side, Ruth - there's always room for one more ![[Biased]](wink.gif)
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Hail Gallaxhar
Posts: 30100 | From: Adrift on a sea of surreality | Registered: Apr 2003
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Max.
Shipmate
# 5846
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Posted
Don't get me wrong - I love the church that I go to very very much, but I feel very very uncomfortable with the fact that it's in the CofE, And I have spoken to my parents about the RC Church and according to them it's out of the question at present.
-103
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For the sake of His sorrowful Passion, have mercy on us and on the whole world.
Posts: 9716 | From: North Yorkshire | Registered: May 2004
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luvanddaisies
the'fun'in'fundie'™
# 5761
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Posted
quote:
Like most evil, bad things can't happen unless we say "yes" to them.
I can just see the "Screwtape Letters" sequel now
"the man from the wannabe RC church - he say 'no'!"
"the woman with the wafer craving - she say 'yes'!"
( reference for anyone across the pond who didn't ever see the UK advert being alluded to!)
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _
as to these statements, all from 103;
(listed haphazardly, in no order except that in which I found them in this thread when I went back to copy & paste them in!)
quote:
...First time I ever was a Eucharistic minister...
quote:
...come to my church again because of that but to Catholics it is INCREDIBLY important...
quote:
...I'm glad that you would like to see me out because I'm glad that I'll be able to leave the confusion and the uncertainty of the CofE that I experience behind and I'll be able to live my life in a denomination that I think is strong and united in beliefs...
quote:
...and I panicked on my first time as Eucharistic Minister. I told my parish priest and he said that he saw and it was exactly what I should've done. I had remembered what he told me to do...
possibly I'm just a bit odd, but does anyone else percieve any trace of inconsistency [maybe even hypocrisy? ![[Ultra confused]](graemlins/confused2.gif) ] in the above.
In my interpretation;
- 103 is a Eucharistic Minister in his church
- his church is (officially) an Anglican one
- however, his church identifies itself more with Rome than with the anglicanism
- he doesn't agree with the church in which he is an E.M.
- he wants to leave the anglican tradition and go to a real RC church, rather than a wannabe one
- for some reason this very small shift (mainly in name rather than in practise) is impossible - currently being assumed that parental pressure is making it so
- he doesn't seem to see any conflict between not agreeing with a church's background, liturgy,etc and acepting a leadership position (however small) in that church
- at the same time he credits the church's vicar (priest/pastor/whatever) as being worthy of enough respect, in an ecclesiastical context, to value and accept the man's opinion
am I the only one confused by this set of apparent contradictions? ![[Paranoid]](graemlins/paranoid.gif) ![[Help]](graemlins/help.gif)
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"Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines, sail away from the safe harbour. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover." (Mark Twain)
Posts: 3711 | From: all at sea. | Registered: Apr 2004
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Peronel
The typo slayer
# 569
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Posted
You're not the only one seeing contradictions.
I confess I can sympathise somewhat with 103. Challenging one's parents can be horribly difficult - particularly if you still live under their roof - and I know that I never managed it successfully.
On the other hand, I can't help but wonder. Christ in the sacrament is, it seems, sufficiently important that 103 is willing to challenge someone at the altar, but it isn't sufficiently important that he's willing to stand up to his parents. That bugs me somehow.
Peronel.
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Lord, I have sinned, and mine iniquity.
Deserves this hell; yet Lord deliver me.
Posts: 2367 | From: A self-inflicted exile | Registered: Jun 2001
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Amos
Shipmate
# 44
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Posted
Well, as Ariel suggested, maybe the lady was his mother. Then 103 only hopes that she won't be coming back to church.
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At the end of the day we face our Maker alongside Jesus--ken
Posts: 7667 | From: Summerisle | Registered: May 2001
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Max.
Shipmate
# 5846
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Posted
Sorry but unless any of you are my younger brother or I have a secret older brother or sister, none of you can possibly know what my family situation is concerning the entire RC-AC thing, with the exception of a few who have met me in real life who have had the entire story explained to them.
-103
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For the sake of His sorrowful Passion, have mercy on us and on the whole world.
Posts: 9716 | From: North Yorkshire | Registered: May 2004
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Peronel
The typo slayer
# 569
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Posted
(humming)
quote:
DEACON: This lady's his what?
103: This lady's my mother!
Priest: This lady's his what?
Acolytes: He says she's his mother!
(with apologies to W. S. Gilbert)
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Lord, I have sinned, and mine iniquity.
Deserves this hell; yet Lord deliver me.
Posts: 2367 | From: A self-inflicted exile | Registered: Jun 2001
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Ariel
Shipmate
# 58
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Amos:
Well, as Ariel suggested, maybe the lady was his mother.
It was the "EAT IT NOW!!" bit that made me suddenly wonder whether this was a phrase he was used to hearing at home. And he just sort of came out with it as a reflex action.
Posts: 25445 | Registered: May 2001
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kentishmaid
Shipmate
# 4767
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Posted
While I have found much of what 103 has said in this thread a little difficult to swallow (if you'll pardon the pun) I do have great sympathy with him on the whole church attendance/parental control thing. Even my mother was not permitted to go to a different church from my father as he thought that, as he was the vicar, this would send the wrong message to the congregation.
On occasions I would hide in order to avoid church attendance, and my father would find me, and forcibly put me in the car. Had I not attended church I would have been required to miss meals, not be allowed to go out etc, and given my father's violent tendencies, in probability suffered physical bruising in order that my father get his way. In our household, you either obeyed my Dad or else. While I am not for one minute suggesting that 103 has to put up with this sort of abusive environment, he may well have incredibly strict parents who have ways of enforcing their will. Frankly, if it was a choice between starving, living on the streets, or being hit versus doing what my Dad required then I opted to obey him. If 103 has similar choices (albeit on a different scale and with less criminal overtones), then, I figure we should give him a bit of breathing space on that score until he is living independently of his parents.
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"Who'll be the lady, who'll be the lord, when we are ruled by the love of one another?"
Posts: 2063 | From: Huddersfield | Registered: Jul 2003
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jlg
What is this place?
Why am I here?
# 98
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by 103 (One-O-Three):
....I'm glad that I'll be able to leave the confusion and the uncertainty of the CofE that I experience behind and I'll be able to live my life in a denomination that I think is strong and united in beliefs.
(Emphasis added)
Prepare yourself for some disappointment, lad. The RCC has the likes of me and my godmother in it.
Though if you're looking for a lot of mindless adoration of various apparitions of the BVM (including little old ladies spouting pious nonsense), you'll surely be able to find your niche.
quote:
BTW - At least I'll still be a Christian and I still believe in Christainity unlike the majority of people in my school and previous schools and I think in the country.
I'll never become an athiest or would you all want me to do that?
Sorry to break it to you, but not being a Christian (or even a Christain -- nice typo!) is hardly the end of the world.
And yeah, I think it might do you good to become an atheist. Such overheated zeal at your young age needs to be tempered with a good dose of serious doubt.
[ETA: I do love that typo! I'm gonna go around singing "The Stain of Christ! He is the Stain of Christ!" for the rest of the evening. ![[Devil]](graemlins/devil.gif) ]
[ 20. April 2005, 21:52: Message edited by: jlg ]
Posts: 17391 | From: Just a Town, New Hampshire, USA | Registered: May 2001
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Max.
Shipmate
# 5846
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by kentishmaid:
While I have found much of what 103 has said in this thread a little difficult to swallow (if you'll pardon the pun) I do have great sympathy with him on the whole church attendance/parental control thing. Even my mother was not permitted to go to a different church from my father as he thought that, as he was the vicar, this would send the wrong message to the congregation.
On occasions I would hide in order to avoid church attendance, and my father would find me, and forcibly put me in the car. Had I not attended church I would have been required to miss meals, not be allowed to go out etc, and given my father's violent tendencies, in probability suffered physical bruising in order that my father get his way. In our household, you either obeyed my Dad or else. While I am not for one minute suggesting that 103 has to put up with this sort of abusive environment, he may well have incredibly strict parents who have ways of enforcing their will. Frankly, if it was a choice between starving, living on the streets, or being hit versus doing what my Dad required then I opted to obey him. If 103 has similar choices (albeit on a different scale and with less criminal overtones), then, I figure we should give him a bit of breathing space on that score until he is living independently of his parents.
OMG - My parents would never hit me, prehaps I gave out the wrong message here! They aren't at all like that and I don't think they would chuck me out on the streets.
But life would be EXTREMELY uncomfortable when it comes to religion (which is a huge part of our family, we go to mass all together as a family, we recite the rosary together and we pray together)
If I was part of a different denomination it would probably cause a split among us, there would be a "You're a different type of Christian to us" attitude, I would be joining the "Novus Ordo Warehouse religion, the religion that only uses churches to distribute mass to the people, the religion that stole the latin from the people and the religion that caused so much upset to my mother's family"
God knows how we got involved in at my current church as it's very different to the AC Church that celebrated mass in Latin that first got my family into the AC Tradition.
Just to clarify, my Parents would never hit me and it is not a Anglicanism or Streets decision.
It's a decision that I have to make whilst thinking about the feelings of other people in the family. The last thing I want to do is cause a lot of hurt and pain in my family, after all I have to live with them!
-103
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For the sake of His sorrowful Passion, have mercy on us and on the whole world.
Posts: 9716 | From: North Yorkshire | Registered: May 2004
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ChristinaMarie
Shipmate
# 1013
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Posted
Pope Benedict wants all Christians to be united, why not stay where you are and work for that, 103?
Christina
Posts: 2333 | From: Oldham | Registered: Jul 2001
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Max.
Shipmate
# 5846
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Posted
Because we won't be fully united, Will we?
-103
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For the sake of His sorrowful Passion, have mercy on us and on the whole world.
Posts: 9716 | From: North Yorkshire | Registered: May 2004
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Nightlamp
Shipmate
# 266
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by 103 (One-O-Three):
BTW - I have no problem with CW Order One because it doesn't follow the BCP 1662 order of Holy Communion.
Ah, but two of the Eucharist prayers in order one contain the same theology.
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I don't know what you are talking about so it couldn't have been that important- Nightlamp
Posts: 8442 | From: Midlands | Registered: May 2001
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kentishmaid
Shipmate
# 4767
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Posted
103 I'm sorry if that came across as implying any such thing - I had thought I'd made that clear. Apparently not. My apologies. I was merely trying to point out that parents can often be less of a negotiable obstacle with respect to these decisions (if you'll pardon the dehumanising turn of phrase) than some may think.
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"Who'll be the lady, who'll be the lord, when we are ruled by the love of one another?"
Posts: 2063 | From: Huddersfield | Registered: Jul 2003
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Marvin the Martian
Interplanetary
# 4360
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by 103 (One-O-Three):
Because we won't be fully united, Will we?
Well, not with an attitude like that we won't...
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Hail Gallaxhar
Posts: 30100 | From: Adrift on a sea of surreality | Registered: Apr 2003
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Max.
Shipmate
# 5846
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Marvin the Martian:
quote:
Originally posted by 103 (One-O-Three):
Because we won't be fully united, Will we?
Well, not with an attitude like that we won't...
He believes that the Anglican Church is not a real church. I don't think we ever will be able to be in full communion with Rome, so we won't be fully united will we? Think about it...
-103
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For the sake of His sorrowful Passion, have mercy on us and on the whole world.
Posts: 9716 | From: North Yorkshire | Registered: May 2004
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luvanddaisies
the'fun'in'fundie'™
# 5761
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by 103 (One-O-Three):
But life would be EXTREMELY uncomfortable when it comes to religion (which is a huge part of our family, we go to mass all together as a family, we recite the rosary together and we pray together)
<snip>
It's a decision that I have to make whilst thinking about the feelings of other people in the family. The last thing I want to do is cause a lot of hurt and pain in my family, after all I have to live with them!
-103
- all of which is admirable, and does show that you're not as immature as some of your less considered posts here may have led some to believe - but why though do you accept appointment to a role of leadership &/or ministry within the church if it is not a church you would otherwise choose to attend?
that is what puzzles me & is where I percieve the biggest contradiction - especially as your beliefs & opinions are so fervently held and expressed.
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"Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines, sail away from the safe harbour. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover." (Mark Twain)
Posts: 3711 | From: all at sea. | Registered: Apr 2004
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Exiled Youth
Shipmate
# 8744
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by 103 (One-O-Three):
Think about it...
and
quote:
we go to mass all together as a family, we recite the rosary together and we pray together
No, YOU think about it...these are distinctly Catholic characteristics. So, you're Catholic in terms of your beliefs, right? Reciting the rosary and everything, transubstantiation, etc. And you want to actually be a Catholic soon. But you don't have a problem being an EM in a non-church, with utterly null and void sacraments, which are administered by a non-priest?
![[Confused]](confused.gif)
Well, I hope your parents realise how stupid that makes them look. I had running battles with my parents about church. Dad actually busted down a locked door once (I was about 10). But could they have made me serve communion if I didn't want to? Course they couldn't.
Sort it out -- you're in, or you're out. Stop lying to people by pretending you still believe you're serving a valid sacrament. If you're going to dodge that by saying "I'm not a Catholic yet", then that's a nice dodge. But you know full well that you will soon affirm that you believe that the sacrament you so diligently protected all those years from those satan-worshippers was in fact just soggy mother's pride.
ETA: cross posted there...and I think the post in question is a little more precise than mine...
[ 20. April 2005, 22:41: Message edited by: Exiled Youth ]
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Gold from Egypt is still gold -- St. Augustine of Hippo
Posts: 411 | From: Home Sweet Home | Registered: Nov 2004
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Marvin the Martian
Interplanetary
# 4360
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by 103 (One-O-Three):
He believes that the Anglican Church is not a real church. I don't think we ever will be able to be in full communion with Rome, so we won't be fully united will we? Think about it...
I think the cause of full communion is best helped more by us staying where we are and working for change from there (be we RCC, Anglican or whatever). Not by effectively saying the only way to all agree is for us all to convert to one particular denomination...
[ 20. April 2005, 22:46: Message edited by: Marvin the Martian ]
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Hail Gallaxhar
Posts: 30100 | From: Adrift on a sea of surreality | Registered: Apr 2003
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ChristinaMarie
Shipmate
# 1013
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Posted
103, if the Pope wants Christians to be united, then he wants us to be united. Think about it. Now he is Pope, he will be seeking for unity with Anglicans, if he means what he says. Your Anglo-Catholicism is nearest to RCism, right? So, can't ACs work within the Anglican community for full unity? If it doesn't work out, maybe then would be a better time to consider, and you'll be older and able to change over without problems with your parents, as you won't be living with them then.
The grass always seems greener on the other side of the fence. This Pope seems to want to remove the fence somehow.
Christina
Posts: 2333 | From: Oldham | Registered: Jul 2001
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Max.
Shipmate
# 5846
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by luvanddaisies:
quote:
Originally posted by 103 (One-O-Three):
But life would be EXTREMELY uncomfortable when it comes to religion (which is a huge part of our family, we go to mass all together as a family, we recite the rosary together and we pray together)
<snip>
It's a decision that I have to make whilst thinking about the feelings of other people in the family. The last thing I want to do is cause a lot of hurt and pain in my family, after all I have to live with them!
-103
- all of which is admirable, and does show that you're not as immature as some of your less considered posts here may have led some to believe - but why though do you accept appointment to a role of leadership &/or ministry within the church if it is not a church you would otherwise choose to attend?
that is what puzzles me & is where I percieve the biggest contradiction - especially as your beliefs & opinions are so fervently held and expressed.
Right, I can hardly see the screen at the mement because I'm very tired so I am only typing this answer by looking at the keybnoard so please excuse any typos, this will be my last post tonight.
I accepted the position of Eucharistic Minister because I fully accept that my church is a true catholic church, but I have always expressed my desire to join the RCC in the near future to my parish priest. He understands my situation but still approached me to be an extraordinary minister of the eucharist. I accepted this because at the time I was in the hope that I could push some traditional catholic belief into my parish church as well as continuing my youth work within the parish. I am planning on continuing my youth work up until the point when I leave the parish and I am licensed until next easter when I can either renew my vows or stop being a Eucharistic Minister. Father hasn't seen this as a problem that will stop me from being able be a Eucharistic Minister, I believe that my church celebrates the real mass on a Sunday and it's a perfectly valid sacrament. I'm not sure though about some other Anglican Churches (to which I wouldn't be allowed to be a Eucharistic Minister in anyway because I'm a member of Forward in Faith and most Anglican Churches in this area have Women priests) and that is what I am very uncomfortable with. I know there are other people who feel the same way as me (although they don't want to cross the Tiber, which to me is just common sense!)
I was waiting to see if we would get a pope who would bring about full communion between us and the Roman Catholic Church but instead we got Ratzinger, I am pretty sure that full communion between Rome and the Anglican Communion will not happen under Ratzinger so I will join Rome in the near future rather than sticking around.
Anyway - I wouldn't be kicking myself if we joined in full communion with Rome and I had converted to Rome, I would've been able to test the waters and speak from one side to the other during the full communioning!
-103
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For the sake of His sorrowful Passion, have mercy on us and on the whole world.
Posts: 9716 | From: North Yorkshire | Registered: May 2004
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Fiddleback
Shipmate
# 2809
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Posted
Anyway, back to the OP...
Have any of Benedict XVI's hosts appeared on eBay yet?
Posts: 2034 | Registered: May 2002
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Trudy Scrumptious
BBE Shieldmaiden
# 5647
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Posted
Getting stupid? When was this not stupid??
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Books and things.
I lied. There are no things. Just books.
Posts: 7428 | From: Closer to Paris than I am to Vancouver | Registered: Mar 2004
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Calindreams
Shipmate
# 9147
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Posted
And that's why no concerned Catholic should have bought the wafer from Ebay. Now there's a new group of people to exploit. If another wafer appears on Ebay then someone else is going to buy it. How do we know that there isn't a pile of them waiting to be sold? If the item really did offend you then the last thing you should do is buy it.
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Toto, I don't think we're in Kansas anymore
Posts: 665 | From: Birmingham, England | Registered: Mar 2005
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Trudy Scrumptious
BBE Shieldmaiden
# 5647
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Posted
If you're gullible enough to believe the seller's unverifiable story about the history of any item on eBay, you deserve to be parted from your money. And, oh, did I mention I've got a dress with the semen of two former US presidents on it, for sale?
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Books and things.
I lied. There are no things. Just books.
Posts: 7428 | From: Closer to Paris than I am to Vancouver | Registered: Mar 2004
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Trudy Scrumptious
BBE Shieldmaiden
# 5647
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Posted
Nope...Roosevelt (Teddy) and JFK.
It's a family heirloom.
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Books and things.
I lied. There are no things. Just books.
Posts: 7428 | From: Closer to Paris than I am to Vancouver | Registered: Mar 2004
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Fiddleback
Shipmate
# 2809
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Posted
Teddy's population paste got all over the place. Hardly a collector's item. Now if you you've got some of Franklin D's joy gloy on a garment, you're going to get some good bids.
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Alfred E. Neuman
What? Me worry?
# 6855
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by TrudyTrudy (I say unto you):
...And, oh, did I mention I've got a dress with the semen of two former US presidents on it, for sale?
I'm interested, but you have to supply a full exposé detailing just how said dress became soiled. Signed black and white glossies (by the presidents) should be sufficient for varification. Not that I don't trust you or anything.
[ 21. April 2005, 00:12: Message edited by: Gort ]
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--Formerly: Gort--
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Trudy Scrumptious
BBE Shieldmaiden
# 5647
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Fiddleback:
Teddy's population paste got all over the place. Hardly a collector's item. Now if you you've got some of Franklin D's joy gloy on a garment, you're going to get some good bids.
Oh, you want me to sell Grandma's souvenirs as well as Mum's and Great-Grandma's? Sorry, that's a separate item. I'll be listing her Presidential crotchless panties next week.
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Books and things.
I lied. There are no things. Just books.
Posts: 7428 | From: Closer to Paris than I am to Vancouver | Registered: Mar 2004
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Hooker's Trick
Admin Emeritus and Guardian of the Gin
# 89
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by 103 (One-O-Three):
The 39 articles of religion really make my shudder.
The lack of papish stuff (elevations, latin etc.)
-103
Have you ever seen a Book of Common Prayer or been to a BCP Mass?
The Articles of Religion are not a part of the Holy Communion service.
And there is no rubric preventing Father from holding Jesus as high in the air as he wants to.
And you can perfectly well have Latin communion motets to your heart's content.
Now, knock off the Book of Evil nonsense or I shall be forced to remind you that the Church of Rome is the Scarlet Whore.
Posts: 6735 | From: Gin Lane | Registered: May 2001
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Duo Seraphim*
Sea lawyer
# 3251
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by jlg:
quote:
Originally posted by 103 (One-O-Three):
....I'm glad that I'll be able to leave the confusion and the uncertainty of the CofE that I experience behind and I'll be able to live my life in a denomination that I think is strong and united in beliefs.
(Emphasis added)
Prepare yourself for some disappointment, lad. The RCC has the likes of me and my godmother in it.
Though if you're looking for a lot of mindless adoration of various apparitions of the BVM (including little old ladies spouting pious nonsense), you'll surely be able to find your niche.
Ah, 103, hear wisdom! As an atheist and an outsider to Catholicism, I was pretty confused to have a sort of conversion experience physically sitting all by myself in a Catholic church. (I had wandered inside to get out of the heat and it seemed nice and quiet.) I stumbled into RCIA in a similar fashion, having sat in a nice quiet place and in the end managing to attend Mass. I held on to the idea of unity of belief within the Catholic Church for a while longer.
Then I was courted by all the various groups that made up the parish I had joined - - the League of Mary led by an ancient and pious Irishwoman (very strong on the Rosary, Miraculous Medals and relics of Padre Pio. I can still hear her intonation of the Hail Mary.),
- the Charismatics, led by a deeply scary woman (all that moaning and rolling about - so un-English),
- a genuine recusant ( very old Shire family that had provided one of the 40 Martyrs. Shades of Brideshead Revisited with that one.),
- supporters of the Latin Mass (What was wrong with the one the Vatican wanted us to celebrate I asked in my innocence.)
You get the picture. They all wanted me to be their sort of Catholic. We all sign up to belief in God, to the teachings of the Bible and to the teaching of the Catholic Church. How we express that faith and comply with that teaching is as variable within the Catholic Church as it is for any other human activity.
I muddled through this highly diverse crew. In the end the ones that made most sense to me were those of quiet faith and prayerfulness who really loved God and loved their fellow humans too. Since then, I've tried to stick with them. They can be found in all sorts of unlikely places.
[typo]
[ 21. April 2005, 02:14: Message edited by: Duo Seraphim ]
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2^8, eight bits to a byte
Posts: 3967 | From: Sydney Australia | Registered: Aug 2002
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Duo Seraphim*
Sea lawyer
# 3251
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by 103 (One-O-Three):
Urm, this is now getting stupid.
Oracular toast? Proven by picking the winner of the last Presidential election? Essence of Pope?
Must be worth less now that we know who the next Pope is.
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2^8, eight bits to a byte
Posts: 3967 | From: Sydney Australia | Registered: Aug 2002
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RuthW
liberal "peace first" hankie squeezer
# 13
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Duo Seraphim:
In the end the ones that made most sense to me were those of quiet faith and prayerfulness who really loved God and loved their fellow humans too.
Is this what we're supposed to be doing? Are you sure? Cuz I thought it was all about figuring out whose rules to follow and then following them as precisely as possible. And excoriating everyone following different rules, hell-bound cretins that they are.
Posts: 24453 | From: La La Land | Registered: Apr 2001
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Duo Seraphim*
Sea lawyer
# 3251
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by RuthW:
quote:
Originally posted by Duo Seraphim:
In the end the ones that made most sense to me were those of quiet faith and prayerfulness who really loved God and loved their fellow humans too.
Is this what we're supposed to be doing? Are you sure? Cuz I thought it was all about figuring out whose rules to follow and then following them as precisely as possible. And excoriating everyone following different rules, hell-bound cretins that they are.
![[Eek!]](eek.gif) Surely not. Oh wait a moment- you mean the other mob over there... ![[Snigger]](graemlins/snigger.gif)
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2^8, eight bits to a byte
Posts: 3967 | From: Sydney Australia | Registered: Aug 2002
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RuthW
liberal "peace first" hankie squeezer
# 13
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Posted
Exactly. Them. It's appalling. I don't know how they hold their heads up.
Posts: 24453 | From: La La Land | Registered: Apr 2001
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mousethief
Ship's Thieving Rodent
# 953
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Son of a Preacher Man:
Who wants an irregular Jesus?
Ah, but did Jesus get constipation? This could be a whole new Purg thread, along with all those others we have enjoyed such as "Did Jesus's penis curve to the left?" or "Was Jesus ever accidentally discovered with his pants down by Mary Magdalene?" or "Was Jesus a really ace carpenter, or just a mediocre one?" and other such nonsense threads.
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This is the last sig I'll ever write for you...
Posts: 63536 | From: Washington | Registered: Jul 2001
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Ariel
Shipmate
# 58
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Posted
103 - if your attraction to the Catholic Church is largely because of the colour, mystery, tradition, Latin and all the rest of it, I can relate to that. But as has also been said, the grass is greener on the other side of the fence.
I regularly attended Latin Masses as a child, although English language ones were an alternative, but that is the tradition I was used to. I later dropped out of Catholicism for various reasons and didn't come back for many years. What I found came as a culture shock. I found a cut-down English language version of services which seemed to me lacking in beauty and mystery, sometimes to the point that it even felt dumbed down. It was at the time all there was and it was that or nothing. I found it quite unsatisfactory. It seemed to me that the flavour of the Catholicism I had known had changed and had more in common with the Protestant church than it had with what I'd been used to. I recognized some of the hymns from the Anglican hymnbook I'd had at school. There were women serving Communion. The altar wine was offered to the congregation. Yes, I'd been away a long time but these were developments I didn't recognize, expect or understand - or much care for. What next, I wondered? How far was all this going to go?
I ended up at an old-fashioned sort of place where the priest was a member of the Latin Mass Society and held regular Latin services. This was more the sort of thing that I wanted (each to their own, OK?). The Sunday morning Mass is hugely popular and often standing room only, with a real range of all ages.
Latin services, however, are not generally on offer. Most places don't do them. What you are likely to get is a half hour English language service on weekdays and an extended version with Victorian hymns on Sundays. Benediction and Vespers are not standard features of every church either. You will be extremely lucky to find anywhere that offers them regularly.
As for the unity of beliefs - there are central core beliefs, however there is enormous diversity within the Catholic Church. If there's one thing I've found, it's that everyone I speak to seems to have a different take on it. People who follow the party line in every single respect are actually fairly rare. This is as true of the older generation who might be expected to be more traditional as it is of the younger ones.
You will find some kind of a place in the church if you decide to join, but I strongly advise you to talk to a range of Catholics before you do, including young people of your own age, and get a balanced view of what it is really like. You may find that you are better off where you are.
Posts: 25445 | Registered: May 2001
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Max.
Shipmate
# 5846
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Posted
No, Latin and colour is something I actually wouldn't mind getting away from. My local RC Parish has no music, the priest only wears a cassock-alb and a stole for mass.
I don't prefer that church over my own at all, I wish they had colour and a big band and I wish the priest would wear a chasuble BUT I feel a lot more comfortable with the fact that it's in the RC Communion and it's not pretending to be something that it's not.
And I know that the 39 articles aren't in the HC service, but they're in the same book which is implying that if you celebrate that service you agree to those rules.
-103
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For the sake of His sorrowful Passion, have mercy on us and on the whole world.
Posts: 9716 | From: North Yorkshire | Registered: May 2004
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Cusanus
Ship's Schoolmaster
# 692
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Duo Seraphim:
a genuine recusant ( very old Shire family that had provided one of the 40 Martyrs. Shades of Brideshead Revisited with that one
You have hobbits in the Roman Catholic Church?
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"You are qualified," sa fotherington-tomas, "becos you can frankly never pass an exam and have 0 branes. Obviously you will be a skoolmaster - there is no other choice."
Posts: 3120 | From: The Peninsula | Registered: Jul 2001
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Duo Seraphim*
Sea lawyer
# 3251
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Cusanus:
quote:
Originally posted by Duo Seraphim:
a genuine recusant ( very old Shire family that had provided one of the 40 Martyrs. Shades of Brideshead Revisited with that one
You have hobbits in the Roman Catholic Church?
That would be York...<pats Cusanus kindly on head> nope, that would be right. They went by the name of Baggins.
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2^8, eight bits to a byte
Posts: 3967 | From: Sydney Australia | Registered: Aug 2002
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kentishmaid
Shipmate
# 4767
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Posted
See, that's not fair. I now have a vision of the Pope as Gandalf, which is probably highly irreverent......
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"Who'll be the lady, who'll be the lord, when we are ruled by the love of one another?"
Posts: 2063 | From: Huddersfield | Registered: Jul 2003
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Erin
Meaner than Godzilla
# 2
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by 103 (One-O-Three):
If I was part of a different denomination it would probably cause a split among us, there would be a "You're a different type of Christian to us" attitude, I would be joining the "Novus Ordo Warehouse religion, the religion that only uses churches to distribute mass to the people, the religion that stole the latin from the people and the religion that caused so much upset to my mother's family"
So what part of this changes in a year's time?
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Commandment number one: shut the hell up.
Posts: 17140 | From: 330 miles north of paradise | Registered: Mar 2001
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luvanddaisies
the'fun'in'fundie'™
# 5761
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Posted
I can just see a bunch of cardinals carrying bags with SWAG on them, snaffling latin texts from people in the dead of night ![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif)
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"Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines, sail away from the safe harbour. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover." (Mark Twain)
Posts: 3711 | From: all at sea. | Registered: Apr 2004
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Amazing Grace*
Shipmate
# 4754
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by The Bede's American Successor:
quote:
Originally posted by Amazing Grace:
Although I think this is a first in just how Spong is being used as a weapon here ...
It is called "synthesis" and "evaluation" on Bloom's Taxonomy. You might try learning enough about a subject to try it sometime.
quote:
Indeed. I think Bede's PoMo Detection Meter has gone a bit haywire.
I think some people need to learn to recognize other forms of hellishness. Gort's Groupies must think he can't find his own oil can these days.
![[Killing me]](graemlins/killingme.gif)
Trippy smoke machine you have there, d00d. Impressive volume. Does it do liturgical colors or just plain black and white projection, argumentum ad homineum, proof by vigorous re-assertion, you know, the standard stuff?
And as a Keeper of the Tat, I want to know if it is swingable, decorative, and has a smoke only mode. That way it could double as a thurible.
Kiss kiss!
Charlotte
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.sig on vacation
Posts: 2594 | From: Sittin' by the dock of the [SF] bay | Registered: Jul 2003
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Amazing Grace*
Shipmate
# 4754
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Gort:
quote:
Originally posted by The Bede's American Successor:
[...] I think some people need to learn to recognize other forms of hellishness. Gort's Groupies must think he can't find his own oil can these days.
Jealousy rears its ugly green head.
Nah, I think that someone else had "The Wizard of Oz" on the brain and elected to do some Margaret Hamilton went to kollidge polysyllabic (etc.) scenery chewing. Don't know nothin' about no postmodernism stuff here in Berserkley, nosirree.
But if I am not Groupie Number One, I could be talked into a pay-per-view CAT FIGHT. All for the Organ Fund, of course.
Charlotte (and my little cat too)
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.sig on vacation
Posts: 2594 | From: Sittin' by the dock of the [SF] bay | Registered: Jul 2003
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Hooker's Trick
Admin Emeritus and Guardian of the Gin
# 89
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by 103 (One-O-Three):
And I know that the 39 articles aren't in the HC service, but they're in the same book which is implying that if you celebrate that service you agree to those rules.
-103
I obviously missed the part of the Holy Communion service in which the priest read out the Articles of Religion and I said "Amen".
Posts: 6735 | From: Gin Lane | Registered: May 2001
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